Great stuff Will, I feel like I'm taking a tree measurer's correspondence course!
Much better (and safer) to do the sine technique on a extreme off center top, never occurred to me. Also like the "from the bottom up" tape idea, makes very good sense. Thanks, -Andrew Will Blozan wrote: > > Andrew, > > Yeah, that tree is a beast to tape drop. Easier yet is to use a pole > and clinometer combination. The pole is the hypotenuse length and > multiply by SINE of the pole angle to get the vertical equivalent. I > did this on one of the Tsuga Search hemlocks that was over 170’ tall. > The top was thin, dead and leaning hard off center. > > Another consideration for future climbs is to drop the throw line from > the top in the presumed best path and then pull the free end of the > tape up to you from the ground (the reel remains on the grund). This > results in a perfectly vertical path. I use a small carabineer for > attachment; the ground help simply unclips the throw bag and clips on > the end of the tape. > > Will F. Blozan > > President, Eastern Native Tree Society > > President, Appalachian Arborists, Inc. > > "No sympathy for apathy" > > -----Original Message----- > From: Andrew Joslin [mailto:[email protected]] > Sent: Saturday, December 05, 2009 11:01 AM > To: [email protected] > Subject: Re: [ENTS] Andrew Joslin and Henry David Thoreau > > At the moment of measurement I had it as straight as I could determine, > > it would help to have a level on the pole for awkward off-center top > > situations. My hand was directly below the twig. In the photo Bob posted > > of me in the top you can see the pole leaning but I don't believe that > > was the moment of measuring, I had to maneuver a bit to get myself in > > the best position to hold the pole straight. > > I secured the tape at 16 ft. from the top but is was still offset to the > > right from the main trunk. I descended about 30 feet from there, was > > hanging out away from the tree beneath the lean, then lowered the tape > > reel on a throwline to the ground. It had a good straight path. I > > couldn't see well enough to know but I imagine Bob and John had to > > transpose back to the base of the trunk to get the measurement. I trust > > they did a good job of that. > > -Andrew > > Will Blozan wrote: > > > Andrew, > > > > > > What was the angle of the pole? Did you come up straight from below? > Was the > > > tape drop to midslope? Maybe the error is in the basal point? > > > > > > Will F. Blozan > > > President, Eastern Native Tree Society > > > President, Appalachian Arborists, Inc. > > > > > > "No sympathy for apathy" > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: Andrew Joslin [mailto:[email protected]] > > > Sent: Saturday, December 05, 2009 10:13 AM > > > To: [email protected] > > > Subject: Re: [ENTS] Andrew Joslin and Henry David Thoreau > > > > > > Will, I completely agree with your analysis, I believe there's some > > > error on my side of things. The crown structure is pretty much the same > > > as in your photo. I went out on the upper right branch/leader as you > > > described and reached up with a 9 foot pole (9 ft. with a mark at 8 feet > > > above where I hold the pole) to get the high twig. I did the same as you > > > did, marked 8 ft. from the top then transposed across to mark 8' at a > > > point on the branch offset to the left of the imaginary plumb line below > > > the top twig. Last night I remeasured my pole to verify my marker is > > > exactly 8 ft., it is. Anyhow something ain't quite right, I will try > > > again when I get the chance. > > > -Andrew > > > > > > Will Blozan wrote: > > > > > >> Bob, > > >> > > >> Awesome day indeed! I am puzzled by the tape drop- something is not > > >> right. Did you add in BH? (156.1+4.5= 160.6) Did Andrew observe crown > > >> damage? I would bank on John Eichholtz's measurements any day (and > > >> yours ;). I can't accept that a tape drop was two feet off of some of > > >> ENTS greatest and most accurate measurers. No way. > > >> > > >> My climb in 2007 of the Grandfather tree substantiated that the high > > >> point of the Thoreau Pine was WAY off center on the down stream and > > >> slightly upslope side of the crown. I recall the intense sphincter > > >> adventures with getting high enough and cantilevered out to even reach > > >> it with the short extension pole I had during the climb. I transposed > > >> the top across the crown to a suitable anchor point for a drop as > > >> straight and close to the trunk as possible. It took some work for > > >> sure. Would have been a lot easier with a clinometer and pole > combination. > > >> > > >> In the photo below (taken from the Grandfather Pine in 2007) the high > > >> point is