If you wish to make it attractive, the meeting point is probably not-dns because alt is .. too desireable by others with different intent, in the real world.
(I didn't mean >not-dns<) the advantage of the unicode choice, was purely that it avoided semantic meaning and was unlikely to be chosen. But I did also hope, that it would terminate in DNS of older code. A useful side-effect. G On Tue, Sep 13, 2016 at 11:02 AM, Warren Kumari <war...@kumari.net> wrote: > On Mon, Sep 12, 2016 at 8:27 PM, George Michaelson <g...@algebras.org> wrote: >> Alt being semantically overloaded in times past, contextually even in >> domain names (Usenet, the great renaming) It seems highly unwise to >> ignore that historic understanding that people thought it meant the >> same thing as "burning man" >> >> The string >not-dns< has two useful properties: its not currently >> semantically loaded, and its meaning is unambiguous. >> >> It has a third useful property: Its ugly. >> >> Personally, I favour use of the unicode U+FFFD � REPLACEMENT CHARACTER > > > This (and your third property) is where we disagree -- there is > nothing that we can do to prevent people from simply squatting on > names. We are not the namespace police. This means that whatever we > select needs to be as attractive as possible if we want any hope of > people using it. Making it ugly, or impossible to type, or in any > other way implying that other resolution systems are second-class > citizens simply means that people won't use it, and will just squat on > whatever they choose. > > I'm assuming you were actually meaning "not-dns" and not ">not-dns<" > -- if you were actually proposing the latter, we have a larger gulf -- > the names need to be useable anywhere current domain type names are - > this includes things like browsers, but also includes other apps, like > SSH, FTP, etc. > > foo.alt (and foo.not-dns) both are accepted by OpenSSH (as an example): > ssh: Could not resolve hostname foo.atl: Name or service not known > wkumari@ron:~/tmp$ ssh foo.not-dns > ssh: Could not resolve hostname foo.not-dns: Name or service not known > > foo.>not-dns< (obviously enough) isn't: > wkumari@ron:~/tmp$ ssh foo.>not-dns< > -bash: syntax error near unexpected token `newline' > wkumari@ron:~/tmp$ > > If we don't provide people an (acceptable) alternative, and at least > try and meet their needs, we lose any sort of right to shake a finger > and say "Bad dog!" when they widdle on the namespace... > > > -W > > >> -G >> >> On Mon, Sep 12, 2016 at 9:57 PM, <internet-dra...@ietf.org> wrote: >>> >>> A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts >>> directories. >>> This draft is a work item of the Domain Name System Operations of the IETF. >>> >>> Title : The ALT Special Use Top Level Domain >>> Authors : Warren Kumari >>> Andrew Sullivan >>> Filename : draft-ietf-dnsop-alt-tld-05.txt >>> Pages : 10 >>> Date : 2016-09-12 >>> >>> Abstract: >>> This document reserves a string (ALT) to be used as a TLD label in >>> non-DNS contexts or for names that have no meaning in a global >>> context. It also provides advice and guidance to developers >>> developing alternate namespaces. >>> >>> [ Ed note: This document lives in GitHub at: >>> https://github.com/wkumari/draft-wkumari-dnsop-alt-tld . Issues and >>> pull requests happily accepted. ] >>> >>> [ Question for Working Group. It has been proposed that the string >>> .ALT should be replaced with something else e.g. .NOT-DNS. As naming >>> discussions in the IETF are always short, simple, and not >>> controversial, we figured we should open these for discussion now. >>> We would appreciate clear feedback on preference and rationale. ] >>> >>> >>> The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: >>> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-dnsop-alt-tld/ >>> >>> There's also a htmlized version available at: >>> https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-dnsop-alt-tld-05 >>> >>> A diff from the previous version is available at: >>> https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-dnsop-alt-tld-05 >>> >>> >>> Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission >>> until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. >>> >>> Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: >>> ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> DNSOP mailing list >>> DNSOP@ietf.org >>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop > > > > -- > I don't think the execution is relevant when it was obviously a bad > idea in the first place. > This is like putting rabid weasels in your pants, and later expressing > regret at having chosen those particular rabid weasels and that pair > of pants. > ---maf _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop
