On Mon, Apr 8, 2013 at 9:26 AM, Robin Fowler <robin.fow...@outlook.com>wrote:
> Hi Samer, > > I agree with you that the logos should be evaluated with technical > limitations in mind, but I think you might be putting too much emphasis on > aspects that are not very relevant and should not be high on the priority > list of choosing the right logo. > > I'm pretty sure the logo will be seen on screens 99% of the time and > should therefore be designed for the screen. It will be seen on the website > and as an application icon. That doesn't mean print shouldn't be > considered, but it shouldn't be the primary reason for choosing a logo. And > just to clear up any misconceptions, gradients can be printed fine > nowadays. What would the logo be printed on anyway? > > I'm not saying I have much of a problem with the logo you chose (i can > give more feedback), but I think it's important to get the priorities right > here. In my opinion the priority is to have a modern, good-looking and > recognisable logo that the community has chosen to be representative of > their product, and i think that is what designers would vote for as well. I > just think having a poll would be best. > > P.S. I agree with you that my first proposal doesn't scale that well, I > will see if I can improve it. > > Robin > I think some sort of poll from users would be useful -- with ONLY the candidates we think would scale well, of course. Really even in that category there are about 5 or 6 that I really liked. > > > On 5 Apr 2013, at 23:12, Samer Mansour <samer...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > I don't know if anyone watched the news yesterday, but does this logo > look > > a little familiar: > > Facebook Home - > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=Lep_DSmSRwE > > > > Hi Everyone, > > > > Think of the average person, you tell them this needs to be used in the > > icons, website, print, media, if you put these up for a poll from them, > > they will vote for the most visually appealing. > > Now think of designers, you tell them this needs to be used in the icons, > > website, print, media, if you put these up for a poll from them, they > will > > vote for the best logo based on the use. > > > > Like Janl has stated, I moved forward with this one because it considered > > the different mediums they will be displayed on and scaling the best. > > > > What specifically is not liked in the flattened proposals? Like Milos > > pointed out, the TM spacing and size can be corrected and the font can be > > changed with a new open font (someone can suggest and point me where to > > download the font that suggest?) > > > > In order to propose a logo to the PMC, I don't think a vote or poll may > be > > necessar > > If we can get to a point where one logo is picked, the PMC doesn't need > to > > judge logos, they just have to approve the change, am I correct? > > > > Here is something more constructive: > > - Robin, would you be able to alter your logo to make it scalable, lines > > are currently lost when shrinking. 32x32 and 16x16 icon? > > - Vasilis, your logo too, could you figure a way to scale that down to > > 32x32 and 16x16. I'm also interested to see what that logo would look > like > > if the gradients were gone, it would be excellent for print. Could you > > post that separately to compare? > > > > This isn't easy, the old logo works really well in all these areas so I > > don't want to replace it with something that doesn't work well in the > same > > areas > > > > The official logo should be version independent as well. > > > > Samer > > > > > > > > On Fri, Apr 5, 2013 at 4:07 PM, Dave Fisher <dave2w...@comcast.net> > wrote: > > > >> > >> On Apr 5, 2013, at 8:02 AM, janI wrote: > >> > >>> On 5 April 2013 16:52, Rob Weir <robw...@apache.org> wrote: > >>> > >>>> On Fri, Apr 5, 2013 at 10:37 AM, janI <j...@apache.org> wrote: > >>>> > >>>>> On 5 April 2013 14:50, Rob Weir <robw...@apache.org> wrote: > >>>>> > >>>>>> On Fri, Apr 5, 2013 at 3:33 AM, Jürgen Schmidt < > jogischm...@gmail.com > >>>>>>> wrote: > >>>>>> > >>>>>>> On 4/5/13 6:01 AM, Samer Mansour wrote: > >>>>>>>> Hello Everyone, > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> Can I propose we move forward with this logo: > >>>>>> http://imagebin.org/252847 > >>>>>>>> I kept the current official blue for both the logo and word 'Open' > >>>> in > >>>>>> the > >>>>>>>> wordmark because the word 'Open' gets less emphasis with the > >>>> lighter > >>>>>>> blue. > >>>>>>>> I also gave the text Apache a placement inside the valley made by > >>>> the > >>>>>> two > >>>>>>>> O's as many people's designs had suggested. > >>>>>>>> The font is Roboto Condensed which is Apache 2.0 Licensed. > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> mmh, I don't think that it would be a good approach if we simply > move > >>>>>>> forward with this one. We collected several proposals over weeks > now > >>>>> and > >>>>>>> it is still not easy to pick the serious ones. > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> We should summarize what we have, maybe drop the obvious bad ones > and > >>>>>>> start a first vote. the 3 best voted proposals will be reviewed in > >>>> more > >>>>>>> detail if they fulfill our requirements and if we can appropriate > >>>>>>> further brand elements like icons, app icon, etc. > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>> Maybe call the initial thing a "poll" rather than a "vote". It is a > >>>> form > >>>>>> of testing, really, gathering feedback in a structured way. But it > is > >>>>> not > >>>>>> a decision-making process. We could put the top 3 into a blog post > >> and > >>>>>> gather feedback and preferences on blog, mailing list, facebook, > etc. > >>>>>> We'll also get 'expert opinion' from those who understand logos > well. > >>>>> This > >>>>>> all gives the PMC some solid information, from community members, > >>>> users, > >>>>>> experts, etc., to make a final decision. Ideally these sources > concur > >>>> on > >>>>>> their preferences. But there might be divergent views. But the PMC > >>>>>> decides in the end. > >>>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> I have lost the overview of how many