Hello
Daniel Carrera wrote:
Jacqueline McNally wrote:Daniel wrote:
In response to Louis advising that Anthony is helping to produce stats, Daniels response (restored) was:
Did you give Anthony Long CVS access to stats.openoffice.org ?
If you do, then you'll be able to forget about stats and focus your time on all the other things that need to get done.
Mmm, I think I read very recently if not on this list, definitely on another OOo list, that noone here can direct others to particular tasks.
I didn't direct anyone to any particular task in this email.
I am not going to engage you on pedantic use of language here.
While not specifying the tasks, you are essentially saying: "Louis, don't do stats, do other things". It is up to Louis how he spends his time.
If I was Louis, I would find your response both arrogant and meaningless to the discussion. I have collated further examples of this issue below.
At least on this list and other MP lists, as far as I can tell, you are the one who initiates the antagonistic style.
I don't really.
Here are recent and historical examples:
On discuss@ http://www.openoffice.org/servlets/ReadMsg?list=discuss&msgNo=47355 and Pavel responded http://www.openoffice.org/servlets/ReadMsg?list=discuss&msgNo=47361
On [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://marketing.openoffice.org/servlets/ReadMsg?list=art&msgNo=488&raw=true
On [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://council.openoffice.org/servlets/ReadMsg?list=discuss&msgNo=463
One of your repetitious points on this list and the subject of a recent presentation was the way volunteers should be encouraged.
I'd like to share an example of that with you. The following archived thread came about after I encouraged an oooforum poster to share his ideas with the website project. I hope all list subscribers will read through the thread and decide if there is an issue with encouragement and fostering participation in the OOo community. Note: www.oooforum.org is not responding today so I was not able to provide the link.
http://website.openoffice.org/servlets/ReadMsg?list=dev&msgNo=6445 Use "Next in thread" to follow the responses chronologically.
The prologue to this is that I have not seen any further contribution to the project from Tony; which is our loss.
Daniel, I view a large part of the community discussion, and discussion in other collaborative communities, so I have a good measure of how you have responded to discussion about this issue.
I didn't initiate the argument at the businesscard thread for example.
I, like a few other people, didn't follow it. Some subscribers contacted me offlist to say that they have unsubscribed as a result of this thread (and others). This is how I became aware of the thread.
I'm actually sorry I did not see your first post, as I would have suggested following through with your idea on [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Now, I know I am blunt about problems at OOo. But I don't think that's bad because I make an effort not to attack people, or engage in adhiminem. I complain about issues, not individuals.
I would like to believe this, but if you scan the archives of this list (http://marketing.openoffice.org/servlets/SummarizeList?listName=dev), the Website Project list (http://website.openoffice.org/servlets/SummarizeList?listName=dev), or any of the lists I've mentioned above and search for the "Sender" you will see the style and tone is very different to how you post on [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://user-faq.openoffice.org/servlets/SummarizeList?listName=authors
I know that everyone here honestly wants to do their best to help OOo, and no one is acting out of malice. But I can still point to problems and solutions when I see them.
Like this: http://dcarrera.blogspot.com/2005/02/business-cards-just-did-it.html ?
I considered changing the subject of this mail from list etiquette to project or community etiquette.
It's great that you wished to find additional designs for your business card (having discovered they are essential for conferences), but the best way to contribute is to participate. The Art Project has its own list, web space and galleries that form part of the MP. If you do not wish to participate in the OOo community or more specifically the MP, that is ok, but please do not accuse us of not doing anything because project members did not actively support or contribute to this or other proposed activities.
This list ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) is used to coordinate marketing tasks and activities. These tasks and activities occur online within the MP and sometimes, marketing elements need to be considered in other projects such as Website, BizDev, and Distribution.
As an example of collaboration and contribution to the MP, read Cristian's private mail [with permission] to me as to why he wanted to instigate an Art Project:
<quote> I drafted a poster for OOo. I did this after I have looked into the relevant issues in MP especially to see what work has been done untill now in the area and saw one poster there.
After posting the link to the poster draft on [EMAIL PROTECTED], I discovered that there are more other posters out there but which are unknown to the marketing project. (i.e. Vitor posted links to his native lang project's posters). Seeing that I came up with the idea that everybody should upload their posters on the wallpapers site in order to be easily found in a central place. This evolved into the Art project idea after that.
In the same idea, I once needed OOo business cards and found none. I was in a hurry that time and I was not able to ask on lists about them. Some days ago when I asked, I discovered that almost everybody has at least one OOo business cards design, all different. But they cannot be found unless you ask on the lists and receive links or attachments. This also raises another point: unified visual identity. But this is another subject. <end quote>
Also, taking a position you don't like is not antagonism. The email you are responding to is certainly not antagonistic, and it wasn't even particularly off topic.
The tone used was a lot softer than previous responses but I do consider it to be antagonistic. Also, I wished to address it before others did and under an appropriate subject, that is, not "stats updated".
Your response was OT. Replies that I can think of are:
- congratulating Anthony - asking what his interest is in the Stats Project - commenting on Louis' statement about 1.1.4
Louis talked about making a task more efficient, and I talked about tasks in general being more efficient. If something I said was rude, then I sincerely apolgize. Rudeness was not intended.
I consider your reply to be OT and as a minimum rude. If people read it in isolation they probably will say that I'm going overboard. But, in context with other posts within the OOo community and on this list, the continual barrage of all that is wrong, and very few mentions of what is right is destructive and an insult to all those people who are participating within the OOo community and doing good things.
Jacqueline McNally Lead, OpenOffice.org Marketing Project
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