EV Digest 2869
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) Re: Range predictopn (was Re: Ampabout)
by "David Roden (Akron OH USA)" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) Re: Charging at campgrounds
by Victor Tikhonov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) Re: EVLN(Bus Rapid Transit says electric rail is dirty)
by "David Roden (Akron OH USA)" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) Re: Charging at campgrounds
by Jim Coate <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) Re: HOV Lane (was EVs pushed into the slow lane, I drive my
politics)
by Aubrey Wilder <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) Re: 50mpg from Lotus Elise was RE: Li-ion car on eBay: real or vapor?
by "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7) Re: EVLN(Bus Rapid Transit says electric rail is dirty)
by Michael Hurley <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8) RE: 50mpg from Lotus Elise was RE: Li-ion car on eBay: real or vapor?
by "Coallier, Steve" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
9) Re: OT: Laptop powered by micro-ICE
by "David Roden (Akron OH USA)" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) Re: EVLN(Bus Rapid Transit says electric rail is dirty)
by "Chuck Hursch" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
11) Re: EVLN(EVs pushed into the slow lane, I drive my politics)
by "Chuck Hursch" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
12) Re: Laptop powered by micro-ICE
by "Chuck Hursch" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13) Re: EVLN(Bus Rapid Transit says electric rail is dirty)
by "David Roden (Akron OH USA)" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
14) Re: EVLN(Bus Rapid Transit says electric rail is dirty)
by Peter VanDerWal <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
15) Kit 3-wheel EVs - WAS:EVLN(Bus Rapid Transit says electric rail is dirty)
by Sam Uzi <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16) Re: hybrid??
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
17) micro-ice
by Jeff Shanab <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
18) RE: micro-ice
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
19) Re: Kit 3-wheel EVs - WAS:EVLN(Bus Rapid Transit says electric
rail is dirty)
by Carmen Farruggia <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
20) RE: Kit 3-wheel EVs - WAS:EVLN(Bus Rapid Transit says electricrail is dirty)
by "Coallier, Steve" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
21) Electric motor books was (Re: hybrid??)
by "damon henry" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
22) RE: Li-ion car on eBay: real or vapor?
by "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
23) Re: Li-ion car on eBay: real or vapor?
by "Jon \"Sheer\" Pullen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
24) RE: Li-ion car on eBay: real or vapor?
by "damon henry" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
25) RE: Charging at campgrounds
by Bruce EVangel Parmenter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
26) vapor : Li-ion car on eBay: real or vapor?
by Bruce EVangel Parmenter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--- Begin Message ---
On 19 Jun 2003 at 15:35, Victor Tikhonov wrote:
> No different from the gas car which you know how many gallons
> [EV=Ah] you put in, but never exactly sure how many miles it
> translated to due to accidental hole in the gas tank
That reminds me. Earlier this week one of the people at work recruited me
to take a look at her car (1998 Toyota Corolla) in the parking lot. She
said "something is leaking."
It turned out to be an underhood hose to the fuel rail, spraying fuel in
copious quantities. It was routed right above the exhaust manifold and
catalytic converter! I told her to have the car towed to the shop, that it
wasn't safe to drive. (She'd driven to work with the windows rolled down
against the gas fumes; you'd think she'd have stopped ...)
It was really tough to hold my tongue. I wanted to say something about how
EVs don't have highly flammable liquids in proximity to hot surfaces.
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David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
1991 Solectria Force 144vac
1991 Ford Escort Green/EV 128vdc
1970 GE Elec-trak E15 36vdc
1974 Avco New Idea rider 36vdc
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thou knowest." Neither shalt thou send me any spam, lest I smite thee.
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--- Begin Message ---
"David Roden (Akron OH USA)" wrote:
>
> Hmm, I wonder if our Brusa chargers can handle DC input. Victor, what do
> you know about this? Brusa NLG4? NLG5? Can they deal with DC in?
I know they eat 110VAC...240VAC and anything in between, but don't
know about DC input.
This is such an odd requirement that I doubt Brusa would make this
as a standard feature, but certainly it can be modified to accept
DC input as a special order.
I'll find out.
Victor
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On 19 Jun 2003 at 22:23, Michael Hurley wrote:
> OH, you can't own one at all,
> enclosed or not.
I live in Ohio, and I've seen people driving licensed 3-wheel vehicles that
look like dune buggies with motorcycle front ends. They're usually noisy
and have uncontrolled exhausts full of unburned hydrocarbons.
