EV Digest 3403
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) Re: Catapiller DC Electric Motor
by James Massey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) Trex,orbitals,questions
by Jeff Shanab <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) Siemens motors on ebay
by Jeff Shanab <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) Donor Car Recommendation?
by Andrew in Ann Arbor <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) Re: Siemens motors on ebay
by Victor Tikhonov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) Re: Donor Car Recommendation
by Mike Chancey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7) Re: Donor Car Recommendation
by Seth <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8) RE: Siemens motors on ebay
by "Don Cameron" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
9) Re: Catapiller DC Electric Motor
by John Wayland <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) Re: Donor Car Recommendation
by "Tim Clevenger" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
11) Re: Donor Car Recommendation
by "Dean Thompson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
12) Re: fun with powerwheels 2...
by "Joe Smalley" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13) Re: Fast charging
by Reverend Gadget <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
14) RE: Brown Power
by "Mark Fowler" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
15) Re: Siemens motors on ebay
by Reverend Gadget <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16) Re: Siemens motors on ebay
by Otmar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
17) Re: Siemens motors on ebay
by "Peter Eckhoff" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
18) Re: Siemens motors on ebay
by Seth <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
19) EV anticipation
by Seth <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
20) US145 report (was battery trouble)
by "Scott Davis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
21) Re: Siemens motors on ebay
by Shawn Rutledge <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
22) schabmuller vs Advanced DC
by Jeff Shanab <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
23) Re: Siemens motors on ebay - A control
by Rod Hower <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
24) Re: fun with powerwheels 2...
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
25) stolen
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
26) Re: fun with powerwheels 2...
by "Mark Thomasson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
27) Re: Siemens motors on ebay
by Peter VanDerWal <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
28) Re: fun with powerwheels 2...
by "Mark Thomasson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
29) Re: Fast charging
by Rich Rudman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
30) Re: Siemens motors on ebay
by Rich Rudman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
31) Re: Siemens motors on ebay
by Rich Rudman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
32) Re: battery trouble
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
33) Re: Siemens motors on ebay
by Otmar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
34) Re: schabmuller vs Advanced DC
by "Tom Shay" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
35) Re: Siemens motors on ebay
by Reverend Gadget <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--- Begin Message ---
At 09:34 AM 12/03/04 -0500, you wrote:
I got an e mail for sombody who wanted to know about useing a Catapiller DC
Electric Motor, 10 Horse power,Working Volts 36 - 48 volts. 1550-2180 RPM's
For Electric Lift Truck, Catapiller Part # 97E2010040,This is a Gereral
Electric Motor, GE # 97E20-10040, model # 5BT1335B007A, New Catapiller
dealer Price,$1250.00, with a $1600.00 core charge,Size of motor, 13.0"
long, X 11.0" dia. X (90.0 lbs),motor will except .750 O.D. 12 spline shaft.
They don't have a lot of money and can get this pretty cheep , would this
compare to a 6.7 adc , the spline shaft I would think would be a problem .
There looking for somthing to go 45mph , in a light car. I'll forward the
info on , thanks .
steve clunn
Aack! 6.7"! I doubt it, more like a 9"! The thing they need to look for on
the nameplate is to be sure that the 10hp rating is continuous, not 15 min.
if 15 min, then it'd be the hydraulic motor, designed for high tourque
short duty time. If continuous then run it from 120V, add an external
blower and they'll be fine.
The difference is that this is likely to be heavier than a 9", and lower
peak current, and they may need to get thr rotor balance checked and run it
to 5000RPM. And use a Z1K, so they can keep the motor parameters under control.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I wish I was ready to buy batteries with you guys, but I am just getting
started on my first conversion, so I don't know enough info yet.
hopefully ready this summer.
What is wrong with the t-rex controller? would it be a good controller
for a first EV? And how much do you want, seth?
will it smoke the tires? :-)
I was hoping to buy 16 to 20 batteries, but don't know what is gonna
fit. (1987 300zx)
looking at netgain warp9 as motor
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
hey victor, look!
