SHEEP! When can this thread die?
......................... Stephen Russell - Senior Visual Studio Developer, DBA Memphis, TN 901.246-0159 -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of KeidrickP Sent: Monday, November 24, 2008 11:06 AM To: [email protected] Subject: [DotNetDevelopment] Re: northwind database ok, so by posting that URL I didn't expect it to turn into a full week discussion. It is very apparent that people feel a certain way about someone not taking the time to look before posting a question in this group. Anyone else that reads this please take the time to at least google, or search the archives before posting a single one-lined question. On Mon, Nov 24, 2008 at 3:12 AM, CK <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Kaarthik, > > Cerebrus doesn't work full time moderating this group, nor is he paid > anything for doing it. > > Because these discussions work both online and through email, a > discussion can get heated and out of control very quickly, I often > find 50 new posts each time I visit, and I feel I look on here a lot. > > People with intelligence should be self-moderating, and should try to > put up with others who cannot. > > That said, it is quite a penomenon that people "discussing" on the > internet will often not be themselves as they are shielded from real > physical interaction by their keyboard. > > We've had numerous threads like this one where people start getting > angry, I started one by paraphrasing a rediculous question that had > led to expert leaving the group to try and show people how stupid > question lead to far more than stupid answers. > > I enjoy reading the posts on this group, and answering where I can, > and occasionally I even ask questions! > > This forum only needs one rule to survive happily, Try Google First! > > On 24 Nov, 01:45, "Kaarthik Padmanabhan" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> Cerebrus, >> Thanks for checking in at last. >> >> It does not matter if someone who joins the group, reads or does not read >> the rules and regulations, It is totally their problem. >> But at any point if they violate the rules, YOU could remove that person - >> stating that he or she has crossed the line. But for you to do that, you >> should have the rules pinned down somewhere at the first place. >> >> Resorting to calling people names or making jokes does not seem to be the >> right approach. >> >> Maybe you should have done this long back, probably then maybe you would not >> have lost "innumerable experts" who got shooed away by slothful idiots and >> laggard nincompoops. >> >> I can understand how frustrating it could get(especially for you) to see a >> slew of emails for VFAQ's AND subscriptions. >> But I share the same concern for people who get publicly humiliated and >> mocked at. Put it in the rules and make it a violation and kick the person >> out - seems a lot more simpler? Doesn't it? >> >> I only hope this thread gets closed with some solution or else it would mean >> that "someone" has chickened out. >> >> And Brandon - are you really following this thread? Santhosh has already >> answered this infamous question on this thread's 18th reply. And who were >> the people who took it that long? Oh wait a second.. I do see a "Brandon" >> somewhere in between there... >> >> Kaarthik >> >> On Mon, Nov 24, 2008 at 1:16 AM, Brandon Betances <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>wrote: >> >> >> >> > Amen Brother. There's a huge difference between coherent, intelligent, well >> > thought out discussions, and asking the same stupid one sentence questions >> > over again. They fact of the matter is, if the OP would have taken the time >> > to type Northwind into Wikipedia, which just took me all of 5 seconds to do, >> > he would have gotten this answer. >> >> > Northwind, a sample database <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Database>included in MS >> > Access <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MS_Access> and MS SQL Server<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MS_SQL_Server>often used in examples of database queries or data access programming. >> >> > Problem solved, question answered, and now week long heated argument that >> > STILL has'nt answered the question. Matter of fact, its taking me longer to >> > write this message than it was to find the answer to the question. >> >> > Those properties, the ability to research, learn on your own, expand your >> > knowledge, and know where to turn when in need of help, are what separate a >> > good programmer from someone who makes a living off other peoples work. No >> > offense, OP, but if you couldn't use the plethora of tools given to you by >> > Al Gore, then you wont make it as a "good" software architect. >> >> > On Sun, Nov 23, 2008 at 2:36 PM, Cerebrus <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> >> >> A lot has been said in this thread about the role of moderators and >> >> the need for modification of the Group's rules/regulations and I will >> >> comment on them, but first, I quote : >> >> >> --- >> >> > If Google was the answer to all the question please tell the aims and >> >> > objectives of this forum. Please paste >> >> > "Only Experienced and Advanced Questions and Users Expected!!" in the >> >> welcome >> >> > page >> >> --- >> >> >> > (mocking at a