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David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
1991 Solectria Force 144vac
1991 Ford Escort Green/EV 128vdc
1970 GE Elec-trak E15 36vdc
1974 Avco New Idea rider 36vdc
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Thou shalt not send me any thing which says unto thee, "send this to all
thou knowest." Neither shalt thou send me any spam, lest I smite thee.
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--- Begin Message ---
Chris Zach wrote:
Any other ideas for places which would have 240 volt outlets?
- Body shops/junk yards will have welder outlets which are usually 240
volt, 50 amps. [done this]
- The school year is winding down most places, but high schools that
still have an auto shop left might also have welder outlets. Limited to
weekdays and school hours and calling ahead and making friends with the
teacher but might enjoy the free lesson plan for the day (ie give kids a
tour of your car). [done this, but it's the school I work in so I have
keys and doesn't really count]
- If a longer trip, for the overnight stop a friendly bed & breakfast
may have a dryer outlet available. [done this too]
_________
Jim Coate
1992 Chevy S10
1970's Elec-Trak
http://www.eeevee.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Here's hoping! If I can write a pursuasive enough letter and get California
to let Jets in the HOV lane, I'll let you all know.
Thanks for the links and info. My Electrica 007 is actually a Dodge Omni -
who knows why - but I love it. Now I just need to get it running. :)
Aubrey
> Correction - jumped too soon.
> The 007 was from Plymouth.
> The Electrica is from Ford
> (http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/index3.html#Ford/Mercury)
>
> If your vehicle is a Jet conversion, this is a professional conversion, by
> Jet Industries, and should already be in the DMV list. All of the Jet
> Industries conversions were made on Plymouth cars
> (http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/index2.html#Dodge/Plymouth).
>
>
> We're behind you getting the Jet vehicles added to the list
> (http://www.arb.ca.gov/msprog/carpool/carpool.htm).
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Now you're talking power to weigh that will work. Sub 1 thousand pound
glider or roller as they call it......Lawrence Rhodes.............
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----- Original Message -----
From: "Coallier, Steve" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Friday, June 20, 2003 11:10 AM
Subject: RE: 50mpg from Lotus Elise was RE: Li-ion car on eBay: real or
vapor?
> http://www.koolkarsltd.co.uk/ - prices are in pounds, I don't have time at
the moment to convert...
>
> Not an Elise, but: http://www.wcmultralite.com/main.html
>
> .Steve Coallier
> "Attack life, it's going to kill you anyway!"
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Behalf Of Jorg Brown
> Sent: Friday, June 20, 2003 10:01 AM
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: RE: Li-ion car on eBay: real or vapor?
>
>
> Too bad Lotus doesn't offer a kit form of the Lotus Elise. The U.S. price
> of a finished Elise is only $45K or so... or at least it was the last time
I
> checked with my local Lotus dealer. It's also 400 pounds lighter than the
> Ultima, owing to the Aluminum chassis.
>
> http://www.lotuscars.com/press_release.html
>
> jorg
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I live in Ohio, and I've seen people driving licensed 3-wheel vehicles that
look like dune buggies with motorcycle front ends. They're usually noisy
and have uncontrolled exhausts full of unburned hydrocarbons.
OK. Guess I was wrong. Maybe it is only enclosed three wheelers. I'm
fairly certain there's a legal issue with things like Sparrows in
Ohio.
--
Auf wiedersehen!
______________________________________________________
"..Um..Something strange happened to me this morning."
"Was it a dream where you see yourself standing in
sort of Sun God robes on a pyramid with a thousand
naked women screaming and throwing little pickles
at you?"
"..No."
"Why am I the only person that has that dream?"
- Real Genius
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
As long as there's still enough room to put all the components...
-----Original Message-----
From: Lawrence Rhodes [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, June 20, 2003 2:49 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: 50mpg from Lotus Elise was RE: Li-ion car on eBay: real or
vapor?
Now you're talking power to weigh that will work. Sub 1 thousand pound
glider or roller as they call it......Lawrence Rhodes.............
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----- Original Message -----
From: "Coallier, Steve" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Friday, June 20, 2003 11:10 AM
Subject: RE: 50mpg from Lotus Elise was RE: Li-ion car on eBay: real or
vapor?
> http://www.koolkarsltd.co.uk/ - prices are in pounds, I don't have time at
the moment to convert...
>
> Not an Elise, but: http://www.wcmultralite.com/main.html
>
> .Steve Coallier
> "Attack life, it's going to kill you anyway!"
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On 20 Jun 2003 at 20:10, Mark Fowler wrote:
> So it's not bad enough that people drive around in ICE powered cars, now they
> can run their laptops from a tiny ICE generator...
