EV Digest 3397
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) Re: Best 2wd trany??
by Seth <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) Re: Gadgets on the dash question
by "Mark Hanson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) Re: wireless e-meter remote
by Rod Hower <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) 1958 MGA Conversion
by "Diana Trevino" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) RE: fun with powerwheels 2...
by David Brandt <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) Re: Your website (ScanMail has removed a file)
by "Joe Strubhar" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7) RE: wireless e-meter remote (Laptop's available)
by "James Jarrett" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8) RE: wireless e-meter remote
by <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
9) RE: 1958 MGA Conversion
by "Grannes, Dean" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) RE: wireless e-meter remote (Laptop's available)
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
11) Re: wireless e-meter remote
by "Tim Clevenger" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
12) More on the laptops for sale
by "James Jarrett" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13) Re: First drive, batteries, range
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
14) Re: 1958 MGA Conversion
by "Diana Trevino" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
15) Re: wireless e-meter remote - long range
by Shawn Rutledge <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16) RE: 1958 MGA Conversion
by "Grannes, Dean" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
17) EVs in the public eye
by Reverend Gadget <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
18) Re: Fellow EV'er Needs Help
by "Mark Hanson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
19) Re: EVs in the public eye
by Otmar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
20) RE: EVs in the public eye
by "Steve Marks" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
21) Re: EVs in the public eye
by Reverend Gadget <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
22) battery trouble
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
23) Re: Your website (ScanMail has removed a file)
by "garry" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
24) NBEAA meeting (March 13, 2004, 10am-12noon) announcement
by "Chuck Hursch" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
25) RE: battery trouble
by David Brandt <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
26) RE: Modify Zivian NG3 for Current Interupt Algorithm
by "Don Cameron" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
27) Re: battery trouble
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
--- Begin Message ---
The only think we never break on the endurance racer is the 280Z trans.
I have seen the Miatas break under the same conditions.
Have used the others but never hard enough to know the difference.
I didn't weigh the 280Z trans, but it didn't feel that heavy when we
changed the clutch . And that Z motor(at ~200 ft-lbs) shock loads the
trans roughly like 300lb-ft of electric motor would.
Seth
On Mar 9, 2004, at 11:18 PM, brian G wrote:
i was thinking of using a chevy s-10 trany(as adapters are already
desinged and such) but then with what others had said i started
thinking what would be the smallest lightest 2wd rear drive trany
its going in a subaru Brat (just for refernce)
here are the ones i was thinking about.
BMW 2002 trany.
early Mazda rx-7 5 speed.
mazda miata 5 speed.
nissan,Datsun 510 or z car trany
any guesses.
weight is my main consern.
_________________________________________________________________
Get business advice and resources to improve your work life, from
bCentral. http://special.msn.com/bcentral/loudclear.armx
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I uaually rewire the existing meters into my EVcom (Electric Vehicle
Computer). PWM modulate the E-F guage to match the battery, pwm the Tach to
match the hall effect sensor on the end shaft of the ADC motor. Re-calibrate
with a pad resistor the H-C guage to match the temperature range of the
motor or controller whichever is more critical (usually the controller).
That way it looks factory and not tack on cobbled stuff. I also added a 2x40
VTF display where the windshield seam meets the dash similar to the EV-1.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tim Medeck" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Tuesday, March 09, 2004 1:02 AM
Subject: RE: Gadgets on the dash question
>
>
> Victor wrote:
> >I'd like people's expertise/suggestions on how one would
> >like to semi-permanently mount a gadget (about a cell phone
> >size) on a dash of a modern car.
>
> 3M Scotch VHB (Very High Bond) tape is used to glue exterior panels to
motor
> coaches and semi trailers in place of rivets now. It is available from
> www.mcmaster.com, or if you just want a few inches of the stuff, just let
me
> know and I'll mail it to you for no charge. This stuff is amazing. If you
> want to surface mount something, this is it. I've used it in place of
welds
> on some applications.
> Tim Medeck
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Get a FREE online computer virus scan from McAfee when you click here.
> http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
If you have more money than time buy one
that is already complete.
http://www.bb-elec.com/productlist.asp?dept_id=152
Rod
--- Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Otmar wrote:
> > It's wireless communication that stumps me on this
> one. Does anyone
> > know of a way to implement this in a small remote
> inexpensively?
> > I'd built one if I could work out the
> communication part in a
> > simple manner.
>
> Oh, come now. It's not that hard.
