Hi Manuel,
I think Thom's comments are a little harsh, but I have to concur with
the underlying idea behind them. I am not exactly an Objective-C
neophyte - around 20K lines of code in the Étoilé repository are my
contribution and I have no problems digging through the -gui source to
find why my code isn't working - but I have twice tried and failed to
use GSWeb.
I don't mind the lack of a GUI WOBuilder clone. I'm quite happy
designing HTML templates by hand (in fact, I'd probably prefer to),
but I can't without the slightest hint of documentation. I have read
the WO and GSW class documentation, but it doesn't really make sense
without some kind of overview and I can't apply the WO documentation
to GSW because the build and deployment environments are too different.
With GNUstep, I can come from the Cocoa documentation, read the
GNUstep Make documentation, and immediately be able to produce command-
line tools. I can read a Gorm tutorial, and then easily map anything
that the OS X tutorials say about IB and apply that to GNUstep. Note
that Gorm and GNUstep Make are the two parts of GNUstep that I
consider the weakest, and yet they STILL compare favourably to GSW in
terms of approachability.
I find GNUstepWeb to be a source of incredible amounts of
frustration. Looking at things like SOGO and other WebObjects
applications make it seem so tantalising, and yet it is always
slightly out of reach. I don't have WebObjects 4.5 and I don't even
have a way of getting hold of a copy. Neither do many other people.
If the only way of using GSW is to have prior experience with an 8-
year-old piece of proprietary software that cost $699 on release then
it probably already has all of the users it ever will and has no
future other than to fade into obscurity which seems like a colossal
waste. If someone who knows GNUstepWeb well would just spend the two
or three hours required to write an introductory tutorial, its
usefulness would be increased dramatically.
I suggest any GSW developers read this:
http://www.shaffer-consulting.com/david/Seaside/
It's close to the bottom of the barrel when it comes to good
tutorials, but it was enough to pick up Seaside and start producing
applications with it. GSW doesn't even seem to have something of this
quality.
David
On 23 Nov 2007, at 18:22, Thom Cherryhomes wrote:
Manuel,
Gee, your responses are one hell of a cop-out.
What about for those of us who don't have an 8 year old copy of
WebObjects 4.5 to start off with? tough shit?
again, tools for your own little world, and I'm of the opinion that
the code should just be removed from the GNUstep tree because of its
sheer uselessness to everyone except a few who have tools that ARE NOT
FREE SOFTWARE IN THE FIRST PLACE.
-Thom
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