If the cordova cli was globally installed, but basically a thin wrapper like grunt-cli…
create: cordova create foo cd foo npm install —save [email protected] cordova platform add android cordova platform add ios cordova create bar cd bar npm install —save [email protected] cordova platform add ios cordova platform add android update: cd bar npm install —save [email protected] cordova update ios cordova update android ?? On 4 June 2014 at 9:23:50, Brian LeRoux ([email protected]) wrote: You know how we do it today? Just like that. On Tue, Jun 3, 2014 at 4:20 PM, Michal Mocny <[email protected]> wrote: > Brian/Tommy, may you please write out the complete set of CLI commands you > envision for: > (a) create a new project and add 2 platforms > (b) upgrade an existing project to a specific version > > I worry the current package.json proposal is more complex than we realize. > > -Michal > > > On Tue, Jun 3, 2014 at 7:17 PM, tommy-carlos williams <[email protected]> > wrote: > >> +1 >> >> >> On 4 June 2014 at 9:17:09, Brian LeRoux ([email protected]) wrote: >> >> …and use package.json to achieve a frictionless env swap on a per project >> basis, eventually making the CLI a thin shell that calls into node_modules >> ala Grunt, Gulp, etc. >> >> >> On Tue, Jun 3, 2014 at 4:07 PM, tommy-carlos williams <[email protected] >> > >> wrote: >> >> > You can’t have version x of a plugin for iOS and version y of that same >> > plugin for Android, so multiple platform versions seems like a >> complexity >> > for complexity’s sake. >> > >> > It’s true that different apps need to support different platform >> versions, >> > but I would suspect that the greatest majority of those would want the >> same >> > version of iOS and Android in app x. >> > >> > >> > >> > On 4 June 2014 at 9:04:42, Brian LeRoux ([email protected]) wrote: >> > >> > That is the thing: you do not EVER want to have disparate versions of >> > platforms. Plugins negate this potential fantasy. >> > >> > You want version locked deps. You want to use package.json to do that >> b/c >> > that is what the runtime we use has standardized itself on. >> > >> > >> > On Tue, Jun 3, 2014 at 1:12 PM, Terence M. Bandoian <[email protected]> >> > wrote: >> > >> > > A typical use case might be: >> > > >> > > -project1 >> > > -project1-ios >> > > -project1-android >> > > -project1-windows >> > > ... >> > > -projectN >> > > -projectN-ios >> > > -projectN-android >> > > -projectN-windows >> > > >> > > with a different platform version for each sub-project. >> > > >> > > Would CLI be installed globally? Locally for each sub-project? Would a >> > > project-platform have to be re-built if a plugin were added? >> > > >> > > -Terence >> > > >> > > >> > > On 6/3/2014 1:47 PM, Michal Mocny wrote: >> > > >> > >> Okay, so I think that implies: >> > >> >> > >> (a) CLI versions tied to very specific platform versions ==> to >> switch >> > >> platform versions you must switching CLI versions ==> switching one >> > >> platform version switches all platform versions. >> > >> - Andrew pointed out this is currently the case, and is a problem >> that >> > >> leads to users not updating CLI as often as they otherwise would >> > >> - I think this basically implies platforms cannot be independently >> > >> versioned (sure the semver numbers may differ, but for all practical >> > >> purposes, you would use platforms from the same release date, based >> on >> > CLI >> > >> version). >> > >> >> > >> (b) Require apps to depend on specific CLI version, assuming you mean >> > with >> > >> a local package.json: >> > >> - Now all cordova projects must be node projects, which they >> currently >> > are >> > >> not. >> > >> - Currently the cordova-cli creates apps, so we have a globally >> > installed >> > >> bootstrapping cordova-cli, and a locally installed specific version >> > >> cordova-cli, a-la grunt/gulp. (this idea was thrown around before). >> > >> - Quite a dramatic change for cordova workflow, surely larger than >> the >> > >> current proposal. >> > >> - Or we drop cordova-cli entirely and just publish grunt/gulp >> plugins to >> > >> "add cordova" to your existing web app. Thats an even more radical >> > >> departure and significant work. >> > >> >> > >> -Michal >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> On Tue, Jun 3, 2014 at 1:58 PM, Brian LeRoux <[email protected]> wrote: >> > >> >> > >> No, at least not how I'd see it done. >> > >>> >> > >>> 1.) Updating is important. Staying current: encouraged. >> > >>> 2.) I'd make my App depend on a specific CLI version. I'd call into >> > that >> > >>> using npm scripts. >> > >>> >> > >>> >> > >>> >> > >>> >> > >>> On Tue, Jun 3, 2014 at 10:48 AM, Michal Mocny <[email protected]> >> > >>> wrote: >> > >>> >> > >>> Thinking it through, if cordova platforms are deps of the CLI, to >> > >>>> >> > >>> install a >> > >>> >> > >>>> specific version you wouldn't just do: >> > >>>> >> > >>>>> npm install -g [email protected] >> > >>>>> >> > >>>> you would actually need to: >> > >>>> >> > >>>>> cd $(npm config get prefix)/lib/node_modules/cordova >> > >>>>> npm install --save [email protected] >> > >>>>> >> > >>>> ..and then remember to do that again whenever you `npm update -g` >> > >>>> ..and its harder to have multiple platform versions for different >> > >>>> >> > >>> projects >> > >>> >> > >>>> (questionable if this is useful for devs outside of cordova >> > >>>> contributors, >> > >>>> but may be useful at last test upgrades when we ship new platform >> > >>>> versions). >> > >>>> >> > >>>> -Michal >> > >>>> >> > >>>> >> > >>>> On Tue, Jun 3, 2014 at 1:28 PM, Brian LeRoux <[email protected]> wrote: >> > >>>> >> > >>>> NIH: not invented here >> > >>>>> >> > >>>>> >> > >>>>> >> > >>>>> On Tue, Jun 3, 2014 at 10:17 AM, Andrew Grieve < >> [email protected] >> > > >> > >>>>> wrote: >> > >>>>> >> > >>>>> On Tue, Jun 3, 2014 at 12:19 PM, Brian LeRoux <[email protected]> wrote: >> > >>>>> >> > >>>>>> >> > >>>>>> Actually that was >0 LOC which is a fine argument if you ask me. >> > >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>> And >> > >>> >> > >>>> we >> > >>>> >> > >>>>> both know there is much more to it than just that. lazy_load…for >> > >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>> example. >> > >>>>> >> > >>>>>> >> > >>>>>> If you're concerned about code, there is a tonne of much >> > >>>>>> >> > >>>>> lower-hanging >> > >>> >> > >>>> fruit. >> > >>>>>> >> > >>>>>> >> > >>>>>> Bundling platforms is bundling a dep that we require to operate. >> We >> > >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>> do >> > >>>> >> > >>>>> not >> > >>>>>> >> > >>>>>>> require plugins to operate. You cannot build a project without >> > >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>> having a >> > >>>> >> > >>>>> platform and, indeed, you probably want more than one. >> > >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>> I don't require blackberry to create an iOS project. But I do >> > >>>>>> require >> > >>>>>> >> > >>>>> some >> > >>>>> >> > >>>>>> plugins. We use "npm cache add" to download plugins, I don't see >> how >> > >>>>>> platforms would not work just as easily. >> > >>>>>> >> > >>>>>> >> > >>>>>> Agree that we need discreet versioning: hence why I'm advocating >> we >> > >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>> use >> > >>>> >> > >>>>> well understood, maintained, and effectively standard system for >> > >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>> doing >> > >>>> >> > >>>>> this. We do not need NIH dependencies that is what package.json is >> > >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>> for! >> > >>>> >> > >>>>> I don't know what NIH dependencies are. Googling suggests you're >> > >>>>>> >> > >>>>> talking >> > >>>> >> > >>>>> about drugs... >> > >>>>>> >> > >>>>>> We *are* using npm for downloading, we're just not making the >> user >> > >>>>>> >> > >>>>> type >> > >>> >> > >>>> it >> > >>>>> >> > >>>>>> directly. >> > >>>>>> >> > >>>>>> Mark's approach also avoids the "what-if" cases where what's in >> your >> > >>>>>> node_modules might not match what's in your platforms/ >> > >>>>>> >> > >>>>>> Does what Mark has implemented not address a use-case of yours? >> Or >> > >>>>>> >> > >>>>> are >> > >>> >> > >>>> we >> > >>>> >> > >>>>> going back & forth over personal preference? >> > >>>>>> >> > >>>>>> >> > >>>>>> >> > >>>>>> >> > >>>>>> >> > >>>>>> >> > >>>>>> >> > >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>> On Tue, Jun 3, 2014 at 9:07 AM, Andrew Grieve < >> > >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>> [email protected]> >> > >>> >> > >>>> wrote: >> > >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>> On Tue, Jun 3, 2014 at 11:34 AM, Brian LeRoux <[email protected]> >> > >>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>> wrote: >> > >>> >> > >>>> Andrew, you misunderstand. I am talking about bundling >> > >>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> platforms >> > >>> >> > >>>> directly >> > >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> as dependencies of the CLI. >> > >>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>> A trivial example: >> > >>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>> CLI >> > >>>>>>>>> '-ios >> > >>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>> Wherein, CLI declares the precise version of the platform it >> > >>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> uses. >> > >>>> >> > >>>>> We >> > >>>>> >> > >>>>>> could >> > >>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>> wildcard. I don't know that we want or need to do that. >> > >>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>> It would have identical semantics to today except the download >> > >>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> penalty >> > >>>>>> >> > >>>>>>> happens up front. (We can remove lazy_load logic. We don't have >> > >>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> to >> > >>>> >> > >>>>> maintain >> > >>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>> our own dependency manifests and caches. LESS code: good >> > >>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> thing.) >> > >>> >> > >>>> Let me paste the code for doing our own caching for you: >> > >>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> cordova_npm: function lazy_load_npm(platform) { >> > >>>>>>>> if (!(platform in platforms)) { >> > >>>>>>>> return Q.reject(new Error('Cordova library "' + >> > >>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>> platform >> > >>>> >> > >>>>> + >> > >>>>> >> > >>>>>> '" >> > >>>>>> >> > >>>>>>> not recognized.')); >> > >>>>>>>> } >> > >>>>>>>> var pkg = 'cordova-' + platform + '@' + >> > >>>>>>>> platforms[platform].version; >> > >>>>>>>> return Q.nfcall( npm.load, {cache: >> > >>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>> path.join(util.libDirectory, >> > >>>>> >> > >>>>>> 'npm_cache') }) >> > >>>>>>>> .then(function() { >> > >>>>>>>> return Q.ninvoke(npm.commands, 'cache', ['add', >> > >>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>> pkg]); >> > >>> >> > >>>> }).then(function(info) { >> > >>>>>>>> var pkgDir = path.resolve(npm.cache, info.name, >> > >>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>> info.version, >> > >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> 