On 2/17/06, JT Moree <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- > Hash: SHA1 > > > > .2. Problems with Modern Spreadsheet Developments > I'll bite. > > perhaps the problem with this guy's views are that they are true but so > what? Spreadsheets are flexible and easy to use for people who cannot > read or figure out how to use things. To say that learning to use awk, > sed, and other unix tools is actually easier than spreadsheets is a > little silly.
Actually I think it is rather silly to print stuff out from one computer and then retype it all in at another computer but this seems to be the prevailing mode of use with Windows. I'll also posit that end users aren't as dumb as their sys admins paint them to be. In fact this condescending attitude of "RTFM" or "you are too stupid to touch a key board" has been quite successful at interdicting Linux adoption. Anyway, I should qualify that; for people who are going to use Linux or *BSD. That is the whole point of transitioning to Linux or BSD; to use utilities that can do mass edits. I also really feel that it would be easier to use Awk/Shell than spreadsheets when it comes to doing calculations. Look, you don't have to be a computer expert to Google for a script. Halfway down this page is a bash script for calculating mortgage payments. http://www.bsdbooks.net/shells/scripting/en/HTML/mathc.html > Those utiltities are available under unix but not under > windows Correct JT - I thought we were talking about UNIX desktops here. That is the original question posed by Robert: "What does Linux/*BSD have to counter the perceived benefits of the forthcoming Vista". My take is that, in the long run, it's easier to learn the basics of these scripts and utilities than to plough through Microsoft's sometimes turgid help. Again you don't have to be a computer expert to use things like these: AWK One Liners: http://www.student.northpark.edu/pemente/awk/awk1line.txt > You can immediately start typing into a spreadsheet after opening the > program but you can't immediately do anything with awk, sed, grep. Even > I use an iterative process when using those tools. I add one pipe at a > time while tweaking options to get the format I want. I agree JT. Again, we are talking about people who want to use Linux in the workplace. IMHO, it's a huge mistake to "sell" Linux / *BSD as a drop in replacement for Windows. The Linux desktops are not well tested and their developers make way to many gratuitous changes. > > the point is that he is complaining that spreadsheets are not really > improving but the real question is 'Do spreadsheets need to improve?" It's not that they have not improved but that they have gotten worse. When I was at the FDA, my colleagues would ask me to help them find errors in their spreadsheets. In some cases it would take 90 minutes to locate the error. All it takes is something like $I22 to be typed as $I$22. > This is not to justify misusing spreadsheets. They have thier uses and > they are versatile but should not be the only tool in someone's bag of > tricks. I will leave it to Robert to comment on the other deficiencies of spreadsheets. I have to reiterate again: It's a huge mistake to cast Linux as a feature for feature replacement for Windows. I'll close with this little anecdote. The second SLUUG meeting I ever attended, I had the good fortune to meet Don Ellis. I had just installed Linux about a month earlier. I complained to him about how things were difficult to setup and use. To every complaint or question I had, Don replied "You must learn Vi". At the time, It seemed somewhat rude that he would deflect my questions with this injunction. A year later the wisdom of this became manifest. Vi was the litmus test to determine if I would be willing to transition to the UNIX way of doing things. In the same way you also have to pre-qualify would be adopters. Are they going to make the commitment to ensure the transition to Linux is successful? If not, it's a waste of time trying o get them to use it. -- Kind regards, Jonathan _______________________________________________ CWE-LUG mailing list [email protected] http://www.cwelug.org/ http://www.cwelug.org/archives/ http://www.cwelug.org/mailinglist/
