All, Here's a slightly modified proposal to take the feedback so far into account: the suggestion is to use Drools for anything related to rules, jBPM for everything related to business processes (BPMN2), SonataFlow for everything related to Serverless Workflow, Kogito for supporting services like persistence, data index and job service, and kie just for anything that doesn't fit any or does fit all of the other categories.
I added a counter-proposal to the document in a column D in the same spreadsheet: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1gsttRcXGtwGQO469EYFDhLxJLEA7Kl3gmioR6XhGhjY/edit#gid=0 Please let us know what you think. Thx, Kris On Tue, Oct 31, 2023 at 6:45 PM Alex Porcelli <a...@porcelli.me> wrote: > Ricardo, > > One concern that I have with the proposed renames is the complete > vanish of the Kogito brand. Although I always agreed that we need to > reposition the brands, I also have concerns to basically make one of > them - that got some decent public coverage in recent years - > completely disappear. > > My suggestion is to revisit the list and get some components to keep > the Kogito brand. My inital suggestion are persistence, data-index and > job scheduler components to be kept under Kogito. > > I also see some components that are planned to be removed like PMML, > Tracing and Predictions that I don't get why. > > On Tue, Oct 24, 2023 at 2:42 PM ricardo zanini fernandes > <ricardozan...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > > Alex, > > > > As discussed here's the spreadsheet: > > > https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1gsttRcXGtwGQO469EYFDhLxJLEA7Kl3gmioR6XhGhjY/edit#gid=0 > > (anyone can edit) > > > > It contains only the Quarkus Add-ons for now, I'll add the remaining > > libraries tomorrow if we all agree with this format. > > > > @Jason, we decided to table this discussion for now. We need to rename > > Kogito SW, and other add-ons to reflect the implementation to release. We > > won't add Apache prefix anywhere at this time. > > > > Cheers! > > -- > > > > > > On Mon, Oct 23, 2023 at 11:17 AM Jason Porter <lightguar...@apache.org> > > wrote: > > > > > I just checked https://groovy.apache.org/download.html#distro and it > does > > > look like Groovy has moved all of their GAV to org.apache.groovy. At > some > > > point we'll need to do the same thing. > > > > > > On 2023/10/23 14:01:12 Jason Porter wrote: > > > > I missed some of this discussion as I was out on Friday. We should > look > > > at what Groovy has done. They’re probably the biggest project that is > in a > > > similar space (Java, Maven, number of artifacts, etc.) to us and has > moved > > > over. I suggest we follow what they have done. > > > > > > > > -- > > > > Jason Porter > > > > Software Engineer > > > > He/Him/His > > > > > > > > IBM > > > > > > > > > > > > From: ricardo zanini fernandes <ricardozan...@gmail.com> > > > > Date: Friday, October 20, 2023 at 13:53 > > > > To: dev@kie.apache.org <dev@kie.apache.org> > > > > Subject: [EXTERNAL] Re: [PROPOSAL] Renaming Kogito SW artifacts to > > > KIE/SonataFlow > > > > As discussed offline, I'm gonna create a spreadsheet with the > renaming > > > > proposition and share it in this thread. > > > > > > > > We table the discussion about `apache` prefixing in GAV/namespaces > for > > > now. > > > > > > > > > > > > On Fri, Oct 20, 2023 at 2:20 PM Alex Porcelli <porce...@apache.org> > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > You have a point in regarding the change of all GAVs. > > > > > > > > > > My suggestion is to table that discussion for now, work on the > > > inventory > > > > > and proposed changes. Once we have it done, we may start a new > thread > > > about > > > > > GAVs. > > > > > > > > > > Wdyt? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Fri, Oct 20, 2023 at 1:07 PM ricardo zanini fernandes < > > > > > ricardozan...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > Alex, I can create and share this spreadsheet, so we can start > > > working on > > > > > > it. > > > > > > > > > > > > IMHO, we shouldn't start adding apache prefixes in some > components > > > and > > > > > not > > > > > > in others. > > > > > > If we ought to add it, I'd rather add everything at once. > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Fri, Oct 20, 2023 at 1:58 PM Alex Porcelli <a...@porcelli.me> > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ricardo, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Besides the SonataFlow proposed changes, Mario already > mentioned a > > > > > > similar > > > > > > > change in Drools, and we'll need similar adjustments for jBPM. > We > > > > > should > > > > > > > collectively create a spreadsheet to be shared in this thread > with > > > an > > > > > > > inventory of the extensions we have with the suggested change; > we > > > look > > > > > to > > > > > > > this in a more comprehensive approach other than local to > > > SonataFlow. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regarding the use of the Apache prefix, even if we are not > > > necessarily > > > > > > > required to adopt it right away, it's inevitable that we'll > have to > > > > > start > > > > > > > using it at some point. Given that we're already discussing a > reset > > > > > with > > > > > > > 10.x, it would help to make the message even more apparent and > > > sharper > > > > > to > > > > > > > incorporate the Apache prefix in the proposed changes that > we'll > > > have > > > > > in > > > > > > > the spreadsheet. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To be more clear and precise, the Apache prefix is expected to > be > > > > > > > incorporated only into the components in the spreadsheet AND > > > nothing > > > > > > else, > > > > > > > so no complete change of GAVs or namespaces. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Fri, Oct 20, 2023 at 8:51 AM ricardo zanini fernandes < > > > > > > > ricardozan...