Kovas Boguta https://twitter.com/kovasb, from the Clojure/AI community, graciously took some time to review the PR for the clojure package.
He had some insightful feedback and high level questions that I thought might be of interest to the larger dev mailing list. https://github.com/apache/incubator-mxnet/pull/11205 Feel free to join in on the discussion here or on the PR. - Carin On Mon, Jun 11, 2018 at 6:49 PM, Carin Meier <[email protected]> wrote: > I'm fine with whatever process works best and what makes everyone the most > comfortable. > > I've completed one of the requests for code coverage and integrated the > cloverage, (https://github.com/cloverage/cloverage), plugin in the PR > branch. I've published the results to the confluence page to help with > transparency and give everyone a better idea where the level of testing is > currently. > https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/MXNET/ > Clojure+Package+Contribution+Needs > > > > On Mon, Jun 11, 2018 at 6:24 PM, Marco de Abreu < > [email protected]> wrote: > >> Exactly, that's what I'm proposing. Having the migration in multiple >> separate PRs which are done in sequence. This would mean that the initial >> PRs might not be tested. >> We could make the factors you mentioned acceptance criteria to be moved >> out >> of contrib. >> >> -Marco >> >> On Mon, Jun 11, 2018 at 3:17 PM Naveen Swamy <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> > I did not suggest to do it at once. I am not comfortable to merge code >> > without good tests, documentation and examples that is not to say >> Clojure >> > codebase does not have that. >> > All that you are saying can happen in separate PRs if you want to break >> it >> > up. >> > >> > >> > On Tue, Jun 12, 2018 at 12:07 AM, Marco de Abreu < >> > [email protected]> wrote: >> > >> > > The problem I see here is that the migration will have different type >> of >> > > challenges which should be handled isolated. Trying to solve them all >> at >> > > once will make it very lengthy and also hard to review. Considering >> Carin >> > > and her team this is doing this on a voluntary base, I'd like to keep >> the >> > > number of hoops to jump through per stage as small as possible and >> rather >> > > split it up into multiple efforts. >> > > >> > > If we would do everything at once, we'd have to involve a lot of >> people >> > and >> > > it would be hard to review. We'd need at least two or three reviewers >> > > involved in that process: You (or another committer familiar with >> Scala >> > to >> > > review the Scala part), Yi Zhi (general reviewer) and me (CI >> > integration). >> > > It would probably require even more committers for other stuff that >> comes >> > > up. It would rather be better to keep the parts that have to be >> touched >> > as >> > > isolated and few as possible. >> > > For example, after the code has been approved and merged in general, I >> > can >> > > assist with the CI integration. This would not require oversight from >> > other >> > > committers, so they'd be free. After that, we'd need somebody familiar >> > with >> > > the release process (probably Naveen) and I'd be free after that. >> Then we >> > > need general improvements which would also involve other people again. >> > > Trying to squeeze everything into a single stage is going to make it >> very >> > > hard in my opinion. >> > > >> > > >> > > -Marco >> > > >> > > On Mon, Jun 11, 2018 at 2:56 PM Naveen Swamy <[email protected]> >> wrote: >> > > >> > > > I disagree with your approach, We should bring features iteratively >> > well >> > > > tested and well documented. MXNet already has many different >> language >> > > > bindings which has quite a bit of tech-debt, I don't want just to >> add >> > > more >> > > > tech-debt to the code base with new language bindings as well. >> > > > >> > > > On Mon, Jun 11, 2018 at 11:17 PM, Marco de Abreu < >> > > > [email protected]> wrote: >> > > > >> > > > > I think we should try to separate this migration into multiple >> > stages: >> > > > > 1. Move into contrib >> > > > > 2. Migrate release pipeline >> > > > > 3. Migrate tests >> > > > > 4. Improvements >> > > > > 5. Mark as stable and announce Julia officially >> > > > > >> > > > > I know how much effort Carin and the other maintainers are putting >> > into >> > > > > that project and thus I'd like to make the migration as easy as >> > > possible. >> > > > > If we try to cover release, test and improvements from Day 1, >> we're >> > > going >> > > > > to make the entire migration a very hard and lengthy process. >> > > Considering >> > > > > the project already has its own CI and maintains a high code >> quality, >> > > I'm >> > > > > confident that some time without CI would be fine. We should make >> > this >> > > > > iteratively. The first big goal would really be to have the >> project >> > in >> > > > our >> > > > > repository - everything else can be followed up later on. >> > > > > >> > > > > -Marco >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > On Sun, Jun 10, 2018 at 8:08 AM Carin Meier <[email protected] >> > >> > > > wrote: >> > > > > >> > > > > > Oh great. Thanks, Chen for clarifying. That's correct, the >> Clojure >> > > uses >> > > > > the >> > > > > > Scala generation which makes use of this :) >> > > > > > >> > > > > > On Sun, Jun 10, 2018 at 9:59 AM, Naveen Swamy < >> [email protected]> >> > > > > wrote: >> > > > > > >> > > > > > > No need to be disappointed, Scala generated APIs by code >> > generation >> > > > for >> > > > > > > ndarray and symbol and if clojure depends on Scala it get >> those >> > as >> > > > > well. >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > On Jun 10, 2018, at 3:40 PM, Chen HY <[email protected] >> > >> > > > wrote: >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > Yep. An example is the cpp port used following code to >> generate >> > > > op.h >> > > > > > > > automatically. >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > https://github.com/apache/incubator-mxnet/blob/master/ >> > > > > > > cpp-package/scripts/OpWrapperGenerator.py >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > It makes easier for everyone to follow up with the