logos are in competition, since > it > >>>> do > >>>>> not follow this theme intensively. I have seen at least one I really > >>>> liked, > >>>>> but to fair I think we should make one page (mwiki/cwiki or something > >>>> else) > >>>>> where everybody can see the competing logos side by side. The logos > >>>> should > >>>>> each be structured as Web-logo, software-logo and favicon (many seems > >> to > >>>>> forget this important part). With such a page the community can give > >>>> their > >>>>> opinion (I agree with rob, no vote just a poll), and the 3 best, go > in > >> a > >>>>> second round, and of course pmc officially decide, but I am pretty > sure > >>>>> they will follow the opinion of the community. > >>>>> > >>>>> I personally would not take the 3 best to a blog/facebook etc....this > >> is > >>>>> "our" product, and we the community decide how to present it to the > >>>>> end-users. > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>> I think of the Facebook thing would be more a poll then a decision > >> making > >>>> process. It is another source of info. As a PMC member, the more > data > >> I > >>>> have to help make decisions the better. I'd weigh heavily community > >>>> opinion on our mailing lists, but I'd also be interesting in taking > the > >>>> pulse of ordinary users who are seeing these things for the first time > >> with > >>>> a fresh perspecitve, as well as the opinions of experts. It is all > >> data. > >>>> It is all good. > >>>> > >>>> It is "our" product, yes, but the logo is not for our private > adoration. > >>>> It is functional, in the sense that its distinctiveness and > >> recognizably is > >>>> as important as its aesthetics. Personally, to make up my mind, I > need > >> to > >>>> have feedback on how "outsiders" see and mentally process the logo, > and > >> not > >>>> just how project "insiders" see it. I think it needs to work well for > >> all. > >>>> > >>> > >>> Point taken, now I understand your view better and agree with it. But I > >>> would still like to see all logos on a single page in the 3 variants, > >> that > >>> would help me and others make up our minds, and give you as PMC better > >>> input. > >> > >> All logos on a new wiki page. If a designer wants to remove some of > their > >> designs from consideration now would be the time. > >> > >> I agree with having a poll. Keep track of the source of each set of > >> results. > >> > >> Interpret the poll here on the list. If there is no consensus on the > best > >> choice then we have a vote. If there are more than 2 possible best > choices > >> we can use a ranked choice voting method. > >> > >> Seems like a plan. > >> > >> Would be something to start next week. Maybe Tuesday? > >> > >> Regards, > >> Dave > >> > >>> > >>> rgds > >>> jan I. > >>> > >>> > >>>> -Rob > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>> Rgds > >>>>> Jan I. > >>>>> > >>>>> -Rob > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>>> Then start the final vote. > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Just my opinion > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Juergen > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> The source file is an SVG created in Inkscape. The above is a png > >>>>>> export. > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> Samer > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> On Sun, Mar 31, 2013 at 2:55 PM, Samer Mansour < > samer...@gmail.com > >>>>> > >>>>>>> wrote: > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> Hello, > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> I will wait a few more days but it sounds like the group will be > >>>>> able > >>>>>> to > >>>>>>>>> come to a consensus on refreshing the orb in some way or another. > >>>>> We > >>>>>>> can > >>>>>>>>> proceed with finalizing this logo proposal if no one objectifies. > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> Samer > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> On Sun, Mar 31, 2013 at 3:40 AM, Kadal Amutham <vka...@gmail.com > > > >>>>>>> wrote: > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> A flat logo may be good for Pepsi, Domino's, Microsoft, Skype, > >>>>>> Twitter > >>>>>>>>>> since they have money power to promote. What AOO needs is a good > >>>>>>> looking > >>>>>>>>>> logo > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> With Warm Regards > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> V.Kadal Amutham > >>>>>>>>>> 919444360480 > >>>>>>>>>> 914422396480 > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> On 30 March 2013 18:17, Juergen Schmidt <jogischm...@gmail.com> > >>>>>> wrote: > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> Am Samstag, 30. März 2013 um 03:05 schrieb Alexandro Colorado: > >>>>>>>>>>>> On 3/29/13, Robin Fowler <robin.fow...@outlook.com> wrote: > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Due to the opinions I've seen so far I've decided to make a > >>>> new > >>>>>>>>>> design: > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>> > >>>> > >> > https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/download/attachments/27846912/OO_4_final_design_Robin-Fowler.jpg?version=1&modificationDate=1364582663662 > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> Here is a tweak, without the orb. Looks pretty olympic. > >>>>>>>>>>>> http://imagebin.org/252139 > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> maybe I am confused but I thought that we want something like > >>>> the > >>>>>> orb > >>>>>>>>>> that > >>>>>>>>>>> can be used standalone with the name. For ample for buttons, > >>>>>> stickers > >>>>>>>>>> etc. > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> Juergen > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Overall it has a flat look and yet still some depth to make > it > >>>>>> stand > >>>>>>>>>>> out > >>>>>>>>>>>>> from the microsoft brand. I think it is also important to > >>>> think > >>>>>>>>>> about > >>>>>>>>>>> the > >>>>>>>>>>>>> form itself, the silhouette should ideally be recognisable on > >>>>> its > >>>>>>>>>> own, > >>>>>>>>>>> which > >>>>>>>>>>>>> is one reason using the apache feather is a good idea. > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Some