Hi Raphael I'm going to start by saying you have my utmost respect with your work on Live Build but let me just say you totally misunderstood my point.
I have no doubt the live build developer community works very well together and that there are a meaningful amount of merge requests. I get regular emails about updates to it so I am aware to a certain degree of how much goes into keeping it a fully maintained collection of software packages. Having said the above paragraph I do not see how that makes my view of the situation within Debian incorrect. When individuals have made comments that they feel burned the indication is there is a cultural problem within the organisation itself that has led to people feeling burned. How/why did this happen? If Debian (the organisation) knows how it happened what has, or is being ,done to fix it and stop it happening again? Lets be honest live build is not the only thing that Debian has had difficulty over in recent memory (you didn't quote that part of my previous message for some reason you just decided to discuss live build). So again I'll ask why would anyone take on something like this until Debian made provisions to working on ways that would not create such a hostile situation again? If people within Debian are shying away from doing things because they feel burned why would someone knowingly volunteer to put themselves in a position where the same thing would happen to them? We are all human, we have feelings and most "normal" people don't willingly put themselves in harms way (even psychological harm). I understand that some may disagree with me and that is their right but from my vantage point Debian has a cultural problem that needs fixing so others do not end up shying away from projects because they don't want to be "burned". Ignore my 2 cents worth if you wish but please understand my desire is to offer constructive critique about a situation that has been brewing for a few years now. It literally has nothing to do with merge requests but everything to do with peoples feelings of being valued. Regards. Michael. On 20/04/2021, Raphael Hertzog <hert...@debian.org> wrote: > Hello, > > On Tue, 20 Apr 2021, Michael . wrote: >> Now having said all that let me just ask you why would someone or >> "people" plural want to take on a task like this in Debian when Debian >> isn't fixing the problems it created. Maybe if Debian acknowledged >> the handling of the issue and made provisions to working on ways that >> would not create such a hostile situation again Debian may find some >> people who are willing to work with it but I'll just say I think it's >> unlikely that Debian has the ability or the desire to do that. > > The regular flow of merge requests that are processed and live-build > uploads do not agree with your view of the situation. > > live-build and its development community is in a relatively good shape but > we are lacking volunteers to care about the generation of release ISO for > the end users because all the current developers are using the tool for > their own need. > > That kind of position with responsibilities requires some amount of trust > so it's not clear to me what are the requirements for the person that > would be volunteering (that is if she isn't a Debian developer already). > > But maybe a call on d-d-a would be in order ? > > Cheers, > -- > ⢀⣴⠾⠻⢶⣦⠀ Raphaël Hertzog <hert...@debian.org> > ⣾⠁⢠⠒⠀⣿⡁ > ⢿⡄⠘⠷⠚⠋ The Debian Handbook: https://debian-handbook.info/get/ > ⠈⠳⣄⠀⠀⠀⠀ Debian Long Term Support: https://deb.li/LTS >