latest >> APIs. >> > > > > > > > It is disappointing if the python version supports the >> latest >> > API >> > > > but >> > > > > > the >> > > > > > > > version of your favorite language doesn't. >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > 2018-06-10 14:19 GMT+01:00 Naveen Swamy <[email protected] >> >: >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> this is fantastic, thanks for being a champ. I am glad to >> have >> > > you >> > > > > > join >> > > > > > > us >> > > > > > > >> :). Yes, we would love to make it work and be available for >> > our >> > > > > users, >> > > > > > > you >> > > > > > > >> can make features available iteratively. I understand you >> > alone >> > > > > can't >> > > > > > > have >> > > > > > > >> everything in one go, I am hoping more contributors will >> join >> > > the >> > > > > > > effort. >> > > > > > > >> >> > > > > > > >> My guess is Chen is recommending generation of Clojure code >> > from >> > > > > > Scala. >> > > > > > > >> >> > > > > > > >>> On Sun, Jun 10, 2018 at 2:55 PM, Carin Meier < >> > > > [email protected] >> > > > > > >> > > > > > > wrote: >> > > > > > > >>> >> > > > > > > >>> Naveen, >> > > > > > > >>> >> > > > > > > >>> Thanks. I appreciate your help. I acknowledge there are >> some >> > > > > > challenges >> > > > > > > >> in >> > > > > > > >>> trying to bring in a new language package, but I think if >> we >> > > can >> > > > > make >> > > > > > > it >> > > > > > > >>> work, it will be the best way for it to grow along with >> the >> > > MXNet >> > > > > > > project >> > > > > > > >>> and be a good fit with its goals and ecosystem long term. >> > > > > > > >>> >> > > > > > > >>> I added a confluence page of the general state of what is >> > > working >> > > > > and >> > > > > > > >> needs >> > > > > > > >>> help. >> > > > > > > >>> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/MXNET/ >> > > > > > > >>> Clojure+Package+Contribution+Needs. >> > > > > > > >>> Feel free to edit. >> > > > > > > >>> >> > > > > > > >>> Chen, >> > > > > > > >>> >> > > > > > > >>> I added the code generator use on the page as well. I >> don't >> > > fully >> > > > > > > >>> understand what you are proposing, but I would like to. If >> > you >> > > > > could >> > > > > > > >>> provide some more details to help me, that would be great. >> > > > > > > >>> >> > > > > > > >>> - Carin >> > > > > > > >>> >> > > > > > > >>> >> > > > > > > >>>> On Sun, Jun 10, 2018 at 8:00 AM, Chen HY < >> > > [email protected] >> > > > > >> > > > > > > wrote: >> > > > > > > >>>> >> > > > > > > >>>> I personally think that is the reason the clojure package >> > > should >> > > > > use >> > > > > > > >> more >> > > > > > > >>>> code generator. >> > > > > > > >>>> It makes easier to build everything align with scala >> > package. >> > > > > > > >>>> >> > > > > > > >>>> 2018-06-10 12:45 GMT+01:00 Naveen Swamy < >> [email protected] >> > >: >> > > > > > > >>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>> I have called for contribution within my organization to >> > help >> > > > > with >> > > > > > > >> the >> > > > > > > >>>>> review, some of them have shown interest and hope to see >> > them >> > > > > help >> > > > > > > >> with >> > > > > > > >>>> the >> > > > > > > >>>>> review. Carin, I learnt you are popular to have given >> great >> > > > talks >> > > > > > on >> > > > > > > >>>>> Clojure. >> > > > > > > >>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>> Could I please ask you document what functionality is >> > working >> > > > and >> > > > > > > >> what >> > > > > > > >>>>> parts of it need contribution. >> > > > > > > >>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>> In general I want to request a few things: >> > > > > > > >>>>> Good API documentation, >> > > > > > > >>>>> Examples, turn examples into integration tests. >> > > > > > > >>>>> Tests, more tests >> > > > > > > >>>>> Everything testable on CI. >> > > > > > > >>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>> In the long term, We have to think how to maintain API >> > > > > > compatibility >> > > > > > > >>> and >> > > > > > > >>>>> tests across language bindings. >> > > > > > > >>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>> Thanks, Naveen >> > > > > > > >>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>> On Sat, Jun 9, 2018 at 2:38 AM, YiZhi Liu < >> > > [email protected] >> > > > > >> > > > > > > >> wrote: >> > > > > > > >>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>> Carin, >> > > > > > > >>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>> Thank you for the great work. I'll do the review. As I >> > have >> > > no >> > > > > > > >>>>>> expertise in Clojure, it will really help to have >> people >> > > from >> > > > > > > >> Clojure >> > > > > > > >>>>>> community reviewing it as well :) >> > > > > > > >>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>> 2018-06-08 14:22 GMT-07:00 Carin Meier < >> > > [email protected] >> > > > >: >> > > > > > > >>>>>>> A couple of questions came up in regard to the PR and >> the >> > > > > current >> > > > > > > >>>> test >> > > > > > > >>>>>>> suite state as well as the best way to review the PR >> > since >> > > it >> > > > > is >> > > > > > > >> a >> > > > > > > >>>> new >> > > > > > > >>>>>>> language binding. >> > > > > > > >>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>> In regards to the Clojure test suite, most of the >> Scala >> > > test >> > > > > > > >> suite >> > > > > > > >>>> has >> > > > > > > >>>>>> been >> > > > > > > >>>>>>> ported over with the goal of having comparable >> coverage. >> > I >> > > > can >> > > > > go >> > > > > > > >>>>> ahead a >> > > > > > > >>>>>>> put in a coverage tool to make that it a bit more >> > > > transparent. >> > > > > > > >>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>> For reviewing, I have a couple people in the Clojure >> > > > community >> > > > > > > >> that >> > > > > > > >>>> are >> > > > > > > >>>>>>> interested in collaborating in this project and I can >> ask >> > > > them >> > > > > > > >> for >> > > > > > > >>>> help >> > > > > > > >>>>>> in >> > > > > > > >>>>>>> reviewing the PR in some way if that is helpful