Hi Ed,

so what do you propose?

Regards,
Matthias

From: <cross-project-issues-dev-boun...@eclipse.org> on behalf of Ed Merks 
<ed.me...@gmail.com>
Reply to: Cross project issues <cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org>
Date: Tuesday, 24. March 2020 at 11:53
To: "cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org" 
<cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org>
Subject: Re: [cross-project-issues-dev] [eclipse-pmc] Upgrading the Eclipse SDK 
target environment for the *September* Eclipse release...


It's not until the bundles are started that one knows their BREEs.  The 
launcher only knows the value for -Dosgi.requiredJavaVersion=1.8 from the 
eclipse.ini and that it already checks.  I believe there are issues with 
restart after update not actually reading the eclipse.ini.

https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=531112

In any case, if the product changes the Dosgi.requiredJavaVersion value during 
update, and product will not start (with a semi-help message) when started from 
scratch if the specified or implicit JVM is not at least that high.  This will 
no doubt create endless grief for users who use the updates to keep their IDE 
update-to-date and perhaps that is even more painful than help not working...  
At least help not working could be explained to the user via something else 
that doesn't require Java 11 to explain the problem...


On 23.03.2020 18:23, Ed Willink wrote:

Hi

I thought I had raised a Bugzilla on this but cannot find it.

IMHO the eclipse.exe launcher should diagnose the suitability of the user's 
platform for Eclipse and provide helpful diagnostics rather than a Java bang 
dialog. This should all be done before Java is started. Wrong Java version is 
an obvious check. Historically, the Microsoft Java was a regular user hazard.

    Regards

        Ed Willink
On 23/03/2020 15:25, Daniel Megert wrote:
HI Matthias

> letting things (like Help) fail seems not very nice from the user’s point of 
> view. I would vote for requiring Java 11 at the start.
I agree.

I'm not a p2 expert, so,, no, I can't answer your question to an end, but I 
assume that it won't warn and just fail on restart.

Dani



From:        "Becker, Matthias" <ma.bec...@sap.com><mailto:ma.bec...@sap.com>
To:        "eclipse-...@eclipse.org"<mailto:eclipse-...@eclipse.org> 
<eclipse-...@eclipse.org><mailto:eclipse-...@eclipse.org>, Cross project issues 
<cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org><mailto:cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org>
Date:        23.03.2020 13:59
Subject:        [EXTERNAL] Re: [cross-project-issues-dev] [eclipse-pmc] 
Upgrading the Eclipse SDK target environment for the *September* Eclipse 
release...
Sent by:        
cross-project-issues-dev-boun...@eclipse.org<mailto:cross-project-issues-dev-boun...@eclipse.org>
________________________________


Hi Dani,



letting things (like Help) fail seems not very nice from the user’s point of 
view. I would vote for requiring Java 11 at the start.

@Dani: Do you also have answers to my other questions?

Regards,

Matthias



From: <eclipse-pmc-boun...@eclipse.org><mailto:eclipse-pmc-boun...@eclipse.org> 
on behalf of Daniel Megert 
<daniel_meg...@ch.ibm.com><mailto:daniel_meg...@ch.ibm.com>
Reply to: "eclipse-...@eclipse.org"<mailto:eclipse-...@eclipse.org> 
<eclipse-...@eclipse.org><mailto:eclipse-...@eclipse.org>
Date: Monday, 23. March 2020 at 13:33
To: Cross project issues 
<cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org><mailto:cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org>
Cc: 
"cross-project-issues-dev-boun...@eclipse.org"<mailto:cross-project-issues-dev-boun...@eclipse.org>
 
<cross-project-issues-dev-boun...@eclipse.org><mailto:cross-project-issues-dev-boun...@eclipse.org>,
 "eclipse-...@eclipse.org"<mailto:eclipse-...@eclipse.org> 
<eclipse-...@eclipse.org><mailto:eclipse-...@eclipse.org>
Subject: Re: [eclipse-pmc] [cross-project-issues-dev] Upgrading the Eclipse SDK 
target environment for the *September* Eclipse release...



It depends. We (the platform) can require/hardcode Java 11 when you start the 
SDK or we do not enforce this but let things like Help/Jetty fail. Our position 
is that users need Java 11 for 2020-09.

Dani



From:        "Becker, Matthias" <ma.bec...@sap.com><mailto:ma.bec...@sap.com>
To:        "eclipse-...@eclipse.org"<mailto:eclipse-...@eclipse.org> 
<eclipse-...@eclipse.org><mailto:eclipse-...@eclipse.org>, 
"cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org"<mailto:cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org>
 
<cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org><mailto:cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org>
Date:        23.03.2020 10:57
Subject:        [EXTERNAL] Re: [cross-project-issues-dev] [eclipse-pmc] 
Upgrading the Eclipse SDK target environment for the *September* Eclipse 
release...
Sent by:        
cross-project-issues-dev-boun...@eclipse.org<mailto:cross-project-issues-dev-boun...@eclipse.org>

________________________________



Hi everybody,

do I understand this correctly that the 2020-09 release needs at least a Java 
11 VM to run? Will it no longer run on a Java 8 VM?

Will platform raise the Bundle-Execution Environment?

If release 2020-09 will only run on Java11 and newer: How does platform's 
"Check for Updates" handle this? What happens if a user has an existing 
installation running on Java 8 (and this is the user's one and only Java VM)? 
Does P2 tell the user that the new bundles to be installed require Java 11 but 
that the current installation does not supply this?

Regards,

Matthias



From: <eclipse-pmc-boun...@eclipse.org><mailto:eclipse-pmc-boun...@eclipse.org> 
on behalf of Mike Wilson <mike_wil...@ca.ibm.com><mailto:mike_wil...@ca.ibm.com>
Reply to: "eclipse-...@eclipse.org"<mailto:eclipse-...@eclipse.org> 
<eclipse-...@eclipse.org><mailto:eclipse-...@eclipse.org>
Date: Friday, 20. March 2020 at 19:35
To: 
"cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org"<mailto:cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org>
 
<cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org><mailto:cross-project-issues-dev@eclipse.org>
Cc: "eclipse-...@eclipse.org"<mailto:eclipse-...@eclipse.org> 
<eclipse-...@eclipse.org><mailto:eclipse-...@eclipse.org>
Subject: [eclipse-pmc] Upgrading the Eclipse SDK target environment for the 
*September* Eclipse release...



Hello cross project people,



The Eclipse Project PMC has approved a change to the target environments for 
the 2020-09 Eclipse release of the Eclipse Project (that is, our 4.17 release) 
to be based on Java 11. This will allow us to include Jetty 10, when it is 
available as indicated here:

    https://www.eclipse.org/lists/jetty-dev/msg03214.html



Given that this change has the potential to impact downstream projects, we are 
asking for feedback now: please let us know if you believe this will cause 
problems for your project.



Note that we are not asking teams to update the BREE for their components, and 
it is fine for components to support earlier versions of Java. This note is 
just identifying the version of Java that we will use to validate the September 
release, and thus will be the supported version for the Eclipse SDK.



thanks,

the Eclipse Project PMC

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