I had toyed with something similar (IDEA - Installable Desktop Enterprise Application), but I don't think it should be tied to either "enterprise" or "desktop". I'd also prefer an acronym that isn't an existing word. I like "IIA" because it is short and unique but still conveys the essential points.
On Jan 7, 2011, at 9:00 PM, Superstring Media wrote: > Hi All, > > Its never the easiest task coming up with an acronym that captures the > intent. Does it have to be three letters long? > > Scratching around I just discovered this: > > MEIDA (modern enterprise installable desktop application) > > or > > MEDIA (modern enterprise desktop installable application) > > or > > MEUDA (modern enterprise universal desktop application) > > > Just some ideas to share, > > Thom > > > On 2011-01-07, at 6:47 PM, Sandro Martini wrote: > >> Hi to all, >> and excuse me for the delay ... >> >> I agree with Greg that RIA is a term a little outdated now so probably >> even the R(Rich) part of it is not-so-much a strong point of interest >> of Pivot (as could/will be for example in JavaFX, or Flash/Flex). >> And even with the general idea that anything now should work inside >> the Browser (Apple is trying to push this with HTML 5) and that Ajax, >> Comet,the new Canvas, etc are best solutions for all problems ... but >> (I could be wrong but) I don't think this. >> And for this many people usually thinks as RIA in Flash/Flex or HTML5 >> and some amazing demos from Google or Apple ... >> >> I like the idea of something like a variation of RIA, but probably >> it's better to have something different and if possible a totally >> different acronym. Even terms proposed by Niclas, or something like >> "Universal Applications" (too strong) ... so maybe here we need some >> marketing guy :-) ... >> Only one thing: I think no on rapid-prototyping because on the idea >> that they remains only prototypes and get never finalized as real >> applications ... but interesting idea. >>> So, you find the transition from prototype to finished product fairly >>> straightforward. That is good to know. >> And this is very interesting. Could be useful some term on this field ... >> >> >> In my experience even ad System Administrator I think that main points >> that we have to address with pivot are: >> - Internet-connected/enabled Applications, and this is already true >> (we can improve, but I think we have a good degree today) >> -- and on this, I'm working to simplify interaction with some web >> frameworks, but this is another story ... >> - Install via Internet (the Installable part of the probably new >> acronym) ... and here I agree with others that probably here we have >> to improve this part, that's why I push so much for example with >> re-enabling Web Start support in our Web Site and in our Demos (I have >> a ticket on this for the 2.1 but if it's more important I can move in >> a 2.0.x) ... but on this, the real world problem is not-so-much the >> Installation (done one time per client), but the keep-Upgraded part of >> installations (always required, day by day by any client) >> -- so on this I'd suggest if it's possible to insert something to >> put in evidence the Upgrade part (if it makes sense). >> -- a little idea on this (maybe for a future Demo), something I call >> "Enterprise Desktop", where like with Apache Maven, the user download >> (manually or in other ways) the base installation, and then any other >> content is downloaded (like user applications, handled by this common >> package) from Internet. In this way for example a Company could Group >> many Applications inside it, but for this maybe we have to improve >> some parts of Pivot ... and if/when isolates will happen in the JVM >> this could be the best ... >> - Interactivity, no latency at any click (like page refresh now much >> improved with Ajax or some trick like Javascript compressing and >> precompiling) but only when the client ask for data. >> - Fast Interaction, like the previous point, but with the focus here >> on how the framework let users to interact fast with application >> features, for example with the keyboard (accelerators, consistency of >> standards, etc) ... and here we have to improve in my opinion, if >> possible starting for the 2.1 >> - Load-balance between the client and the server, using the same >> language, and sometimes reusing (parts of) the same code >> - Cross-platform ... but we are no more in J2ME/CLDC/etc days, so I >> hope for the 3.0 we will be ready for modern Mobile platforms (mainly >> Android 2.x, and maybe others but Open :-) ...) >> - the multi-platform, thanks to Java >> - the multi-JVM language support, this is an important field for us >> for next years but mainly for gain Developer's attention >> - to compete with Microsoft tools (but not only, in the JVM world the >> is even the amazing Griffon), the ability to realize fast CRUD >> applications ... maybe with some contribution we could improve this in >> a few time >> -- but on this, please keep in mind that NOT anything is on a DB (i >> work many times in decoupled SOA environments where only few times I >> make queries to a relational DB) >> -- and on this I like very much the approach taken by Grails (and >> later by Griffon), to put constraints inside Domain classes with a >> custom DSL thanks to Groovy dynamic features. For Pivot 3.0 I'd like >> to have features like these (and the ability to have skeleton of >> applications created/updated by shell commands, etc) ... but this is >> another story. >> -- what I'd like to have in Pivot 2.x on CRUD is (if not CRUD >> features in the base package) at least features that enable related >> sub-projects to be able to do this in a short and good shape (removing >> constraints if any, and improve what is necessary, but maybe anything >> is already good). >> -- last on CRUD, probably we should compare at the moment if not >> with the future JavaFX 2.0, at least with Griffon (currently 0.9.2), >> but close gaps on something complex like this requires much community >> work, so any help is appreciated. And this is definitely something >> that the community has to discuss better, to solve the next level in >> real-world applications. >> - etc ... >> >> I agree with calatus that we have to improve giving some more shell >> script or class to simplify execution of demos outside the browser. >> Even in Eclipse, I think that adding a dedicated folder (maybe under >> examples, so outside any release) with eclipse launch files could help >> ... I have already many of them in my development environment. But I >> agree with Greg that for most cases the Eclipse plugin is enough. >>>> Not entirely sure what you mean. All of the demos and tutorials are >>>> developed first as desktop apps, then deployed to the web. >>> >>> The current Pivot site does not provide such development steps. Just >>> providing final web based application. >> Yes, probably on the Site we could add some zip/tar.gz for some demo >> inside (with shell scripts), but we have to think where to put it to >> not break our build scripts. Or could be an addition to our binary >> zip/tar.gz ... >> >> >> >> What I really think it's missing (due to lack of time, funds, etc from >> any of us) is something that really uses the full power of modern >> Desktops, for example like accessing local storage (some of this will >> be possible with HTML 5 and even with Flash today). We have some >> signed Demo, and of course we have the JVM constraints, but I think >> that in the framework we could do something (at least to show what/how >> to do something like this). >> On this, I prototyped some code years ago but was too complex and has >> been dropped ... maybe we can revise it and maybe move in a secondary >> project. >> >> And one important point is that while for not-full-time users of the >> same application (or occasionally users) the Browser enabled content >> (dynamic pages and/or RIA/Applets) is good enough, it ISN'T for >> full-time users of some applications (where more interactivity and >> fast answers is needed). >> By direct experience in last 10 years I've seen (and I currently see) >> this many times, but customers ask for dynamic web pages (and >> sometimes some RIA), so we have to make them ... but I'm sure that our >> is the right choice (at least for full-time users). >> >> >> So, to finish, even to me "IIA" doesn't say so much, but why not ? >> Comments ? >> >> Sorry for the long post, I hope to put inside everything :-) ... >> >> Bye, >> Sandro >