too. >> > > > > > > >>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>> I'm also open to other suggestions. >> > > > > > > >>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>> Thanks, >> > > > > > > >>>>>>> Carin >> > > > > > > >>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>> On Fri, Jun 8, 2018 at 4:06 PM, Carin Meier < >> > > > > > > >> [email protected]> >> > > > > > > >>>>>> wrote: >> > > > > > > >>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Here is the PR https://github.com/apache/ >> > > > > > > >>> incubator-mxnet/pull/11205 >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>> I've ported in the content from the external github >> > repo ( >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>> https://github.com/gigasquid/clojure-mxnet), that >> has >> > > been >> > > > > > > >> tested >> > > > > > > >>>> by >> > > > > > > >>>>>> some >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>> of the Clojure community, into the contrib directory. >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>> There is still lots more to do in relation to adding >> > > tests, >> > > > > > > >>>>> benchmarks, >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>> and increasing stability, but I thought this might >> be a >> > > good >> > > > > > > >> point >> > > > > > > >>>> to >> > > > > > > >>>>>> bring >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>> it in initially so that the other work can be >> reviewed >> > in >> > > > > > > >> smaller >> > > > > > > >>>>>> chunks. >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>> I also would like to get other people involved in >> making >> > > it >> > > > > > > >>> better, >> > > > > > > >>>>> so I >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>> thought that having the base package in there would >> be a >> > > > good >> > > > > > > >>>> starting >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>> point for collaboration. >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Feedback welcome. >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>> - Carin >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>> On Tue, Jun 5, 2018 at 11:40 AM, Carin Meier < >> > > > > > > >>> [email protected]> >> > > > > > > >>>>>> wrote: >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Thanks everyone. I'll work on getting together a PR >> > with >> > > > your >> > > > > > > >>>>> feedback >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> and post it here. >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> On Tue, Jun 5, 2018 at 4:05 AM, Chen HY < >> > > > > [email protected] >> > > > > > > >>> >> > > > > > > >>>>> wrote: >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> I would suggest using code generators in case >> upstream >> > > > > library >> > > > > > > >>>>> adding >> > > > > > > >>>>>> the >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> functions for arrays. >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> It seems that cpp binding is using a code generator >> > and >> > > > > works >> > > > > > > >>>> fine. >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> 2018-06-05 7:59 GMT+01:00 Naveen Swamy < >> > > > [email protected] >> > > > > >: >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> ~/mxnet/contrib/clojure-package good place for >> the >> > > code. >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> the package name org.apache.mxnet.contrib.clojure >> ? >> > do >> > > > you >> > > > > > > >>> need >> > > > > > > >>>>>> mxnet >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> again? >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> I forgot to request to run some benchmarks and >> > > document. >> > > > > One >> > > > > > > >>> of >> > > > > > > >>>>> the >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> reasons >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> users use MXNet is because of its performance and >> we >> > > want >> > > > > to >> > > > > > > >>>>> ensure >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> that we >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> maintain it across language bindings. >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Also invite your other clojure programmer buddies >> to >> > > the >> > > > > > > >> party >> > > > > > > >>>> :) >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Thanks, Naveen >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, Jun 4, 2018 at 1:55 PM, Carin Meier < >> > > > > > > >>>> [email protected] >> > > > > > > >>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> wrote: >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Oh right. That's not a problem, I wonder if >> > something >> > > > like >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> org.apache.mxnet.contrib/clojure-mxnet >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> would work? >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> If this seems like it is the right direction, we >> > could >> > > > > > > >> work >> > > > > > > >>>> out >> > > > > > > >>>>>> the >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> details >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> in a PR. >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, Jun 4, 2018 at 4:44 PM, Naveen Swamy < >> > > > > > > >>>>> [email protected]> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> wrote: >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> I agree with your assessment that we shouldn't >> need >> > > the >> > > > > > > >>> user >> > > > > > > >>>>> to >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> change >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> their code. I am not sure if we can release >> under >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> org.apache.clojure-mxnet >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> we might have to stick with our primary group id >> > > > > > > >>>>>> org.apache.mxnet >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> and >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> may >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> be create a sub-package under it? any creative >> > ideas? >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, Jun 4, 2018 at 1:29 PM, Carin Meier < >> > > > > > > >>>>>> [email protected]> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> wrote: >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks for the feedback everyone. >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> I agree on the contrib option. I think it's a >> > great >> > > > > > > >> path >> > > > > > > >>>>>> forward >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> and >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> would >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> allow it time for feedback, contribution by >> > others, >> > > > > > > >> and >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> stabilization. >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> If I'm understanding correctly, that would mean >> > > > > > > >> putting >> > > > > > > >>>> the >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> source >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> code >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> in: >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> ~/mxnet/contrib/clojure-package >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> and having the artifact jar named >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> `org.apache.contrib.clojure-mx >> net/clojure-mxnet` >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> I would recommend not having the individual >> > > namespaces >> > > > > > > >>> of >> > > > > > > >>>>> the >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> files >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> have >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> contrib embedded in them, so that if it >> graduates, >> > > > > > > >> users >> > > > > > > >>>>> won't >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> have >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> to >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> change their code, only the dependency. >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Please let me know if this is correct or if >> there >> > > are >> > > > > > > >>> any >> > > > > > > >>>>>> other >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> ideas. >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> - Carin >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, Jun 4, 2018 at 4:03 PM, Naveen Swamy < >> > > > > > > >>>>>> [email protected] >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> wrote: >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I think that's a great idea to bring in under >> > > > > > > >> contrib >> > > > > > > >>>> and >> > > > > > > >>>>> we >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> can >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> also >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> get >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> user feedback >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Jun 4, 2018, at 12:44 PM, sandeep >> > > > > > > >> krishnamurthy < >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> [email protected]> wrote: >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hi Carin, >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> This is a commendable work. Thanks a lot for >> all >> > > > > > > >> the >> > > > > > > >>>>> hard >> > > > > > > >>>>>> and >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> smart >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> work >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> you have put behind this :-) I think this >> will >> > be >> > > > > > > >> a >> > > > > > > >>>>> great >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> value >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> addition. >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> If people are not sure about usage, can I >> > suggest >> > > > > > > >>> this >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> awesome >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> work >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> to >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> be >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> brought in "contrib" package? Invite and >> build >> > the >> > > > > > > >>>>>> community >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> around >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Clojure, stabilize and increase the coverage, >> > and >> > > > > > > >>>> based >> > > > > > > >>>>> on >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> usage >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> and >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> development, graduate it to main stable >> support >> > > > > > > >> from >> > > > > > > >>>>>> contrib. >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Suggestions and thoughts? >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Best, >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sandeep >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, Jun 4, 2018 at 12:27 PM, Ivan >> Serdyuk < >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> [email protected]> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote: >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hello everyone. >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> A small comment, about Scala API: main >> > commiters >> > > > > > > >>> are >> > > > > > > >>>>>> hardly >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> available, >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> as >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> for today. >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> As for Clojure - I might suggest that it >> might >> > be >> > > > > > > >>>>>> possible >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> to >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> enlight >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> future work, for that package, for Clojure >> > > > > > > >>>> developers. >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, Jun 4, 2018 at 8:50 PM, Naveen >> Swamy < >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> [email protected] >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote: >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hi Carin, >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> This is great effort and very nicely >> > documented. >> > > > > > > >>>> When >> > > > > > > >>>>> I >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> surveyed >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> at >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> my >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> day >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> job on the interest for Scala packages >> there >> > > > > > > >> were >> > > > > > > >>> a >> > > > > > > >>>>> few >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> people >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> who >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> specifically were interested in the Clojure >> > > > > > > >>>> packages, >> > > > > > > >>>>> I >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> think >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> those >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> are >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> people who might have tried and understand >> the >> > > > > > > >>>>>> complexity >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> of >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> making >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Scala >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> work in Clojure. >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I am in support of a MXNet-Clojure >> package, I >> > > > > > > >>>> request >> > > > > > > >>>>>> you >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> to >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> add >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> more >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> unit >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> tests and integration tests that can be >> ported >> > > > > > > >> to >> > > > > > > >>>> CI. >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks for your efforts. >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -Naveen >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Fri, Jun 1, 2018 at 6:16 PM, Carin >> Meier < >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> [email protected]> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote: >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> It is always a good thing to consider the >> > cost >> > > > > > > >>> with >> > > > > > > >>>>> the >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> benefit. >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'll >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> do >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> my >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> best to explain what I see the tradeoffs >> to >> > be. >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> First, I wanted to clarify that it took >> > > > > > > >>> significant >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> development >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> effort >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> get the Clojure package and the interop >> > working >> > > > > > > >>>>>> properly >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> despite >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> my >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> simple >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> looking design on the confluence page :) >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> One of the advantages of MXNet over its >> > > > > > > >>> competitors >> > > > > > > >>>>> is >> > > > > > > >>>>>> its >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> many >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> language >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> support. The Clojure package would only >> > > > > > > >> increase >> > > > > > > >>>> the >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> value of >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> this >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> proposition and bring new users and growth >> > into >> > > > > > > >>> the >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> community. >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> However, there is a cost associated with >> > adding >> > > > > > > >>>> this >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> language >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> support >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> as >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> you pointed out. >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Since the Clojure package right now is >> only >> > > > > > > >>> reliant >> > > > > > > >>>>> on >> > > > > > > >>>>>> the >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Scala >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> jars >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> from >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Maven, it can exist outside the main >> project >> > as >> > > > > > > >>> an >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> independent >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> repo >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> but I >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> think that would lessen the growth benefit >> > both >> > > > > > > >>> to >> > > > > > > >>>>> the >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Clojure >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> community >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and to the MXNet community to not be >> included >> > > > > > > >> as >> > > > > > > >>> a >> > > > > > > >>>>>> first >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> class >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> language. >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I believe having first class Clojure >> support >> > in >> > > > > > > >>>> MXNet >> > > > > > > >>>>>> is >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> valuable, >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> but >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> cost of that support is up to the >> community >> > to >> > > > > > > >>>>> decide. >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Is there a process for considering a new >> > > > > > > >> package >> > > > > > > >>> in >> > > > > > > >>>>>> MXNet? >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> - Carin >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Fri, Jun 1, 2018 at 5:51 PM, Chen HY < >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> [email protected] >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote: >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Have checked the issue and the confluence >> > > > > > > >> page, >> > > > > > > >>>> but >> > > > > > > >>>>>> still >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> curious. >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Clojure and Scala are both JVM based >> > > > > > > >> languages. >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> They, as well as many JVM based >> languages, >> > can >> > > > > > > >>>> share >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> their >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> class >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> and >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> method >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> at a certain level. >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Why should the community maintain two >> APIs >> > for >> > > > > > > >>> two >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> languages >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> with >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> can >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> share >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> their packages with almost zero effort? >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 2018-06-01 21:58 GMT+01:00 Carin Meier < >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> [email protected] >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> : >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hi all, >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I've been working on a Clojure package >> for >> > > > > > > >>> MXNet. >> > > > > > > >>>>>> Since >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Clojure >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> is >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> a >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> JVM >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> language, the package leverages the >> great >> > > > > > > >> work >> > > > > > > >>> of >> > > > > > > >>>>> the >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> existing >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Scala >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> package. >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I would appreciate any feedback and >> > testing. >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Here is the original issue: >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> https://github.com/apache/ >> > > > > > > >>>>>> incubator-mxnet/issues/8971 >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Architecture & Design: >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> https://cwiki.apache.org/ >> > > > > > > >>>> confluence/display/MXNET/ >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> MXNet+Clojure >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and the github repo for rapid testing >> and >> > > > > > > >> issue >> > > > > > > >>>>>> fixing >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> before >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> of >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> opening >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> an >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> official PR >> https://github.com/gigasquid/ >> > > > > > > >>>>>> clojure-mxnet >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm also active in the slack channel so >> > feel >> > > > > > > >>> free >> > > > > > > >>>>> to >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> ping me >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> there. >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks, >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Carin Meier >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -- >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Chen Hanyang 陈涵洋 >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Software School Fudan University >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> +86-138-1881-7745 >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -- >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sandeep Krishnamurthy >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> -- >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Chen Hanyang 陈涵洋 >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> Software School Fudan University >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> +86-138-1881-7745 >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>>> -- >> > > > > > > >>>>>> Yizhi Liu >> > > > > > > >>>>>> DMLC member >> > > > > > > >>>>>> Amazon Web Services >> > > > > > > >>>>>> Vancouver, Canada >> > > > > > > >>>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>>> >> > > > > > > >>>> >> > > > > > > >>>> >> > > > > > > >>>> >> > > > > > > >>>> -- >> > > > > > > >>>> Chen Hanyang 陈涵洋 >> > > > > > > >>>> Software School Fudan University >> > > > > > > >>>> +86-138-1881-7745 >> > > > > > > >>>> >> > > > > > > >>> >> > > > > > > >> >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > -- >> > > > > > > > Chen Hanyang 陈涵洋 >> > > > > > > > Software School Fudan University >> > > > > > > > +86-138-1881-7745 >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > >> > > >> > >> > >
