this is a user issue. It is not a bug. My suggestion is practice. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Christopher Gilland" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Tuesday, November 25, 2008 5:09 PM Subject: Fw: Really annoying issue with editing in text boxes.
I sent this to Apple Accessibility. Do any of yall have any thoughts? Chris. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Christopher Gilland" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Tuesday, November 25, 2008 5:04 PM Subject: Really annoying issue with editing in text boxes. >I am a voiceover user using Leopard 10.5.5. > > I have noticed this issue as far back as the first release of Tiger. > > Basically, it's gonna be hard for me to type out what is happening, being > this is more an auditory based thing, so try to stick with me on this. I > really hope I don't confuse you all. > > OK, I have a document up, o... let's just say, in, o? I dunno. Text Edit, > we'll just say for sakes being. > > OK, I have typed the following line of text in a new, blank text document. > Please pay extremely close attention to how I've typed this both > gramatically, and also spelling: > > The colors of tHe flag r red. white. and blUe? > > Boy, this sentence is r'r'r'really! messed up! > > Let's edit it. > > OK, I go to the beginning of that line with command+left arrow. > > I hear the word, The. > > OK, so now I move word by word, with option right arrow. > > The > colors > of > tHe > > Whoops? We gotta booboo here. OK, so, I hit right arrow. > > I hear space. UM? OK? > > I hit left arrow. I hear again: Space. What in the heck? > > I hit left arrow again. I hear E. aa, K. now we're getting there. I > left arrow again. I hear cap H. There we go. I need to delete this and > put a lower case h, instead of capital. So I hit the delete key, then > type lower case h. > > Now, if I read the current line with vo+L, I hear: > > hhe colors of tHe flag r red. white. and blUe? > > What? in the world? Why did it do? that! > > I called a friend for help, and what he told me is the following. I've > pasted his response below: > > > Wo wo wol Chris! Hold on here. Wol! Ur'r'r'rk? > > Um? You're kind a failing to see something here: You're thinking Windows > again. Stop doing that. Voiceover, thank God, doesn't work like JAWS. > You can't edit that way. The thing is, Chris, as you left and right > arrow, you know how in Windows, your insertion point is gonna be right on > the actual character that it speaks? Well, un? fortunately, in Voiceover, > it's not quite that simple. In VO, it is actually reading to you the > character that your insertion point passes over, rather than the way > Windows does it, with jfw, by reading the character you're sitting on. > > This is why when you hit the left arrow then delete, it did what it did. > > Let's say, Chris, that you type the word Hello, but instead of h, e, l, l, > o, you did: h, e, k, k, o. Hekko? What the hell kind a word is that! > > So, you wanna get rid of those two k's, and replace them with l's. Right? > OK, What I'd! do, Chris, is I would option right arrow, until I hear > Hekko. Now remember, Chris, you're not on the word Hekko. Because you > were working to the right in the document, where are you really? cor, > rect! You're to the right! of the word hekko. That is definitely not > where we wanna be, is it? So hit option left arrow one time. You'll hear > again: Hekko. Can you explain to me Chris, why that is? The reason's, > because now, you moved to the left! of the word Hekko. See... you're not > on the word actually. That's where you're getting confused. On the Mac, > unlike in Windows, there is! no such thing, as being quote, unquote, on! a > character/word. You have to be on either trailing side of it, and > depending on whether you've done left arrow, or right arrow, will > determine which side you're on. OK, so now. We're to the left of the > word Hekko. hit you're right arrow. You'll hear cap H. however, watch > this. read your current character with vo+C. Did you see what it did? It > said E. It didn't say H did it. ok, now hit left arrow. What did you > hear? You heard E again didn't you. Now, hit vo C. Notice it said H? > See? it's telling you what your cursor passed over! not! what it's > actually on. so hit right arrow once. You heard E. Actually though, it > passed the letter e, and since you're working to the right, it now is > sitting on the right side of the letter E. So I betcha, if you now hit vo > C, it'll say K. See that? You're now actually sitting on the first > letter K in Hekko. So, hit your delete key twice. now, type ll. > > Now read the current line with vo+L. > > Hello > > See? Mission accomplished! > > > End of response from my friend. > > > God! blessid! That confused me. I don't totally get what he's saying > about it passing over things etc. That's driving me to drinking, as I > can't hardly edit a document this way. > > Is there any way to think about this differently, or at least, maybe a way > in a future update, maybe under navigation in the vo utility, yall could > make a checkbox, to make it behave more like Windows and speak what it's > actually under instead of what it passes? God. I'm sure I'm not the > first newly migrating user from Windows to a Mac, who's ran into this. I > dono if it's a bug, that yall didn't really fix, as most people don't > really seem to care, they just deal with it, or if you all purposefully > made it this way, but no offense. In all do respect though guys, this! is > outstandingly disgusting! > > Ewww! Yoyk! You can imagine for people who have to work in other > languages that don't use the standard lattin based alphebet, you can > imagine for someone like that, how Godly hard this would be to edit. > > Say in Arabic, you're wanting to type Allah. > > Yes, you could do: A, l, l, A, h. but what if you're really typing > arabic. > > Alif, lam, lam, heh. > > now that is Not! gonna read with vo if you use the actual Arabic letters, > so, editting that? being you don't know what you're literally, on, as it's > passing things, not reporting what you're sitting on? Now you got > yourself a double! challenge. Trying first to figure out what characters > you got, and B, figuring out where your cursor really truely is sitting, > not what it's passed over. > > just, ya know: > > Be aware of this. It is something that I really think you all may wanna > consider looking into as it's so confusing to me, it's almost making me > scared of Leopard, and really wanna use it less and less. It just cfeels > so awquard! Any suggestions? > > Chris.
