Thanks @josevalim, I'll definetly send a PR to the Elixir guide as you suggested. I had no idea this page existed.
I tend to agree with @eksperimental. The other point I have (oops had) in favor of implementing Kernel.seed is that @josevalim recently implemented Kernel.rand. Scratch that just saw this commit from 5hrs ago https://github.com/elixir-lang/elixir/commit/8e2a1e58510dbefb5c707071fcba1584ba3b614f Regardless, I think there should be a more idiomatic way to seed rand that does not involve sending the user down the path I've gone down in my blog post. << i1 :: unsigned-integer-32, i2 :: unsigned-integer-32, i3 :: unsigned-integer-32>> = :crypto.strong_rand_bytes(12):rand.seed(:exsplus, {i1, i2, i3}) This code above just doesn't seem like the spirit of Elixir which focuses on developer productivity and happiness by simplicity. It sends people to learn the intricacies of erlang for something that should be simple and is simple in a lot of other languages. I think we can take a hint from Ruby and Java and their SecureRandom libraries: Java: https://docs.oracle.com/javase/7/docs/api/java/security/SecureRandom.html Ruby: https://ruby-doc.org/stdlib-2.1.2/libdoc/securerandom/rdoc/SecureRandom.html Particularly I like Ruby's SecureRandom because it provides helpful methods such as `urlsafe_base64`, `uuid`, `random_bytes` and `hex`. I remember this being the first thing I looked for when I was building my first Elixir application (url shortener) and was surprised at how many hoops I had to jump through as a beginner to get something so simple done. On Wednesday, September 21, 2016 at 2:39:13 PM UTC-5, eksperimental wrote: > > there is a single particularity in this proposal, and it could solve > something I have been bitten > by some time ago when improving *.random functions in Elixir core. > I couldn't figure out why all tests related to random functions were not > working, and that's becuase > when creating Integer.random (a function that never made it to core) I > used :random.seed instead > of :rand.seed. > Believe me it took me a while and a lot of head scratches to figure out > what was going on. > > Having two modules so similar it's a source of confusion, and being this > function a critical > function when generating randon values could be a source of security bugs: > so I don't think it > would be a bad idea to have a Kernel.seed funcion > > > On Wed, 21 Sep 2016 21:01:23 +0200 > José Valim <jose....@plataformatec.com.br <javascript:>> wrote: > > > We typically avoid only wrapping Erlang functions because in the long > term > > we will just end-up duplicating all the efforts already done in the > Erlang > > community. For example, even for a simple case such as Kernel.seed, we > need > > to document the tuple format, the meaning of exsplus, etc. And unless we > > wrap all the functionality in rand, at some point you will still need to > > use rand directly. > > > > So I would like to propose other initiatives: > > > > * We should continue to focus on better documenting those entry points, > > which we already do in places such as the Getting Started guides > > <http://elixir-lang.org/getting-started/erlang-libraries.html>. In > fact, > > your article is a great exploration of the rand module and, if you send > a > > pull request to the guides linking to your article in the rand section, > we > > would love to merge it! > > > > * Send a pull request to Erlang/OTP that improves their documentation. > For > > example, including an example of using the crypto module for a > > cryptographically secure example would probably be very welcome. > > > > * Send a pull request to Erlang/OTP that adds the functionality you > would > > like to see Elixir wrapping. > > > > If you or anyone else need help in contributing to Erlang, please ping > me > > any time, either on IRC or by e-mail and I would love to provide > guidance. > > Improving Erlang is our responsibility too! :D > > > > > > *José Valim* > > www.plataformatec.com.br > > Skype: jv.ptec > > Founder and Director of R&D > > > > On Wed, Sep 21, 2016 at 8:47 PM, Dorian Karter <dka...@gmail.com > <javascript:>> wrote: > > > > > I recently wrote a blog post about my explorations into random number > > > generation from Elixir and Erlang. You can find it here: > > > https://hashrocket.com/blog/posts/the-adventures-of- > > > generating-random-numbers-in-erlang-and-elixir > > > > > > This led me to question why `:rand.seed` is not exposed from Elixir > > > without hitting Erlang directly. I think every time we send a user to > learn > > > something about the intricacies of Erlang we are introducing a mental > > > overhead. > > > > > > I would be happy to submit a pull request that will attempt to wrap > > > `:rand.seed` but figured I'd check with the core team first. My > questions: > > > > > > 1. Why is `:rand.seed` not exposed from Elixir? is that by design? > > > 2. If it should be exposed by Elixir where do you imagine it living? > > > `Kernel.seed`? or should we create a new `Random` module. > > > 3. Would it make sense to provide a method that will just securly seed > > > rand like so > > > > > > << i1 :: unsigned-integer-32, i2 :: unsigned-integer-32, i3 :: > unsigned-integer-32>> > > > = :crypto.strong_rand_bytes(12):rand.seed(:exsplus, {i1, i2, i3}) > > > > > > 4. Anything else I should consider if I submit a pull request other > than > > > obvious testing and documentation > > > > > > > > > Thanks so much for your attention and feedback! > > > > > > Dorian > > > > > > -- > > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > Groups > > > "elixir-lang-core" group. > > > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send > an > > > email to elixir-lang-co...@googlegroups.com <javascript:>. > > > To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/ > > > msgid/elixir-lang-core/577910ae-2a52-49f4-9e77- > > > 670639106a3c%40googlegroups.com > > > < > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/elixir-lang-core/577910ae-2a52-49f4-9e77-670639106a3c%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> > > > > > . > > > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. > > > > > > > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "elixir-lang-core" group. 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