To All, In Europe:
No recent version has been cited yet, but for the EN 301 489-1:V1.9.2 under the EMCD. For now this is the only version "available" for certification without Notified Body. I can confirm that this version is not suitable for the RED. No harmonised cited version is available for the RED up to now. If you use a NB, citation is not relevant anymore, and any standard version can be applied, including 1.9.2, 2.2.0, 2.2.1 and the 2.2.2 (currently under vote and expected in December) but you will need to convince the NB of the suitability of that standard covering the ERs from the directive. Not sure if the sudden relaxation to Class A in V2.2.0 Clause 8.2 is accepted by the NB, given the latest harmonized version that did not contain that relaxation. Surprising is that this Class A thing got into the standards but did not make it to the change history in Annex D in any of the 3 versions above.
Gert Gremmen On 17-9-2019 15:11, micha...@acbcert.com wrote:
Hi Charlie,The last presentation from ETSI that I recall on the topic, stated that we should be looking at EN 301 489-1 V2.x.x and newer. We should not be considering the old EN 301 489-1 V1.9.2 because that is simply not sufficient for the RED.Thanks, Michael. *From:*Charlie Blackham <char...@sulisconsultants.com> *Sent:* 17 September 2019 13:12 *To:* EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG *Subject:* Re: [PSES] Intentional radiator Class A or Class B Gert EN 301 489-1 V1.9.2 was published in 2011 and is quite old nowAs you know, EN 301 489-1 V2.1.1 was published by ETSI in February 2017 and the latest draft, V2.2.0 was issued by ETSI in March 2019 – both contain radiated immunity requirements to 6 GHz, which are more extensive than those in V1.9.2, and both contain the Class A option for emissions, though with slightly different wordingAs far as I know, V1.9.2 won’t ever be cited under the RED - though nor will V2.1.1 - and the communication from ETSI suggest that the issues in V2.2.0 mainly revolve around equipment performance monitoring and criteria and not the Class A/B option for appropriate end environmentsAre you suggesting that V1.9.2 is a better standard to apply under the RED than either V2.1.1 or V2.2.0?I also know that you’re involved in the process of standard being published in the OJ, so any further light you can shed on this matter would be greatly appreciatedRegards Charlie *Charlie Blackham* *Sulis Consultants Ltd* *Tel: +44 (0)7946 624317* *Web: https://sulisconsultants.com/ * Registered in England and Wales, number 05466247 *From:*Gert Gremmen <g.grem...@cetest.nl <mailto:g.grem...@cetest.nl>> *Sent:* 17 September 2019 11:56*To:* Charlie Blackham <char...@sulisconsultants.com <mailto:char...@sulisconsultants.com>>; EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG <mailto:EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG>*Subject:* Re: [PSES] Intentional radiator Class A or Class B Hi CharlieThat version of the standard 301-489-1 V2.2.1 has not yet been approved, yet published, so be careful....For now keep relying on V1.9.2 , that does not mention your text on industrial environment, and that has not yet been cited under the RED either.Gert Gremmen On 17-9-2019 10:59, Charlie Blackham wrote: You can use Class A for industrial locations under EN 301 489-1: 8.2.3 Limits The ancillary equipment shall meet the class B limits given in CENELEC EN 55032 [1], annex A tables A.4 and A.5. *Alternatively, for ancillary equipment intended to be used exclusively in an industrial environment or telecommunication centres, the class A limits given in CENELEC EN 55032 [1], annex A tables A.2 and A.3 may be used.* If the screen is “ancillary equipment”, another EMC standard can be used as per section 5.4, though it is more likely to be “combined and/or integrated radio and non-radio equipment” so the advice in EN 303 446-x can be followed Also, of course, a RED Notified Body (NB) is only required where the applicable article 3.2 or 3.3 Harmonised Standard is not used The manufacturer is free to choose the EMC and safety standard without use of NB if they wish *Charlie Blackham* *Sulis Consultants Ltd* *Tel: +44 (0)7946 624317* *Web: https://sulisconsultants.com/ * Registered in England and Wales, number 05466247 *From:*Gert Gremmen <g.grem...@cetest.nl> <mailto:g.grem...