>
> You can buy a cordless phone for $19.95; that will
> provide a 2-way
> communications channel.
>
> Digikey sells a variety of Melixis, TI-RFiD, and
> Linx Technologies brand
> RF modules, ranging from $7 to $50 each; a complete
> development kit (2
> transmitters, 2 receivers, antennas, and everything
> needed to send
> serial data for $113-$195.
>
> For an E-meter, you could wire a crystal oscillator
> module to the serial
> output as a transmitter (serial data controls its
> Enable output) as a
> transmitter, and a consumer AM or FM receiver to
> receive the data.
> --
> "Never doubt that a small group of committed people
> can change the
> world. Indeed, it's the only thing that ever has!"
> -- Margaret Meade
> --
> Lee A. Hart 814 8th Ave N Sartell MN 56377
> leeahart_at_earthlink.net
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Yesterday, I found a 1958 MGA sitting in a field with no motor. I think this
is going to be my first converison attempt. Anyone ever convert one of
these? Anyone know the weight of this vehicle?
Jack,
Negative 48 L C
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
David Dymaxion wrote:
> Doubled voltage on Lamborghini = broken trannies.
Yes, I've dissected the trannies. The drive gear arrangement on the
Lamborghini is very poor (plastic gear driven by stamped steel yoke). There
are two failure modes right there on that gear. The 4-wheelers, on the
other hand, are exactly the same form factor, but have an excellent drive
gear arrangement (metal gear pressed on the motor shaft). A transplant from
the 4 wheeler to the Lamborghini of the motor and gear, or even the entire
drive unit, would solve the problem. The Jeeps are even more robust, but
are a different geometry.
>If you could start more
> gradually, then I think the powerwheels would be up to doubled
> voltage.
The easiest way would be to replace the footswitch with the cordless drill
system you mention. They operate on up to 24V, for the big ones.
Hmmm...something else to look for at garage sales...(adds to list as project
no. 8472...)
> I found I can buy a Hawker Cyclon 12 V, 8 Ahr battery for $25.
I'm using 13Ahr Hawkers that I got for about the same price from a surplus
place. I need another one so all 3 vehicles can run for the same amount of
time. The kids are starting to invite friends over to play with them.
> I like to put in a self-resetting 30 Amp auto fuse. Then if a kid
> trips it (like by going through high grass uphill) it "fixes" itself.
I believe that was a standard feature that was built in to the original
powerwheels brand batteries, although later they seemed to go to the cheaper
automotive type fuses. It's definitely good to have. What source do you
use for the ones you have added?
> The Jeeps can do wheelies when you double the voltage!
My daughters have already done that on just 12V! I'm not messing with that
one yet:-)
Besides, I'm just standardizing on 12V. It just happened that for the
Lamborghini, this is double the design voltage.
> Something I want to try: Putting 12 V LEDs across the braking
> resistor, for tail lights. Then when the driver lifts, the brake
> lights would come on.
I may look at adding a simple lighting system to the vehicles. This would
be a neat addition.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Sorry, I don't get attachments as noted.
Joseph H. Strubhar
E-Mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Web: www.gremcoinc.com
----- Original Message -----
From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Tuesday, March 09, 2004 6:33 AM
Subject: Re: Your website (ScanMail has removed a file)
> See the attached file for details.
>
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
----
> * LP8.2: HTML/Attachments detected, removed from message *
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
About three times a year my school does a "decommissioning sale". These are
computers that have been pulled out of classrooms and are sold to the
faculty/staff/general public at really REALLY low prices.
These are computers that are old, but still work perfectly and have been
replaced with newer technology.
Our next Decom sale will be sometime week after next. In that sale I have
about 47-48 IBM 380D laptops. These have 2 gig hard drives, 800x600 active
matrix color monitors, 84 megs of ram floppy and CD-rom drive and IBM
ethernet pcmcia card/cable. The batteries in these boxes range from fair to
lousy, so don't expect much battery life.
Anyway, with all the talk about putting computers in evs I thougt some of
you might be intereted. The comptuers will sell for $100.00 each and I
garuntee they work (I serviced every one of them MYSELF!). For an
additional $30.00 you can upgrade the ethernet pcmcia to an orinoco gold
802.11b 11 megabit wireless network pcmcia card.
By school rules I HAVE to sell these to students and teachers first, but I'm
sure I won't sell them all. Anyone who is interested, or has any questions
please feel free to contact me.
