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Oops,
I lied. Here's a "potential" reason why I don't have a problem with Topica
ham vs. spam:
BentallKillDel.txt
============
HEADERS 0 CONTAINS Topica.com
Andrew
8)
Andrew,
Topica also has a bulk-mail
service and they definitely cater to spammers. That service is very much
like Uptilt or Midnshare Design. I have found a few legitimate
newsletters coming from it, but it's almost all garbage and we do block the
bulk-mail from them on site, and whitelist the rare exception.
If yo
note Topica's new site, they are leaving the discussion groups behind and
concentrating on bulk-mail services. The reason why you might think they
have gotten better is because they were probably damaged by SBL listings and
the like, and spamming members chose other cleaner services for their
lists. Doing confirmed opt-in also helped to clean up some of the worst
of the abuse, but still, free discussion groups aren't their thing any
more.
As far as Jaguar Technologies goes, I'm not totally sure why they
are associated with this IP space. ARIN shows the space in that block as
coming from Yipes which is of course a favorite of spammers. I believe
that it is possible that Senderbase is showing the connection to Jaguar
Technologies in error since Topica has their own assignments from Yipes, and
so does the spam house that came up in Nick's link. I have grown to be
suspicious of the data that Senderbase displays in the upper right hand side
of the data. In this case, it doesn't come from public whois
data.
Matt
Colbeck, Andrew wrote:
That would be this hosting provider:
http://www.jaguarpc.com
Topica certainly uses this provider provider for some of their mailings,
and Jaguar is also hosting others.
I don't know if that makes them good or evil.
My own opinion about Topica is that in the 3 years the've been sending
mail to my domains, they have gotten incrementally better. Some of
their lists are derived from suspect sources, but I never seen them do
"broadcast spam" to unrelated addressees. It's the subscribers to daily
Astrology, Diet, Jokes, Deals and whatnot that get on the spontaneous
newsletter treadmill. This is what I call "sel-inflicted spam".
Unsubscribing from Topica newsletters does seem to work, but others may
describe it as "listwashing".
As a private company and not an ISP, I can take no great effort in
allowing or blocking them, as Topica rarely has business related lists
of interest to us.
Andrew 8)
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On Behalf Of NIck Hayer
Sent: Wednesday, June 01, 2005 1:45 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [Declude.JunkMail] legit newsletter services
Thanks Matt!
What about Jaguar Technologies?
http://www.senderbase.org/search?searchBy=organization&searchString=Jagu
ar%20Technologies%20LLC
Are they part of Topica?
-Nick
Matt wrote:
Nick,
Any list service of moderate or large size will leak spam, some more,
some less, but it's fairly bad wherever you go because the spammers
tend to have the larger lists, but probably only represent the
minority of their customers.
Roving.com (ConstantContact), bCentral, some of Topica, etc. all
experience these issues. There is no magic bullet to solving this
issue. You either block some legitimate E-mail or you allow through
some spam. Since my first priority is to deliver the good E-mail, I
choose to leak a bit of the spam. Content based filters are best for
this type of thing. Sniffer will tag some payload domains that are
separate from the provider (but you might have to remove some of the
provider rules in your rule base if they false positive), and tools
that do SURBL type lookups can be useful in separating the wheat from
the chaff, though they also tend to false positive on the provider's
domains on occasion. Using IP-based RBL's to differentiate between
the good and the bad here is a losing battle, and the results are
inconsistent because of things like SpamCop.
This was a huge issue for me along with legitimate bulk-mail because
there is hardly a resource out there that doesn't have false positive
issues on this content. My solution was to identify all such
companies by way of IP space and reverse DNS entries so that I could
disable the IP4R tests (by giving credit back), and then just simply
relying on content/payload filtering to take care of the spam that
might come from them. This was a ton of work and there are new
additions to my lists all the time, but it has paid off for me.
Matt
NIck Hayer wrote:
Does anyone have a list of newsletter [revdns?] senders that are
trusting to not send spam that they would be willing to share? I send
quite a bit of time trying to figure out if some emails are actuall
valid - for example stuff from roving.com, etc.
Thanks!
-Nick
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