'package'); >> > >>>>>>>> return pkgDir; >> > >>>>>>>> }); >> > >>>>>>>> }, >> > >>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> There's really no "amount of code" argument here. >> > >>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> Adding platforms at a specific version would mean having a >> > >>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> specific >> > >>>> >> > >>>>> version >> > >>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>> of the CLI. Yes: this is way better! Explicit dependencies is >> > >>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> the >> > >>> >> > >>>> best >> > >>>>>> >> > >>>>>>> way >> > >>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>> to work w/ the small modules thing. >> > >>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>> Bundling platforms with CLI would be like bundling all of the >> > >>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>> plugins >> > >>>> >> > >>>>> with >> > >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> CLI, or like bundling every npm module with npm. >> > >>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> Devs need to be able to try out platforms at different >> versions. >> > >>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>> We >> > >>> >> > >>>> should >> > >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> not do anything that keeps users clinging to old versions of >> CLI >> > >>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>> (e.g. >> > >>>>> >> > >>>>>> they >> > >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> do this now because they don't want to update to new platforms) >> > >>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>> On Mon, Jun 2, 2014 at 7:34 PM, Michal Mocny < >> > >>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> [email protected]> >> > >>>> >> > >>>>> wrote: >> > >>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>> On Mon, Jun 2, 2014 at 10:14 PM, Andrew Grieve < >> > >>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>> [email protected] >> > >>>>>> >> > >>>>>>> wrote: >> > >>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>> Here's both flows as I understand them: >> > >>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> Direct NPM flow: >> > >>>>>>>>>>> # Downloads platform source into node_modules >> > >>>>>>>>>>> npm install [email protected] --save >> > >>>>>>>>>>> # Runs the create script and installs plugins to create >> > >>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>> platforms/ios >> > >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> cordova platform add ios --path=node_modules/cordova-ios >> > >>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> To be fair, I think with Brian's suggestion, platform add >> FOO >> > >>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>> would >> > >>>>> >> > >>>>>> by >> > >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> default look in node_modules so you wouldn't be explicit >> > >>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>> about >> > >>> >> > >>>> it, >> > >>>>> >> > >>>>>> and >> > >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> also >> > >>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>> the default cordova project package.json would depend on all >> > >>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>> the >> > >>>> >> > >>>>> latest >> > >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> versions of each platform, so the flows would actually be: >> > >>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> cordova create Foo && cd Foo >> > >>>>>>>>>>> npm install >> > >>>>>>>>>>> npm install [email protected] --save >> > >>>>>>>>>>> cordova platform add android >> > >>>>>>>>>>> cordova platform add ios >> > >>>>>>>>>>> # crazy idea? use npm post-install hooks to auto-run >> > >>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>> create/upgrade >> > >>>>>> >> > >>>>>>> so >> > >>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>> you usually don't need above two lines? >> > >>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>> Compared to: >> > >>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> cordova create Foo && cd Foo >> > >>>>>>>>>>> cordova platform add android >> > >>>>>>>>>>> cordova platform add [email protected] >> > >>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>> I think #2 is enough better that its not worth changing. >> > >>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>> Cordova-to-npm flow (as Mark's implemented): >> > >>>>>>>>>>> # Runs "npm cache add cordova-ios", then runs create script >> > >>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>> from >> > >>>>> >> > >>>>>> ~/cache/cordova-ios/bin/create >> > >>>>>>>>>>> cordova platform add [email protected] >> > >>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> - In both flows: we use npm to do all of the heavy lifting >> > >>>>>>>>>>> - In both flows: the npm module is cached in your home >> > >>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>> directory >> > >>>>> >> > >>>>>> - In both flows?: we store the plugins & platforms >> > >>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>> explicitly >> > >>> >> > >>>> within >> > >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> config.xml (Gorkem's added this) >> > >>>>>>>>>>> - In flow #1, we have a package.json & a node_modules, in >> > >>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>> #2 >> > >>> >> > >>>> we >> > >>>> >> > >>>>> don't. >> > >>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>> Why