I don’t think you can currently do that, though, not without having the
exact issue we’re discussing.

That is, TLS doesn’t require a POP, there are no rules that require CAs
require a POP (and, as discussed, good reason for that), so if you see
another CA has revoked a cert, you cannot safely revoke certs within your
database.

There’s been some discussion about this in the past, where CAs aren’t
expected to comb other CA’s CRLs, and from a “Delegated Third Party”
perspective, reasonable to not do that.

So if CAs are doing it today, they’re already in a bad spot - and this
would help correct it?

On Wed, Feb 2, 2022 at 6:19 PM Seo Suchan <[email protected]> wrote:

> I'm not really sure about weaking the meaning of keycompromise. Currently
> if I saw a cert revoked it by keycompomised then one can throw its public
> key into 'leaked keys' bin and propargate key-purging between CA by
> pointing other CAs revoke this certifiate with same key as compromised-
> like multiple smime certificates from different CAs as there is no CT and
> first one who revoked key may not know that second cert with same key exsit.
>
> although right thing to do such case would be notify the original holder
> in first revocation and let subscriber call the key with other CA they
> signed or have some kind of central leaked-publickey-here repository.
>
> sent again, to the list this time
> 2022-02-03 오전 7:35에 Ryan Sleevi 이(가) 쓴 글:
>
>
>
> On Wed, Feb 2, 2022 at 7:25 AM Doug Beattie <[email protected]>
> wrote:
>
>> Will the CA block further issuance when the request for revocation does
>> not include PoP which could DoS them for renewal using the same key pair?
>>   To me, if the subscriber can’t provide PoP of the private key the
>> unspecified reason code would be more accurate.  What’s the value to the
>> subscriber, CA and ecosystem to treat that case as key compromise vs.
>> unspecified?
>>
>>
>>
>> I’m probably just not understanding the background and value for the
>> second rule around processing requests for revocation with key compromise
>> without PoP.
>>
>
> As hopefully my reply to Aaron captured a little, it's about where the
> burden rests.
>
> Today, for most TLS issuance, no POP is required. That's because TLS
> itself doesn't need a POP, because it's an online protocol - the POP is
> delivered in-band, and it's not an identity-attestation system based on a
> directory (e.g. compared to S/MIME, where a sender needs to look up your
> public key ahead of time to encrypt something to you)
>
> So the functional change of requiring the POP is that very few people,
> today, could request keyCompromise without doing more work. That's not
> ideal.
> Further, however, is that for situations that are not uncommon, such as
> malicious deletion or ransomware, there is zero guarantee the victim would
> be able to prove keyCompromise at that time.
>
> This is very similar to the discussions in the past of how many hoops a CA
> can place to request revocation (i.e. "You can only request revocation on
> the fifth Tuesday of every February under the full moon"). For Subscribers,
> and users, this matters.
>
> However, an additional consideration is that keyCompromise revocations
> *are* likely more valuable than other forms of revocations, both in terms
> of efficient and timely delivery and in user risk. A policy that restricts
> when and how Subscribers can request this revocation is thus one that
> limits the value of that, by making it harder, which harms end users more.
> The more barriers placed for Subscribers, the harder it is to get this
> information in a timely fashion.
>
> So, to end users, it's ideal where Subscribers can request any revocation
> reason that they want (... within reason), and for imposing obligations on
> CAs, to use particular revocation reasons when they're made aware, either
> internally or by externally reports. That protects users the most.
>
> However, because there's no POP, that does offer _some_ abuse scenarios
> from malicious entities wishing to abuse the policies, and so some
> safeguards are needed. The question posed to this group is, seemingly, do
> we want to throw the baby out with the bathwater? Namely, should
> Subscribers have flexibility to (as easily as possible) request the method
> of their choice, or is the risk of abuse too great to trust them?
>
> I'd like to find a solution where we can empower Subscribers as much as
> possible, because that can help protect Users the greatest. I think you're
> right that we want to figure out how to narrowly scope the abuse scenarios,
> so definitely, thanks for raising 6.1.1.3. We should try to find a way to
> best balance things, don't you agree?
>
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