other thoughts: > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> One of the problems i see with a lot of the proposals is the > >>>>> lack > >>>>>> of > >>>>>>>>>>> thought > >>>>>>>>>>>>> given to typography. It seems the text is just slapped on as > >>>> an > >>>>>>>>>>>>> afterthought, in many cases the 'apache' is floating > somewhere > >>>>>>>>>> randomly > >>>>>>>>>>>>> above 'openoffice'. Think of what you want the logo to imply, > >>>> it > >>>>>>>>>>> should not > >>>>>>>>>>>>> look disorganised. Another thing worth pointing out is the > >>>>> kerning > >>>>>>>>>>> (spacing > >>>>>>>>>>>>> between letters) which could be optimised on some of the > >>>>>> proposals. > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> There was a long discussion about the typography, starting > with > >>>>> an > >>>>>>>>>>>> open typography, and also a more artistic. > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> This is an extremely important aspect of the whole logo > design > >>>>> and > >>>>>>>>>>> should be > >>>>>>>>>>>>> considered when choosing a design. After all, many logos > >>>> consist > >>>>>> of > >>>>>>>>>>> nothing > >>>>>>>>>>>>> other than text. > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> I also want to say i really like Vasilis Xenofontos design. > It > >>>>>> might > >>>>>>>>>>> be too > >>>>>>>>>>>>> different from the current, but it's a very good logo imo. > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Robin > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> On 28 Mar 2013, at 12:38, Samer Mansour <samer...@gmail.com> > >>>>>> wrote: > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Robin brought up a good point that we should pick a logo > >>>> before > >>>>>> we > >>>>>>>>>>> start > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> work on the application artifacts or the website as it will > >>>>>>>>>> influence > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> those. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> I initially was excited that we could have a new logo, an > >>>>>>>>>>> opportunity to > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> change the face of OpenOffice. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> But after I saw Chris R. proposal I convinced myself > >>>> refreshing > >>>>>>>>>>> rather > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> than > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> re-branding was the better path. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> So I would like to start a conversation that will hopefully > >>>>> give > >>>>>>>>>> us > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> strong > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> arguments to picking a logo. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> I already mentioned I liked the flat logo. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Here are reasons: > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> - It is very similar to the current logo and that logo has a > >>>>>>>>>> history > >>>>>>>>>>> of > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> being recognized. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> - Flat is 'in', easily recognizable on and works well on > >>>> social > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> platforms, > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> screens and print media. (Think corporate and product logos > >>>> of > >>>>>>>>>> today, > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> recently Pepsi, Domino's, Microsoft, Skype, Twitter) > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> - This logo can be severed from the word mark to make it fit > >>>>> in a > >>>>>>>>>>> square > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> and still carry the branding image. Icons, site, etc. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> - A middle ground for community members who like the current > >>>>>> logo. > >>>>>>>>>>> Who > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> want > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> to achieve a new image of 4.0 without tossing history. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Looking back, we had lots of ideas but it only took me a > >>>> moment > >>>>>>>>>> when > >>>>>>>>>>> i > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> saw > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Chris r.'s proposal to realize the logo didn't need to be > >>>>> complex > >>>>>>>>>> and > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> completely new. That simple was actually beautiful. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Thoughts? Agree? Disagree (and your solution is)? > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Samer Mansour > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- > >>>>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: > >>>>>> marketing-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org > >>>>>>>>>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: > >>>>>>>>>> marketing-h...@openoffice.apache.org > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> -- > >>>>>>>>>>>> Alexandro Colorado > >>>>>>>>>>>> Apache OpenOffice Contributor > >>>>>>>>>>>> http://es.openoffice.org > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>> > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > >>>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: > >>>>>> marketing-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org > >>>>>>>>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: > >>>>>>> marketing-h...@openoffice.apache.org > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org > >>>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>> > >>>> > >> > >> > >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- > >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org > >> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org > >> > >> > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org > > -- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MzK "Achieving happiness requires the right combination of Zen and Zin."