James
PS they can come with a case also if you want it, your call. The cases are
in fair shape but the are a butt-ugly hunter green color.
JJ
James F. Jarrett
Information Systems Associate
Charlotte Country Day School
(704)943-4562
http://www.ccds.charlotte.nc.us/~jarrett
http://www.ccds.charlotte.nc.us/~jarrett/EV
Smooth seas do not make skillful sailors. - African Proverb
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
You can see what the fob is from my Evalbum posting:
http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/268k.jpg
-Ed Thorpe
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Behalf Of Jim Coate
Sent: Tuesday, March 09, 2004 9:20 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: wireless e-meter remote
FM pagers to notify you when you car is being broken into (why??) are
available, such as
http://www.crutchfield.com/S-aJFXul2i7yt/cgi-bin/ProdView.asp?i=041CM2500
which can send 6 different 'zone' (SOC) signals.
I never saw the EV+, let alone the matching key fob. It sounds like the
perfect consumer accessory... getting down to fob size is the challenge.
Otmar wrote:
>This brings up something I would like to see for us hobbyists.
>
>Remember the Honda EV+ key fob remote? That was slick!
>
>I believe it was rated for 1000 foot range, had a display of battery
>state of charge and a precondition button. You could push this button
>1/2 hour before you left (say from inside your home or office) and
>the car would preheat or precool using grid power.
>
>It's wireless communication that stumps me on this one. Does anyone
>know of a way to implement this in a small remote inexpensively.
>
>Does anyone know of a auto remote on the market now that receives
information?
>
>I'd built one if I could work out the communication part in a simple
manner.
_________
Jim Coate
1970's Elec-Trak
1992 Chevy S-10 BEV
1997 Chevy S-10 NGV
http://www.eeevee.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Jack,
I am the proud owner of a 1959 MGA conversion. See it at
http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/114.html
I didn't do the conversion myself. It was converted by the late EV
pioneer Bob Wing. I know a little of its history--it went through
several changes in configuration since its original conversion to
electric in 1972(!). Currently it has 20 Optimas, buddy-paired for
120V. It is garaged, but has been itching to get out on the road since
the weather turned warm this past weekend in the Bay Area.
I'd be happy to try to answer any questions you have either on- or
off-list. Alas, I don't know the weight of the vehicle.
Dean Grannes
1979 VW Rabbit "Blue Phantom"
1959 MGA "Fire Chief"
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
You said (in part):
> Our next Decom sale will be sometime week after next. In that sale I
> have about 47-48 IBM 380D laptops. These have 2 gig hard drives,
> 800x600 active matrix color monitors, 84 megs of ram floppy and CD-rom
> drive and IBM ethernet pcmcia card/cable. The batteries in these boxes
> range from fair to lousy, so don't expect much battery life.
Not familiar with the IBM model number. What processor (type and speed)
are these? Will they be sold with an OS loaded, and if so what? Actualy
that one does not really matter as I'll likely format and start over
anyway....
I'm in need of an old laptop so these may well fit the bill quite well.
Thanks
-----------------------
Jim Walls - K6CCC
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Mobile Radio Operations
Southern California Edison Co.
Ofc: 626-302-8515 - PAX 28-515
FAX: 626-302-7501 - PAX 27-501
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
My dad recently had an alarm system installed on his work truck. It is a
two way pager that can lock/unlock doors, start the vehicle, roll down
windows, etc., and then receives confirmation when the command has
been performed. It also has a multi-zone alarm that will page the fob.
The fob is somewhere between a small pager and a GPS unit in size
and shape, and has a range of up to half a mile. You could use the two
way controller to turn on and off heat/air conditioning, while using the
alarm zones to warn you when charging is completed or aborted, pack
temperature reaches a certain level, CO detector picks up hydrogen,
etc.
Tim
------
Date: Tue, 09 Mar 2004 19:09:59 -0800
From: Victor Tikhonov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: wireless e-meter remote
Microchip and Maxim both make controllers with RF stage integrated
in it as well as stand alone transmitters and receivers.
But off-shelf wireless RS232 extenders may work better, or
I should say present less effort if all you need is remote
display (one way comm).
I'm planning on add on option for BMS - exactly as Jim
described, which is remotely monitor charging progress.
Normally this part of the gadget will be left unpopulated.
But, one thing at the time...
--
Victor
'91 ACRX - something different
_________________________________________________________________
Fast. Reliable. Get MSN 9 Dial-up - 3 months for the price of 1!
