On Friday 03 May 2013 00:12:48 Michael Grube wrote:
> So this paper is definitely interesting. One thing we should ask ourselves,
> though, is if we are OK with there being a non-uniform key distribution.
> Seems essential to me.
> 
> This might be a good temporary solution though. Doing markov chains with
> neighbors is a decent idea. The question is if we can replace it with a
> function whose output is equally hard to forge but also fairly random.
> There may be some simple operation we can perform on the output to make the
> distribution more equal.
> 
> Also, I'm seeing their simulator source code but not their implementation
> code.

Fascinating indeed! It's worrying that it's less uniform. I don't know what 
that would mean for e.g. data retention, load distribution? Nonetheless it is 
clearly a major improvement on the current algorithm: It's much faster (maybe 
it relies on the scale free property more than we do though? the graph will 
have aspects of this...?); it's immune to all published attacks, which have a 
fairly significant effect.

Also, the reality may be even worse: Even without attackers, churn in the 
network causes "natural" degeneration; we randomise periodically to try to 
correct this.

Note that we are probably immune to their third attack due to using a 
commit/reveal on swapping. However the first two are real enough and can't be 
beaten by commit/reveal.

We could implement this tomorrow. What exactly do we need to determine before 
doing so? We could validate the implementation, and compare it to current 
swapping, in a many-nodes-one-VM simulator (we can simulate approx 100 to 500 
"real" nodes on one high end system).

The old probe requests were intended to find the "successor" of a particular 
location/node, and often saw huge gaps. However they were often so large that I 
assumed it was a bug in the implementation, or a particularly perverse topology 
glitch combined with overload... if the latter, that's a serious problem in 
itself...

The paper talks about not having peers-of-peers. We do have locations for 
peers-of-peers for FOAF routing purposes. I wonder if this is important...

Average hops is good, but their max htl is nearly 200. This is kind of 
worrying! Fortunately we can afford some failure thanks to key-level 
redundancy...

The new algorithm has impressive performance on big networks - swapping doesn't 
scale, LMC works a lot better with the limited number of swaps. Having said 
that, they only show 10k nodes in this paper - the slides from the related talk 
( 
http://www.icsi.berkeley.edu/icsi/events/2013/03/strufe-dark-social-networking 
) suggest it works well on larger networks too; clearly swapping is running 
into scalability problems even at 10k nodes, at least with 6000|V| swaps.
> 
> On Thu, May 2, 2013 at 6:42 PM, Matthew Toseland
> <[email protected]>wrote:
> 
> > On Tuesday 05 Mar 2013 15:57:58 Matthew Toseland wrote:
> > > A paper accepted by INFOCOM 2013 claims to:
> > > 1) Show that our view of Kleinberg is unrealistic because we do not have
> > the sideways lattice links - the closest connection to the target isn't
> > always closer to the target than we've been so far.
> > > 2) Prove that we can't have polylog routing, and show that perverse
> > cases where the best route will take us further away are increasingly
> > common as networks grow, and
> > > 3) Propose a new algorithm that is provably polylog.
> > >
> > http://www.p2p.tu-darmstadt.de/publications/details/?no_cache=1&tx_bibtex_pi1[pub_id]=TUD-CS-2013-0036
> > > ("A Contribution to Analyzing and Enhancing Darknet Routing", Roos &
> > Strufe)
> > >
> > > Performance simulations show it is similar to ours or better depending
> > on the properties of the network, via a parameter C, "the maximal distance
> > to the closest neighbor over all nodes", i.e. if our closest links are
> > close enough, our current algorithm should work, but if not, their version
> > is significantly faster.
> > >
> > > The new algorithm changes backtracking and keeps a list of marked nodes
> > - all nodes visited AFAICS, or at least nodes where it backtracked.
> > Obviously this has security implications, but on darknet this is less
> > important than on opennet, and we really should have a separate tunnel
> > setup system for the very paranoid (e.g. based on Pisces).
> > >
> > > Having said that:
> > > - All the topologies simulated showed acceptable HTL for a 100,000 node
> > network, even using our current simplistic algorithm. Granted that's
> > somewhat idealized...
> > > - We can use redundancy to some degree to avoid perverse parts of the
> > keyspace breaking important functionality. I've suspected that "perverse
> > parts of the keyspace" exist for some time, and that seems to be the
> > paper's main concern; and it does not solve the problem either, it merely
> > limits it.
> > > - Right now hardly anyone uses darknet, and Michael Grube still hasn't
> > finished dealing with Pitch Black.
> > >
> > > His homepage also has some rather vague ideas under "open theses" on
> > censorship attacks on opennet via flooding; I suspect this was written by
> > his supervisor who may not have investigated the matter fully. IMHO
> > flooding opennet is a rather expensive attack, it's probably much easier to
> > MAST your target and take them offline IRL! :)
> > > http://www.p2p.tu-darmstadt.de/people/stefanie-roos/
> > >
> > And they provide a new swapping algorithm too, which is simpler to
> > implement, only uses local information, is faster and far more attack
> > resistant:
> >
> > http://www.ukp.tu-darmstadt.de/fileadmin/user_upload/Group_P2P/share/publications/Attack_Resistant_Network_Embeddings_for_Darknets.pdf
> >
> > Now if only we really had a 10,000 node darknet to run these algorithms
> > on! Making it easy to build a darknet has to be a high priority.
> >
> 

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