person) is not going to invite new users and is surely not >> >> making this the "most >> >> > popular Google group for discussions on Microsoft.NET(R) and related >> >> > technologies". >> >> --- >> >> >> > then let us have those points added to the rules and >> >> > regulations. Can we? >> >> > There are a lot of things documented. Are you telling me that >> >> > only undocumented and unexplained queries have been answered by people >> >> in >> >> > this group so far? >> >> --- >> >> >> > this is not in rules and regulations of the >> >> > forum so newbies would be eager to ask such questions. And it will be >> >> good >> >> > some senior members mark such questions as closed for the begining >> >> itself >> >> > there by avoiding some one abuse for this and avoiding a bulk thread >> >> like >> >> > this ;) >> >> >> > Something like >> >> >> > =========== >> >> > CLOSED FOR GOOGLE >> >> > =========== >> >> >> --- >> >> > No one has answered the question about including some points to the >> >> rules and >> >> > regulations yet. Moderator! KNOCK KNOCK - are you there? >> >> >> > Let us get something constructive here with this one. Something like >> >> this >> >> > would not offend anyone: >> >> >> > 1. Avoid posting questions which have already been asked. Please >> >> search >> >> > the group for similar questions, before you post yours >> >> > 2. Post your questions with some example code wherever possible. >> >> > Arbitrary questions will not be entertained. >> >> > 3. Users repeatedly violating these terms will be automatically >> >> > unsubscribed from the list. >> >> --- >> >> >> My comments are as follows : >> >> >> 1. The aims and objectives of this Group are the same as those of any >> >> online technical discussion forum - mutually productive interaction >> >> between intelligent members of a community. A user does not need to be >> >> advanced or experienced to be able to Google. That is the point many >> >> members have been trying to make. I want to add that this Group has >> >> never been anti-newbie. One common element in most such discussions is >> >> that all people who ask stupid un-researched questions are branded as >> >> newbies and the impression is created that the experts in this Group >> >> do not want to help newbies. This is a grossly misleading >> >> characterization. All newbies are not lazy, indolent idiots who demand >> >> to be assisted with the most basic of problems. A person could be very >> >> experienced and still not be bothered to do the slightest research. >> >> >> 2. This is the most popular Google group for Microsoft.NET discussions >> >> because of its members who are highly respected, highly knowledgable >> >> and highly passionate about the subject. It has *not* become popular >> >> because we chose to spoonfeed slothful idiots so that a good public >> >> impression could be maintained. We are not a corporation and we do not >> >> care about our Public relations image. We have had innumerable experts >> >> leave the Group because it had become a forum for "homework questions" >> >> and the majority of us did not find it intellectually stimulating at >> >> all to answer a VFAQ. When laggard nincompoops leave the Group no one >> >> notices but when experts leave the Group, the loss is widely felt >> >> because these are the people who actually contribute to make this a >> >> better community. >> >> >> 3. It is I who wrote the "Welcome message" of the Group two years back >> >> and it is I who takes the sole responsibility for its >> >> comprehensiveness (or lack, thereof). I welcome suggestions about it, >> >> but before you send me manuscripts full of ideas, answer me two >> >> questions - Do you know what percentage of members have never >> >> (bothered to) read the Welcome message? After about 3 years moderating >> >> this Group, my estimate is that about 70% of members simply ignored >> >> that message and the included rules/regulations. Yes, that is the >> >> reason I later changed a part of it to red and bold faced. Do you know >> >> how many emails I get on my personal email address asking me to >> >> subscribe them to the Group's membership ? About 1-2 every day. I >> >> always check and they're almost always already subscribed. I mean, how >> >> hard is it to see the "Join this Group" link on the right ? >> >> >> Even if I chose to include the suggested guidelines explicitly, I >> >> doubt it would have much effect on the behaviour of those whose >> >> languor is so great that they find it easier to ask a question here >> >> rather than Google it, for those who would rather write an incoherent >> >> question fully of misspellings that doesn't disclose any details about >> >> the problem rather than spending a few minutes gathering their >> >> thoughts. >> >> >> 4. There have been suggestions that this thread be closed. This group >> >> is for discussions and I do not close any threads until the language >> >> becomes ugly or the atmosphere becomes vitiated. Therefore, this >> >> thread will remain open for the present. >> >> >> There can be no excuse for laziness and therefore, we do not excuse >> >> it. >> >> >> -- >> >> Cerebrus. >> >> Group Moderator.- Hide quoted text - >> >> - Show quoted text - No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.175 / Virus Database: 270.9.9/1807 - Release Date: 11/24/2008 9:03 AM
