On Fri, 3 May 2013 13:37:18 -0300 Gustavo Sverzut Barbieri <barbi...@profusion.mobi> said:
> On Fri, May 3, 2013 at 12:38 PM, Carsten Haitzler <ras...@rasterman.com>wrote: > > > On Fri, 3 May 2013 12:03:22 -0300 Gustavo Sverzut Barbieri > > <barbi...@profusion.mobi> said: > > > > > On Fri, May 3, 2013 at 8:35 AM, Cedric BAIL <cedric.b...@free.fr> wrote: > > > > > > > On Fri, May 3, 2013 at 8:13 PM, Gustavo Sverzut Barbieri > > > > <barbi...@profusion.mobi> wrote: > > > > > It is not about generating code, people just don't get it > > > > > > > > For people to get it, we need many things to improve the situation in > > > > Elev8. We need to polish its introduction in Enlightenment and provide > > > > an easy way to distribute gadget/apps. Along with some documentation > > > > that would help spread it and show case what it is good for. > > > > In my opinion JS is not a tool good for everything. Any application > > > > that require a team to maintain it over time with a more than 1000 > > > > lines of code is going to suffer with it. Hopefully that still leave a > > > > lot of application possible. I am thinking about all the configuration > > > > tools here : connman, cups, transmission, ... It should also be good > > > > for webservice integration like reddit and friends. And finally it > > > > should be good for casual game to. We should be able to code elemines > > > > or efbb more easily in Elev8 (We need an easy-game helper maybe :-)). > > > > But JS wont be good for an integrated communication suite, an IDE, a > > > > web browser, ... So we need tool to help the development of both side. > > > > In the JS/EasyUI world, it is mostly integration with E and > > > > distribution of application. In C, it is more an IDE that we need. > > > > Both work are orthogonal in my opinion. > > > > > > > > > > This is complete nonsense. With JS you can modularize as well as in C, > > > actually the language constructs makes it easier to modularize. > > > > > > The performance of a hundred thousand lines of code with JS is not an > > > issue, as the sensitive areas are basically done in C (with elev8/efl), > > > also the V8 can optimize quite well some loops and access, thus moot > > point. > > > Moreover, from the hundred thousand lines case, you're often executing > > > small parts of it at the same time, afterall you can't fit much in one > > user > > > screen. > > > > > > As for your points "JS won't be good", let's review it with reality: > > > - communication suite: the best communication suite out there is > > written > > > in HTML5 + JS, it is called Gmail + Gtalk > > > - an IDE: adobe and others disagree, http://brackets.io/ is fully JS > > and > > > HTML5. Let's not forget that we both use Emacs, that is written mostly in > > > Elisp, that is far from being as optimized as JS nowadays; > > > - web browser: the browser itself is a very thin layer, I can't see > > why > > > a browser chrome couldn't be written in JS.. the heavy work is all in > > > WebKit/Blink, you just need to get some signals and update the title, > > > progress... > > > > > > I just don't understand why people don't understand. Also I don't > > > understand why I still bother to write this stuff. > > > > performance wise js is fun as long as you can pass off the heavy lifting to > > native code and it's doing the logic/direction at the higher level. no > > problem > > with that. > > > > the issues here are: > > > > 1. the actual target audience is currently developing apps with efl as > > native. > > they like it that way. they want it that way. changing that desire is very > > hard, so let's service the desire and make things easier > > 2. the intent is to support elev8 later as well, but first service the > > desire > > of the people who are paying for it. > > 3. it's impossible to sensibly tell people to "write in elev8/js" vs native > > because it is so limited/crippled right now. we have a long way to go to > > fill > > it out with functionality first so it can be even close to native in terms > > of > > what it can do (even if slowly or whatever - which is not something i > > intent to > > argue about given the other reasons). > > > > limited like what? even the fs module that I hugely dislike is in there, > there is http, dbus and other methods to communicate. bare rect, bare image, bare edje, bare image, bare text, bare textblock, bare emotion, no evas map controls, proxy src controls, animators must be tied to elm objects only, no animator timeline (animators run over specific time interval and pass in interval position 0->1), no eet, no efreet, no ephysics, ecore-ipc, ecore-audio, ecore-imf, eeze, ephysics, ethumb... > the only thing is missing now is the option to create a bare rectangle, > which is doubtful in real life given that most UI elements are edje > elements... and they exist in eui right now you missed my comment "cannot write efbb". you need raw images, direct map controls etc. just to begin with... > -- > Gustavo Sverzut Barbieri > http://profusion.mobi embedded systems > -------------------------------------- > MSN: barbi...@gmail.com > Skype: gsbarbieri > Mobile: +55 (19) 9225-2202 > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Get 100% visibility into Java/.NET code with AppDynamics Lite > It's a free troubleshooting tool designed for production > Get down to code-level detail for bottlenecks, with <2% overhead. > Download for free and get started troubleshooting in minutes. > http://p.sf.net/sfu/appdyn_d2d_ap2 > _______________________________________________ > enlightenment-devel mailing list > enlightenment-devel@lists.sourceforge.net > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/enlightenment-devel > -- ------------- Codito, ergo sum - "I code, therefore I am" -------------- The Rasterman (Carsten Haitzler) ras...@rasterman.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Get 100% visibility into Java/.NET code with AppDynamics Lite It's a free troubleshooting tool designed for production Get down to code-level detail for bottlenecks, with <2% overhead. 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