I don't think it will, uh, fly.
Consider the emissions and noise. Ugh. If someone runs one of those next
to me on the airplane, I'm going to get REAL upset, and I suspect I'm not
the only one.
This is a solution in search of a problem. If you can't use a rechargeable
battery, disposables are effectively "fuel," with no noise or emissions (at
the point of use). I don't see a whole lot of consumer concern over this
issue.
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David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
1991 Solectria Force 144vac
1991 Ford Escort Green/EV 128vdc
1970 GE Elec-trak E15 36vdc
1974 Avco New Idea rider 36vdc
= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
Thou shalt not send me any thing which says unto thee, "send this to all
thou knowest." Neither shalt thou send me any spam, lest I smite thee.
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--- Begin Message ---
Michael Hurley wrote:
> >Michael Hurley wrote:
> >> There's also the fact that some of us like to date every
now and
> >> again. ;-) It's nice to be able to pick her up in your own
nifty EV,
> >> rather than an ICE.
> >
> >When my wife and I were dating, I picked her up on our 2nd
date in my
> >ComutaVan EV. She married me anyway :-)
>
> I'm all for smaller vehicles. SUVs and such are pointless as
commuter
> vehicles. But I also think that a single-seat vehicle is
destined to
> be nothing but a niche-market vehicle, a second car. They will
never
> be accepted as main-stream. Many people (myself included) can't
> afford to own two vehicles. As I live in an apartment, I'm not
sure I
> can even keep two cars easily. On a daily commuter basis, I
drive
> alone it's true, but I do go out with friends pretty regularly.
We
> usually carpool to save on parking costs. This would be
impossible in
> a Sparrow, and motorcycle parking is not common around here. To
me
> two seats are the minimum number for a primary vehicle.
For people living in an apt, it is nearly impossible to own an
EV, by virtue of the fact that many apt managers make it nearly
impossible to set up charging. If you can get charging at work,
that may help, but then you still wouldn't be able to charge over
the weekends. It would seem natural that apts, with their high
population concentration, and people frequently living close to
work, would be a natural for having a high percentage of cars as
EVs. I am the only EV owner in this apt complex of say a
thousand or two thousand people. There are a few Prii lurking
around. (I can always think to myself that I own the cleanest,
most efficient vehicle here.) I had a difficult time getting
permission for charging, but some six months after the initial
application, one brand-new pack run into the ground, and after
spending $500 for the installation, I had my charging outlet (had
to satisfy two requirements: wiring totally enclosed, and a
lockable box => the outlet is on the carport ceiling => I have to
run upstairs to get my stool chair to plug 'er in => no, this is
not really easier than gassing your ICE car). Interesting that
over at the security bldg they have open NEMA 5-15 outlets low on
the walls in the garages (don't know if they are powered up, but
they probably are).
I acquired/was-offered the family Toyota 4-Runner from Colorado
in 1998 for my long-range vehicle (I previously rented -
entailing a multi-hour round-trip bus ride to go get/return a
rental) - a vehicle that was in quite good shape. While parking
was quite tight around here then (not so tight now as the vacancy
rate is up), I probably could've more or less taken over a slot
and used a car-cover. However, my worries about other hassles
such as vandalism or car-door dings meant the 4-Runner is housed
in a storage container over in San Rafael - $135/month.
Sometimes I wonder: the security people seem to hang around my
carport in their noisy trucks a lot longer when my EV is plugged
in. This has started occurring within the last couple of months.
It makes me wonder in-a-way if a big hassle is coming up. Nobody
has bothered me about it in nearly 9 years of charging, so that
is record enough - never a problem. But I will be glad to have
my own place sometime, and give the you-know-what to a population
that never seems to be able to deal with its population and
energy issues - it should be very evident to most...
Chuck Hursch
Larkspur, CA
NBEAA treasurer and webmaster
www.geocities.com/nbeaa
http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/339.html
www.geocities.com/chursch/bizcard.bmp
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I sometimes wonder about this business of going fast (if you
aren't doing 65, you get run over by the goliath SUVs) in a
carpool lane. Many of these scenes are of a fairly empty carpool
lane next to three or four lanes of parking lot. Suppose I'm
going 65, and somebody from the parking lot decides they've had
enough and pull right out in front of me - I've seen it happen.
Whether my EV can do 65 or not is irrelevant, I ain't driving
that fast next to "parked" cars. The goliath SUV can be patient
and do 45-50 on my bumper next to the parking lot. I may just
have a chance of avoiding the menaces in front and behind, since
I don't have to slam on the brakes quite so hard in a panic
slow-down if I'm going slower.