(Limited-time Offer) http://click.atdmt.com/AVE/go/onm00200361ave/direct/01/
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Just so I don't have to keep typing this over and over, the 380D laptops
(you can see dozens of them on Ebay if you want pictures and more specs) all
come with a CD drive, floppy drive, power cord, etc.
These are COMPLETELY usable. I will NOT EVER sell a computer missing ANY
part that is required to use it. These particular ones are 150 MHZ pentium
I computers. They have Windows 98 second edition installed and all the
latest microshaft critical updates and driver updates installed.
They DO NOT have USB ports. If you you want USB you'll have to purchase a
USB or USB2 pcmcia card. The laptop has two slots, one of which will be
filled by either a wired networking card or the wireless card ($30.00
extra).
The drivers for BOTH of these cards are already installed and can be
downloaded from the appropriate websites if you want to start over.
These computers have JUST be re-imaged. These computers have gone through a
complete checkup and re-imaging and testing process.
James
James F. Jarrett
Information Systems Associate
Charlotte Country Day School
(704)943-4562
http://www.ccds.charlotte.nc.us/~jarrett
http://www.ccds.charlotte.nc.us/~jarrett/EV
Smooth seas do not make skillful sailors. - African Proverb
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Behalf Of Tim Medeck
> Sent: Tuesday, March 09, 2004 1:02 AM
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: RE: Gadgets on the dash question
>
>
>
>
> Victor wrote:
> >I'd like people's expertise/suggestions on how one would
> >like to semi-permanently mount a gadget (about a cell phone
> >size) on a dash of a modern car.
>
> 3M Scotch VHB (Very High Bond) tape is used to glue exterior
> panels to motor
> coaches and semi trailers in place of rivets now. It is
> available from
> www.mcmaster.com, or if you just want a few inches of the
> stuff, just let me
> know and I'll mail it to you for no charge. This stuff is
> amazing. If you
> want to surface mount something, this is it. I've used it in
> place of welds
> on some applications.
> Tim Medeck
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Get a FREE online computer virus scan from McAfee when you
> click here.
> http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
>> Unfortunately there is no space for insulation on the Prizm pack,
>> and the bottom is both steel and right under the car (in the
>> airflow).
There still may be ways. Try putting a sheet of 1/4" styrafoam under the
batteries; you probably can spare 1/4" of height.
Get a bag of styrafoam beads for filling a bean-bag chair, and pour them
in between the batteries. They will fit in places too irregular for any
rigid insulation.
Lay a fiberglass batt over the top. It is nonconductive, conforms
easily, and won't interfere with venting. The ones in a plastic bag are
best for avoiding a mess. Don't use the ones with foil backing! :-)
--
"Never doubt that a small group of committed people can change the
world. Indeed, it's the only thing that ever has!" -- Margaret Meade
--
Lee A. Hart 814 8th Ave N Sartell MN 56377 leeahart_at_earthlink.net
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Nice car, I used to work in Fremont. That Prestolite 4001 , is that about
the same as the ADC 4001 which is 100 hp, 30 hp cont.? Have any close
pictures on where the batts are mounted ?
Jack,
Negative 48 L C
----- Original Message -----
From: "Grannes, Dean" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2004 10:37 AM
Subject: RE: 1958 MGA Conversion
> Jack,
>
> I am the proud owner of a 1959 MGA conversion. See it at
> http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/114.html
>
> I didn't do the conversion myself. It was converted by the late EV
> pioneer Bob Wing. I know a little of its history--it went through
> several changes in configuration since its original conversion to
> electric in 1972(!). Currently it has 20 Optimas, buddy-paired for
> 120V. It is garaged, but has been itching to get out on the road since
> the weather turned warm this past weekend in the Bay Area.
>
> I'd be happy to try to answer any questions you have either on- or
> off-list. Alas, I don't know the weight of the vehicle.
>
> Dean Grannes
> 1979 VW Rabbit "Blue Phantom"
> 1959 MGA "Fire Chief"
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
--- Doug Weathers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Or a full-on environmental monitoring system with a voice synthesizer
> in it, like the Sensaphone. http://www.smarthome.com/7005.html
BTW I have one of these sitting around unused; if anybody has a use for
it... make me an offer offline.
