I think many of the attendees at Carpentries workshops are researchers who have been struggling with data and computation for a while - more of a "reactive" response to the need for training. On the other hand, I think scaling up into formal classes means targeting a slightly different audience and being "proactive" about training. Among the institutions I've been in, it's been very challenging to convince researchers and grad students to invest time and energy into courses unless they are required or promoted from the top-down (e.g. by departmental requirements, PIs, etc.)
A point that I keep coming back to is that if Carpentries or Carpentries-style content is formalized in courses, I really would like appropriate compensation for instructors (in contrast to the current model where most instructors volunteer their time). This is partially driven by the fact that at my PhD institution, the department only recently started offering R and Python classes, which are taught by a volunteer adjunct (full-time employee at an affiliated government agency, volunteering their time), and a part-time paid lecturer, so the lack of institutional support for computational training was noticeable. How can students be expected to take this seriously if none of the faculty are involved in teaching it? Best, -- Hao Ye [email protected] On Wed, Oct 3, 2018 at 12:08 PM, Labou, Stephanie <[email protected]> wrote: > Hello, > > > > We are having a similar discussion at the University of California San > Diego. Rather than formalizing the workshops as a course across > departments, or offering credit, we’re working to add the workshops to > students’ co-curricular record (CCR). The CCR is like an official > transcript, but for professional development, non-class learning, research > activities, etc. That way, students can have their Carpentry workshop > participation (or Carpentry-inspired workshop, such as a multi-day > “Tidyverse for R” series) reflected in an official capacity, and we don’t > have to navigate course credit red tape. > > > > I will say that we are approaching it this way because we are fortunate to > have an active Carpentry community here on campus – the Library runs formal > Software Carpentry workshops twice a year, with additional > Carpentry-inspired workshops maybe 2-3 times a year. So we have a level of > consistency in our workshop offerings that makes the CCR approach a valid > option. > > > > Best, > > > > Stephanie > > > > ---- > > Stephanie Labou > > Data Science Librarian > > The Library | University of California, San Diego > > [email protected] | 858-822-4808 > > ORCID: https://orcid.org/0000-0001-5633-5983 > > Schedule a meeting: https://calendly.com/slabou > > > > *From:* PERU Giacomo <[email protected]> > *Sent:* Wednesday, October 3, 2018 3:08 AM > *To:* discuss <[email protected]> > *Subject:* Re: [discuss] How can we scale up Carpentries training at > universities? > > > > Hi Lex, all, > > > > thank you for bringing this up. In my reply I am not answering to your > questions directly but I am offering our experience at the University of > Edinburgh, where we are in the same process, perhaps at an earlier stage. > > > > Edinburgh is one of the bases of the Software Sustainability Institute > (SSI), which is the UK coordinator of the Carpentries. Edinburgh is home to > several Carpentries instructors and generally very rich in resources, both > human and of other kind, which can be useful for scaling up the Carpentries > in the institution. We observe a general demand for Carpentries training at > all levels of UoE: undergraduates, postgraduates, PI’s, staff, librarians, > all show enthusiasm when offered the possibility of attending these > workshops or collaborating in some capacity. > > > > Clearly there is a ‘market’ and there are resources. What is missing is > coordination, and this is what we are trying to achieve. Like Lex says: > ‘making Carpentry workshops a core offering across departments’. > > > > We have just started and, despite the general sense of optimism, we are > aware that the difficult part will be to devise a plan for the scalability > and sustainability of this endeavour. > > > > The most immediate difficulty, in my opinion, is sourcing people wanting > to help in all roles, as instructors, helpers, organisers. There is always > a degree of voluntary participation in Carpentries workshop, so, in order > to ensure a longer term stability of the training, the plan needs to be > endorsed and supported by Faculty/College (or whatever structure is in > charge). > > > > Enabling students to earn credit from Carpentries workshop is something we > are not considering yet (would assessment come into play in this case, or, > would an attendance certificate suffice?). > > > > In the UK there are a few Universities offering regular Carpentries. It > might be interesting to gather together (including any other non UK > institution interested in this) for a one day workshop and discuss our > respective experiences, problems and solutions. > > > > Regards, > Giacomo Peru > > — — — > Project Officer - The Software Sustainability Institute > EPCC, University of Edinburgh, The Bayes Centre, 47 Potterrow, > <https://maps.google.com/?q=47+Potterrow,+Edinburgh,+EH8+9BT,+UK&entry=gmail&source=g> > Edinburgh, EH8 9BT, UK > <https://maps.google.com/?q=47+Potterrow,+Edinburgh,+EH8+9BT,+UK&entry=gmail&source=g> > t. +44 131 650 5856 > www.software.ac.uk > www.epcc.ed.ac.uk > > www.bayes.ed.ac.uk > > > > On 3 Oct 2018, at 08:55, Lex Nederbragt <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > Hi community, > > At the University of Oslo (UiO), we have an ongoing process that will > result in a Masterplan for IT at the university. I am part of the task > force responsible for writing this plan, and have been tasked to contribute > to a section on skills training. We have a large Carpentries effort at UiO, > regularly teaching one-day workshops with one lesson of the Software > Carpentry stack each (including make and testing/continuous integration), > very popular two-day R (tidyverse), and occasionally Data or Library > Carpentry lessons or full two-day workshops. Many at UiO are now seeing the > need to offer this kind of skills training more widely and organized as > formal course offerings, potentially with students earning credit. > > I am very happy with this development as it is a recognition of the skill > gap that exists amongst researchers, and a testament to the success of The > Carpentries and our local effort in filling it. However, I also worry that > we may lose something in the process of scaling up offering these workshops. > > By making Carpentry workshops a core offering across departments, with > students able to earn credit from them, my fear is that the spirit of the > volunteer effort gets lost or may become reduced. Making our workshops into > required courses may change (reduce) the motivation for learners and > instructors. > > So here are my questions to you: > > ⁃ Have other universities made the same move, or are they planning > this, and if so, how are they organizing this effort? > ⁃ How to keep learners motivated if they feel they are required to > take a Carpentries workshops? > ⁃ How to keep the quality of instruction, and instructor motivation, > high, if workshops become organized like regular courses? > > I’d appreciate any suggestions that will help us become succesful scaling > up our Carpentries skills training! > > Regards, > > Lex Nederbragt > > > ------------------------------------------ > The Carpentries: discuss > Permalink: https://carpentries.topicbox.com/groups/discuss/Tad9e416c2ec > 4742e-M3c6d988d25ad7f3c3b283d04 > Delivery options: https://carpentries.topicbox.c > om/groups/discuss/subscription > > > > *The Carpentries <https://carpentries.topicbox.com/latest>* / discuss / > see discussions <https://carpentries.topicbox.com/groups/discuss> + > participants <https://carpentries.topicbox.com/groups/discuss/members> + > delivery > options <https://carpentries.topicbox.com/groups/discuss/subscription> > Permalink > <https://carpentries.topicbox.com/groups/discuss/Tad9e416c2ec4742e-M2ebe0f78acab0ce249fc18f2> > ------------------------------------------ The Carpentries: discuss Permalink: https://carpentries.topicbox.com/groups/discuss/Tad9e416c2ec4742e-M7046a25f5d342a2837f478bc Delivery options: https://carpentries.topicbox.com/groups/discuss/subscription