I do understand the need for some power reserve in carpool lanes,
so you don't slow to a crawl and back it up on a long uphill
grade. With the 96V Rabbit, the long uphill carpool lane would
be a problem. On the flats, I can do 65-70 with the rest of the
crowd, and I did it once for 25 miles when the car was down in
the South Bay when I made a run from Redwood City down to
Sunnyvale / Santa Clara and back.
Chuck Hursch
Larkspur, CA
NBEAA treasurer and webmaster
www.geocities.com/nbeaa
http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/339.html
www.geocities.com/chursch/bizcard.bmp
----- Original Message -----
From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Friday, June 20, 2003 11:41 AM
Subject: RE: EVLN(EVs pushed into the slow lane, I drive my
politics)
> Correction - jumped too soon.
> The 007 was from Plymouth.
> The Electrica is from Ford
> (http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/index3.html#Ford/Mercury)
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Ed Thorpe
> Sent: Friday, June 20, 2003 11:36 AM
> To: '[EMAIL PROTECTED]'
> Subject: RE: EVLN(EVs pushed into the slow lane, I drive my
politics)
>
>
> Aubrey,
>
> If your vehicle is a Jet conversion, this is a professional
conversion, by
> Jet Industries, and should already be in the DMV list. All of
the Jet
> Industries conversions were made on Plymouth cars
> (http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/index2.html#Dodge/Plymouth).
>
> Also, make certain you can drive freeway speeds. Early on some
conversions
> got hov stickers yet could barely drive 55mph.
>
> We're behind you getting the Jet vehicles added to the list
> (http://www.arb.ca.gov/msprog/carpool/carpool.htm).
>
> -Ed Thorpe
> driving HOV in Sparrow because its a motorcycle
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Aubrey Wilder [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Sent: Friday, June 20, 2003 11:19 AM
> To: EV List
> Subject: Re: EVLN(EVs pushed into the slow lane, I drive my
politics)
>
>
> Thank you for the information, but I wasn't misinformed. Both
my
> registration and title are marked E. A couple of months ago, I
mailed in
> the proper form and fee to the California DMV. A few weeks
later I received
> my check back and a letter, which said,
>
> "This letter is in regards to your application for Clean Air
Vehicle Decals.
>
> A review of the Air Resources Board requirements indicates that
your vehicle
> does not qualify for the Clean Air Vehicle Decal.
>
> Only those vehicles that are on the ARB list are qualifying for
a Decal at
> this time. If you have questions regarding qualifactions
requirements,
> please call the Air Resources Board at 1-800-242-4450.
>
> For further information on the Clean Air Decal Program visit
the web site
> ARB. CA GOV. Any application fee you submitted will be
refunded.
>
> Thank you for your interest in our Clean Air Vehicle Decal
Program.
>
> Sincerely,
> Cory James Shipley-Brown, Manager
> Special Processing Unit"
>
> I am intending to call and get this cleared up once my master's
thesis is
> finished. All I'm saying is that for a state supposedly so
concerned with
> air quality, they're not making this easy!
>
> Aubrey
> '80 Jet Electrica
>
>
>
> > Conversions are allowed in the HOV lanes if they have a
> > HOV sticker. To get the sticker, the conversion EV has
> > to be registered as 'E' for Electric, and the proper
> > form with the fee has to be submitted.
>
> > ...
> > This 'conversions not allowed in the HOV lane' keeps
> > coming up again and again. It is going to be a mis-
> > conception we will have correct over and over again.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Mark Fowler wrote:
> So it's not bad enough that people drive around in ICE powered
cars, now they can run their laptops from a tiny ICE generator...
>
> http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/54/31312.html
>
> Mark
I didn't see anywhere where it said it was an ICE. Could it be
some other kind of combustion engine? A Stirling?
Chuck Hursch
Larkspur, CA
NBEAA treasurer and webmaster
www.geocities.com/nbeaa
http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/339.html
www.geocities.com/chursch/bizcard.bmp
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On 20 Jun 2003 at 13:47, Victor Tikhonov wrote:
> Type "A/C" this is more common for air conditioners.
I've noticed that "aircon" is a common abbreviation in Europe and Asia. It
can't possibly be mistaken for anything else. I use it to avoid having AC
or even A/C taken as "alternating current."
