Re: [Design] Fwd: [Bug 6134] Edit > Delete deleted event when I expected it to delete collection

[Mimi Yin]

https://bugzilla.osafoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=6134 Forwarding Heikki's comments to the list, at least I think they're Heikki's comments (John A submitted them, but it's signed Heikki). Mimi Yin wrote: > > ISSUE: Should Chandler switch keyboard focus to the sidebar when users > > click in the sidebar? > >  > > The short explanation for why we are NOT switching focus: > > Most of the time, when user's click in the sidebar, it is NOT to switch > > their focus to the sidebar. Instead the sidebar is merely an > > intermediary or handle for changing what you see in the summary pane. As > > you click on different collections in the sidebar however, your 'mental' > > focus remains in the summary pane. Making context-dependent decision on when to move focus is tricky, but I agree that it can make the experience smoother *if it is what the user expects*. In some cases expectations can vary. I use Thunderbird, and expect the focus to switch. iCal users would also expect it to switch. Apple Mail users wouldn't. Chandler has both elements of iCal and Apple Mail...which paradigm do we follow? I don't understand why we switch focus when you are editing in the detail view but not when you are in-place editing in the calendar. When you have focus in the calendar but are not editing, clicking in the sidebar changes focus to sidebar. That's a bug then. Focus should never switch to the sidebar with just a click. There are two sub-cases for the click in the sidebar: one where you click the same collection you are in, and one where you click a different collection. In the first case you are not trying to change what you see (unless it was a mistake click), so the click cannot be seen as an intermediary in my opinion. Yes that's true. I wonder if this is too subtle a distinction to pick up as an user. What happens if you click on the same collection twice by accident? e.g. You meant to click on the collection below, but you miss? What is your expectations for clicking 1) same collection in sidebar, 2) different collection in sidebar when the initial focus is: a. focus in in-place event editor in calendar b. focus in event in calendar c. focus in calendar (but not any event) d. focus in detail view field e. focus in toolbar search box Are you asking if the behavior should be different depending on the context?  I'm not sure that there's a difference between any of these contexts. Thus far, we've identified 3 use cases for switching focus to the sidebar: 1. Deleting a collection from the sidebar 2. Using your keyboard to navigate up and down collections 3. Renaming a collection (which you can do in today's paradigm with a d-click) I can't think of any common scenarios where the likelihood of 1,2 and 3 would be more or less depending on abcd or e. f. focus in in-place editor in sidebar I would expect to exit out of edit mode. g. focus in sidebar entry I'm not sure I understand your question in the context of f and g.  What is the expectation when clicking minicalendar? Focus wouldn't shift to mini-calendar. You can't for example delete days off the mini-calendar. What is the expectation when clicking menu? Focus shifts to the menu because you are indeed changing your mental focus to the menu items. When you are trying to launch the account creation dialog, you're not longer looking at the main UI. ... Btw, when you click the week/day headers in the calendar, the focus is in the sidebar. Seems like another bug. If you click the previous or next week arrow in the calendar, focus seems to disappear. Also seems like a bug. -- Heikki Toivonen  On Jul 14, 2006, at 3:41 PM, Mimi Yin wrote: ISSUE: Should Chandler switch keyboard focus to the sidebar when users click in the sidebar? Forwarding this bug to the design list since it is turning into a discussion :o) We addressed this issue in bug 2127 and on the list  in January: https://bugzilla.osafoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=2127 Below are links to the original design list thread: + Original post: http://lists.osafoundation.org/pipermail/design/2006-January/003759.html + Summary thread: http://lists.osafoundation.org/pipermail/design/2006-January/003793.html === The short explanation for why we are NOT switching focus: Most of the time, when user's click in the sidebar, it is NOT to switch their focus to the sidebar. Instead the sidebar is merely an intermediary or handle for changing what you see in the summary pane. As you click on different collections in the sidebar however, your 'mental' focus remains in the summary pane. See Katie's anecdote about Thunderbird for a more vivid account of this idea: http://lists.osafoundation.org/pipermail/design/2006-January/003789.html By contrast when users are browsing windows / file directories in the Finder or Windows Explorer (which is where this convention comes from), you really are changing focus. You are selecting a new window. Mimi Begin forwarded message: From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: July 14, 2006 3:06:11 PM PDT To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [Bug 6134] Edit > Delete deleted event when I expected it to delete collection http://bugzilla.osafoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=6134 [EMAIL PROTECTED] changed:            What    |Removed                     |Added ----------------------------------------------------------------------------                  CC|                            |[EMAIL PROTECTED] ------- Comment #12 from [EMAIL PROTECTED]  2006-07-14 15:06 PST ------- Think of it this way: where do you expect the focus to be when you click some part of an application? I am pretty sure most people will say they expect the focus to be where they clicked, regardless of what they happened to be doing just prior to the click (assuming, of course, that the area they clicked can accept focus).  Notice that if you happen to be editing a search string in toolbar, or any field in the detail view, and click once in a sidebar entry, the focus moves to the sidebar. The only case when the focus does not move is when it is in the in-place editor in calendar - in other words, this bug. Mimi, your thoughts? --  Configure bugmail: http://bugzilla.osafoundation.org/userprefs.cgi?tab=email ------- You are receiving this mail because: ------- You are on the CC list for the bug, or are watching someone who is. _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ Open Source Applications Foundation "Design" mailing list http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/design

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