> On 06 Jul 2016, at 11:24, Thomas Mortagne <[email protected]> wrote: > > On Wed, Jul 6, 2016 at 11:21 AM, Vincent Massol <[email protected]> wrote: >> >>> On 06 Jul 2016, at 11:15, Thomas Mortagne <[email protected]> wrote: >>> >>> On Wed, Jul 6, 2016 at 11:00 AM, Vincent Massol <[email protected]> wrote: >>>> >>>>> On 06 Jul 2016, at 10:54, Thomas Mortagne <[email protected]> >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> On Wed, Jul 6, 2016 at 10:36 AM, Vincent Massol <[email protected]> >>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> On 06 Jul 2016, at 10:31, Thomas Mortagne <[email protected]> >>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> IMO ideally we should have <current wiki> -> <main wiki> for each >>>>>>> configuration property, not all or nothing. Exactly like standard >>>>>>> XWikiPreference based configuration properties. >>>>>> >>>>>> This is what we have, it’s already per-property. >>>>>> >>>>>>> As for the 1 vs 2 I really see no reason to forbid overwriting part of >>>>>>> the configuration in his own wiki for use cases like myxwiki.org for >>>>>>> example. >>>>>> >>>>>> The question is: Do we really want local admins on myxwiki.org to be >>>>>> able to use their own SMTP servers? I guess with ours we could configure >>>>>> some anti-spamming techniques to prevent myxwiki users from spamming >>>>>> people. At least we would have the mail logs in our SMTP server when >>>>>> some third party decides to blacklist us. >>>>> >>>>> 1) The SMTP server is not the only thing you can setup there (for >>>>> example it's interesting to change the default from mail address for >>>>> you wiki). But you might still want to use your own SMTP server for >>>>> you wiki (becauseou have a SMTP server which provide some analysis of >>>>> the mails, storage, etc.). >>>> >>>> So we could easily decide to use the local wiki only for some properties >>>> if we want. >>>> >>>>> 2) I don't see the relationship with spam. The only thing really >>>>> important for spam is who is allowed to send mail, not really who is >>>>> allowed to choose the SMTP server. Allowing someone to configure his >>>>> own SMTP server actually only decrease the load on the main SMTP >>>>> server and the chance of it being used for spam in case it's >>>>> overwritten. >>>> >>>> I explained the relationship in the previous mail. In short: controlling >>>> the SMTP server allows you take some actions/monitor mails. >>> >>> They don't need XWiki to send mail trough their own SMTP server. >> >> I think they do because the mail sender api requires PR and on a farm you >> don’t get it. And if they want to use java mail they need groovy which also >> requires PR. >> >> Do you see a way for them to send mail without PR? > > I don't think you understood what I mean. XWiki is not the only > software out there that allows sending mails. If you have your own > SMTP server then you can just use any mail client to send mails trough > it, not need to request a myxwiki.org wiki for that.
Indeed I had misunderstood :) Good point. Thanks -Vincent > And >>> again what would be blacklisted is this other SMTP server so we don't >>> care. >> >> Indeed, good point. I was thinking about myxwiki.org being blacklisted but >> you’re right, there’s no reason for myxwiki.org to be blacklisted; it’s not >> the one sending the mail. >> >> So I’m still in favor of option 2. Anyone strongly in favor of option 1? I’d >> like to start modifying the code soon so please reply asap. >> >> Thanks >> -Vincent >> >>> Thanks >>>> -Vincent >>>> >>>> PS: I’m playing the devil’s advocate (trying to represent Denis ;)) >>>> because I’m also preferring option 2. >>>> >>>>> Thanks >>>>>> -Vincent >>>>>> >>>>>>> But I don't mind too much getting rid of the two [Backward >>>>>>> compatibility] steps. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Tue, Jul 5, 2016 at 5:56 PM, Vincent Massol <[email protected]> >>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>> Hi devs, >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I’m working on http://jira.xwiki.org/browse/XWIKI-13546 ("Error in the >>>>>>>> log when sending a mail through the Mail API”). One way to fix it >>>>>>>> would to always look for the Mail.Config page in the main wiki instead >>>>>>>> of in the current wiki. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Actually the current algorithm is the following when looking up a mail >>>>>>>> configuration property: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> * <ul> >>>>>>>> * <li>Look in Mail.MailConfig in the current wiki</li> >>>>>>>> * <li>[Backward compatibility] Look in (current >>>>>>>> space).XWikiPreferences in the current wiki</li> >>>>>>>> * <li>[Backward compatibility] Look in XWiki.XWikiPreferences in the >>>>>>>> current wiki</li> >>>>>>>> * <li>Look in the xwiki properties file</li> >>>>>>>> * </ul> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> We also need to implement http://jira.xwiki.org/browse/XWIKI-12435 >>>>>>>> (“Use the Main Wiki Mail Configuration if not overridden at the >>>>>>>> subwiki level”): >>>>>>>> “ >>>>>>>> Right now when sending a mail in a subwiki, the configuration is taken >>>>>>>> from that subwiki's Mail.MailConfig document. >>>>>>>> In a non-farm use case, it's a pain to have to configure SMTP settings >>>>>>>> for each subwiki. >>>>>>>> It would be better to look into the main wiki's mail configuration >>>>>>>> when there's no overridden config at the subwiki's level. >>>>>>>> " >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> So I can see 2 options. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Option 1: Drop support for looking for configuration in subwikis >>>>>>>> ======== >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> * Rationale: there are few use cases that require overriding the mail >>>>>>>> config in a subwiki >>>>>>>> * Potential issue: if we stop looking for *.XWikiPreferences or for >>>>>>>> <current wiki>:Mail.Config then we won’t migrate configurations but >>>>>>>> always use the config from the main wiki. So backward compat is >>>>>>>> theoretically broken. >>>>>>>> * But it’s likely that the config in subwikis is the same as the >>>>>>>> config from the main wiki anyway. It’s also likely that if a subwikis >>>>>>>> smtp server is configured, then the main wiki is also configured. So >>>>>>>> it could be acceptable with a message in the Release Notes. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Option 2: Continue supporting overriding in subwikis >>>>>>>> ======== >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> * Stop bundling Mail.Config for subwikis and modify the config >>>>>>>> algorithm to be: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> * <ul> >>>>>>>> * <li>Look in Mail.MailConfig in the current wiki</li> >>>>>>>> * <li>[Backward compatibility] Look in (current >>>>>>>> space).XWikiPreferences in the current wiki</li> >>>>>>>> * <li>[Backward compatibility] Look in XWiki.XWikiPreferences in the >>>>>>>> current wiki</li> >>>>>>>> * <li>Look in Mail.MailConfig in the main wiki</li> >>>>>>>> * <li>Look in the xwiki properties file</li> >>>>>>>> * </ul> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I’ve discussed it quickly with Denis who prefers option 1 since he >>>>>>>> even sees the ability to configure the smtp server at the wiki level a >>>>>>>> potential issue (bypassing the farm admin). >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Personally I’m hesitating and I’d hate to remove the local override >>>>>>>> and then find some use cases where we need it. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> WDYT? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Thanks >>>>>>>> -Vincent _______________________________________________ devs mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs