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David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
1991 Solectria Force 144vac
1991 Ford Escort Green/EV 128vdc
1970 GE Elec-trak E15 36vdc
1974 Avco New Idea rider 36vdc
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Thou shalt not send me any thing which says unto thee, "send this to all
thou knowest." Neither shalt thou send me any spam, lest I smite thee.
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--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Yup but you can't legally drive a Sparrow, unless they've changed the
laws recently.
Ohio has one of the weirdest laws I've seen concerning three wheelers.
They can have two back wheels and one front wheel and be considered a
bike or motorcycle (depending on whether or not they have an engine),
but the law is very specific...only ONE front wheel. Trikes with two
front wheels are specifically excluded from the definition.
So trikes with two front wheels aren't considered motorcycles and they
aren't cars so they can't drive on the public roads in Ohio.
On Fri, 2003-06-20 at 14:38, David Roden (Akron OH USA) wrote:
> On 19 Jun 2003 at 22:23, Michael Hurley wrote:
>
> > OH, you can't own one at all,
> > enclosed or not.
>
> I live in Ohio, and I've seen people driving licensed 3-wheel vehicles that
> look like dune buggies with motorcycle front ends. They're usually noisy
> and have uncontrolled exhausts full of unburned hydrocarbons.
>
>
> = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
> Want to unsubscribe, stop the EV list mail while you're on vacation, or
> switch to digest mode? See http://www.evdl.org/help/
> = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
> David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
> 1991 Solectria Force 144vac
> 1991 Ford Escort Green/EV 128vdc
> 1970 GE Elec-trak E15 36vdc
> 1974 Avco New Idea rider 36vdc
> = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
> Thou shalt not send me any thing which says unto thee, "send this to all
> thou knowest." Neither shalt thou send me any spam, lest I smite thee.
> = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
>
--
EVDL
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
> Still, I always thought Corbin made a mistake in making the Sparrow a one-
> passenger vehicle. That made it ideal for the HOV lanes in California, but
> what about the rest of the country? What do you do when you want to go to
> lunch with a co-worker, or out to dinner with your partner at home? There's
> no room to have stuff sitting on the seat beside you, no way to show the car
> off for your friends (other than handing them the keys). And unlike a
> "real" motorcycle there's no tandem ability.
there is yet-another-Swiss 3-wheel EV called the SAM, which has in-line
tandem seats... seemed a more rational design than the Sparrow; a t-frame, with
motors on the crossbar in front and the electronics and battery pack inside the
beam running down the length; seats straddle the beam ...of course, we'll almost
certainly never see it available here in the USA
what are the rules concerning kit cars? can kit-built vehicles ever be
street-legal? presumably the regulations are state-specific
if feasible, perhaps the way to commercialize small EVs is to sell them as
assemble-it-yourself kits that can be packed up in a relatively small crate or
two...
should be possible to make the assembly process simple enough for the average
joe to put together without too much hair-pulling... make sure the design is
modular enough that more advanced DIYers can make mods and upgrades, etc, too
no worries about finding a retail showroom; just the thrill of waiting
for the truck to arrive and drop the crate in the driveway!
I could easily imagine people holding slap-it-together workshops and forming
clubs, etc... the EV's answer to the "Model-T"
ideally, the chargers and controller would be programmable so that the same
units could accomidate different battery configs and motor choices, etc...
perhaps even with a built-in flash-card reader to make U/Ling programming for
new configurations simple? ...yeah, I'm dreaming, but it's not THAT
unreasonable an idea...
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
damon henry wrote:
>
> Ryan,
>
> I have children 12, 9, 6, and 4. They all love the electric stuff I build
> and I would enjoy showing them how to build a simple electric motor. Do you
> have a URL or simple instructions for this? Sounds like fun.
>
> damon
>
> When I can teach a 3rd grader
> >"exactly"
> >how an electric motor works in a matter of 5 minutes. That same child
> >could build a motor with just a few feet of copper wire, 7 nails, and a
> >chunck of particle board.
There are lots of great, simple-to-build motor projects. Many have
posted example links available on the web, and there are lots more in
library books. People have been doing this for 100+ years.
However, I have noticed that most of them are really poor motors. They
barely work, and actually teach you very little about reasonable motor
design.
The design and construction of practical electric motors has been
covered well in pre-WW2 books. Besides a good library (if they haven't
thrown them out), you can get them from Lindsay Publications Inc,
P.O.Box 538, Bradley IL 60915, 815-935-5353, <www.lindsaybks.com>. For
example, "Electrical Designs" (published in 1901); "The Boy Mechanic",
volumes 1, 2, or 3 (1913-1919); "The Boy Electrician" (1940).