@cetest.nl> *Sent:* 17 September 2019 09:01 *To:* EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG <mailto:EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG> *Subject:* Re: [PSES] Intentional radiator Class A or Class B Note that for intentional transmitters the EMCD en LVD are not applicable (but the RED is!). And so are the standards listed for them. Probably as this is a transceiver with ancillary equipment (though heavily integrated?) the combi EN 301489-17/EN 301 489-1 will be applicable. The latter limits the emission Class to Class B (for ancillary electronics) only and refers to EN 55032 as test method. Note that RED standards are prone to changes in the close future, make sure you have the last version and re-check if another version may be listed (cited) in the OJ-L. Use a Notified Body otherwise. Gert Gremmen On 17-9-2019 8:48, John Woodgate wrote: Not exactly. The question was strictly about 'Class', which of course can mean different things in different standards, but my answer is, I think, correct for Europe. Intentional radiation is excluded from the CISPR standards and is covered by the ETSI standards cited by Charlie Blackham. Best wishes John Woodgate OOO-Own Opinions Only J M Woodgate and Associateswww.woodjohn.uk <http://www.woodjohn.uk> Rayleigh, Essex UK On 2019-09-16 23:55, peterh...@aol.com <mailto:peterh...@aol.com> wrote: John, Are you saying that a product with intentional radiator only needs to meet Class A for emissions in EU? i.e there is no difference in terms of the limit between intentional and unintentional radiators when it comes to EU. Is that a correct statement? Thanks Peter -----Original Message----- From: John Woodgate <j...@woodjohn.uk> <mailto:j...@woodjohn.uk> To: peterhays <peterh...@aol.com> <mailto:peterh...@aol.com>; EMC-PSTC <EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG> <mailto:EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG> Sent: Mon, Sep 16, 2019 11:34 am Subject: Re: [PSES] Intentional radiator Class A or Class B That should be CISPR 35, not CISPR 24 now. In Europe, it would be Class A. The manual should say 'This product is not to be used in a residential environment.'. Best wishes John Woodgate OOO-Own Opinions Only J M Woodgate and Associateswww.woodjohn.uk <http://www.woodjohn.uk> Rayleigh, Essex UK On 2019-09-16 17:56, peterh...@aol.com <mailto:peterh...@aol.com> wrote: The product is an ITE and follows CISPR 32 and CISPR 24 It will be sold globally The product is a small touch panel. -----Original Message----- From: John Woodgate <j...@woodjohn.uk> <mailto:j...@woodjohn.uk> To: peterhays <peterh...@aol.com> <mailto:peterh...@aol.com>; EMC-PSTC <EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG> <mailto:EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG> Sent: Mon, Sep 16, 2019 12:37 am Subject: Re: [PSES] Intentional radiator Class A or Class B To give a reliable answer, we need to know the type of product or the EMC emission standard that applies (e.g. CISPR 14-1/EN 55014-1) and which countries/regions it will be sold in. Best wishes John Woodgate OOO-Own Opinions Only J M Woodgate and Associateswww.woodjohn.uk <http://www.woodjohn.uk> Rayleigh, Essex UK On 2019-09-16 03:51, 000006cee064502d-dmarc-requ...@ieee.org <mailto:000006cee064502d-dmarc-requ...@ieee.org> wrote: Dear Colleagues, I have a client that design and manufacture products for use in non-residential environment. This product consists of a BT module. I am told that the product must meet Class B emissions. Is this correct? What if we put an statement in the user manual stating that this product is not to be used in residential market? Would that give us the pass to go to Class A? Thank you all Peter - ---------------------------------------------------------------- This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to <emc-p...@ieee.org <mailto:emc-p...@ieee.org>> All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieee-pses.org/emc-pstc.html Attachments are not permitted but the IEEE PSES Online Communities site at http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/ can be used for graphics (in well-used formats), large files, etc. Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ Instructions: http://www.ieee-pses.org/list.html (including how to unsubscribe) List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas <sdoug...@ieee.org <mailto:sdoug...@ieee.org>> Mike Cantwell <mcantw...@ieee.org <mailto:mcantw...@ieee.org>> For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher <j.bac...@ieee.org <mailto:j.bac...@ieee.org>> David Heald <dhe...@gmail.com <mailto:dhe...@gmail.com>> - ---------------------------------------------------------------- This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to <emc-p...@ieee.org <mailto:emc-p...@ieee.org>> All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieee-pses.org/emc-pstc.html Attachments are not permitted but the IEEE PSES Online Communities site at http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/ can be used for graphics (in well-used formats), large files, etc. Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ Instructions: http://www.ieee-pses.org/list.html (including how to unsubscribe) List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas <sdoug...@ieee.org <mailto:sdoug...@ieee.org>> Mike Cantwell <mcantw...@ieee.org <mailto:mcantw...@ieee.org>> For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher <j.bac...@ieee.org <mailto:j.bac...@ieee.org>> David Heald <dhe...@gmail.com <mailto:dhe...