On Friday, 29 June 2018 at 19:50:32 UTC, Jonathan M Davis wrote:
On Friday, June 29, 2018 11:54:48 Joakim via Digitalmars-d
wrote:
On Friday, 29 June 2018 at 11:32:13 UTC, Jonathan M Davis
wrote:
> On Friday, June 29, 2018 10:50:52 Joakim via Digitalmars-d
>
> wrote:
>> I coincidentally just read this blog post, that summarizes
>> a lot of my thoughts against conferences and meetups:
>>
>> https://marco.org/2018/01/17/end-of-conference-era
>>
>> Maybe a good first step would be a mostly online DConf
>> geared towards Asian timezones? I could help out with
>> arranging those online talks.
>
> That article seems to pre-suppose that the only benefit from
> conferences is the talks. A _lot_ of good comes from having
> a bunch of the key developers in the same place for a few
> days where they can talk in person.
It "pre-supposes" nothing, points like yours are specifically
addressed:
"But all of that media can’t really replace the socializing,
networking, and simply fun that happened as part of (or
sometimes despite) the conference formula."
Well, then I clearly read over it too quickly, but regardless,
I think that you're going to have a hard time convincing the
folks that attend dconf that meeting in person is not highly
valuable, and for those who aren't there in person and only
care about the talks, the talks are livestreamed and then made
available separated out later. I don't see how trying to kill
off the in-person aspect of things makes it any worse for those
online, and I can say from experience that meeting in person
can be a game changer. It gives you a very different
perspective on someone if you've actually talked with them in
person, and there's lots of communication that works far better
that way. dconf is valuable for both the talks and the
communication that happens before, between, and after them. And
regardless of its location, I would hate to see it stop
happening or stop being an actual, physical conference. Much as
I prefer it when it's closer to where I live so that the travel
time and expenses are lower, I've gone even when it's been
halfway around the world, and I wasn't speaking (and thus
wasn't reimbursed), and I will continue to do so. And I hate
flying.
I honestly don't see how convincing folks to do just online
videos instead of meeting in purpose and recording the talks is
any kind of improvement. At best, it could be argued that if
folks could give their talks from home that the travel expenses
would be avoided, but that's not even vaguely worth the loss of
being able to have most of the core devs and many D enthusiasts
meet and talk in the same place for a few days - even if
several hours of that time is spent listening to talks that
could arguably have been done from home.
As I just told Mike, if you can't defend wasting time watching
talks together, then do all those things you mention without the
talks. And simply stating that the in-person talks are "valuable"
is no defense.
If you don't want to show up in person, then just watch the
livestream and don't show up. The rest of us actually want to
show up in person.
I have never shown up in person, I suspect I never will.
I feel sorry for those who want to come but can't afford to (be
it due to the time required or the money required), but they
wouldn't be any better off if everyone were livestreaming their
talks from home instead of a central location that they
couldn't afford to go to.
This is not about them, as you say, they can just watch the talks
online either way.
Many of us pay to go to dconf and consider the money very well
spent.
Yes, this is about those people, who as that blog post notes, are
wasting a ton of money on an outdated ritual that no longer makes
sense. If you believe the core team and a few key devs like you
need to get together once a year in person and hash things out,
then do that as an offline retreat somewhere, just don't sucker
in a bunch of other paying DConf attendees to help defray your
costs.
The ultimate question here is what is the best use of the money
that's being expended every year at DConf? Is that money best
spent mostly on hotel/conference rooms and airline tickets for
marginal benefit to most or on actually getting shit done? I
think it's obvious that the model I've sketched out to Mike above
would get a _lot_ more done.