--
Lee A. Hart Ring the bells that still can ring
814 8th Ave. N. Forget your perfect offering
Sartell, MN 56377 USA There is a crack in everything
leeahart_at_earthlink.net That's how the light gets in - Leonard Cohen
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I agree this may not be a bad idea if off of renewable fuels, Makes me
think of another idea. Anyone ever try to make a bounce generator ?
I have seen Popular mechanics stuff on it years ago?
Delimma: I want an EV but yesterday I went paintballing with the gang
after work, The drive cycle for the day was 8 miles to work, 8 miles to
store, 10 miles home. All at about 45 mph with occasional 60mph spots.
This is basiclly the daily I need to deal with. Then on the freeway for
26 miles each way at 80mph. Obviously this would be a challenging
design on battery only. What if I had a small onboard generator that ran
on ( gas,CNG,propane), capable of charging or cruise currents. Most the
time it would be off. I would fire it up only to take long trips or top
off while I was at my destination. Ok, now the questions: Is there a
reformer-fuel cell unit that is small and light that could do this
efficently? or is there such thing as a bouce gen in which the magnet
moves back and forth instead of rotary? how light and efficient is what
is available? Would carring it around all the time be too much? On
subject of AirC, I heard mention of reversible chemical tube for ac that
recharges at pack time, anyone have info on that? I have been thinking
of designing an amonia-hydrogen-water unit for ice engines that would
run of the exhaust header waste heat. How much power does AirC take?
if we sized for keeping cool, could we make something that used
minimal current and perhaps ran slowly off of solar while parked? \
PS. Could the 20K price tag for a single seater w/o AC have been
corbin's downfall? I would have bought one if it was priced more like a
motorcycle than a V6 ICE.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Jeff wrote:
PS. Could the 20K price tag for a single seater w/o AC have been
corbin's downfall? I would have bought one if it was priced more like a
motorcycle than a V6 ICE.
Jeff-
The Corbin sold for $15k-$16k. And at only about 350 built over 3 years, the
company was still losing money on each vehicle.
-Ed T
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
on 6/20/03 1:20 PM, Sam Uzi at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
> what are the rules concerning kit cars? can kit-built vehicles ever be
> street-legal? presumably the regulations are state-specific
>
> if feasible, perhaps the way to commercialize small EVs is to sell them as
> assemble-it-yourself kits that can be packed up in a relatively small crate or
> two...
>
> should be possible to make the assembly process simple enough for the average
> joe to put together without too much hair-pulling... make sure the design is
> modular enough that more advanced DIYers can make mods and upgrades, etc, too
>
> no worries about finding a retail showroom; just the thrill of waiting
> for the truck to arrive and drop the crate in the driveway!
>
> I could easily imagine people holding slap-it-together workshops and forming
> clubs, etc... the EV's answer to the "Model-T"
>
> ideally, the chargers and controller would be programmable so that the same
> units could accomidate different battery configs and motor choices, etc...
> perhaps even with a built-in flash-card reader to make U/Ling programming for
> new configurations simple? ...yeah, I'm dreaming, but it's not THAT
> unreasonable an idea...
>
I have been writing to those who are currently producing EV's (i.e. Reva
etc..) and suggesting that they make kit-builts for sale in the U.S. so that
they might be able to pass on the crash test stuff. Any ideas from the
list about the regs on kit builts.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
The regs vary by state. California's regs are at
http://www.dmv.ca.gov/vr/spcnsreg.htm.
.Steve Coallier
"Attack life, it's going to kill you anyway!"
-----Original Message-----
From: Carmen Farruggia [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, June 20, 2003 4:26 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Kit 3-wheel EVs - WAS:EVLN(Bus Rapid Transit says
electricrail is dirty)
> Any ideas from the list about the regs on kit builts.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Thanks for the tip. I have had very little success at my local libraries.
I was there a couple of weeks ago and picked up what looked like a good book
on motor theory. I don't remember how old it was, but when I thumbed
through it, every other sentence referenced a diagram, but there were no
diagrams anywhere in the book. My libraries are great for everything else,
maybe it's more of the big oil conspiracy :-)
damon
From: Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: hybrid??
Date: Fri, 20 Jun 2003 18:04:40 -0700
damon henry wrote:
>
> Ryan,
>
> I have children 12, 9, 6, and 4. They all love the electric stuff I
build
> and I would enjoy showing them how to build a simple electric motor. Do
you
> have a URL or simple instructions for this? Sounds like fun.