=====
. _______ Shawn T. Rutledge / KB7PWD [EMAIL PROTECTED]
(_ | |_) http://ecloud.org/ [EMAIL PROTECTED]
__) | | \______________________________________________
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Search - Find what you�re looking for faster
http://search.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Jack,
> That Prestolite 4001 , is that about
> the same as the ADC 4001 which is 100 hp, 30 hp cont.?
I don't know the answer to this, as I'm not familiar with the ADC4001.
I suspect others on the list can tell you more.
> Have any close pictures on where the batts are mounted ?
I took lots of (film) pictures a few years back when I swapped in a new
pack. I wanted to make sure I got them back in the right places with
the correct orientation. I could scan them in, or I could just take
some new ones with my digital camera. I don't have a convenient place
to put them on the web, so I could email them to you directly. (If
others are interested and care to point me to some available web space,
I can post them publicly).
I am amazed at how Bob managed to shoehorn 20 Optimas into that car.
I'm going from memory, but I think there are eight under the hood and
twelve in the trunk area. The batteries in front are very easy to
access. The ones in back are very difficult to access, because some are
under the "floor" of the trunk and some are stacked on top of the trunk.
Accessing some of the batteries in the back requires removing all the
other batteries on top of them, as well as the floor of the trunk, onto
which is bolted the chargers. That's perhaps the hardest part of
working on that car.
A few years ago, I had the rear springs stiffened (a few more leaf
springs put in). This had been a suggestion from Bob when I bought the
car, as it had been on his "to-do" list for some time. It really made
it ride and handle better. Still, with a 400A controller at 120V, it
isn't very peppy. Plus, I've continued to have problems with
buddy-paired Optimas. If I were to do it again, I would wire the 20
batteries in series for 240V and use a Zilla controller.
Still, it's a lot of fun to drive, and it turns heads wherever I go.
Dean
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Be careful what you wish for or you might get it! I
just signed a 13 episode deal for a new show on
Discovery Channel. and you know I will be showing off
the EV stuff as much as possible. I need to get going
on my car conversion ASAP so it will have some air
time. we start shooting on monday.
Gadget
=====
visit my website at www.reverendgadget.com
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* LP8.2: HTML/Attachments detected, removed from message *
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Be careful what you wish for or you might get it! I
just signed a 13 episode deal for a new show on
Discovery Channel. and you know I will be showing off
the EV stuff as much as possible. I need to get going
on my car conversion ASAP so it will have some air
time. we start shooting on monday.
Gadget
Hey Gadget,
That's great news!
btw: The controller for your blender should arrive today, tracking
says it was in Sylmar last night.
--
-Otmar-
http://www.CafeElectric.com
Mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Congratulations! Are there any more details you can give us on this?
Steve
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Behalf Of Reverend Gadget
> Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2004 10:28 AM
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: EVs in the public eye
>
>
> Be careful what you wish for or you might get it! I
> just signed a 13 episode deal for a new show on
> Discovery Channel. and you know I will be showing off
> the EV stuff as much as possible. I need to get going
> on my car conversion ASAP so it will have some air
> time. we start shooting on monday.
>
> Gadget
>
> =====
> visit my website at www.reverendgadget.com
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Fantastic! I can't wait to start building this thing.
Gadget
--- Otmar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >Be careful what you wish for or you might get it! I
> >just signed a 13 episode deal for a new show on
> >Discovery Channel. and you know I will be showing
> off
> >the EV stuff as much as possible. I need to get
> going
> >on my car conversion ASAP so it will have some air
> >time. we start shooting on monday.
> >
> > Gadget
>
> Hey Gadget,
> That's great news!
> btw: The controller for your blender should arrive
> today, tracking
> says it was in Sylmar last night.
>
>
> --
> -Otmar-
> http://www.CafeElectric.com
> Mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
=====
visit my website at www.reverendgadget.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I sent the email below to Nawaz about the batteries in my Tropica. Since then I've got
a failed battery with a reversed cell so now I have to do something. I'm planning on
replacing 5 of the 12 on Saturday. Is that a dumb thing to do? I know it's better to
swap out the whole pack but I can't do that every time something fails. I'd sure like
to know what caused this. The story I'm getting from US Battery is that I was charging
with 12 amps and that's not high enough. Am I the only one charging US125s at 12amps?
Any advise is appreciated.
email to Nawaz...
