On 11 Jan 2016 at 18:23:03, Eduard Moraru
([email protected](mailto:[email protected])) wrote:
> Hi,
>
> IMO, option B feels like "the right way". It's clean and does not affect
> the productivity of neither advanced users, since just like the fact that
> not all advanced users are developers, neither are they all testers :)
>
> Additionally, option B also intorduces a nice structure in the UIXs of the
> editors which would become very handy for the developers of future editors.
> Right now, it's just a pile of editors (no grouping), while we have clearly
> identified "categories" for editors (WYSIWYG, Wiki source, object, class,
> etc.).
>
> I also realize that the effort in having B done right is considerably
> larger than doing A so maybe another (less ideal but more realistic) option
> would be to aim/plan for B in future iterations and just do A for now,
> since resources are limited.
>
> Regarding the name for the old WYSIWYG editor... we`re lucky right now that
> only advanced users might be exposed to whatever we come up with :)
:)
Option B is not just for advanced users AFAICS. It just means that the editor
names are visible in the Admin UI (admins) and in the User Profile pages (all
users).
Thanks
-Vincent
> Thanks,
> Eduard
>
> On Mon, Jan 11, 2016 at 4:53 PM, Ecaterina Moraru (Valica) <
> [email protected]> wrote:
>
> > On Mon, Jan 11, 2016 at 4:09 PM, [email protected]
> > wrote:
> >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > On 11 Jan 2016 at 15:08:12, [email protected] ([email protected]
> > (mailto:
> > > [email protected])) wrote:
> > >
> > > > Note that if the admin doesn’t want to show multiple editors to its
> > > user, he should not install multiple editors either :)
> > > >
> > > > (ofc there’s a problem right now in that the current editor is not an
> > > extension that you can uninstall).
> > > >
> > > > For advanced users, I still think it’s best to show all the active
> > > editors (in addition to the default which is set by the admin - We could
> > > have “(Default)” next to it in the menu. With UC3 the admin can decide
> > > whether he wants to make only 1 editor avail or several.
> > >
> > > Which is kind of nice if you want to let your users testdrive some new
> > > editor (such as the Realtime one for example - it’d be a pain to have to
> > go
> > > back to the your profile and constantly switch back and forth between
> > > editors)
> > >
> >
> > The purpose of users is to get the job done, not test and experiment with
> > different editors.
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Caty
> >
> >
> > >
> > > Thanks
> > > Vincent
> > >
> > > > Thanks
> > > > -Vincent
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > On 11 Jan 2016 at 14:52:46, Ecaterina Moraru (Valica) (
> > [email protected]
> > > (mailto:[email protected])) wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > Hi,
> > > > >
> > > > > I prefer B: I prefer to have things simpler for the user, while
> > > providing
> > > > > power to the administrator.
> > > > >
> > > > > There can be multiple extensions that integrate themselves inside
> > that
> > > menu
> > > > > (like the real-time editor) but I don't see that as a benefit for the
> > > user,
> > > > > but more confusing about all the types of editors.
> > > > >
> > > > > We already have 3 modes: WYSIWYG, Wiki, Inline + Objects + Class ....
> > > we
> > > > > need to find ways to simplify that, rather than adding more things in
> > > the
> > > > > menu (even if only for advanced users).
> > > > >
> > > > > The administrator should select the preferred editor from
> > > Configuration -
> > > > > Edit Mode Settings - Editor - Default Editor (for the farm or per
> > > wiki).
> > > > > The user will use the default value provided by admin or overwrite it
> > > from
> > > > > his User Preferences (if he is advanced and knows about the existence
> > > of
> > > > > multiple editors).
> > > > > By default we should select the recommended editor to be used and
> > this
> > > > > should be changed just in exceptional / desired cases.
> > > > >
> > > > > Having multiple editors available is not something a normal user
> > would
> > > care
> > > > > about and doesn't provide additional/different benefits for the user.
> > > > > Important is to provide the best tool by default.
> > > > >
> > > > > When adding the CKEditor first you will need to configure the wiki in
> > > order
> > > > > to use it. After a testing period we can change the default editor if
> > > we'd
> > > > > like.
> > > > >
> > > > > Off topic: I think that the Page syntax preference in the Document
> > > > > Information should be removed. There are not that many variations
> > > between
> > > > > 2.0 and 2.1 and I don't see why a normal user would care or want to
> > > chance
> > > > > the syntax. The users should rely on the default/recommended and the
> > > > > default is configured from Administration.
> > > > >
> > > > > Comment A: "GWT WYSIWYG" that would look super cryptic :)
> > > > >
> > > > > Thanks,
> > > > > Caty
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > On Mon, Jan 11, 2016 at 3:27 PM, [email protected]
> > > > > wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > On 11 Jan 2016 at 14:16:40, Marius Dumitru Florea (
> > > > > > [email protected](mailto:
> > [email protected]
> > > ))
> > > > > > wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > On Mon, Jan 11, 2016 at 2:00 PM, [email protected]
> > > > > > > wrote:
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Hi Marius,
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > I prefer to think in term of use cases. Here are the ones I see
> > > as
> > > > > > > > important on this topic and that I think we need to ensure that
> > > we
> > > > > > > > implement:
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > UC1: Ability for admins to install an extension that
> > contributes
> > > a new
> > > > > > > > editor
> > > > > > > > UC2: Ability for admins to select which editor is the default
> > > editor
> > > > > > for
> > > > > > > > their users in a given wiki (note that ideally this
> > configuration
> > > > > > should be
> > > > > > > > per wiki for the farm use case)
> > > > > > > > UC3: Ability for admins to decide which editors are active
> > (i.e.
