There are 6 messages in this issue.
Topics in this digest:
1. Re: English -uice
From: Arthaey Angosii
2a. Re: USAGE: What gender is _Wikipedia_ in German?
From: Paul Bennett
2b. Re: USAGE: What gender is _Wikipedia_ in German?
From: Andreas Johansson
3a. Re: composite preposition with two opposite meanings
From: Eric Christopherson
3b. Re: composite preposition with two opposite meanings
From: Eric Christopherson
4. Name clitics (was Re: USAGE: What gender is _Wikipedia_ in German?)
From: Eric Christopherson
Messages
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1. Re: English -uice
Posted by: "Arthaey Angosii" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Fri Jul 28, 2006 3:39 pm (PDT)
On 7/28/06, Roger Mills <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Is sluice in ME? I'd suspect a later borrowing of Dutch sluis, again with an
> attempt to get the weird diphthong right.
OED has this to say about "sluice":
[ad. OF. escluse (-clusse, -clouse, etc.; mod.F. écluse), = Sp. and
Pg. esclusa, late and med.L. exclusa (also sclusa, etc.), fem. sing.
of L. exclūsus, pa. pple. of exclūdere to shut out, EXCLUDE v.
OF. is also the source of MDu. sluse, sluyse, sluus (Du. sluis, WFris.
slús), MLG. sluse, sluze (LG. slüse, slüs, G. schleuse), Da. sluse,
Sw. slus. For the English forms which represent the late L. clūsa see
CLOW n.1
The spelling with ui (cf. juice) did not come into general use until
the 18th century.]
--
AA
http://conlang.arthaey.com
Messages in this topic (3)
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2a. Re: USAGE: What gender is _Wikipedia_ in German?
Posted by: "Paul Bennett" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Fri Jul 28, 2006 3:52 pm (PDT)
On Fri, 28 Jul 2006 18:27:18 -0400, Andreas Johansson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
> As for my idiolect, "Wikipedia" is a proper name, but _wiki_ [vi:kI]
Odd. I have the exact opposite vowel pattern /wIki:/ for that kind of
website.
I have something like /wIki_x'pi:dIj@/ for the name of that site.
I imagine it's properly /wiki/ in Hawaiian, isn't it?
Oh, and the question originally posed, but for Thagojian? It'd fit very
nicely into the -ia/-ua declension, which are mostly biologically female
or inanimate nouns. Thus:
Singular
Agentive: uikipedia
Patientive: uikipediam
Oblique: uikipedai
Plural
Agt: uikipediaz
Pat: uikipedianz
Obl: uikipedavi
Paul
Messages in this topic (8)
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2b. Re: USAGE: What gender is _Wikipedia_ in German?
Posted by: "Andreas Johansson" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Fri Jul 28, 2006 4:08 pm (PDT)
Quoting Paul Bennett <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> On Fri, 28 Jul 2006 18:27:18 -0400, Andreas Johansson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> wrote:
>
> > As for my idiolect, "Wikipedia" is a proper name, but _wiki_ [vi:kI]
>
> Odd. I have the exact opposite vowel pattern /wIki:/ for that kind of
> website.
Mine is in Swedish, which, I'll infer from the /w/, yours isn't, so I don't
think it's odd at all.
Andreas
Messages in this topic (8)
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3a. Re: composite preposition with two opposite meanings
Posted by: "Eric Christopherson" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Fri Jul 28, 2006 4:03 pm (PDT)
On Jul 28, 2006, at 11:20 AM, Roger Mills wrote:
> Remé Uittenbogaard wrote:
>>
>> Apparently the expression "in possession of" can mean two opposite
>> things.
>>
>> This book is in possession of my brother.
>> I have been in possession of this book for years.
>>
> Disagree. I think there has to be a "the" in the first case.
> Consider also:
[snip]
I forgot about another expression where the presence or absence of
"the" matters - "in case of" vs. "in the case of." "Wear galoshes in
case of rain" means to wear galoshes regardless of whether it
actually rains or not, because it might; whereas "wear galoshes in
the case of rain" means only to wear them if it does in fact rain.
(Actually, maybe I'm wrong; the second sentence sounds strange to me
now. I think I would have to change it to "in the case of rain, wear
galoshes" or even "in the case of it raining, wear galoshes" for it
to sound natural. Also it just occurred to me that "in the case
of ..." usually seems to refer back to something already mentioned,
whereas "in case of ..." doesn't necessarily. Still, it always
strikes me as odd when I see a fire alarm switch with the message "In
case of fire break glass and pull handle," because I interpret that
to mean that, in any event, I should break the glass, just in case a
fire breaks out :) )
Messages in this topic (4)
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3b. Re: composite preposition with two opposite meanings
Posted by: "Eric Christopherson" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Fri Jul 28, 2006 4:07 pm (PDT)
On Jul 28, 2006, at 11:20 AM, Roger Mills wrote:
> Remé Uittenbogaard wrote:
>>
>> Apparently the expression "in possession of" can mean two opposite
>> things.
>>
>> This book is in possession of my brother.
>> I have been in possession of this book for years.
>>
> Disagree. I think there has to be a "the" in the first case.
> Consider also:
[snip]
> And offhand I can't think of any comparable expressions.
An expression that annoys me because (to me) it sounds like it should
mean the opposite is "by way of." E.g., the sentence "By way of
explanation, John said X" means that John explained something, and
the method by which he explained it was X -- whereas to my mind it
*sounds* like it should mean John said X, and the method by which he
said X was by explanation. I hope that makes sense. The other usage
of "by way of" means that something has gone through some place or
passed through the hands of someone on its way.
Messages in this topic (4)
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4. Name clitics (was Re: USAGE: What gender is _Wikipedia_ in German?)
Posted by: "Eric Christopherson" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Fri Jul 28, 2006 4:27 pm (PDT)
On Jul 28, 2006, at 7:05 AM, Kalle Bergman wrote:
> Makes me think of my dad's dialect, which has a
> special set of clitics used with names of people, when
> those names are used to refer to a person by that
> name. (So, for instance, you use the clitic when
> saying things like "I met Ove yesterday", but not when
> saying "His name is Ove", because in the latter case,
> "Ove" refers to the name itself, rather than to
> someone called "Ove"). The clitics were en-/n- in the
> case of men, and a- in the case of women, so you got
> things like:
>
> Jag såg n'Ove
> I saw Ove
>
> And
>
> Jag såg a'Karin
> I saw Karin
>
> I think it's an interesting feature.
It's very interesting! I have thought about including something like
it in a conlang, but so far haven't quite done it. Do you know the
origins of those clitics? And does anyone know of other languages
that do that? The only nat- or conlang I'm aware of is Toki Pona
with <jan> "person."
Messages in this topic (8)
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