On Thursday, June 25, 2020 8:05:43 PM EDT Dotzero wrote:
> After reading Dave Crocker's proposal, which I consider fundamentally
> broken, I've given some thought to the issues.
> 
> 1) Many MLM's do not want to change their current practices yet suffer
> consequences from DMARC implementations at their subscribers domains.
> 
> 2) There is a mismatch between the granularity (domain) which DMARC
> operates at and individual subscriptions to mailing lists.
> 
> 3) It would be useful for domains with individual users to show
> authorization for messages by individuals that are likely to flow through
> intermediaries such as MLMs.
> 
> Without formulating all the details, what I propose for the groups
> consideration is a new field which I will call "Intermediary" as a stalking
> horse. This field would be DKIM signed separately from the current DKIM
> signing. This would ensure more robust survivability in passing through the
> intermediary. There would likely need to be some additional elements signed
> to mitigate against replay attacks using the second signature.
> 
> Variations on this approach might include:
> 
> A) Generic signing of "Intermediary". This seems as risky or perhaps more
> risky to me as signing using the "*l*=" tag. Presumably generic signing
> should not be used in conjunction with reject.
> 
> B) Specifying the specific Intermediary in the Intermediary Field. This
> would indicate that the users domain recognizes that the user uses the
> intermediary and by policy exempts this use even though it breaks both DKIM
> and SPF validation. The receiving domain would need to recognize some
> potential risk of malicious modifications or additions to the message.
> 
> Benefits of this proposal include:
> 
> 1) This is an addition to DMARC that does not change the underlying
> functionality of DMARC for those domains not interested in participating in
> this extended functionality.
> 
> 2) It resolves the mismatch in granularity between the domain level and the
> user level as far as authentication/authorization.
> 
> 3) It would require no effort on the part of known intermediaries other
> than not breaking the second signature.
> 
> Issues:
> 
> 1) It increases administrative complexity for the originating domain in
> that it requires the domain to either track user:intermediary relationships
> or enable users to self approve such relationships ad hoc.
> 
> 2) A more detailed specification would need to be fleshed out to determine
> whether this approach would survive likely modifications by known
> intermediaries.
> 
> 3) This does not address the issue of modifications by intermediaries not
> identified in advance and authorized.
> 
> Feel free to start pulling this apart. This is a proposal for an approach,
> not a complete proposed solution.
> 
> Michael Hammer

I think a good place to start is ATPS (RFC 6541).  At least at this level of 
detail it sounds similar to me.  I think it would be useful to know what you 
would do differently or alternately why you think it might catch on now when it 
didn't when it was developed.

Scott K



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