On 08/22/2011 12:03 PM, JB wrote:
Steve Grubb<sgrubb<at> redhat.com> writes:
...
You're not seeing the hundreds - no thousands of emails about systemd?
You are not seeing that all the expected facilities of init are not covered?
There is well founded rebellion here.
...
Yes, you are right. And the people (e-mails, posts) you refer to are too.
Your concerns and those of others point to a questionable (non-UNIX) systemd
design.
Once again I refer everybody to Denys Vlasenko's thread, where this is very
visible; go over it again and you will know why:
http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/devel/2011-June/152323.html
Sys init was, and should be (as it was expected to be in systemd):
- simple, limited-in-functions, stable, and thus secure in design
- no sys init *and* services manager roles (the last one should be done by
another (child) process and inetd-like server)
- no networking exposure due to security concerns
- no pseudo-roles like handling user sessions, login's, etc
- etc
It is not by chance that people think about a Windows-like approach in concept
and design of systemd, and even Lennart admitted to it:
"I like to see it as a modular platform to build an OS from."
It comes thru, he wants systemd, with its implied "world domination" attitude,
to be a base for some OS-to-be; he even expects it to be some kind of
a standard every distro would adopt.
I can only say I hope not !
I would suggest that Fedora will be first to reject it as it is now.
Fedora is a BETA distro by choice, so it should be easy, prudent, and proper
to stop here and redesign systemd, with community, users and testers input.
A propos, I have here a few links to sources on UNIX philosophy.
I would suggest to everybody to not just read them (skip over them quickly),
but also think for a few minutes about each principle.
It helps clear up one's mind.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unix_philosophy
Eric Steven Raymond
The Art of Unix Programming
http://www.catb.org/esr/writings/taoup/
http://www.catb.org/esr/writings/taoup/html/
The Unix Philosophy
http://www.linuxjournal.com/article/2877
Enjoy it.
JB
Vivaldi - Da due venti il mar turbato - Angela Gheorghiu - 1987 (Very Rare!)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?gl=US&v=8_MtYYCuFjk
+1000
--
Stephen Clark
*NetWolves*
Sr. Software Engineer III
Phone: 813-579-3200
Fax: 813-882-0209
Email: steve.cl...@netwolves.com
http://www.netwolves.com
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