>
> damon
>
> When I can teach a 3rd grader
> >"exactly"
> >how an electric motor works in a matter of 5 minutes. That same child
> >could build a motor with just a few feet of copper wire, 7 nails, and a
> >chunck of particle board.
There are lots of great, simple-to-build motor projects. Many have
posted example links available on the web, and there are lots more in
library books. People have been doing this for 100+ years.
However, I have noticed that most of them are really poor motors. They
barely work, and actually teach you very little about reasonable motor
design.
The design and construction of practical electric motors has been
covered well in pre-WW2 books. Besides a good library (if they haven't
thrown them out), you can get them from Lindsay Publications Inc,
P.O.Box 538, Bradley IL 60915, 815-935-5353, <www.lindsaybks.com>. For
example, "Electrical Designs" (published in 1901); "The Boy Mechanic",
volumes 1, 2, or 3 (1913-1919); "The Boy Electrician" (1940).
--
Lee A. Hart Ring the bells that still can ring
814 8th Ave. N. Forget your perfect offering
Sartell, MN 56377 USA There is a crack in everything
leeahart_at_earthlink.net That's how the light gets in - Leonard Cohen
_________________________________________________________________
MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE*
http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Li-ion car on eBay response.
Dear Mr Rhodes,
Our address is listed with eBay.
Manufacturing of the vehicle is global.
Due to industrial espionage, all other details are
proprietary.
Similar vehicles have been built, and if in
mass-production they would cost much less.
Best Regards,
Jon
--- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> Would it be possible to get some technical
> specifications, your address and manufacturing
> plant. Satisfied customers, website, etc... Thank
> you. Lawrence Rhodes........Sounds too good to be
> true..Well the price is a bit high....
> --------------------
----------------------------------------------------
This mailbox protected from junk email by Matador
from MailFrontier, Inc. http://info.mailfrontier.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Industrial espionage my foot. I smell scam.
S.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Friday, June 20, 2003 6:07 PM
Subject: RE: Li-ion car on eBay: real or vapor?
> Li-ion car on eBay response.
> Dear Mr Rhodes,
>
> Our address is listed with eBay.
>
> Manufacturing of the vehicle is global.
>
> Due to industrial espionage, all other details are
> proprietary.
>
> Similar vehicles have been built, and if in
> mass-production they would cost much less.
>
> Best Regards,
>
> Jon
>
>
> --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> > Would it be possible to get some technical
> > specifications, your address and manufacturing
> > plant. Satisfied customers, website, etc... Thank
> > you. Lawrence Rhodes........Sounds too good to be
> > true..Well the price is a bit high....
> > --------------------
>
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------
> This mailbox protected from junk email by Matador
> from MailFrontier, Inc. http://info.mailfrontier.com
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Well why bother with the Li Ions then why not just make full use of the
over-unity drive. It must have one.
Due to industrial espionage, all other details are
proprietary.
Similar vehicles have been built, and if in
mass-production they would cost much less.
Best Regards,
Jon
--- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> Would it be possible to get some technical
> specifications, your address and manufacturing
> plant. Satisfied customers, website, etc... Thank
> you. Lawrence Rhodes........Sounds too good to be
> true..Well the price is a bit high....
> --------------------
----------------------------------------------------
This mailbox protected from junk email by Matador
from MailFrontier, Inc. http://info.mailfrontier.com
_________________________________________________________________
Tired of spam? Get advanced junk mail protection with MSN 8.
http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail
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--- Begin Message ---
It was asked, has anyone charged at RV parks/camp-
grounds with RV power, what are the protocols, etc.
I have charged at RV parks, as there is no public EV
charging South of Santa Clara until you get to San
Luis Obispo.
I have found that if try to explain what you are doing
to RV parks local to me, they get real tired with all
of it and are soon to deny you access by saying 'you
have to be and RV'. So, I stopped telling.
Since I do not want to spend my time there as to use
them means I am on a road trip, I choose RV parks that
offer 220 VAC power. You research which RV park to
use by seeking a park with available '50 amp' power.
That is their term for a 14-50 220 VAC 50 amp outlet.
If I were an EV driver with an onboard 6kw charger
(PFC-50, Zivan NG5, etc.) then have an adaptor for a
14-50.
In my case, I have enough chargers to get out there
even quicker. Even fully discharged, within a half
hour, I am unplugging chargers as I quickly reach the
80% charged point.
For me, charging on a RV's 120 VAC 30 amp outlet would
give 1/3 the power of a 14-50, and would take too long.
It is only worth the effort to secure a campground or
RV park that has '50 amp' service (a 14-50 outlet).