@gmail.com>>--Independent Expert on CE marking Harmonised Standards (HAS-) Consultant @ European Commission for RED and EMC EMC Consultant Electrical Safety Consultant - ---------------------------------------------------------------- This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to <emc-p...@ieee.org <mailto:emc-p...@ieee.org>> All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieee-pses.org/emc-pstc.html Attachments are not permitted but the IEEE PSES Online Communities site at http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/ can be used for graphics (in well-used formats), large files, etc. Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ Instructions: http://www.ieee-pses.org/list.html (including how to unsubscribe) List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas <sdoug...@ieee.org <mailto:sdoug...@ieee.org>> Mike Cantwell <mcantw...@ieee.org <mailto:mcantw...@ieee.org>> For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher <j.bac...@ieee.org <mailto:j.bac...@ieee.org>> David Heald <dhe...@gmail.com <mailto:dhe...@gmail.com>> - ---------------------------------------------------------------- This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to <emc-p...@ieee.org <mailto:emc-p...@ieee.org>> All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieee-pses.org/emc-pstc.html Attachments are not permitted but the IEEE PSES Online Communities site at http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/ can be used for graphics (in well-used formats), large files, etc. Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ Instructions: http://www.ieee-pses.org/list.html (including how to unsubscribe) List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas <sdoug...@ieee.org <mailto:sdoug...@ieee.org>> Mike Cantwell <mcantw...@ieee.org <mailto:mcantw...@ieee.org>> For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher <j.bac...@ieee.org <mailto:j.bac...@ieee.org>> David Heald <dhe...@gmail.com <mailto:dhe...@gmail.com>> -- Independent Expert on CE marking Harmonised Standards (HAS-) Consultant @ European Commission for RED and EMC EMC Consultant Electrical Safety Consultant - ----------------------------------------------------------------This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to <emc-p...@ieee.org <mailto:emc-p...@ieee.org>>All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieee-pses.org/emc-pstc.htmlAttachments are not permitted but the IEEE PSES Online Communities site at http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/ can be used for graphics (in well-used formats), large files, etc.Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/Instructions: http://www.ieee-pses.org/list.html (including how to unsubscribe)List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas <sdoug...@ieee.org <mailto:sdoug...@ieee.org>> Mike Cantwell <mcantw...@ieee.org <mailto:mcantw...@ieee.org>> For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher <j.bac...@ieee.org <mailto:j.bac...@ieee.org>> David Heald <dhe...@gmail.com <mailto:dhe...@gmail.com>> - ----------------------------------------------------------------This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to <emc-p...@ieee.org <mailto:emc-p...@ieee.org>>All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieee-pses.org/emc-pstc.htmlAttachments are not permitted but the IEEE PSES Online Communities site at http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/ can be used for graphics (in well-used formats), large files, etc.Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/Instructions: http://www.ieee-pses.org/list.html (including how to unsubscribe)List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas <sdoug...@ieee.org <mailto:sdoug...@ieee.org>> Mike Cantwell <mcantw...@ieee.org <mailto:mcantw...@ieee.org>> For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher <j.bac...@ieee.org <mailto:j.bac...@ieee.org>> David Heald <dhe...@gmail.com <mailto:dhe...@gmail.com>>
-- Independent Expert on CE marking Harmonised Standards (HAS-) Consultant @ European Commission for RED and EMC EMC Consultant Electrical Safety Consultant - ---------------------------------------------------------------- This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to <emc-p...@ieee.org> All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://www.ieee-pses.org/emc-pstc.html Attachments are not permitted but the IEEE PSES Online Communities site at http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/ can be used for graphics (in well-used formats), large files, etc. Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ Instructions: http://www.ieee-pses.org/list.html (including how to unsubscribe) List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas <sdoug...@ieee.org> Mike Cantwell <mcantw...@ieee.org> For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher: <j.bac...@ieee.org> David Heald: <dhe...@gmail.com>
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