On 2017-01-03 11:01 PM, Robert Sanderson wrote:
> Dear all,
>
> At the Getty, we are currently remodeling our Provenance Index data into 
> Linked Open Data.  As you might expect, there is a lot of historical payment 
> information related to the transfer of ownership of objects.  We were very 
> happy to see that 6.2.2 adds in some of the foundational modeling for 
> supporting this information.  The scope notes in the current draft are a 
> little unclear for Monetary_Amount and Currency, however.
The version of 6.2.2 on the old web site [1] doesn't include P96
Purchase, so I can't comment on this in detail.  (In fact, the .doc
version of the current release is actually headed 6.2.1.  Still, this is
better than the 'new' site [2], where the current release that is
offered is 5.0.4 from December 2011.  I think some updating is required.)

> We are assuming that the Amount the face value of the money (e.g. $100 USD is 
> always the amount 100 of the currency USD) regardless of the actual _value_ 
> of that amount. If this is correct, then could the scope notes confirm this?  
>
> All currency amounts have an absolute value that changes constantly due to 
> inflation and markets, and there’s no way to associate a date with the amount 
> instance to capture this.  This seems somewhat in conflict with being a 
> subclass of Dimension, which is “the true quantity, independent from its 
> numerical approximation, e.g. in inches or in cm.” – in other words the 
> absolute value, independent of the unit, which is in this case the currency.  
Assuming that E96 Purchase is a subclass of E7 Activity, it will have
the opportunity to record an associated date.  I think you are
over-thinking what it is feasible to record here: if a specified price
was paid for an object on a specified date, surely that's all you need
to record - in fact it's all you can record.  It is for others to make
their own deductions as to the 'real' value (in some sense) of that
monetary amount.
> As a thought experiment, if the unit of an “inch” were to change definition 
> to be exactly 2.5 centimeters, then I believe from the description of 
> Dimension, that the lengths would remain the same in absolute value, and we 
> would need a new unit for “new inches”.  This is not practical for currency, 
> as we would need new units constantly … which is also forbidden by the scope 
> notes of currency: “One monetary system has only one currency”.  So how are 
> we to deal with comparisons over time?
I think that the only case where we should be making this sort of
distinction is where the currency itself changes its 'semantics': for
example the revaluation of the French franc in 1960.

> And in either case, it would be correct to have all uses of $100 USD refer to 
> the exact same resource… there need only be one Monetary_Amount that has a 
> particular value and currency … $100 is $100, regardless.  The practical 
> implication is that Monetary_Amount URIs could be constructed algorithmically 
> along the lines of http://example.org/Monetary_Amount/dollars/100.  This 
> doesn’t seem to be affected by face value vs actual value, but confirmation 
> would be appreciated.
Again I can't comment on what the 'official' line on this might be, but
there are analogies here for other measurement-like entities, such as
dates [e.g. 3].  While there may be advantages to 'quantizing' dates
(given the inherent uncertainty in deciding when an event/activity
happened, and the possibility it opens up of matching on the 'same'
date) I think there is less of a case for doing this to monetary
amounts.  If they are recorded as a numerical value, it is
straightforward to add them up, and to make comparisons ('find all
transactions with a value greater than $10,000'), etc.  With a URL for
the amount, you lose this ability.

> Secondly, and this is likely out of scope for the CRM at this stage, we have 
> a requirement to model where the money comes from and goes to.  For example, 
> there are many occurrences of dealers owning only a part share of an 
> expensive artwork, and the payment being divided according to that share 
> amongst the owning dealers.  For this we need more than just a 
> Monetary_Amount associated with a Purchase, and have been using a new 
> subclass of Activity a “Payment” with properties mirroring transfer of 
> ownership:  paid_amount, paid_to and paid_from.
I agree that this would be generally useful.  Another element of this
Payment activity would be a description of the good or benefit that is
transferred in return for the payment.

Best wishes,

Richard

[1] http://old.cidoc-crm.org/official_release_cidoc.html
[2] http://new.cidoc-crm.org/get-last-official-release
[2] http://ceur-ws.org/Vol-665/CorrendoEtAl_COLD2010.pdf
>
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-- 
*Richard Light*

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