My 12 US 125s were installed in June of last year. Most days, I drive 13 miles to
work, charge, drive home and charge again. My charger puts out 12amps. It takes about
4 hours to complete the bulk charge after my commute as a reference point. The Tropica
has 2 Curtis 1209B controllers which are 400amps each. Three times last summer I've
taken the car 30-35 miles on a charge. The whole time I was watching that my voltage
didn't drop below 65 for more than 2 or 3 seconds. I have had trouble with my
Flow-Rite watering system and I have had cells over water a number of times. My
solution to the over water is to distribute the acid from the overwatered cell to
adjacent cells.
Last November, my charger didn't terminate a couple of times and now it won't at all.
November is when the temp started to drop here. We were getting 40 degree F nights.
About 5 of the batteries will come up to 7.75v and 3 won't come up above 7.0 with the
12amps. I can get them up higher with additional current. I've tried equalizing but so
far it hasn't helped. When I measured the SG, I did draw up some black or gray
particles. It's now difficult to accelerate from a stop without the voltage dropping
below 63v. They also seem to self discharge quickly although it's difficult to tell if
they've really been fully charged. Two of the batteries are also getting hot, 50
degrees C, during charging. The temp is very different from the top to the bottom of
the battery with the bottom being at 50.
I understand that these batteries should be charged at c/10 but I didn't realize that
using lower current could cause a problem. I've started running a second charger
during bulk last Friday but am I beating a dead horse with this pack? Can it be
recovered? Do you believe that charging with 12amps instead of 24 could be the cause
of this? Is charging to completion twice a day reducing the life of the batteries?
When I bought the Tropica, the 72v pack had 2v volts across it. I brought it back to
life and was getting near 20 miles range. I kept that pack for 9 months. You may
remember helping me with a Dv/Dt algorithm for that charger. This pack has only 7
months on it. I want to make sure I don't kill a pack every 7-9 months!
thanks for you advice,
Steve
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi Joe,
Consider yourself lucky, the file that was with this contained a virus and
you are far better off not having got it.
Garry Stanley
Cable.net.nz
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
The March meeting of the North Bay Chapter of the
Electric Auto Association will be held on Saturday
March 13th from 10am - 12 noon at Thunderstruck Motors,
3200 Dutton Ave., Suite #220, Santa Rosa, CA 95407.
Our featured speakers will be Steve Muskarelli and
Brian Hall. Steve will be discussing the Eilean/G2
Project - a novel, personal commuter vehicle which
is currently in pre-production, prototype form and
just a step or two away from being mass-produced.
The G2 is a front wheel drive, recumbent motorized
bicycle/experimental electric vehicle which quickly
and silently accelerates to legal top speeds of
30-35mph. The design is commonly referred to as
"a leaner", meaning the G2 has two independently
suspended rear struts which allow confidence in the
tightest of corners.
Brian Hall will be talking about drag racing EVs and
his recent experiences with his electric motorcycle
racing against those noisy gassers! Brian's shop can
accommodate just about any charging requirement,
using his new public Avcon unit, a 14-50 and various
other 220V and 110V receptacles which will be
available, so bring your EV!
Location:
Thunderstruck Motors, 3200 Dutton Ave., Suite #220,
Santa Rosa, CA 95407.
Date: 13th March from 10am-12 noon
Contacts: Steve Muskarelli
Phone: (707) 829 0565
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Website: http://www.evolvemotorworks.com/
Brian Hall
Phone/fax: (707) 575 0353
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Website: http://www.thunderstruck-ev.com
Driving directions:
Heading South on 101:
Take Hearn Ave. exit in Santa Rosa and head West.
Immediately take a left onto Corby, passing the auto
dealers.
Corby turns right and becomes Bellevue.
Turn a left onto Dutton at the crossroads.
3200 is on the left hand side after approx. 300 yards.
Heading North on 101:
Take Todd Road exit in Santa Rosa and head West.
Take a right onto Standish which becomes Dutton.
3200 is on the right hand side approx. 400 yards
after crossing W Robles Ave.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi, Steve. I have US125's too, and like you, I have no hope of getting to
much more than about 12 amps into the pack using my BC-20 charger. In fact,
if I want to keep cords from melting and breakers from popping, I need to
keep the battery amps under 10. At home, I can crank it up a little more
(until things get hot, anyway - molded on plugs on the extension cord are
the worst) because that outlet is a 30 amp circuit.
I've had excellent results so far, though. The vehicle (about 3400 lb.,
114V pack, curtis 400 amp controller) has been very lightly used, but still
has to travel 10 miles over a hilly route to get to town (and travels the
same route back, of course). This includes several 250 amp hills and one
350 amp hill.
I do not charge to the USB specs, however. I believe that their recommended
voltage cap, while assuring a full charge, is too high. I charge to a
voltage cap defined as the upper limit by that "other" battery manufacturer.
USB defines the same number as only a float charge.
I also tend to listen to the batteries, and shut the charger off when they
are all bubbling lightly. I equalize occasionally, but usually the
batteries stay in very good balance. I water the cells individually. While
driving, I keep the voltage above 100V, which is not very hard to do, as the
pack is still stiff under load. It is about 1 3/4 years old.
What you describe sounds like symptoms of premature aging on the part of
some batteries, more than anything. Could this be caused by overcharging?
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2004 3:10 PM
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: battery trouble
>
> I sent the email below to Nawaz about the batteries in my Tropica. Since
> then I've got a failed battery with a reversed cell so now I have to do
> something. I'm planning on replacing 5 of the 12 on Saturday. Is that a
> dumb thing to do? I know it's better to swap out the whole pack but I
> can't do that every time something fails. I'd sure like to know what
> caused this. The story I'm getting from US Battery is that I was charging
> with 12 amps and that's not high enough. Am I the only one charging US125s
> at 12amps? Any advise is appreciated.
>
> email to Nawaz...
>
> My 12 US 125s were installed in June of last year. Most days, I drive 13
> miles to work, charge, drive home and charge again. My charger puts out
> 12amps. It takes about 4 hours to complete the bulk charge after my
> commute as a reference point. The Tropica has 2 Curtis 1209B controllers
> which are 400amps each. Three times last summer I've taken the car 30-35
> miles on a charge. The whole time I was watching that my voltage didn't
> drop below 65 for more than 2 or 3 seconds. I have had trouble with my
> Flow-Rite watering system and I have had cells over water a number of
> times. My solution to the over water is to distribute the acid from the
> overwatered cell to adjacent cells.
>
> Last November, my charger didn't terminate a couple of times and now it
> won't at all. November is when the temp started to drop here. We were
> getting 40 degree F nights. About 5 of the batteries will come up to 7.75v
> and 3 won't come up above 7.0 with the 12amps. I can get them up higher
> with additional current. I've tried equalizing but so far it hasn't
> helped. When I measured the SG, I did draw up some black or gray
> particles. It's now difficult to accelerate from a stop without the
> voltage dropping below 63v. They also seem to self discharge quickly
> although it's difficult to tell if they've really been fully charged. Two
> of the batteries are also getting hot, 50 degrees C, during charging. The
> temp is very different from the top to the bottom of the battery with the
> bottom being at 50.
>
> I understand that these batteries should be charged at c/10 but I didn't
> realize that using lower current could cause a problem. I've started
> running a second charger during bulk last Friday but am I beating a dead
> horse with this pack? Can it be recovered? Do you believe that charging
> with 12amps instead of 24 could be the cause of this? Is charging to
> completion twice a day reducing the life of the batteries? When I bought
> the Tropica, the 72v pack had 2v volts across it. I brought it back to
> life and was getting near 20 miles range. I kept that pack for 9 months.
> You may remember helping me with a Dv/Dt algorithm for that charger. This
> pack has only 7 months on it. I want to make sure I don't kill a pack
> every 7-9 months!
>
> thanks for you advice,
> Steve
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I am a little confused. I spoek with a Zivan retialer and he mentioned
that they (meaning the retailer) can program different profiles for the
charger - I was wondering if that an IC algorithm could be programmed as
well. This would greatly increase battery life!
Don
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Jim Coate
Sent: March 9, 2004 9:37 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Modify Zivian NG3 for Current Interupt Algorithm
How do you define "can"?
Somewhere out there is an engineer who made the thing and could
undoubtedly make a custom eprom to produce this profile, or at least the
15/20 duty cycle. The 3 Ahr overcharge can't be determined as the Zivan
has no Ahr counter.
But... as owner/end-user of a Zivan you can't program that in. In fact,
you can't really make many changes at all.
Don Cameron wrote:
> ... I was wondering, since the Zivan NG3 charger can
> be programmed, can it be programmed to apply a constant current charge
> to 100% charge, then repeating a cycle of charge for 15 seconds, then
> rest for 20 seconds, until a 3 Ah overcharge was provided?
>
_________
Jim Coate
1970's Elec-Trak
1992 Chevy S-10 BEV
1997 Chevy S-10 NGV
http://www.eeevee.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
David,
Thanks for the reply. How long would you estimate you're at 250 or 350 amps? While I'm
crusing on the freeway I'm at 160 amps. I did have one person from US tell me that
they were overcharged. The charger is setup with their algorithm however.
Steve
In a message dated 3/10/2004 4:29:28 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
>
>
> Hi, Steve. I have US125's too, and like you, I have no hope of getting to
> much more than about 12 amps into the pack using my BC-20 charger. In fact,
> if I want to keep cords from melting and breakers from popping, I need to
> keep the battery amps under 10. At home, I can crank it up a little more
> (until things get hot, anyway - molded on plugs on the extension cord are
> the worst) because that outlet is a 30 amp circuit.
>
> I've had excellent results so far, though. The vehicle (about 3400 lb.,
> 114V pack, curtis 400 amp controller) has been very lightly used, but still
> has to travel 10 miles over a hilly route to get to town (and travels the
> same route back, of course). This includes several 250 amp hills and one
> 350 amp hill.
>
> I do not charge to the USB specs, however. I believe that their recommended
> voltage cap, while assuring a full charge, is too high. I charge to a
> voltage cap defined as the upper limit by that "other" battery manufacturer.
> USB defines the same number as only a float charge.
>
> I also tend to listen to the batteries, and shut the charger off when they
> are all bubbling lightly. I equalize occasionally, but usually the
> batteries stay in very good balance. I water the cells individually. While
> driving, I keep the voltage above 100V, which is not very hard to do, as the
> pack is still stiff under load. It is about 1 3/4 years old.
>
> What you describe sounds like symptoms of premature aging on the part of
> some batteries, more than anything. Could this be caused by overcharging?
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2004 3:10 PM
> > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > Subject: battery trouble
> >
> > I sent the email below to Nawaz about the batteries in my Tropica. Since
> > then I've got a failed battery with a reversed cell so now I have to do
> > something. I'm planning on replacing 5 of the 12 on Saturday. Is that a
> > dumb thing to do? I know it's better to swap out the whole pack but I
> > can't do that every time something fails. I'd sure like to know what
> > caused this. The story I'm getting from US Battery is that I was charging
> > with 12 amps and that's not high enough. Am I the only one charging US125s
> > at 12amps? Any advise is appreciated.
> >
> > email to Nawaz...
> >
> > My 12 US 125s were installed in June of last year. Most days, I drive 13
> > miles to work, charge, drive home and charge again. My charger puts out
> > 12amps. It takes about 4 hours to complete the bulk charge after my
> > commute as a reference point. The Tropica has 2 Curtis 1209B controllers
> > which are 400amps each. Three times last summer I've taken the car 30-35
> > miles on a charge. The whole time I was watching that my voltage didn't
> > drop below 65 for more than 2 or 3 seconds. I have had trouble with my
> > Flow-Rite watering system and I have had cells over water a number of
> > times. My solution to the over water is to distribute the acid from the
> > overwatered cell to adjacent cells.
> >
> > Last November, my charger didn't terminate a couple of times and now it
> > won't at all. November is when the temp started to drop here. We were
> > getting 40 degree F nights. About 5 of the batteries will come up to 7.75v
> > and 3 won't come up above 7.0 with the 12amps. I can get them up higher
> > with additional current. I've tried equalizing but so far it hasn't
> > helped. When I measured the SG, I did draw up some black or gray
> > particles. It's now difficult to accelerate from a stop without the
> > voltage dropping below 63v. They also seem to self discharge quickly
> > although it's difficult to tell if they've really been fully charged. Two
> > of the batteries are also getting hot, 50 degrees C, during charging. The
> > temp is very different from the top to the bottom of the battery with the
> > bottom being at 50.
> >
> > I understand that these batteries should be charged at c/10 but I didn't
> > realize that using lower current could cause a problem. I've started
> > running a second charger during bulk last Friday but am I beating a dead
> > horse with this pack? Can it be recovered? Do you believe that charging
> > with 12amps instead of 24 could be the cause of this? Is charging to
> > completion twice a day reducing the life of the batteries? When I bought
> > the Tropica, the 72v pack had 2v volts across it. I brought it back to
> > life and was getting near 20 miles range. I kept that pack for 9 months.
> > You may remember helping me with a Dv/Dt algorithm for that charger. This
> > pack has only 7 months on it. I want to make sure I don't
> kill a pack
> > every 7-9 months!
> >
> > thanks for you advice,
> > Steve
--- End Message ---