> > > which
> > > > > > > > editors users will be able to configure or use). For example it
> > > should
> > > > > > be
> > > > > > > > possible to completely replace the GWT-based WYSIWYG by
> > > CKEeditor and
> > > > > > > > preventing any user from using the GWT-based WYSIWYG editor.
> > > > > > > > UC4: Ability for a user (simple or advanced) to explicitly
> > > decide which
> > > > > > > > default editors he/she’ll use (in his/her user profile
> > probably).
> > > > > > Should
> > > > > > > > override the editor selected in UC2 (but they should only see
> > > editors
> > > > > > that
> > > > > > > > are active, cf UC3)
> > > > > > > > UC5: Ability for an advanced user to choose on the spot
> > > (on-demand) the
> > > > > > > > editor to use to edit a given page, bypassing the default
> > editor.
> > > > > > Should
> > > > > > > > override the editor selected in UC4.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > WDYT?
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > All these use cases are covered by both A and B so it doesn't
> > help
> > > me
> > > > > > > choose one or the other. My question is more how to implement
> > > these use
> > > > > > > cases: using A or B?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Ok cool if they’re covered by A and B (it wasn’t mentioned in your
> > > email…).
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Note that currently there’s no default choice anymore for advanced
> > > users
> > > > > > when they edit a page and we’d need to put that back (that’s UC4).
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Apart from this, I think I prefer A) than B).
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Thanks
> > > > > > -Vincent
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Thanks
> > > > > > > > -Vincent
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > On 11 Jan 2016 at 12:31:12, Marius Dumitru Florea (
> > > > > > > > [email protected](mailto:
> > > [email protected]))
> > > > > > > > wrote:
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > Hi devs,
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > I'm working on integrating CKEditor in XWiki and I'm
> > wondering
> > > how
> > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > Edit
> > > > > > > > > menu should reflect the fact that there are multiple editors
> > > > > > available. I
> > > > > > > > > see two options:
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > (A) List all the available content editors in the Edit menu
> > > (note
> > > > > > that
> > > > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > menu is visible only for advanced users). E.g. Wiki, GWT
> > > WYSIWYG,
> > > > > > > > CKEditor
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > PROS:
> > > > > > > > > * easier to implement (because there is already an UIX for
> > > this)
> > > > > > > > > * easier to discover new content editors (e.g. after an admin
> > > > > > installs an
> > > > > > > > > extension that provides a content editor)
> > > > > > > > > * ability to try a different content editor than the one
> > > configured
> > > > > > (i.e.
> > > > > > > > > without updating the configuration)
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > CONS:
> > > > > > > > > * the (advanced) user might not know, at first, which content
> > > editor
> > > > > > to
> > > > > > > > > choose from the Edit menu
> > > > > > > > > * once the user has a preferred editor the other content
> > editor
> > > > > > entries
> > > > > > > > > become noise (the user may want to hide them)
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > (B) List only the edit modes in the Edit menu. E.g. Wiki,
> > > WYSIWYG
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > PROS:
> > > > > > > > > * easier to choose the edit mode (wiki/source vs. WYSIWYG)
> > > > > > > > > * less crowded Edit menu (easier to scan, no noise)
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > CONS:
> > > > > > > > > * the user needs to edit his profile to discover the
> > available
> > > > > > editors
> > > > > > > > for
> > > > > > > > > Wiki/WYSIWYG modes
> > > > > > > > > * harder to try the new content editors (you need to update
> > the
> > > > > > > > > configuration)
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > Let's see what we need for each option:
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > (A) Needs:
> > > > > > > > > * UIX in the Edit menu (already available)
> > > > > > > > > * 1 configuration option ("editing.content.defaultEditor") to
> > > > > > configure
> > > > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > default editor (at farm/wiki/space/user level). We can
> > probably
> > > > > > extend
> > > > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > "Default editor to use" preference from the user profile to
> > > show all
> > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > available content editors.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > (B) Needs:
> > > > > > > > > * 3 configuration options:
> > > > > > > > > ** default edit mode (Wiki vs. WYSIWYG), already available in
> > > the
> > > > > > user
> > > > > > > > > profile
> > > > > > > > > ** default Wiki mode editor (only one editor for now so we
> > can
> > > skip
> > > > > > it)
> > > > > > > > > ** default WYSIWYG mode editor (GWT-based vs. CKEditor)
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > I'm leaning towards option (A). WDYT?
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > Thanks,
> > > > > > > > > Marius
> > > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > > devs mailing list
> > > > > > [email protected]
> > > > > > http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs
> > > > > >
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