RV Campground Protocols
Always be considerate. Especially during the quiet
time 10pm to 7am. I make special effort all the time
not to slam doors and minimize my noise. Not drawing
attention to yourself is the right protocol and idea.
Example:
When I drove my Blazer down to San Martin's EV store
to have a tow bar mounted on it, I planned to charge
at one of that town's RV parks. After the work was
done, I pulled into the park, cabled up all my cords,
and thought I would go pay for a spot (I was
actually plugged into three spots).
As soon as I started plugging in, a visiting RV
neighbor interrupted his libation regiment to saunter
over and see what I was doing. Leaning and breathing
heavily on my EV hood, he 'just-wanted-to-make-sure'
I belonged there and that I had paid.
Without going into too much detail ( words would be
wasted on the wasted ), I told them I wanted to plug
in first to 'get-this-cooking' then go pay.
As I was planing to head to the main office to pay,
when curious kids started descending on my spot. I
walked toward the office fearing that 'something'
was going to happen while I was gone.
In the office, I rented a spot. The wanted to know
about my RV rig. Having learned from previous
experience, I did not go into the whole EV shpeal.
I told them I had a camper on a S-10 truck (a C
Class RV) and gave them the lic plate #, year, #
of people (1), no pets, staying only one day.
They wanted to assign me a spot, and I wanted a
spot that had a vacant spot next to me. So I
played innocent and said "Oh, I did not know. I
pulled into A5 because it was open." They said OK,
but next time ... (finger shaking time).
When I walked back, I had to gently shoo the kids
away from playing with my cords. I climbed inside
my EV and tried to be invisible without much luck.
It seemed like everyone at the park took a turn
coming out to walk by and take a look. I laid back
my seat trying to look like I was asleep, trying
not to draw attention of the park's golf-cart-
roving attendant.
What I learned and will do the next time is:
-Research all campgrounds that have 50 amp power
ahead of time.
-Call ahead to the RV park/campground to reserve my
spot with a credit card. Know their office hours
for checking in.
-When you come in, don't plug in first. Park around
the corner, walk to the office and check in. I
don't tell them its Electric. I go through the
routine as if it was an RV and answer their
questions. Then when all is paid, go to your spot,
plug in and keep the receipt with you.
-If people stop by and ask, tell them this is your
'tow vehicle' for getting around (that's a term used
for the car RV's tow behind them). If they want to
know where the RV is, tell them it will be back, its
getting a tune up, or its being 'gassed-up' (that
usually shuts them up, if not, show the receipt that
you have paid for the spot).
-If you can leave the vehicle unattended, the better.
Sitting in the vehicle or around it draws attention.
RV parks are usually pretty laid back and RVrs
usually mind their own business. Its the odd
lubricated curious ones that want-to-know,
especially when you look different (aren't a RV).
I was there during the day, but have used RV parks
at night. I am very quiet as after hours, residents
could call the police if you look suspicious.
...
In reconnoitering a route to drive to LA from Silicon
Valley, I ran into some interesting RV parks. Some
could care less about what you are doing and just
want the money, others were turn off by all of it
and it would have been better to use a 'don't talk,
don't tell' method.
=====
' ____
~/__|o\__
'@----- @'---(=
. http://geocities.com/brucedp/
. EV List Editor & RE newswires
. (originator of the above ASCII art)
=====
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
SBC Yahoo! DSL - Now only $29.95 per month!
http://sbc.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
The response I got back was not much better than Larry's
but it was different:
-
Date: Fri, 20 Jun 2003 06:29:23 -0700 (PDT)
From: Jon Chance <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Our team has been building EVs and other vehicles for
many years. All further information is proprietary.
We are not seeking more publicity or buyers, but
thanks for the offer.
Best Regards,
Jon
-
IMHO: Translation:
We know what we are doing,
we don't have to prove a thing,
and we do not need any help.
Now go away unless you want to give us $92,000.
They are a very odd, and very unfriendly group
of people. They obivously do not know there is
a huge EV community, and do not think they need
to held accountable.
I think it is safe to say, this listing is a scam,
and people should be warned off.
Its just too slimey to be real, ie:
http://search.yahoo.com/search?p=Barnum+%22fool+born+every+minute%22
=====
' ____
~/__|o\__
'@----- @'---(=
. http://geocities.com/brucedp/
. EV List Editor & RE newswires
. (originator of the above ASCII art)
=====
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
SBC Yahoo! DSL - Now only $29.95 per month!
http://sbc.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
