Hi, Frankly, I am not particularly happy about making a distinction between "old NetBeans" and "new NetBeans". There should be just one "NetBeans". I think that's the point of keeping the name.
Also, I am not sure how many people are still using the NetBeans 8.2 update center (or if we can even find out the number, as this is not(?) done through redirects). Jan On Thu, Jul 23, 2020 at 11:05 PM Antonio <[email protected]> wrote: > Hi all, > > Some comments below. > > El 23/7/20 a las 14:57, Jaroslav Tulach escribió: > > That's a great analysis Antonio! At least we know what we are > dealing with. > > There are 23,6 million of requests recorded in the ODS file. Artifactory > seems > > to be responsible for 15 million of accesses. Nexus is responsible for > next 5 > > million. That however leaves us with 3,8 million accesses that aren't > routed > > via any caching machinery. A good reason for not shutting anything down > > without a replacement, in my opinion. > > But we do have a replacement called Apache NetBeans 12.0, haven't we? > And it's hosted in Maven Central! > > If this is not a good enough replacement for Oracle NetBeans 8.2, then > let's make the users help us improve it. > > What is required to make NetBeans 12.0 a viable alternative to 8.2? What > needs to be done? When will we meet that goal? > > > > >> themselves, so my personal choice is to go with solution P2 below. > > > > Sure, write the blog entry. Go and instruct "some users" (with 3.8 > million of > > accesses!) to get ready for their builds being broken. The problem is > real and > > warning NetBeans Platform users is necessary. I doubt many read such > blog, but > > writing it at least gives us a good feeling, doesn't it? > > > > The idea is to warn _Oracle NetBeans Platform users_, as _Oracle_ is > going to shut down an _Oracle-owned_ _Oracle Netbeans_ repository, > possibly after many years of service, and suggest them to become Apache > NetBeans Platform users. > > No feelings necessarily involved in this (but for those some may have > when saying goodbye to Oracle NetBeans 8.2). > > Having said that, if the objective of your message is to make me feel > responsible for breaking the builds of some _Oracle NetBeans_ users, and > to move me to action to solve the situation, then I'm afraid having to > say you've failed. > > I don't think any of the Apache NetBeans Team is responsible for Oracle > shutting down a repository. Nor for breaking the builds of some _Oracle > NetBeans users_. On the contrary, I think the Apache NetBeans Team has > been trying to help _Oracle NetBeans users_ with a smooth transition and > a viable alternative during the last years. If we have failed or not in > providing a viable alternative I don't know, I just know we've tried hard. > > I don't think Oracle is to blame, either. Oracle has been helping > _Oracle NetBeans users_ by hosting this repository during the last > years. This goes far beyong the donation process, I think. Oracle has > helped us to build an alternative for their users. If we have failed or > not in providing a viable alternative I don't know, I just know they've > helped (are helping) us. > > Finally, I think it's not a responsibility of the Apache NetBeans Team > (nor ASF Infra's) to download, verify, upload, re-verify, secure, host > nor distribute any Oracle NetBeans binaries for _Oracle NetBeans users_. > > Also note that without a written permission by Oracle (and even possibly > with one), I personally refuse to download, verify, upload, re-verify, > secure, manipulate, alter, host, distribute or have nothing to do with > any Oracle binaries with the final objective of keeping _Oracle NetBeans > users_ happy. I'll try to make _Apache NetBeans users_ happy instead. If > anybody is willing to do all this then, of course, I may help with some > technical advice, if required. > > > On the other hand, I am against stopping the delegation to the Oracle > server > > I think we all are. > > > until it dies of its own. Or until somebody sets a copy of the old > NetBeans > > Maven repository up (btw. it's less than 16GB, if I counted the size of > my own > > copy correctly). > > Ah, it's good to know you have a copy. If you need any technical advice > when "setting a copy of the old NetBeans Maven repository up" then feel > free to send me an email. > > Kind regards, > Antonio > > > > > -jt > > > > - pondělí 20. července 2020 18:30:29 CEST, antonio - > >> Hi all, > >> > >> So I analyzed the redirections being sent to the old Maven repositories, > >> hosted at Oracle, during July. > >> > >> The script is at /var/tmp/OLD_MAVEN_LOGS. > >> > >> I've uploaded the results to: > >> > >> https://bits.netbeans.org/user-agents.csv > >> and https://bits.netbeans.org/user-agents.ods > >> (the second one sorted by number of requests). > >> > >> Some interesting findings: > >> > >> - Top requestor is Artifactory/6.18.1 