EV Digest 2841
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) Re: DC-DC's in parallel?
by "1sclunn" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) Re: Another over-priced EV on eBay
by "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) Re: ADC 8" Motor timing--Raptor 1200 relationship...
by "1sclunn" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) Re: Lectra Specs
by "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) Re: Car back on line...
by "Joseph H. Strubhar" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) Citroen Saxo pictures online
by "Philippe Borges" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7) TdS Report #70: Team Profile: "Electric Hog", #12
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
8) TdS Report #71: Photos - The Electric Hog, #12
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
9) Re: Lectra Specs
by "Christian Kocmick" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) TdS Report #72: Team Profile: "eGO XR", #8
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
11) Re: electric ouboard photos (dial-up friendly)
by Seth <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
12) Re: ADC 8" Motor timing--Raptor 1200 relationship...
by Bob Bath <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13) Re: DC-DC's in parallel?
by "Dave Anderson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
14) TdS Report #73: Demonstration Vehicle: "Hy-wire"
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
15) TdS Report #74: Photos - General Motors Hy-wire
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
16) underpriced EV at ebay
by "Christian Kocmick" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
17) Re: Citroen Saxo pictures online
by "David Roden (Akron OH USA)" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
18) Re: ADC 8" Motor timing--Raptor 1200 relationship...
by "David Roden (Akron OH USA)" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
19) Re: underpriced EV at ebay
by Bruce EVangel Parmenter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
20) Re: Li Ion Series Resistance
by "Chris Brune" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--- Begin Message ---
How about selling a few?
SteveClunn
> Thanks Bruce, I am going to try it then, and will report back. I can get
a
> bunch of these dirt-cheap, so I have little to lose if smoke gets out.
>
> -Dave
>
> 82 Jet Electrica Escort, Curtis 1221c+20 T-125s
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Bruce EVangel Parmenter" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Sent: Sunday, June 01, 2003 10:41 PM
> Subject: Re: DC-DC's in parallel?
>
>
> <snip>
> He said that it can be
> done as long as the units in parallel are set to
> the same output voltage.
> <snip>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I don't think the factory EV is a problem. I took a factory (not running)
Lectra and boldly took out the controller(not that bold it didn't have a
motor) and replaced everything but parts of the wiring harness. I now have
a completely modified bike that runs much farther on a charge and goes about
the same speed as the orginial. There will always be modifications to stock
vehicles. Yes the drives in factory units "work better" but I personally
like the way our grownup golfcarts work. Yes in general you need to keep
the transmission. Yes you need two motors and expensive controllers if you
don't. They are still less expensive and just as dependable and for me a
standard way of putting electric vehicles together. These conversions will
be around for as long as the bodies hold up. Lawrence Rhodes......
----------------------------------------------------
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----- Original Message -----
From: "1sclunn" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Friday, June 06, 2003 7:03 PM
Subject: Re: Another over-priced EV on eBay
> He love's his EV (and why not) and knows what it will cost to replace it .
> There is a EV in my town that I have heard about but not
> gone to see . Its one bought at an auction from one of the power companies
,
> a ford ranger I believe , AC drive and all the goodies but it doesn't work
.
> What is it worth ? If it's not working not very much but if it was a
> "regular" conversion I'd have been there the day I heard about it but as a
> "factory conversion" I'm almost sure there's nothing I could do to get it
> going . Some day when I have time I'll go look at it and may be posting
> questions but I know how things go , I could spend a day and not get it
> going and make no money . There a good chance of that. One reason for
EV's
> not selling for more is the problem of who will fix them is heavy on the
> minds the people thinking of buying one. We all want the car companies to
> start making/selling EV's but when they do it may put an end to all the
fun
> we're having building them now . A factory EV like the gas cars today
will
> probable not be user fixable and there won't be any trying out new
> controllers/batteries/chargers ect your just get next years car if you
want
> something better. I'm a lucky guy I got to play with gas cars when that
was
> possible( 35 years ago) and got to play with electric car when it was
> possible. A lot of kid's today won't get to do either . "Dad the tire on
my
> bike is flat and I can;t ride it " "don't worry son we'll get you a new
one
> " Lawn man " @#$! look at this , another perfectly good bike sitting out
in
> the trash with just a flat tire I can't pass that by" .
