That sounds quite intriguing, I'd like to hear more about this, and how Alan's visit with Adobe went.
-Zak On 1/18/07, Zjnue Brzavi <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Hi SJ and list, I've recently tried to introduce a suite of open technologies I'd like to see at the forefront of e-learning, particularly in OLPC context. Not only is the language (haXe) powerful and a pleasure to work with, but I can attest of the good direction the owners of these technologies provide. Here is my previous post again: from Zjnue Brzavi <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> date Jan 13, 2007 6:27 PM subject Re: Flash support at current OLPC browser? Dear all, I've previously posted to introduce a new language called haXe (haxe.org), that compiles to flash (6-9) bytecode, js and a server language neko (nekovm.org). More recently I've been getting involved with a project called xinf (xinf is not flash - xinf.org) that promises exciting options in terms of exposing a consistent gui api to haXe for targetting both js, flash 9 (potentially other versions also) and a neko-based format that will run on a xinfinity player, currently in development. This means your gui will be able to 'fall-back' onto the flash player when xinfinity is not installed or while it still lacks in features. I'm very interested to look at combining these technologies for the purposes of e-leanring and because they all have a very small footprint, I believe it to be very well suited to the OLPC project. If anyone else share these interests please get in touch. I do feel there is great potential. Best, Zjnue On 1/18/07, SJ Klein <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Cc:ing the devel list. > > Yes, there is a lot of Python work in and around OLPC; some people are > also trying to use pygame as a model/kernel for a general intro-to-Python > tutorial... Bridge builder is pretty fly; I don't see why something with > a similar physics engine couldnt' be built without high-end requirements. > > SJ > > > On Thu, 18 Jan 2007, Ben Sawyer wrote: > > > I don't know the author per-se but InXile Entertainment just licensed the > > rights to make it into a game. While I think the educational aspects of it > > are not as explicit as other things people cite we shouldn't forget the sheer > > creativity it represents and the ideas it offers in terms iterative > > development and other interesting aspects. > > > > There are many etoys (bridge builder anyone? > > http://downloads.theregister.co.uk/Windows/Games/Building/bridge-builder.html > > yes high-end requirements but humor me) and games that could be identified > > for the laptops and of course many are built in Flash but I agree in general > > that part of the core goal really being discussed here is the idea that there > > be some etoy/game like programming system that is ideally suited to the > > laptops. > > > > My gut tells me the script flash within flash is probably a dead end for any > > number of reasons but I think it's a good conversation to force on adobe > > (even if it were a special version they did and then ported everywhere) on. > > I don't know enough about Squeak to know if it really fits the vision of > > things like Click-n-Play and other "gamemaker/etoy" maker products we've had > > in gaming but my sense is that despite it being used to make games by kids > > that it probably doesn't do it to the degree and focus those products have. > > It's complimentary to some extent perhaps even a step above as it moves you > > further up the programming scale then a gamemaker but again I don't see it > > 1:1. > > > > The critical issue will not be the issues of scripting or programming but of > > the entire IDE and graphics process which is where from an etoy/game making > > perspective is where the hard work lies. Perhaps something that is written > > to combine SDL with PyGame? (www.pygame.org) Again the problem here is that > > there isn't much of an IDE and graphics environment here but we might be able > > to construct something with this that then works easily as I believe Python > > support is quite heavy with OLPC. The students at CMU's Entertainment > > Technology Center are working with PyGame and Jesse Schell from CMU > > recommended it highly. > > > > Sorry for lurking but my .02 > > > > - Ben > > > > On Jan 17, 2007, at 12:23 AM, Samuel Klein wrote: > > > >> > >> I love this discussion. I also REALLY want linerider on the laptops... > >> Does anyone know *fsk , the author? > >> http://lineridervideos.blogspot.com/ > >> > >> We're reaching thread-length and cc: length for a public list. > >> Can we take this discussion [and the notes below] to [EMAIL PROTECTED] ? > >> > >> SJ > >> > >> > >> On Tue, 16 Jan 2007, GameMogul wrote: > >> > >>> As far as networking would go, *that* is where we have our proprietary > >>> coding, right? Because there's no way to *just* use AS for multiplayer > >>> flash games, you have to have server-side code (whatever language) to > >>> control this, and interact with each client. Multiplayer usage won't be > >>> supported in non-OLPC machines, right? > >>> > >>> And to answer Joshua, loading local files is easy if the files are > >>> XML-based (shortened with URL-shortener): > >>> http://geobay.com/f12341 > >>> > >>> You are right in that you can't save files... like you think. Look