Joe,

      I'd have to think hard about any claim made by Alan. He has stated a 
belief that trees should not be allowed to get much over 40 feet in height. For 
a species like white pine, that's somewhere between ridiculous and absurd. I 
have no idea what Alan is trying to grow, but I have no interest in his 
woodland experiments. I am certain Alan means well and I guess he does achieve 
a kind of timber result that suits some uses and fills a market niche, but 
overall, his vision of a "healthy woodland" redefines the concept of boring. 

Bob

-------------- Original message -------------- 
From: "Joseph Zorzin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 

Russ, you say you once worked for Alan Page- I've heard that Alan claims the 
pines on his land, which are consistently thinned- grow have half inch rings 
per year. I haven't heard his claim for height growth per year.

Of course super fast volume and/or height growth is often not desired with 
trees which have a future in the lumber yard- as such fast growth results in 
lower quality wood. If we want fast growing trees we'd all grow hybrid poplar.

It's a fine research endeavor to look for huge trees and fast growing trees but 
what I'd like to find are trees that produce value at a very fast speed. If we 
can find ways for land to produce great value quickly with trees- we can help 
protect that land from development. And, if we can incorporate values for the 
intangible values too- then we can be sure that the forests won't become just 
fast growing monocultures, instead they'll be forests which can rapidly produce 
timber value while maintaining other values or increasing them too. What I seek 
is a True Forestry Economics which will work to produce better forests which 
we'll all enjoy and which will make this a better planet.

Joe

----- Original Message ----- 
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
To: [email protected] 
Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2008 3:23 PM
Subject: [ENTS] Re: The long update process has begun


Bob:

I have never seen 60" internodes persist for more than three successive years 
but I've seen consistent 36" internodes persist for ten years or more.  

I guess as long as it is early in the life of the tree it really wouldn't be a 
lot weaker....especially if there were decades of consistent diameter growth 
following the initial height growth

In terms of "leader" growth, I've noticed many times both red oak and yellow 
poplar saplings put on more than 5 feet of height in a single year, especially 
after being released.   

Russ






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