Hello Jan, Jan Holesovsky a écrit : > Hi Charles, > > First of all - let's separate 2 parts of the project: > > 1) the OOo part > - the UI for the templates as it is now is unacceptable >
I think so as well. And I think that my critics were not targeted at that part -the spec itself-. > 2) the templates design part > - increase the amount of good templates > Why not, indeed. But then there is an existing work and infrastructure. I'm not saying it is the best one, far from that . And as you know, there is also the idea of the MarketPlace, and the Extensions project, not to mention the Art sub project at the Marketing project. The Marketplace does not exist yet, but the extensions project and the Art initiative do. > I am here for the first part, and don't want to comment on the 2nd - but > probably I have to ;-) Petr can even better - he has been working hard with > Kami on sorting out the licenses of the templates that Kami found - so that > the templates could be committed up-stream. > > On Saturday 02 December 2006 12:41, Charles Schulz wrote: > > >> I must say that I am quite puzzled to read this. First, I would like to >> ask if this project was proposed according to the appropriate way? I'm >> not saying it is a bad idea, I'm just saying that it's good to follow >> the guidelines. >> > > What do you mean by the 'appropriate way', please? We have an i-team with > all > the interested parties involved - including UX, QA and documentation. > Apologies for forgetting dev@documentation.openoffice.org :-( - please see > below. > Well, I was confused between the two parts of the spec. I think that if there had been an actual proposal for a new templates project a proposal should have been drafted and sent to several lists. At this point though, I think it should be welcome and perhaps more effective to take away anything related to the repository of templates question out of the existing spec. > >> Second, saying that the documentation project is dead is quite >> surprizing: the documentation project hosts the Templates contest. Kami, >> where did you have this information according to what the documentation >> project of OOo was dead? It's fairly active I believe. >> > > Sorry for that statement (even thought I'm not its author ;-) ). But have a > look at the status of the templates from May (according to web.archive.org - > no data from September unfortunately): > > http://web.archive.org/web/20060529002820/documentation.openoffice.org/Samples_Templates/User/template_2_x/index.html > > 10 Writer and 7 Calc templates for OOo 2.x. Didn't it look like a dead > project? Please note that he Wiki page arose in September - no sign of the > Template contest at that time. > > I am _very_ happy that the situation improved drastically. Could you please > fix the Wiki? Eg. a pointer to the contest etc. would be very helpful I > guess. > The documentation project did not initally focus on templates, so the activity of this project cannot be reduced to the numbers of templates submitted. For instance, did you know that the french native-lang and the japanese native-lang projects had their own set of local and localized templates? It may not have been visible through the Internet Archive though... > >> Third, and much in the same line, the very least you guys can do is to >> notify Roderick Singleton and Scott Carr, leads of the documentation >> project, that you wish to do something with the templates and open a new >> project. To me it is a clear lack of respect towards the community. I do >> expect apologies from you to Gerry and Scott. >> > > Roderick, Scott - apologies from my side. I am very sorry that we did not > add > dev@documentation.openoffice.org to Cc. > > Could you tell us more how the template part of the documentation project > works? How is the Documentation project related to the 'Documentation' we > have in our i-Team? What can we do to communicate the efforts better? Is > Cc'ing dev@documentation.openoffice.org enough? Are you on IRC? Can we join > the efforts, please? > Thank you for your answer on that Jan. I think it is up to Gerry to answer to that one. > >> Fourth, I can't help but notice that this has been done totally behind >> the back of everybody, except Novell, Sun, and Kami. >> > > Everything is in the wiki, it's the authoritative source. Russell > Osserdryver > from Worldlabel.com, the company that sponsors the Template/Clipart contest, > was always part of the discussion. Caolan from RedHat. Rene from Debian. > Pavel Janik from the community. Really behind the back of everybody? > > I again apologize that we did not Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > >> Sorry to be the >> bad-mooded guy here, but I think that we had our share of instant >> surprizes with Novell these days. >> > > Do you mean something in particular, please? > > >> A low profile would be expected. >> > > Could you explain, please? I do not understand the idiom. > Jan, don't take it personnally of course. I just think that given Novell's quite hectic news and the reactions of many -my opinion notwhistanding here- the way that Novell engineers could handle the present situation on the templates do not help to improve the image of Novell. That's very unfortunate. I'm just talking damage control and public image, but of course I do understand that it is not your job . > >> I do >> simply not understand why Sun engineers all of a sudden decided to take >> the OOo templates elsewhere without notifying anyone. If you want to >> change the specs on the UI in order to make a better use of the >> templates, I'm fine with it, but please do not enter that new Templates >> project thing which is as it seems quite cheesy for the moment. >> Communication, folks. Communication. >> > > Our focus is up-stream. We are happy to hear that the Template part of the > Documentation project is in good health. And I'll be glad to help to > transfer the templates from the page to the OOo CVS (are they JCA covered & > LGPL'ed?) so that everyone has the templates in the default installation of > OOo. > Jan, here's my "humple opinion" about the idea. I am not sure that the documentation project would ultimately be the right place for hosting templates. I think we have to take into account three factors. Of course this is independent from the first part of the spec: - the market place, commercial extensions for OOo - the extensions project: what would be its role? - a repository for the templates: should one part go to the market place and the other one to the extensions project? Or should we create a new repository? etc. So whatever you/we do, we have to include people from the documentation, people from Sun/Novell, engineers, UI testers, marketing/art people, the NLC community members, etc. In short, lots of people :-) . > >> Last but not least: Kami, I am very disappointed by your attitude. You >> do not communicate on this project, but you never hesitate to spam the >> discuss lists and the hungarian lists with your Oxygen office. >> > > Please - don't be disappointed, and help Kami learn how he should communicate > to fulfill the community needs. Offending is not the way IMHO. > Kami and I have worked together in the past. I am not quite sure that he feels that much offended, and I'm ready to help him anyway. Regards, Charles. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