> Steve Clunn----- Original Message -----
> From: "Bruce EVangel Parmenter" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Sent: Thursday, June 05, 2003 10:52 PM
> Subject: Re: Another over-priced EV on eBay
>
>
> > [Here is the ebay seller's response]
> >
> > -[edited]
>
> > Date: Thu, 5 Jun 2003 07:42:14 -0500
> > From: "Bill Williams" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > Subject: Re: Question for seller -- Item #2417660823
> >
> > Thanks for your advice. If I run the ad again,
> > I will put in better pictures.
> > Price stays same - will keep before I give away;
> > it is worth it.
> > Thanks,
> > Bill
> > -
> >
> >
> >
> > =====
> > ' ____
> > ~/__|o\__
> > '@----- @'---(=
> > http://geocities.com/brucedp/
> > EV List Editor & RE newswires
> > (originator of the above ASCII art)
> > =====
> >
> > __________________________________
> > Do you Yahoo!?
> > Yahoo! Calendar - Free online calendar with sync to Outlook(TM).
> > http://calendar.yahoo.com
> >
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Did you find any thing out on this , two people have asked me this same
Question , the motors will be in car's , 3000 lbs 156volt
----- Original Message -----
From: "vinnybrain" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, June 02, 2003 8:18 AM
Subject: ADC 8" Motor timing--Raptor 1200 relationship...
> I read somewhere on the list here that Raptor 1200 controllers may
> lose their smoke if wired to ADC motors that haven't had their timing
> set properly. Being the proud owner of a brand-spankin new 8 and a
> Raptor 1200 ala Emillio, I really would like to keep the smoke inside
> both of my two most pricey components of my 'lectro-metro.
> Since I find the search engine on this board about useless, can
> someone either direct me to the old post/digest #'s where this was
> covered, or maybe someone might know off the top of their brain how
> to take me thru the tutorial on checking it and verifying my timing??
>
> Thanks list!
>
> Vince Barma
>
>
> p.s. whats up with the search engine anyway? one would think I could
> type in "motor timing" and it would present something other than a
> list of last weeks 12 digest topics, none of wich correct...
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
OK the Grote part number for the tailight lense is #90232. Snap on lense.
Commonly used on trailers. The rear shocks are spring assisted and just
about anything can be used depending on weight carrying ability. In my
personal opinion(just a guess) is if the motor controller combo blows it
might be cheaper to replace with a Curtis and series motor. That cost me
$350 used over the internet. You will however need a DC/DC converter then.
Lawrence Rhodes....
----------------------------------------------------
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----- Original Message -----
From: "Christian Kocmick" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Saturday, June 07, 2003 7:16 PM
Subject: Lectra Specs
> Lawrence,
> What I'd like to do is create a small website that identifies the most
often
> replaced parts with their off the shelf replacement. For example: Lectra
11
> tooth sprocket = X part, or Lectra Front Fork Seals = Yamaha DT50MX/80MX.
> That way, I 'd eventually help Lectra owners and hobbyist repair, or even
> build a Lectra, thus keep what I consider to be one of the most able
> electric two-wheelers on the road. I'd hate to see the Lectra become a
> distant memory. If you have such information, please let me know.
>
> Christian
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: "Christian Kocmick" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Sent: Saturday, June 07, 2003 1:55 AM
> Subject: Re: Lectra Motorcycle and Zapworld
>
>
> > If you need a tailight lense, have to get it from Grote. Any Carquest
> will
> > order it over the phone. Lawrence Rhodes...
> >
> >
> > ----------------------------------------------------
> > This mailbox protected from junk email by Matador
> > from MailFrontier, Inc. http://info.mailfrontier.com
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Christian Kocmick" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > Sent: Friday, June 06, 2003 10:39 AM
> > Subject: Lectra Motorcycle and Zapworld
> >
> >
> > After some repeated emails, phone calls, and faxes, ZapWorld confirms
that
> > yes, they sold the Lectra and even better, they still have a few left.
Oh,
> > they do have some service/parts for the motorcycle. So if there are any
> > EV'ers out there who still want a Lectra motorcycle, there still may be
an
> > opportunity to get one.
> >
> > Christian
> >
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Better yet, how about moisture-proof heat shrink? Of course, abrasion
protection is a must - maybe braided metallic stuff of some sort. The heat
shrink would be rated to 600 v.
Joseph H. Strubhar
E-Mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Web: www.gremcoinc.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Lin Tse Hsu" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, May 19, 2003 1:28 PM
Subject: Re: Car back on line...
> Hose may not be the best material for abrasion
> resistance. But it's better than electrical tape.