clearly seen to the upper right of the crown. I recall it > > >> being virtually invisible from the ground from typical measurement > > >> vantage points. Perhaps it has broken but it sounds like it needs to > > >> be reclimbed. Thoreau is worthy! > > >> > > >> Will F. Blozan > > >> > > >> President, Eastern Native Tree Society > > >> > > >> President, Appalachian Arborists, Inc. > > >> > > >> //"No sympathy for apathy"// > > >> > > >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > >> > > >> *From:* [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] > > >> *Sent:* Friday, December 04, 2009 8:40 PM > > >> *To:* [email protected] > > >> *Subject:* [ENTS] Andrew Joslin and Henry David Thoreau > > >> > > >> ENTS, > > >> > > >> Well today was a big day for the Massachusetts group of dedicated > > >> Ents. At my request, Andrew Joslin and two companion climbers took on > > >> the daunting task of climbing the Henry David Thoreau pine in Monroe > > >> State Forest for the purpose of doing a tape drop measurement. The day > > >> was perfect for the climb. > > >> > > >> We met at the Charlemont Inn at 8:30AM and had breakfast. To our > > >> delight, John Eichholz was able to make it. So, after breakfast, we > > >> headed for Dunbar Brook. While John and team readied for the climb, > > >> John and I scooted around measuring other trees. We also measured the > > >> Thoreau pine from as many locations as possible. Our ground-based > > >> measurements ranged from 157.1 to 158.4 feet. John and I thought the > > >> most probably height for the tree to be 158 feet. > > >> > > >> To cut to the chase, Andrew's tape drop came to 156.1 feet. John and I > > >> were surprised, but that is the best measurement we have, so the big > > >> tree is no longer in the 160 Club. However, John established a new > > >> mid-slope baseline for girth using the Will Blozan method. Thoreau's > > >> girth is an even 13.0 feet. So, the Thoreau pine moves into another > > >> girth class. Lose some, win some. > > >> > > >> John went farther out the ridge while Andrew and team were getting > > >> themselves positioned in the top of the pine. John measured a sugar > > >> maple to 124.7 feet, a new height record for the Dunbar Brook maples. > > >> The Rucker Index stands at 123.7 today. Its all time high is 124.1. I > > >> found a tall ash upslope from Thoreau and the Grandfather pine. Its > > >> dimensions are girth = 7.2 feet, height = 128.9 feet. Not bad. I > > >> remeasured the Grandfather pine and got 144.7 feet. That is a > > >> believable number, given Will Blozan's climb a couple of years ago. I > > >> think he got around 143.5 feet or so. > > >> > > >> Well, enough chatter. The following images tell a little of the story. > > >> > > >> ThoreausBase.jpg: This image show's Thoreau's base. That is what a > > >> 13-foot circumference looks like for a straight white pine. > > >> > > >> LookingIntoThoreausCrown.jpg: I tried to capture the appearance of how > > >> this tree soars. > > >> > > >> TopOFThoreau.jpg: This image shows Andrew's pole at the tippy top of > > >> the great tree. > > >> > > >> ClimberInThoreau.jpg: This image shows a climber ascending. > > >> > > >> AshMapleAndRock.jpg: This image is included to give an idea of the > > >> surrounding terrain and forest. Great place. > > >> > > >> and your team, all ENTS thanks you and your team, and most of all the > > >> great Henry David Thoreau pine thanks you. We can promote this climb > > >> as a genuine effort to put truth into the tree numbers. > > >> > > >> Bob > > >> > > >> -- > > >> Eastern Native Tree Society http://www.nativetreesociety.org > > >> Send email to [email protected] > > >> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/entstrees?hl=en > > >> To unsubscribe send email to [email protected] > > >> -- > > >> Eastern Native Tree Society http://www.nativetreesociety.org > > >> Send email to [email protected] > > >> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/entstrees?hl=en > > >> To unsubscribe send email to [email protected] > > >> > > > > > > > > -- > > Eastern Native Tree Society http://www.nativetreesociety.org > > Send email to [email protected] > > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/entstrees?hl=en > > To unsubscribe send email to [email protected] > > -- > Eastern Native Tree Society http://www.nativetreesociety.org > Send email to [email protected] > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/entstrees?hl=en > To unsubscribe send email to [email protected] -- Eastern Native Tree Society http://www.nativetreesociety.org Send email to [email protected] Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/entstrees?hl=en To unsubscribe send email to [email protected]
