Yes, I read a lot of background info when I was younger and know that it makes biological sense. The truth is that I don't manage anything. I eat some tofu, lots of beans, and lots of fruits, vegetables, and root crops. I will challenge any of the HCB editors to a game of one-on-one basketball to demonstrate how healthy I am. :) Of course the biology of what you say makes sense, but it practicality the fact that I don't get all the amino acids seems not to matter much. Not sure why. I think other vegetarians would agree.
N. Quoting malcolm McCallum <[email protected]>: > here is a quick article that briefly discusses amino acid deficiencies > in plants. Of course, you must manage your diet very carefully, but > lys, trp, and met are the key AA of importance here. > http://www.plantphysiol.org/cgi/content/full/147/3/954 > > I tried to find further references, but simply do not have the time. > > M > > On Wed, Sep 9, 2009 at 11:56 AM, Lesley Campbell <[email protected]> wrote: > > Hello everyone, > > > > While I'm more than happy to agree that the amount that ecologists travel > > (relative to the average earth resident) is an outrageous disaster, and > I'm > > happy to agree that curbing travel has a far larger impact on one's > > ecological footprint than curbing the consumption of animal products, the > > statement that humans cannot survive on a plant based diet is clearly > false. > > Humans do not require any animal-derived amino acids (although they are > > certainly tasty!). If it is not proof enough that there are entire > cultures > > (with reasonable life-spans) that eat strictly vegetarian diets, just > survey > > the academic literature on vegetarian (vs non-vegetarian) health. > Vegetarian > > diets do require humans to consume foods differently than non-vegetarians > > but they are not impossible, nor unhealthy. Unfortunately, most people > > switch to a vegan diet with little education in nutrition and end up > rapidly > > depleting essential nutrients that come from food the normal North > American > > doesn't use regularly. > > > > Here's an abstract of a the first comparative study of vegetarians and > > non-vegetarians I pulled up on Web of science. It looks as if Buddhist > > vegetarian nuns are just as healthy (if not more) as non-vegetarian > > omnivores. > > > > Body composition and nutrient intake of Buddhist vegetarians (2009) > > Lee, Yujin, Krawinkel, Michael. > > ASIA PACIFIC JOURNAL OF CLINICAL NUTRITION    18(2): 265-271 > > Abstract: We described the body composition and nutrient intake of > Buddhist > > vegetarians and compared the data with that of omnivores in South Korea. > > Vegetarian subjects were 54 Buddhist nuns, who adhered to a vegetarian > diet > > in accordance with Buddhist teachings. We compared these finding with a > > group of 31 omnivore Catholic nuns who shared a similar lifestyle but > > different dietary pattern than those of the Buddhist nuns. All subjects > > completed the estimated three-day dietary record. Body composition was > > determined by a segmental multi-frequency-bioelectrical impedance analysis > > method. No height difference between the dietary groups existed but the > > vegetarians had a significantly higher body weight, fat free mass, body > fat > > and body mass index (BMI, kg/m(2)) than the omnivores. The median BMI of > > both vegetarians and omnivores fell in the normal range (22.6 vs. 20.7 > > kg/m(2)). In vegetarians, body fat was inversely correlated with the > > duration of vegetarianism (p for trend = 0.043). The long duration group > of > > the vegetarians had lower body fat than the short duration group (12.1 vs. > > 15.0 kg, p = 0.032). The status of the nutrient intake of Korean Buddhist > > vegetarians was comparable to that of omnivores, and the intake of some > > nutrients in vegetarians was more favorable than in the omnivores. > > > > And the most highly cited, manipulative study I could find, revealed that > a > > vegetarian diet (including dairy products) has beneficial consequences for > > blood pressure. > > > > A clinical trial of the effects of dietary patterns on blood pressure > (1997) > > Appel LJ, Moore TJ, Obarzanek E, Vollmer WM, Svetkey LP, Sacks FM, Bray > GA, > > Vogt TM, Cutler JA, Windhauser MM, Lin PH, Karanja N > > NEW ENGLAND JOURNAL OF MEDICINE  336 (16): 1117-1124 > > > > Abstract: Background It is known that obesity, sodium intake, and alcohol > > consumption influence blood pressure. In this clinical trial, Dietary > > Approaches to Stop Hypertension, we assessed the effects of dietary > patterns > > on blood pressure. > > Methods We enrolled 459 adults with systolic blood pressures of less than > > 160 mm Hg and diastolic blood pressures of 80 to 95 mm Hg. For three > weeks, > > the subjects were fed a control diet that was low in fruits, vegetables, > and > > dairy products, with a fat content typical of the average diet in the > United > > States. They were then randomly assigned to receive for eight weeks the > > control diet, a diet rich in fruits and vegetables, or a ''combination'' > > diet rich in fruits, vegetables, and low-fat dairy products and with > reduced > > saturated and total fat. Sodium intake and body weight were maintained at > > constant levels. > > > > Results At base line, the mean (+/-SD) systolic and diastolic blood > > pressures were 131.3+/-10.8 mm Hg and 84.+/-4.7 mm Hg, respectively. The > > combination diet reduced systolic and diastolic blood pressure by 5.5 and > > 3.0 mm Hg more, respectively, than the control diet (P<0.001 for each); > the > > fruits-and-vegetables diet reduced systolic blood pressure by 2.8 mm Hg > more > > (P<0.001) and diastolic blood pressure by 1.1 mm Hg more (P=0.07) than the > > control diet. Among the 133 subjects with hypertension (systolic pressure, > > greater than or equal to 140 mm Hg; diastolic pressure, greater than or > > equal to 90 mm Hg; or both), the combination diet reduced systolic and > > diastolic blood pressure by 11.4 and 5.5 mm Hg more, respectively, than > the > > control diet (P<0.001 for each); among the 326 subjects without > > hypertension, the corresponding reductions were 3.5 mm Hg (P<0.001) and > 2.1 > > mm Hg (P=0.003). > > > > Conclusions A diet rich in fruits, vegetables, and low-fat dairy foods and > > with reduced saturated and total fat can substantially lower blood > pressure. > > This diet offers an additional nutritional approach to preventing and > > treating hypertension. (C) 1997, Massachusetts Medical Society. > > > > > > On Sep 8, 2009, at 10:50 PM, malcolm McCallum wrote: > > > >> I tend to believe that any absolute answer that is declared an end all > >> answer > >> is probably not the answer. 啫or example, I'm not convinced that everyone > >> jumping into a vegetarian diet is going to suddenly or even slowly > >> save the world. > >> Especially, considering that some of these stats are based on unrealistic > >> estimates. > >> > >> For example, suggesting that x acres of corn would feed x number of cows > >> and > >> that would feed x number of people whereas the x acres of corn would feed > >> way > >> more people is flawed. 㗎umans cannot survive on a corn diet. 啲ven if > >> we expanded > >> this to grains and soybeans, humans cannot survive on a corn-soybean > diet. > >> Why? 毪ecause vegetables in general are low in two or three essential > >> amino acids > >> that humans must get in their diet. 濳hose amino acids are produced by > >> animals > >> and so you must ultimately get them from animals or artificially > >> produced products. > >> > >> Furthermore, even if the plant has x amount of lysine for example, the > >> amount in > >> the plant is not completely biologically available to the human > >> because we simply > >> do not have the enzymes for breaking these products down. > >> > >> Also, outside of feedlots where high-concentrate diets are fed, if you > >> look at > >> grass fed cattle/sheep/goats you are going to find that these animals > >> are raised > >> on lands that are not very suitable for food crop production AND that > much > >> of > >> what they are fed is not human food but rather grasses. 㗎owever, most > >> beef is fed out in feedlots and relatively little is raised on grass. > >> Sheep and > >> goats, however, are virtually entirely fed using areas that would not be > >> used > >> for any kind of crop farming. > >> > >> Now, growing row crops such as corn and soybeans is not a one-to-one > >> conversion > >> to growing horticultural food crops. 㗎orticultural food crops require > >> more intensive > >> care in order for them to have shelf life and for other technical > >> reasons. 糍he seeds > >> are planted further apart, the rows further apart and the necessary > >> irrigation and > >> pest control much more extreme than row crops. 嘢ther crops such as > fruits > >> waste tons of land in comparison. 啱t takes a good 5 years before a fruit > >> tree > >> reaches maturity (semi dwarf) and closer to two years for a dwarf. > 孭gain, > >> high use of pesticides is the norm. 孭nd what about nuts? 孭ren't > >> these one of the > >> wonder foods that will supplant meat in our diet??? 咗ell, a pecan tree > >> takes a > >> good 15-30 years to reach maturity depending on the hybrid!!!! now that > >> tree > >> will produce for a good long time, but do you really think a pecan > orchard > >> is > >> all that productive? > >> > >> Overall, we would do well to lower our meat intake for both environmental > >> and > >> health reasons. 㗎owever, if we wanted to really do this right, we > >> would all buy > >> a goat for milk, have it eat our grass and weeds for milk, then eat the > >> kids. > >> > >> In fact, goat meat is much more in line with human nutrition than lamb > and > >> lamb > >> more in line than beef or pork. > >> > >> My wife and I have our own flock of chickens we use for eggs. 咗e raise a > >> couple of pigs each year, and do raise a few meat goats each year. 啱 > >> still > >> like to eat a nice juicy steak once in a while. 咗e raise most of our > >> vegetables > >> from the garden, although the weather in East Texas has been anti-garden > >> for > >> three years strait...luckily, we put away a lot three years ago. > >> > >> I don't know if what I am doing is making any great contribution to the > >> earth's > >> environment. 啱 certainly can't say that I'm setting some great example, > >> as > >> who the heck sees what I'm doing anyway? 㗎owever, I have always had this > >> idea that pseudohomesteading (my term I invented comparing what we do to > >> the > >> movement from the 1970s) would be fun. 嚒o, we are doing it because we > >> like to live this > >> way. 啱f it wasn't for a pile of student loans and medical bills, I > >> might just go off the > >> grid and give the world the proverbial phalange, except for the > >> occassional journal > >> article I publish, letter to the editor, and maybe even a listserv > >> post if I kept the > >> internet for contact with the real world. 啱 also enjoy watching TV, > >> so it can't go > >> either. 孭nd then there is central air and heat. 嘢h, and running water. > >> 嘞adio, > >> music, damn....I'm back on the grid and almost hit yupeeville :( > >> > >> If everyone pics ONE CAUSE and stuck with it, the world would be a better > >> place. > >> If your cause is recycling, and you do it religiously, and a bunch of > >> other people also do it, > >> it will have an impact. > >> > >> But the real problem is that there are a lot of people who do > >> absolutely nothing, have > >> absolutely no interest in the health of the environment, and a mess of > >> people who are > >> actually at war with environmental causes. If even most people tried > >> to do something, > >> I think you would see an environmental revolution. 吚nfortunately, most > >> people > >> are consumed by other things and even if they are concerned about the > >> environment, > >> they really are not engaged in anything of environmental importance. > >> > >> How's that for a completely bleak outlook. > >> Ask me tomorrow and I may have a more positive slant! > >> > >> > >> On Tue, Sep 8, 2009 at 9:50 PM, Kevin McCluney<[email protected]> > >> wrote: > >>> > >>> I recently attended the 2009 annual meeting of the Ecological Society of > >>> America (ESA). 糍he theme of this year旧 meeting was sustainability. > >>> 糍here > >>> were many great talks on this subject and a few truly pessimistic ones. > >>> 嘢ne > >>> speaker proposed that human beings are, by our very nature, destined to > >>> consume and reproduce as much as possible, and despite our best efforts, > >>> this will lead to our own demise. 餸uring the same talk the speaker also > >>> asked, 聴ho is responsible?� 㗎e answered his question by saying that we > >>> at > >>> this conference are just as much a part of the problem as anyone else. > >>> > >>> Is this true? 啱 know I myself have taken many steps to lower my > >>> footprint > >>> and many other ecologists have as well. > >>> > >>> For instance, at last year旧 ESA meeting in Milwaukee there was an > >>> interesting occurrence at local restaurants. 糍he first night of the > >>> conference I had a really good veggie burger at one restaurant. 啱 went > >>> back > >>> later in the week for another. 糍he waitress apologized� they were all > >>> out. > >>> She went on to explain that the manager had heard our conference was > >>> coming > >>> to town, so bought extra ahead of time, but ran out of those quickly > >>> anyway. > >>> The manager then went to the local grocery store and bought more. 脷ut > >>> alas, > >>> by the time I returned, they had run out of those as well. 啫urther, > when > >>> I > >>> dine with friends at ESA meetings, I often find that more than half the > >>> table orders vegetarian entrees. > >>> > >>> Why does eating vegetarian matter so much? 嗰odern, industrialized > >>> livestock > >>> production is one of the more environmentally destructive human > >>> endeavors. > >>> It contributes roughly one fifth of all our greenhouse gas emissions, > >>> more > >>> than all cars, and these gases are major contributors to the rapid > >>> climate > >>> change we虐e experiencing. 㗒ivestock production also may, in certain > >>> cases, > >>> be leading to deforestation and destruction of important ecosystems, as > >>> well > >>> as to pollution of rivers, lakes, and even oceans. 啱n addition, we all > >>> know > >>> that basic ecological principles hold that it takes less resources to > >>> raise > >>> plant based food sources than meat based, since energy is lost as you > >>> move > >>> up the food chain. 糍hus we can feed more people and use fewer resources > >>> on > >>> a plant-based diet. 孭ll this caused the chairman of the > >>> Intergovernmental > >>> Panel on Climate Change recently to proclaim that the best thing a > person > >>> could do to reduce their impact on climate change was to eat a more > >>> plant- > >>> based diet. > >>> > >>> My wife and I haven急 stopped at eating low on the food chain. 咗e挙e > >>> also > >>> joined community supported agriculture, where we buy a share of produce > >>> from > >>> a local farm. 糍he farmer gets upfront economic security and we get very > >>> affordable, local, fresh organic produce. 咗e pay just $18 per week for > a > >>> large bag of food. 孭t this price we can afford to supplement our diet > >>> with > >>> additional organic items from the grocery store. > >>> > >>> We挙e also taken a variety of other steps, from riding my bike to work, > >>> to > >>> offsetting car and air travel through renewable energy from an > >>> independently > >>> certified company, to buying 100% of our electricity from renewable > >>> sources > >>> through our local utility for as little as $15 per month. > >>> > >>> While we may not be reaching the small ecological footprint of those in > >>> many > >>> third world countries, we挙e done our best to come in line with our > >>> planet旧 > >>> limits while maintaining a decent quality of life. > >>> > >>> So, are ecologists just as much a part of the problem as everyone else? > >>> 孭re > >>> all ecologists the same? 咗hat are the variety of lifestyle choices made > >>> by > >>> ecologists? 嘅ot only would the answers to these questions provide a > >>> response to the ESA presenter, but I think the answer would be > >>> interesting > >>> to a wide audience. 啱 propose that ESA conduct a poll of members, > asking > >>> questions about lifestyle choices and demographics, comparing ours to > >>> that > >>> of the general public. 啱f we are not different, this would be a bit of > a > >>> wake-up call. 㗎owever, if we are different, then perhaps some of our > >>> lifestyle choices would be informative to understanding how to achieve a > >>> more sustainable society. > >>> > >>> If there is one thing I learned from a cultural anthropology course I > >>> once > >>> took, it was that there isn急 just one right way to live. 㗎uman > cultures > >>> throughout the world are very diverse. 脷ut, from the inside of one > >>> culture > >>> it is often very hard to see other ways to live. 㗒et us not be trapped > >>> in > >>> our culture, but seek a better understanding of all the ways of living, > >>> so > >>> that we might find a more sustainable path. > >>> > >>> -- > >>> Kevin E. McCluney > >>> Graduate Student > >>> School of Life Sciences > >>> Arizona State University > >>> Tempe, AZ 85287-4601 > >>> > >> > >> > >> > >> -- > >> Malcolm L. McCallum > >> Associate Professor of Biology > >> Managing Editor, > >> Herpetological Conservation and Biology > >> Texas A&M University-Texarkana > >> Fall Teaching Schedule: > >> Vertebrate Biology - TR 10-11:40; General Ecology - MW 1-2:40pm; > >> Forensic Science - 咗 6-9:40pm > >> Office Hourse- TBA > >> > >> 1880's: "There's lots of good fish in the sea" 咗.S. Gilbert > >> 1990's: 嗰any fish stocks depleted due to overfishing, habitat loss, > >>           and pollution. > >> 2000: 嗰arine reserves, ecosystem restoration, and pollution reduction > >>         MAY help restore populations. > >> 2022: Soylent Green is People! > >> > >> Confidentiality Notice: This e-mail message, including any > >> attachments, is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and may > >> contain confidential and privileged information. 孭ny unauthorized > >> review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. 啱f you are not > >> the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and > >> destroy all copies of the original message. > >> > >> > >> -- > >> BEGIN-ANTISPAM-VOTING-LINKS > >> ------------------------------------------------------ > >> > >> Teach CanIt if this mail (ID 931782601) is spam: > >> Spam:       > 温ttps://antispam.osu.edu/b.php?i=931782601&m=974a7b4b1780&c=s > >> Not spam:   > 温ttps://antispam.osu.edu/b.php?i=931782601&m=974a7b4b1780&c=n > >> Forget vote: > https://antispam.osu.edu/b.php?i=931782601&m=974a7b4b1780&c=f > >> ------------------------------------------------------ > >> END-ANTISPAM-VOTING-LINKS > >> > >> > > > > > > -- > Malcolm L. McCallum > Associate Professor of Biology > Managing Editor, > Herpetological Conservation and Biology > Texas A&M University-Texarkana > Fall Teaching Schedule: > Vertebrate Biology - TR 10-11:40; General Ecology - MW 1-2:40pm; > Forensic Science - W 6-9:40pm > Office Hourse- TBA > > 1880's: "There's lots of good fish in the sea" W.S. Gilbert > 1990's: Many fish stocks depleted due to overfishing, habitat loss, > and pollution. > 2000: Marine reserves, ecosystem restoration, and pollution reduction > MAY help restore populations. > 2022: Soylent Green is People! > > Confidentiality Notice: This e-mail message, including any > attachments, is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and may > contain confidential and privileged information. Any unauthorized > review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you are not > the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and > destroy all copies of the original message. >