> Electrical tape is really overused stuff. Every
> conversion electric vehicle should go through an
> electrical tape audit. Of course, there are many
> inferior alternatives to electrical tape, and I have
> seen them all. Nothing, for example, or masking tape,
> or the clear plastic tape used for taping cardboard
> boxes. This stuff is particularly bad, since it does
> not conform to the connectors.
>
> Why not take a lesson from the old school? The NEC
> specifies conduit if there is a risk of physical
> contact. These guys may be overly conservative, and
> they may serve industry interests to the detriment of
> real safety, but they are better than electrical tape.
> Just because you are designing cutting edge
> technology does not mean that you are exempt from the
> foundations of safe electrical construction practices.
> Naaaaaah, everybody thinks they are exempt if they
> are new-fangled, ex. dot-comm. Besides, EV's are not
> new.
>
> BTW, I saw this on the Internet. Not an urban legend?
> Are the clearing currents (14000 A) realistic?
>
> http://www.ecmweb.com/ar/electric_anatomy_electrical_accident/index.htm
>
>
> __________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.
> http://search.yahoo.com
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
http://vehiculeselectriques.free.fr/Saxo.html
Philippe
Et si le pot d'�chappement sortait au centre du volant ?
quel carburant choisiriez-vous ?
http://vehiculeselectriques.free.fr
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
TdS Report #70: Team Profile: "Electric Hog", #12
Carl Vogel brought his custom built Electric Hog to the Tour de Sol in 2001 and
2002. Last year he had controller problems that kept him from completing the
technical testing required to compete in the rally, but, once the controller
started to work again, he showed his vehicle off at the festivals.
I caught up with him and his team in Burlington. He was not happy. "The motor
controller went again. This year it has a new controller, but it is not
working." He didn't know why. "I'll have to bring it back to the company and
see what happened to it. Get another one." It had been running through the
winter. "I have been using it. It was giving about 40 miles at 55 miles per
hour. The batteries froze so I put new batteries in, fixed the wiring and put
in the good controller, well that I thought was good. It was kind of
last-minute. Now it is not working."
When it is working, does the fact that it is so quiet cause people to stare?
"Yes, it attracts a lot of attention. The Harley guys love it. They
appreciate that it's American made." Carl designed the bike from scratch.
"The only noise you can hear is the drive chain."
New this year is a side-car. "It's to extend the range. Behind the seat is a
bio-diesel generator, made by Yanmar. That is to extend the range, using B100.
It was the simplest thing to do. I bought the side-car and modified it to hold
the generator." There is still room for a person. There is a plug on the back
of the side-car so the generator can be used for other purposes, such as when
he goes camping.
"Before he wasn't married. Now he is," commented team mate Brian Lima. "He
has it balanced nicely," so it handles well. "It's like riding a big Fat Boy
or something like that."
Carl planned to get the bike going and bring it back for the Washington DC
Festival, which he did.
Another bike is in the works, based on a Harley frame from the 1960s or 70s.
http://www.vogelbilt.com
Vehicle Name Electric Hog
Vehicle Number 12
Category HYBRID AND ALTERNATIVE FUELED VEHICLES (H&AFV)
Vehicle type category Advanced battery
Team Name Vogelbilt
Who Built private group
Vehicle Manufacturer Vogelbilt
Vehicle Model Year 2003
Vehicle Type Class One Person
Vehicle Type Division Prototype
Vehicle Type Model Motorcycle
Energy Storage System Lithium Ion
Battery Lithium Ion
Plug Type 6-30P
Conversion Pre-Prod Prototype
Range miles 80
Program blurb The Electric Hog, a full size motorcycle was
completely redesigned for this year. Using
Lithium ion batteries and AC power, range and
performance were greatly improved. In addition
the Hog has received a lightweight sidecar which
houses a small bio diesel generator to extend
range for long trips.
516-443-1715
Although the listing above says the batteries were to have been Lithium Ion, I
don't believe they were. Maybe next year.
- - - -
The complete set of Tour de Sol Reports for 2003 can be found at:
http://www.AutoAuditorium.com/TdS_Reports_2003
The complete set of past Tour de Sol Reports can be found at:
http://www.FovealSystems.com/Tour_de_Sol_Reports.html
- - - -
The above is Copyright 2003 by Michael H. Bianchi.
Permission to copy is granted provided the entire article is presented
without modification and this notice remains attached.
For other arrangements, contact me at +1-973-822-2085 .
- - - -
For more on the NESEA Tour de Sol, see the web page at
http://www.TourdeSol.org
- - - -
Official NESEA Tour de Sol information is available from the sponsor,
the Northeast Sustainable Energy Association (NESEA) at
413 774-6051 , and 50 Miles Street, Greenfield, MA 01301 , and
[EMAIL PROTECTED] . All media enquiries should be addressed to ...
Jack Groh
Tour de Sol Communications Director
P.O. Box 6044
Warwick, RI 02887-6044
401 732-1551
401 732-0547 fax
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
TdS Report #71: Photos - The Electric Hog, #12
Photographs from the Tour de Sol:
http://www.AutoAuditorium.com/TdS_Reports_2003/photos_034.html
The Electric Hog, #12
Carl Vogel with his Electric Hog.
Students attending the Tour de Sol think the Electric Hog is cool.
- - - -
The complete set of Tour de Sol Reports for 2003 can be found at:
http://www.AutoAuditorium.com/TdS_Reports_2003
The complete set of past Tour de Sol Reports can be found at:
http://www.FovealSystems.com/Tour_de_Sol_Reports.html
- - - -
The above is Copyright 2003 by Michael H. Bianchi.
Permission to copy is granted provided the entire article is presented
without modification and this notice remains attached.
For other arrangements, contact me at +1-973-822-2085 .
- - - -
For more on the NESEA Tour de Sol, see the web page at
http://www.TourdeSol.org
- - - -
Official NESEA Tour de Sol information is available from the sponsor,
the Northeast Sustainable Energy Association (NESEA) at
413 774-6051 , and 50 Miles Street, Greenfield, MA 01301 , and
[EMAIL PROTECTED] . All media enquiries should be addressed to ...
Jack Groh
Tour de Sol Communications Director
P.O. Box 6044
Warwick, RI 02887-6044
401 732-1551
401 732-0547 fax
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Lawrence,
In another post, you mentioned that you replaced the controller, and now get
much better range with the Lectra.
If you don't mind me asking, what improvements did you make? Also, do you
think installing a two-speed automatic transmission is worth doing?
Christian
----- Original Message -----
From: "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Christian Kocmick" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Sunday, June 08, 2003 10:29 AM
Subject: Re: Lectra Specs
> OK the Grote part number for the tailight lense is #90232. Snap on lense.
> Commonly used on trailers. The rear shocks are spring assisted and just
> about anything can be used depending on weight carrying ability. In my
> personal opinion(just a guess) is if the motor controller combo blows it
> might be cheaper to replace with a Curtis and series motor. That cost me
> $350 used over the internet. You will however need a DC/DC converter
then.
> Lawrence Rhodes....
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------
> This mailbox protected from junk email by Matador
> from MailFrontier, Inc. http://info.mailfrontier.com
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Christian Kocmick" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Sent: Saturday, June 07, 2003 7:16 PM
> Subject: Lectra Specs
>
>
> > Lawrence,
> > What I'd like to do is create a small website that identifies the most
> often
> > replaced parts with their off the shelf replacement. For example: Lectra
> 11
> > tooth sprocket = X part, or Lectra Front Fork Seals = Yamaha
DT50MX/80MX.
> > That way, I 'd eventually help Lectra owners and hobbyist repair, or
even
> > build a Lectra, thus keep what I consider to be one of the most able
> > electric two-wheelers on the road. I'd hate to see the Lectra become a
> > distant memory. If you have such information, please let me know.
> >
> > Christian
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > To: "Christian Kocmick" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > Sent: Saturday, June 07, 2003 1:55 AM
> > Subject: Re: Lectra Motorcycle and Zapworld
> >
> >
> > > If you need a tailight lense, have to get it from Grote. Any Carquest
> > will
> > > order it over the phone. Lawrence Rhodes...
> > >
> > >
> > > ----------------------------------------------------
> > > This mailbox protected from junk email by Matador
> > > from MailFrontier, Inc. http://info.mailfrontier.com
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "Christian Kocmick" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > > To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > > Sent: Friday, June 06, 2003 10:39 AM
> > > Subject: Lectra Motorcycle and Zapworld
> > >
> > >
> > > After some repeated emails, phone calls, and faxes, ZapWorld confirms
> that
> > > yes, they sold the Lectra and even better, they still have a few left.
> Oh,
> > > they do have some service/parts for the motorcycle. So if there are
any
> > > EV'ers out there who still want a Lectra motorcycle, there still may
be
> an
> > > opportunity to get one.
> > >
> > > Christian
> > >
> >
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
TdS Report #72: Team Profile: "eGO XR", #8
Electric scooters are often shown at the Tour de Sol, and a fair number of them
compete or register as Demonstration Vehicles. The eGO XR is here as a
demonstrator, but it went through the technical testing and participated in the
range event. There are two models being shown: the current production model
that uses lead acid batteries and the prototype with Lithium Ion batteries.
Farshid Bakhtiari is with Modular Energy Devices in Rhode Island. ModEnergy
is a start-up company that manufactures Lithium Ion batteries. "Sunday, in the
Tour de Sol range test, we drove 55 miles on a single charge. The battery pack
is 30 Volts holding 64 Amp-hours. The pack is made up of small cell batteries.
They claim to have overcome the safety issues and the cost issues that large
lithium ion batteries have presented in the past. Their's are about 1/10th the
usual cost for this chemistry. "Ours cost a little bit more than twice the
cost of lead acid batteries, but our life cycle is also twice as much." They
have a sophisticated charger that monitors the cells for charge and discharge.
"The intelligence is built into the battery." A full charge can take less than
1 hour. The eGO will be out with Lithium Ion batteries later in 2003, in a
limited edition.
Jim Hamann is with Ego Vehicles, also out of Rhode Island. "We teamed together
with ModEnergy to put their batteries in our cycles. Typically, with lead acid
batteries, the eGO travels about 20-to-25 miles per charge. Yesterday we did
55 on Lithium Ion. There are two different driving modes on the scooter. The
Go Far mode will drive at 17 miles-per-hour. The Go Far mode has a little bit
smoother acceleration and doesn't allow you to be so peppy, which is why you go
farther. The Go Fast mode will top out at 23 miles-per-hour. It charges in
4-to-5 hours and costs about 10 cents for a kiloWatt-hour of electricity.
"Ego Vehicles has been around for about 4 years. This is our second generation
product that has been available for about a year. We see this as an
international market." They have a product that complies with European Union
requirements. "The Canadians love it. In the states we are doing well too.
The basic model is $1400, and the there are accessories."
www.EgoVehicles.com
www.ModEnergy.com
Vehicle Name eGO XR
Vehicle Number 8
Category ONE-PERSON VEHICLES
Vehicle type category Advanced battery
Team Name ModEnergy/Ego Vehicles
Vehicle Manufacturer Ego Vehicles
Vehicle Model Year 2002
Vehicle Type Class One Person
Vehicle Type Division Prototype
Vehicle Type Model eGo XR
Energy Storage Manufacturer Modular Energy Devices, Inc.
Energy Storage System Lithium-Ion
Battery Modular Energy Devices, Inc./Lithium-Ion
Plug Type 5-20P
Conversion Purpose-Built
Range miles 70-90
Program blurb We are a new company with a mission to
dramatically reduce the cost of large Lithium-ion
batteries. Our electric scooter will have a 75
Amp hour Lithium-ion battery pack. We recently
received funds from the state of Rhode Island,
Slater Center.
- - - -
The complete set of Tour de Sol Reports for 2003 can be found at:
http://www.AutoAuditorium.com/TdS_Reports_2003
The complete set of past Tour de Sol Reports can be found at:
http://www.FovealSystems.com/Tour_de_Sol_Reports.html
- - - -
The above is Copyright 2003 by Michael H. Bianchi.
Permission to copy is granted provided the entire article is presented
without modification and this notice remains attached.
For other arrangements, contact me at +1-973-822-2085 .
- - - -
For more on the NESEA Tour de Sol, see the web page at
http://www.TourdeSol.org
- - - -
Official NESEA Tour de Sol information is available from the sponsor,
the Northeast Sustainable Energy Association (NESEA) at
413 774-6051 , and 50 Miles Street, Greenfield, MA 01301 , and
[EMAIL PROTECTED] . All media enquiries should be addressed to ...
Jack Groh
Tour de Sol Communications Director
P.O. Box 6044
Warwick, RI 02887-6044
401 732-1551
401 732-0547 fax
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
New, low bandwidth version now (60kb jpegs) should be more 56k friendly
now. More pictures too.
http://mysite.verizon.net/vze3v25q/photoalbum/
Seth
--
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
* LP8.2: HTML/Attachments detected, removed from message *
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I wired up 6 of 'em in parallel, for 30amps. I mounted them end-to-end. It
made a package about 22" x 5.5" x 2.5". I tested the rig standalone (no
battery) with a 20 amp load: head/tail lights, brake lights, etc. (20 amps
is as far as my wussy VOM will go.) No smoke.
Now these are actually 120v A/C input power supplies, but 120v D/C input
from my traction pack seems to work fine. It appears that the first thing
that happens in the circuit is that it gets rectified. I guess it's a buck
converter or something from there. There is a small trim-pot that can be
tweaked to vary the output from 9v to 13.8v. I cranked 'em all up evenly
to13.8 so that it will float-charge the battery.
I am no electronics expert, I can hardly wire a diode, so if this hack
freaks out the electronics gurus here, my humblest apologies. All I know is
I get lots of light, and no smoke. :)
I think I can get about 30 more of these at $9.95 each. I will need a bit
more $$ as incentive, but not a lot, if anyone cares to get some from me.
Heck $9.95+S&H for a 13.8v power supply for your CB ain't bad neither. Oh
yea they also have a separate 5v output.
-Dave
----- Original Message -----
From: "1sclunn" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Sunday, June 08, 2003 10:30 AM
Subject: Re: DC-DC's in parallel?
How about selling a few?
SteveClunn
> Thanks Bruce, I am going to try it then, and will report back. I can get
a
> bunch of these dirt-cheap, so I have little to lose if smoke gets out.
>
> -Dave
>
> 82 Jet Electrica Escort, Curtis 1221c+20 T-125s
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Bruce EVangel Parmenter" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Sent: Sunday, June 01, 2003 10:41 PM
> Subject: Re: DC-DC's in parallel?
>
>
> <snip>
> He said that it can be
> done as long as the units in parallel are set to
> the same output voltage.
> <snip>
>
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TdS Report #73: Demonstration Vehicle: "Hy-wire"
Over the years, the Tour de Sol has enjoyed presenting some of the futuristic
vehicles that the major auto companies have presented to the public. This year
the General Motors Hy-wire was on display at the Festivals in Trenton,
Philadelphia and Washington DC. I spoke with Susan Garavaglia, Manager of
Communications for Advanced Technology at GM, who is part of the group
displaying the Hy-wire.
"The Hy-wire is the first by-wire and fuel cell technology concept vehicle,
first introduced at the Paris Motor Show in 2002. We have been taking it
around the world to educate consumers and legislators about the importance of
hydrogen as an alternative fuel and our commitment to bring one to consumers by
the end of the decade."
The Hy-wire, and its concept predecessor the AUTOnomy, have all the drive, fuel
and control systems in a relatively thin platform, referred to as the
skateboard. The passenger compartment is attached on top of the skateboard.
Where did that come from? "The idea evolved from a research group, called the
Design and Technology Group, that looks for ways to marry design and technology
in new and innovative ways. Chris Borroni-Bird, the director of the Hy-wire
program, and his team came up with the idea of building the chassis and car
around the fuel cell, versus packaging into a conventional vehicle. What could
we do if we reinvented the automobile, from the ground up, around the fuel
cell? That's what Hy-wire shows you."
Part of the concept is that multiple passenger compartments could be designed
to attach to a single skateboard. "It would be possible to have a sports-car
type body, as we showed in the AUTOnomy. This is more of a luxury version, and
it could also be an SUV or a pickup truck; what ever the customer wanted."
In the Hy-wire, all the driving functions are in the steering wheel, including
acceleration and braking, and they are all communicated electrically to the
systems in the skateboard. I wondered how responsive it would be. "It is very
responsive. It takes some getting used to if you haven't driven a motor cycle.
I found that at first I wanted to hit the brakes with my feet, but there aren't
any foot pedals. But once I got used to the idea of braking with my hands, by
squeezing the hand grips, it was really quite fun to drive."
If you look at the car for a few minutes, it is clear that it couldn't be
licensed for road use. For example, there is no place on the front for a
license plate, and there is a window immediately above the bumper which one
imagines would shatter in the smallest of accidents. Has the car been put into
any sort of stress conditions, say on a track? "No. This is a concept
vehicle. The designers put that glass in front to show what can be done with
the interior if there isn't an engine or transmission, and you don't have the
constraints of the internal combustion engine. When it comes to market it will
be built with the crash protection to make it safe for consumers."
What is next? "From GM, there will be a fuel cell vehicle on the road by the
end of the decade. Will it look like Hy-wire? Probably not. But we are
looking at incorporating the by-wire technology into the vehicle we will bring
to market in 2010. In fact, some aspects of by-wire already available in some
of our cars. One of the Cadillac products has an aspect of by-wire, but I am
not sure which."