put the onus on the user to fetch the platform source >> > >>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>> when >> > >>>> >> > >>>>> it's >> > >>>>>> >> > >>>>>>> as >> > >>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>> easy >> > >>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> as running "npm cache add" under-the-hood? >> > >>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> In regards to the idea of using require() on platform >> > >>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>> scripts >> > >>> >> > >>>> instead >> > >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> of >> > >>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>> subshelling: I think this is tangental to the debate of how >> > >>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>> to >> > >>>> >> > >>>>> fetch >> > >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> the >> > >>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>> platform. >> > >>>>>>>>>>> In regards to using "npm install" directly when using the >> > >>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>> plugman >> > >>>>> >> > >>>>>> workflow: >> > >>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> Sounds good to me. >> > >>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, Jun 2, 2014 at 6:05 PM, Brian LeRoux <[email protected]> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>> wrote: >> > >>>>> >> > >>>>>> Eventually, yes. (Sort of how Grunt works now.) >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, Jun 2, 2014 at 5:52 PM, Terence M. Bandoian < >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> [email protected] >> > >>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>> wrote: >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> Can multiple versions of a platform be installed >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> side-by-side? >> > >>>>>> >> > >>>>>>> -Terence >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> On 6/2/2014 3:04 PM, Michal Mocny wrote: >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> >From original email: "Ideal future CLI uses platforms >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> just >> > >>>>> >> > >>>>>> like >> > >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> other >> > >>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> deps. >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> We lose lazy loading but network and disk is cheap so >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> it >> > >>> >> > >>>> wasn't >> > >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> really >> > >>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> important anyhow." >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Made me think Brian is proposing adding platforms to >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> cli >> > >>> >> > >>>> package.json >> > >>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> dependencies, and you would have a single global >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> install >> > >>> >> > >>>> cordova-platforms. >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Then you can override the version with an explicit >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> install >> > >>>>> >> > >>>>>> as >> > >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> he >> > >>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>> mentions >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> "npm i [email protected]". >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Personally, I think that workflow could work, and has >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> a >> > >>> >> > >>>> few >> > >>>>> >> > >>>>>> benefits, >> > >>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> but >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm not sure that option compares well to the >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> alternative >> > >>>> >> > >>>>> of >> > >>>>> >> > >>>>>> just >> > >>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>> lazy >> > >>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> loading using npm cache add as Mark has already >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> implemented >> > >>>>> >> > >>>>>> an >> > >>>>>> >> > >>>>>>> experiment >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> (anyone interested in this topic should take a look at >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> that >> > >>>>> >> > >>>>>> patch). >> > >>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>> The steps Brian & Ian outline about how to package >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> platforms >> > >>>>> >> > >>>>>> for >> > >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> release >> > >>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> to >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> npm are possibly an improvement over the old-style >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> platform-centric >> > >>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>> workflow. Instead of downloading a tarball and >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> running >> > >>> >> > >>>> a >> > >>>> >> > >>>>> create >> > >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> script, >> > >>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> you npm install and run a create() function, and that >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> can >> > >>>> >> > >>>>> more >> > >>>>>> >> > >>>>>>> easily >> > >>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> be >> > >>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> bundled into other build scripts/boilerplate. For CLI >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> workflow, >> > >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> not >> > >>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>> sure >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> that there is any real difference (as Jesse says). >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> One >> > >>> >> > >>>> note, >> > >>>>>> >> > >>>>>>> though: >> > >>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> cordova-* platforms are templates for projects, so >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> the >> > >>> >> > >>>> package.json >> > >>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> of >> > >>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> the >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> npm package itself shouldn't end up inside projects >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> that >> > >>> >> > >>>> are >> > >>>>> >> > >>>>>> created >> > >>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>> with >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> it. I think. >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> -Michal >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, Jun 2, 2014 at 3:42 PM, Ian Clelland < >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> [email protected]> >> > >>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> wrote: >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> There seems to be some confusion -- I think people >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> are >> > >>> >> > >>>> talking >> > >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> about >> > >>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> different things here, but perhaps it's just me ;) >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I thought that Brian's original suggestion was about >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> being >> > >>>>> >> > >>>>>> able >> > >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> to >> > >>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>> host >> > >>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> Cordova platforms directly on NPM. That's why each >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> one >> > >>> >> > >>>> would >> > >>>>>> >> > >>>>>>> require >> > >>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> a >> > >>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> package.json. (which would probably end up in >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <project>/platforms/<platform> in a project, but >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> that's >> > >>> >> > >>>> not >> > >>>>> >> > >>>>>> the >> > >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> point >> > >>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> of >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> it). >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> As an NPM project, we then would have the opportunity >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> (though >> > >>>>>> >> > >>>>>>> not >> > >>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>> the >> > >>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> obligation) to make all of the supporting scripts for >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> each >> > >>>>> >> > >>>>>> platform >> > >>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>> (create, build, run, etc) part of the node module, >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> for >> > >>> >> > >>>> a >> > >>>> >> > >>>>> uniform >> > >>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>> interface >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> that doesn't require going through the command line. >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> It's not about making platforms into CLI dependencies >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> (any >> > >>>>> >> > >>>>>> more >> > >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> than >> > >>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> plugins are CLI dependencies right now), or about >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> making >> > >>>> >> > >>>>> a >> > >>>>> >> > >>>>>> cordova-based >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> project into a node package. >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> If that's right, then I support that -- I'd like the >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> platforms >> > >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> to >> > >>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>> be >> > >>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> installable through npm, and to be versioned >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> separately, >> > >>>> >> > >>>>> installable >> > >>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> separately, and scriptable without having to spawn >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> subshells. >> > >>>>>> >> > >>>>>>> And if I have it completely wrong, then let me know >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> -- >> > >>> >> > >>>> I'll >> > >>>>> >> > >>>>>> just >> > >>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>> go >> > >>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>> back >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> to >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> fixing File bugs ;) >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, Jun 2, 2014 at 3:29 PM, Andrew Grieve < >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> [email protected]> >> > >>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> wrote: >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Not sure what your question is. >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, Jun 2, 2014 at 2:03 PM, Brian LeRoux < >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> [email protected]> >> > >>>>> >> > >>>>>> wrote: >> > >>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>> *ahem >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Wed, May 28, 2014 at 11:20 AM, Brian LeRoux < >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> [email protected] >> > >>>>>> >> > >>>>>>> wrote: >> > >>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> npm i [email protected] >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Right? >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On May 27, 2014 11:06 PM, "Andrew Grieve" < >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> [email protected] >> > >>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>> wrote: >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Lazy loading is what will give us the ability to >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> support >> > >>>>> >> > >>>>>> multiple >> > >>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>> versions >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> of platforms. >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> If we don't support users choosing the version of >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the >> > >>>> >> > >>>>> platform >> > >>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>> they >> > >>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> want, >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> then they will resist updating their version of >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> CLI >> > >>> >> > >>>> (like >> > >>>>>> >> > >>>>>>> they >> > >>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>> do >> > >>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> right >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> now). >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm very keen to allow users to chose their >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> platform >> > >>>> >> > >>>>> versions, >> > >>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>> just >> > >>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> as >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> they >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> are able to choose their plugin versions. >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Tue, May 27, 2014 at 5:57 PM, Mark Koudritsky >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> < >> > >>> >> > >>>> [email protected] >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote: >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> +1 >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Steve published (some of?) the platforms on npm >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> as >> > >>> >> > >>>> part >> > >>>>>> >> > >>>>>>> of >> > >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> the >> > >>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>> latest >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> release. >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> https://www.npmjs.org/package/cordova-android >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> https://www.npmjs.org/package/cordova-ios >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> CLI already require()s npm for downloading >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> plugins >> > >>> >> > >>>> from >> > >>>>>> >> > >>>>>>> the >> > >>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>> registry. >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Extending this to platforms is on my todo list for >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> this\next >> > >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> week. >> > >>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> The "lazy" part of the loading was about >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> caching, >> > >>> >> > >>>> so >> > >>>> >> > >>>>> we >> > >>>>>> >> > >>>>>>> don't >> > >>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>> lose >> > >>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> it >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> since >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> npm does its own caching. >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Tue, May 27, 2014 at 5:42 PM, Parashuram >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Narasimhan >> > >>>>> >> > >>>>>> (MS >> > >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> OPEN >> > >>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> TECH) >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> < >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> [email protected]> wrote: >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> +1. This will also be a step towards releasing >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> platforms >> > >>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>> independently. >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Will the CLI have a semver like dependency on >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >> > >> >> >