at > >>> what line-rider does. How does it remember the 'levels' you make? > >>> SharedObjects. > >>> > >>> Here's an example of LineRider's cache path for M$ (honestly, I don't know > >>> Gnash's Flash cache for Linux... likely > >>> /home/<user>/.gnash/etc./etc./etc.): > >>> > >>> For the exe: > >>> C:\Documents and Settings\<user name>\Application Data\ > >>> Macromedia\Flash Player\#SharedObjects\ > >>> <some stupid cache name: LVSZR946>\localhost\ > >>> Documents and Settings\<user name>\Desktop\ > >>> LineRider_beta.exe\undefined.sol > >>> > >>> For the web player: > >>> C:\Documents and Settings\<user name>\Application Data\ > >>> Macromedia\Flash Player\#SharedObjects\ > >>> <some stupid cache name: LVSZR946>\ic1.deviantart.com\ > >>> fs12\f\2006\266\6\f\engin2_16devart.swf\undefined.sol > >>> > >>> In this final folder is a Shared Object Library (SOL) file, where *all* > >>> the level information is saved. There is a (albeit... not nice way) > >>> possible way to save user input, and just have it available next time they > >>> launch the application. > >>> > >>> I know it's no the best solution, but I'm just putting it out there. > >>> -Zak > >>> > >>> Alan Kay wrote: > >>>> The plan is go further than this. The thinking has been that each OLPC > >>>> machine will be a server, and can serve itself if there is no network > >>>> connectivity. > >>>> Again, there is no problem making any of this happen on the OLPC machine. > >>>> The entire environment and permissions are controlled. It's helping > >>>> children who don't have these machines in the rest of the world to be > >>>> part of the same conversation and activities. > >>>> Cheers, > >>>> Alan > >>>> At 03:25 PM 1/16/2007, Joshua Ellis wrote: > >>>>> Okay, I understand now. The key is to have the simple IDE easily > >>>>> deployable across platforms, not just the SWFs it creates. I'm sorry > >>>>> -- I lost that somewhere. > >>>>> One of the main problems is that Flash *cannot* interact with the host > >>>>> file system at all. It can't write files. I don't even think it can > >>>>> *load* local files. (I've never tried, but it's a pretty good > >>>>> assumption.) And this is unlikely to change -- it's a security thing. > >>>>> Adobe's Flex Server can compile apps over the network on the fly: > >>>>> check out http://try.flex.org/index.cfm to see an example. And this > >>>>> would be possible to replicate as an open-source tool. > >>>>> SJ mentioned to me the idea of a server OLPC as well as a client one > >>>>> -- from what he'd said, I'd envisioned a sort of LAN where all of the > >>>>> laptop OLPCs could connect to one server OLPC, which could function as > >>>>> a router, or a machine for a teacher. If this is the case, couldn't > >>>>> one run a compiler on *that* machine? > >>>>> jze > >>>>> On 1/16/07, GameMogul <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >>>>>> Well, if we had the ability to use outside applications, then, like > >>>>>> Alan > >>>>>> said, why are we stuck to Flash to begin with? If we want this to play > >>>>>> on ALL flash-capable computers... it has to built-in. If there are > >>>>>> external applications or external linkages to the Internet required > >>>>>> (i.e. server-side scripts), then it is very limited; such as, as Alan > >>>>>> said, school-districts not allowing the installation of executables. > >>>>>> Which also brings up the point of Internet-dependency, *requiring* > >>>>>> server scripts would make it so that people had to have a connection. > >>>>>> What if a laptop is out of range of others? Unfortunately, you > >>>>>> couldn't > >>>>>> say we'd just use a PHP engine on the laptop, because 1) large > >>>>>> size-bloat there and 2) it wouldn't work for just your average Joe on > >>>>>> an > >>>>>> M$ box who won't have a PHP engine on his computer. > >>>>>> -Zak > >>>>>> Joshua Ellis wrote: > >>>>>>> Also, has anybody looked at Apollo yet? > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> http://labs.adobe.com/wiki/index.php/Apollo:developerfaq > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> If you could get Adobe to release/write a version of the Apollo > >>>>>>> runtime for OLPC, that would kick serious ass -- you could develop > >>>>>>> apps for the OLPC in HTML/Flash/Flex/CSS/Javascript! > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> jze > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> On 1/16/07, Joshua Ellis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >>>>>>>> Also, here's a consideration: Flex generates Flash apps based on the > >>>>>>>> MXML language. So wouldn't it be possible to create a simple Flash > >>>>>>>> IDE > >>>>>>>> that generates MXML files, which could then be passed to a compiler, > >>>>>>>> rather than trying to make Flash evaluate user-written code from > >>>>>>>> within the player itself? > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> Oh, my poor head is aching. :-) > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> jze > _______________________________________________ > Devel mailing list > [email protected] > http://mailman.laptop.org/mailman/listinfo/devel > _______________________________________________ Devel mailing list [email protected] http://mailman.laptop.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
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