I also got to talk with Jeff Wolak, who is a development electrical engineer on
the Hy-wire project. "I got to work with putting the vehicle together and also
getting all the systems to work together. Getting all the systems, the drive-
by-wire, the fuel cell and all the body electronics, to work together as one
package took a bit of effort." It wouldn't be possible to have one wire for
every function. "We have many communication networks talking amongst each
other." The networks are not the Ethernet or TCP/IP networks of computers, but
rather industrial control networks such as CAN (Controller Area Network).
"Each device has its own address." CAN is Ethernet-like in that messages are
sent at whatever time and if two are sent and collide the protocol fixes the
problem with retransmissions. TTP (Time Triggered Protocol) is time-sliced,
so each message is guaranteed to get through. TTP is the protocol used for
operator controls like steering and brakes. "We actually run two different
communication buses so if there is a problem, no single failure will take down
the whole car. For example, each brake has its own controller. A problem with
a brake is limited to just that one brake. Steering has two motors and two
controllers, so if either part should have a problem we could safely steer the
vehicle."
Did Jeff do anything when he was younger that forshadowed his work on the Hy-
wire? "When I was going in school at Kettering University, I worked on the
Formula Lightning electric race cars. I was very involved with that for about
5 years. It was a lot of fun and I learned a lot. It was basicly that program
that then got me interested in electric cars or alternatively fueled cars.
Through my co-op employment, when they asked me what I wanted to do when I
graduated, I said, `I really liked working on that stuff at school. Can I get
into that part of GM?' They were able to make some calls and get me into that
area."
Did anything surprise Jeff about the Hy-wire project? "This is car was built
by a lot of different groups in a lot of different countries. We did the in
Detroit, but we built the body in Italy, a lot of drive-by-wire work in
Holland, and a lot of fuel cell work in Germany. Working with all these
different cultures and countries and languages and people gave me different
perspectives. For example, I always supported better fuel economy, but when
you see the price of fuel over there ..."
We looked over the Hy-wire together, to see some of the things done
differently. "We've got little cameras and LCD screens instead of rear-view
mirrors in the car. Doing that means that when different people drive the car
you don't have to adjust mirrors. The cameras and screens are always in the
right position.
The handle grips turn clockwise and counter-clockwise for steering, but the
center of the "wheel" does not turn. That means that the display in the center
is always oriented for easy viewing. And, since there are no control pedals,
the whole control "wheel" can be slide from the left side to the right,
allowing the front "passenger" to become the driver.
The chassis of the car is made of aluminum and the body is fiberglass.
The air vents are WAY forward of the passengers, under the leading edge of the
windshield. I imagine it makes for a gentler flow of air through the body of
the car.
What looked like a very large Game Boy on a cable was sitting in the right
seat. "We use it to keep track of the systems, monitoring temperatures and
pressures. It also has an emergency brake in case someone driving for the
first time gets out of control. And I can play Tetris on it, too."
- - - -
The complete set of Tour de Sol Reports for 2003 can be found at:
http://www.AutoAuditorium.com/TdS_Reports_2003
The complete set of past Tour de Sol Reports can be found at:
http://www.FovealSystems.com/Tour_de_Sol_Reports.html
- - - -
The above is Copyright 2003 by Michael H. Bianchi.
Permission to copy is granted provided the entire article is presented
without modification and this notice remains attached.
For other arrangements, contact me at +1-973-822-2085 .
- - - -
For more on the NESEA Tour de Sol, see the web page at
http://www.TourdeSol.org
- - - -
Official NESEA Tour de Sol information is available from the sponsor,
the Northeast Sustainable Energy Association (NESEA) at
413 774-6051 , and 50 Miles Street, Greenfield, MA 01301 , and
[EMAIL PROTECTED] . All media enquiries should be addressed to ...
Jack Groh
Tour de Sol Communications Director
P.O. Box 6044
Warwick, RI 02887-6044
401 732-1551
401 732-0547 fax
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
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TdS Report #74: Photos - General Motors Hy-wire
Photographs from the Tour de Sol:
http://www.AutoAuditorium.com/TdS_Reports_2003/photos_035.html
General Motors Hy-wire
Front passenger side.
Actually, that all depends.
The driver controls can be moved from the left side to the right.
Front wheel and bumper.
Arriving at the Philadelphia Festival.
"Will I get to drive something like this?"
Notice the little rear-view camera housing on the front corner of the side
window. It's image is presented on an LCD screen inside the car, at just
about that position, although a little lower and further forward,
mounted on the inside surface of the front wheel well.
There is another camera-monitor pair on the other side.
Now that's a BIG game console.
Actually it is used for data analysis and emergency braking. It also plays
Tetris.
The rear seats.
The center panels of the seat backs are a mesh material that "breaths" easily.
Notice the size of the single door hinge.
Here you can see one LCD display on the steering wheel and another on the
center console.
Notice how the steering wheel is on the left side of an arm supported by the
center console. The arm can be slide so it would now be in front of the
right seat, and the steering wheel slides on the arm so it is in the correct
position for the person in that seat.
- - - -
The complete set of Tour de Sol Reports for 2003 can be found at:
http://www.AutoAuditorium.com/TdS_Reports_2003
The complete set of past Tour de Sol Reports can be found at:
http://www.FovealSystems.com/Tour_de_Sol_Reports.html
- - - -
The above is Copyright 2003 by Michael H. Bianchi.
Permission to copy is granted provided the entire article is presented
without modification and this notice remains attached.
For other arrangements, contact me at +1-973-822-2085 .
- - - -
For more on the NESEA Tour de Sol, see the web page at
http://www.TourdeSol.org
- - - -
Official NESEA Tour de Sol information is available from the sponsor,
the Northeast Sustainable Energy Association (NESEA) at
413 774-6051 , and 50 Miles Street, Greenfield, MA 01301 , and
[EMAIL PROTECTED] . All media enquiries should be addressed to ...
Jack Groh
Tour de Sol Communications Director
P.O. Box 6044
Warwick, RI 02887-6044
401 732-1551
401 732-0547 fax
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
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It seems that someone has converted a yamaha motorcycle to electric.
Located at:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&category=6718&item=2417816830
Converted in 1998, as an experiment.
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On 8 Jun 2003 at 22:13, Philippe Borges wrote:
> http://vehiculeselectriques.free.fr/Saxo.html
>
Very impressive! Have you submitted this to the EV Album?
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David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
1991 Solectria Force 144vac
1991 Ford Escort Green/EV 128vdc
1970 GE Elec-trak E15 36vdc
1974 Avco New Idea rider 36vdc
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On 8 Jun 2003 at 16:56, Bob Bath wrote:
> the
> opposite of advanced (recessed?).
Retarded. Really.
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Want to unsubscribe, stop the EV list mail while you're on vacation, or
switch to digest mode? See http://www.evdl.org/help/
= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
1991 Solectria Force 144vac
1991 Ford Escort Green/EV 128vdc
1970 GE Elec-trak E15 36vdc
1974 Avco New Idea rider 36vdc
= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
Thou shalt not send me any thing which says unto thee, "send this to all
thou knowest." Neither shalt thou send me any spam, lest I smite thee.
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[ref
http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/ev-list-archive/message/2911 ]
Its only under priced if the winning bid stays low.
I wonder if the North SF Bay EAA chapter
http://geocities.com/nbeaa
knows of this EV?
I would likely remove the 'crude' onboard charger and
replace it with two small 48V smart chargers
http://www.4unique.com/battery/48volt.htm
The Soneil is light weight & works off 120 or 220 VAC.
The Battery-Tender puts out 10 amps.
Both can charge AGM batteries.
=====
' ____
~/__|o\__
'@----- @'---(=
. http://geocities.com/brucedp/
. EV List Editor & RE newswires
. (originator of the above ASCII art)
=====
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Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Calendar - Free online calendar with sync to Outlook(TM).
http://calendar.yahoo.com
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> How about 15.4KW at 85%SOC to 26.3KW at 25%SOC!
> Good thing I'm only planning on using 309V nominal pack drawing up
to
> 1.5C or 135Amps: only 13.2KW at 85%SOC to 22.6KW at 25%SOC. ;-)
I assume you are talking about a theoretical amount of heat generated by the
cells here. Do we have enough data to assume that "equivalent series
resistance" of the cells actually results in 100% heat?
What concerns me more is that at least upto 1.0C discharge currents the
thunder sky graphs (Curve 4) seem to show the cell voltage be limited to
2.75V. If the cell voltage needs to be kept above 2.75V then it is entirely
possible that at only 100A draw you'll be limited to ~42Ahr drawn out of the
cell.
And at 100A with the cells down at 2.75V even your 85 cells only give you
~23kW of usable power. Not exactly stellar accleration.
I HOPE that series resistance goes down as I add more cycles. The
Thunder-sky curves certainly imply a much lower series resistance. We'll
see. And keep in mind that this is a sample of one cell, I haven't tested
any of the others.
Chris Brune
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