with > 10 million requests. > >> - Second is Nexus/2.32.0-03 with 1.5 million requests > >> - Third is Artifactory/6.19.0 with 1.3 million requests > >> - Fourth is Artifactory/6.11.1 with 970k requests > >> - Fifth is unknown, with 840k requests > >> - Sixth is Artifactory/4.4.3 with 780k requests > >> - Maven 3.3.9 comes in position 16th with 147k requests. > >> > >> I'd say most requests come from Artifactory, Nexus, excon?, Aether and > >> Archiva. Many bots, too. > >> > >> As far as I understand all these are able to cache/mirror the artifacts > >> themselves, so my personal choice is to go with solution P2 below. > >> > >> Kind regards, > >> Antonio > >> > >> P.S.: Let me know if you'd like to see any extra information regarding > >> these statistics. > >> > >> El 20/7/20 a las 10:04, Korney Czukowski escribió: > >>> Hi, > >>> > >>> if anybody is still using those, I imagine there would be some > >>> indication of it in web server statistics, server access logs if not > >>> anything else. It should help to decide what's the right thing to do > >>> with the old binaries. > >>> > >>> 20.07.2020 8:47, Antonio wrote: > >>>> Hi all, > >>>> > >>>> As you know bits.netbeans.org currently redirects requests for old > >>>> Oracle NetBeans Maven artifacts (http://bits.netbeans.org/maven2) to > >>>> the old Oracle Maven repository. > >>>> > >>>> This repository may be decomissioned soon. The repository hosts > >>>> artifacts for (at least) 21 Sun/Oracle NetBeans releases [1], which in > >>>> turn represent several hundred thousand files and directories, many of > >>>> which have unknown licenses. > >>>> > >>>> It seems we have currently two lines of thought: > >>>> > >>>> A) Some of us have shown interest in keeping these around, because > >>>> "some users" still depend on those binaries for their builds. > >>>> > >>>> B) Some of us, on the contrary, think that these "some users" should > >>>> clone the repository locally to ensure their own reproducible builds > >>>> (possibly using a mirror repository of some kind). > >>>> > >>>> Proposed plans I can remember from other threads: > >>>> > >>>> P1) Upload old binaries to Maven Central, this has been requested six > >>>> months ago, with little progress: > >>>> > >>>> https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/INFRA-19735 > >>>> > >>>> P2) Instruct "some users" to set up a repository of their own to > >>>> ensure caching and reproducible builds of their stuff. Possibly with a > >>>> blog entry. > >>>> > >>>> P3) Ask for permission to OSUOSL, and then conform a team to upload > >>>> those hundred thousand files to OSUOSL, so they pay for the storage > >>>> and the bandwidth. > >>>> > >>>> Discuss: > >>>> > >>>> So please state your preferred plan (or add any other plans you can > >>>> think of) and, if migration to new servers is required, please state > >>>> your interest in helping out with the migration. > >>>> > >>>> Thanks > >>>> Antonio > >>>> > >>>> P.S.: Migration/hosting to a new server may require Oracle's > >>>> permission, I imagine (I'm not sure on this, though). > >>>> > >>>> [1] > >>>> RELEASE69 dates from 2011, RELEASE 82 is from 2016. > >>>> > >>>> RELEASE69 RELEASE691 RELEASE70 RELEASE701 RELEASE71 RELEASE711 > >>>> RELEASE712 RELEASE72 RELEASE721 RELEASE73-BETA RELEASE73-BETA2 > >>>> RELEASE73 RELEASE731 RELEASE74-BETA RELEASE74 RELEASE80-BETA RELEASE80 > >>>> RELEASE801 RELEASE802 RELEASE81 RELEASE82 > >>>> > >>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- > >>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: [email protected] > >>>> For additional commands, e-mail: [email protected] > >>>> > >>>> For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit: > >>>> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists > >>> > >>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- > >>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: [email protected] > >>> For additional commands, e-mail: [email protected] > >>> > >>> For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit: > >>> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists > >> > >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- > >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: [email protected] > >> For additional commands, e-mail: [email protected] > >> > >> For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit: > >> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: [email protected] > > For additional commands, e-mail: [email protected] > > > > For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit: > > https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists > > > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: [email protected] > For additional commands, e-mail: [email protected] > > For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit: > https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists > > > >
