On 15/05/14 02:31 PM, Jerry Stuckle wrote:
On 5/15/2014 1:53 PM, Gary Dale wrote:
On 15/05/14 01:33 PM, Jerry Stuckle wrote:
On 5/15/2014 12:16 PM, Gary Dale wrote:
On 15/05/14 04:04 AM, Andrei POPESCU wrote:
On Jo, 15 mai 14, 00:27:08, Gary Dale wrote:
I disagree. Browser support for DRM makes it easier for people to
provide
content that uses DRM. After all, if every browser supports it, why
not use
it?
Debian is based on freedom. Iceweasel exists because Firefox
contained
proprietary parts.
Iceweasel exists because the trademark policy for Firefox requires
all
changes to the browser to be approved my the Mozilla Corporation and
this conflicts with Debian's usual security support strategy for
stable.
Lately Mozilla has been providing the ESR and Debian has been
upgrading
iceweasel in wheezy via the security archive. I'd say there are
chances
that Jessie releases with Firefox instead of Iceweasel.
To not remove digital restrictions support undermines a
major strength of Debian. If people want DRM, they can always
download
Firefox but they should have a choice for freedom.
There is no need to remove *support* for DRM, as long as it is Free
Software (according to Debian's definition). Whether to use it (or
not)
must be the choice of the user.
Kind regards,
Andrei
I disagree again. The presence of DRM material is an affront to the
open
nature of the web. Mozilla's decision to cave in to the DRM crowd
doesn't need to be echoed by Debian. DRM isn't a user's choice.
It's the
choice of the site owners. Groups like Debian should be backing the
FSF
on this by refusing to endorse web content restrictions.
As it should be. The site owners own the content, and they get to
decide what is being done with it.
Copyright violations are rampant on the web. If there were no
problem, DRM would not be required. People deserve to protect what
they worked hard (and often paid) for.
Just because it's there does not mean you have a right to use it as
you see fit. Try using a car that was parked on the street, just
because it was there. See how far you get.
Jerry
Nonsense. There is the concept of fair use. No right is nor should be
unlimited. DRM throws centuries of jurisprudence out the window.
DRM exists not because of copyright violation but because people can get
away with it. DVD's CSS for example never prevented anyone from making a
copy of a DVD. It just prevented legitimate owners of DVDs from taking
their DVDs with them when they switched continents.
You need to look up the meaning of "fair use". It does not, for
instance, allow you to post a copy of an article on my web page - or
even link to an image on my web page - without my permission.
And this has been supported by "centuries of jurisprudence". DRM does
nothing to change that. If the owner of the copyright doesn't want
the item used, he/she can implement DRM to protect it. If he/she
doesn't care, he/she does not need to implement DRM.
And the claim that "if all browsers support DRM, everyone will use it"
is completely bogus. For instance, all browsers (at least all of the
major ones) support Java applets and Flash. But not everyone uses
them. In fact, very few do - even though, according to your thinking,
"they have no reason not to".
Jerry
This is why so many discussions degenerate into flame wars - people
presenting ideas on topics they seem to have little knowledge. I can,
for example, quote anything presented publicly and post it online with
critical comment - except if it is part of DRM-protected content. That's
an example of fair use and how DRM restricts it.
As for Flash, I note that for a long time it was the defacto standard
for posting video despite being proprietary. It's only lately that it
has begun to lose its stranglehold. Javascript is also the defacto
standard for client-side processing, again because all major browsers
support it.
If I'm a typical content provider, I'll put in DRM if I can be sure it
won't interfere with my site's views. If only one browser supports DRM,
I'll think twice before doing it. If you don't understand this
reasoning, we have nothing more to talk about.
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