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hi Jason! Are we required to change namespaces/GAV to include > > > > > `apache`? > > > > > > > I'd > > > > > > > > instead do this simple change now since we must move on with > > > > > > SonataFlow, > > > > > > > > and then rethink all modules to include "org.apache.kie" > prefix. > > > > > > > Honestly, > > > > > > > > if we are not required, I'd keep the naming we have today. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Fri, Oct 20, 2023 at 12:54 AM Jason Porter > > > > > <jpor...@ibm.com.invalid > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > We don’t have to rename current code, but new code will > need > > > to be > > > > > > > > > org.apache (sonataflow is probably fine). I was thinking if > > > we’re > > > > > > going > > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > rename packages group id now, we might as well make it > Apache > > > and > > > > > > only > > > > > > > do > > > > > > > > > it once. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > > > > > Jason Porter > > > > > > > > > Software Engineer > > > > > > > > > He/Him/His > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > IBM > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > From: ricardo zanini fernandes <ricardozan...@gmail.com> > > > > > > > > > Date: Thursday, October 19, 2023 at 11:47 > > > > > > > > > To: dev@kie.apache.org <dev@kie.apache.org> > > > > > > > > > Subject: [EXTERNAL] Re: [PROPOSAL] Renaming Kogito SW > > > artifacts to > > > > > > > > > KIE/SonataFlow > > > > > > > > > We have org.drools, org.jbpm, hence org.sonataflow. Can't > we > > > keep > > > > > > this > > > > > > > > > ubiquity? org.kie.apache.sonataflow is too large, IMO. If > we > > > go for > > > > > > > > > org.apache.sonataflow, then maybe renaming everything else > to > > > > > follow > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > same pattern? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Thu, Oct 19, 2023 at 2:30 PM Jason Porter < > > > > > > lightguar...@apache.org> > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I'm +0 on this. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If we're going to rename it to SonataFlow, should we not > > > make it > > > > > > > > > > org.apache.kie.sonataflow or something similar under the > > > Apache > > > > > > name? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On 2023/10/19 12:42:53 ricardo zanini fernandes wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > Friends, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Since we moved from "Kogito Serverless Workflow" to > > > > > "SonataFlow" > > > > > > > > > project > > > > > > > > > > > I'd like to propose a naming change to those artifacts > > > > > targeting > > > > > > > > 10.x. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Some are *only* related to SW which is implementation > > > > > specifics. > > > > > > We > > > > > > > > can > > > > > > > > > > > change to SonataFlow, for example: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Description Extension Target > > > > > > > > > > > Runtime development tools for SonataFlow > > > > > > > > > > > org.kie.kogito:kogito-quarkus-serverless-workflow-devui > > > > > > > > > > > org.sonataflow:sonataflow-quarkus-devui > > > > > > > > > > > SonataFlow Add-On - Includes OpenApi Client, the > Process > > > > > engine, > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > Knative Eventing capabilities > > > > > > > > > > > org.kie.kogito:kogito-quarkus-serverless-workflow > > > > > > > > > > > org.sonataflow:sonataflow-quarkus > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Another renaming is targeting Kogito Quarkus Add-Ons > to KIE > > > > > > Quarkus > > > > > > > > > > Add-Ons > > > > > > > > > > > for generic proposes (works for SonataFlow, jBPM, > Drools, > > > etc). > > > > > > For > > > > > > > > > > example: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Description Extension Target > > > > > > > > > > > KIE Data Index Infinispan Add-On > > > > > > > > > > > > org.kie.kogito:kogito-addons-quarkus-data-index-infinispan > > > > > > > > > > > org.kie:kie-addons-quarkus-data-index-infinispan > > > > > > > > > > > KIE Data Index In-memory Add-On > > > > > > > > > > > > org.kie.kogito:kogito-addons-quarkus-data-index-inmemory > > > > > > > > > > > org.kie:kie-addons-quarkus-data-index-inmemory > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > There are also jBPM specifics, which I propose: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Description Extension Target > > > > > > > > > > > jBPM Add-On for e-mail support on Human Tasks. > > > > > > > > > > > org.kie.kogito:kogito-addons-quarkus-mail > > > > > > > > > > org.jbpm:jbpm-addons-quarkus-mail > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To keep things simple for now, we can refrain from > renaming > > > > > > > > namespaces, > > > > > > > > > > but > > > > > > > > > > > GAV is important since we are moving to 10.x., so we > start > > > > > fresh. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If we agree, I can keep a spreadsheet with all the > renames > > > and > > > > > > > share > > > > > > > > it > > > > > > > > > > > with the community. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Cheers! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > > > > > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@kie.apache.org > > > > > > > > > > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@kie.apache.org > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@kie.apache.org > > > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@kie.apache.org > > > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@kie.apache.org > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@kie.apache.org > >