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=46098&item=2466585654
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
>I am still hunting for my donor car. I want to use a small light, car
>2dr hatchback with enough room for a 6'2" driver. Max 2 passengers.
How about a 70's SAAB 99?
I had a '72 and a '74. The hatchback was introduced in '76 or '78.
Not the lightest at 1150 Kg curb weight but real heavy duty sheet metal.
Take out the rear seat and you could probably get all your batteries
between the rear axle and the front seats.
The engine is mounted longitudinally and sits on to of the transmission.
Good for tall people (I'm 6'4").
--
Andrew in Ann Arbor
technology is the answer, what was the question?
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Jeff Shanab wrote:
hey victor, look!
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=46098&item=2466585654
This is high torque version of 1PV5133 motor from 312A67 system
Ballard install (use to :-( ) in Ford Ranger EVs. Siemens
designed and manufactured the motor, Ballard designed and
manufactured - custom front flange/ integrated housing gear box,
and Ford proudly labeled whole thing as "Ford" without contributing
anything technical.
Whoever buys it is going to have lot of fun with this shaft
integrated with the gear:
http://www.mavin.com/pictures/ford_ev_motor_1_5.jpg
Excellent motor for an EV though.
Some more info on this:
http://www.metricmind.com/misc/ballard_a312v67.pdf
--
Victor
'91 ACRX - something different
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hey Don, how about a Civic? Good room, and a family of similar models to
share parts from.
Thanks,
Mike Chancey,
'88 Civic EV
'95 Solectria Force (almost there)
Kansas City, Missouri
EV List Photo Album at: http://evalbum.com
My Electric Car at: http://www.geocities.com/electric_honda
Mid-America EAA chapter at: http://maeaa.org
Join the EV List at: http://www.madkatz.com/ev/evlist.html
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
VW golf MKII (85-92) is common and pretty light. Not like a Metro, but
you can haul more batteries and adapters are common.
Seth
On Mar 12, 2004, at 1:11 PM, Don Cameron wrote:
I am still hunting for my donor car. I want to use a small light, car
2dr hatchback with enough room for a 6'2" driver. Max 2 passengers. I
have been looking at Geo Metros, Fireflys and Swifts (1995 and better)
however the payload is not all that good. The Mazda 323 payload looks
better. Anybody have any other suggestions or recommendations?
thanks
Don
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
You have to wonder if it is easy to match the helical splined shaft to a
transmission. Price is not too bad though.
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Jeff Shanab
Sent: March 12, 2004 4:08 PM
To: EVlist
Subject: Siemens motors on ebay
hey victor, look!
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=46098&;
item=2466585654
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hello to All,
As the resident forklift repair dude, I'll step in on this.
1sclunn wrote:
> ....sombody who wanted to know about useing a Catapiller DC
> Electric Motor, 10 Horse power,Working Volts 36 - 48 volts. 1550-2180 RPM's
> For Electric Lift Truck....Size of motor, 13.0"
> long, X 11.0" dia. X (90.0 lbs)....would this
> compare to a 6.7 adc?
>From James Massey:
>Aack! 6.7"! I doubt it, more like a 9"!
I agree with James.
>The thing they need to look for on
>the nameplate is to be sure that the 10hp rating is continuous, not 15 min.
James, forklift motors are all rated at the expected 'continuous duty', so this motor
can
run at 10 hp, virtually, all day long if necessary.
>if 15 min, then it'd be the hydraulic motor, designed for high torque
>short duty time.
Correction (friendly, of course)....hydraulic motors as used in forklifts, are by no
means, considered intermittent duty, and in fact, are most often even more robust and
able
to run non-stop, than are the traction motors in the drive units. I see electric
forklifts
in operation every day, and trust me, some of my accounts have those pump motors
running
continuously.....reach in (hydraulic pump on)....secure load and lift (hydraulic pump
on)...raise up (1000's of lbs....hydraulic pump on)....lower load, reach back
(hydraulic
pump on)...lower forks (hydraulic pump still on, though light load)...then,
repeat....hours and hours at a time!
1sclunn wrote:
> The difference is that this is likely to be heavier than a 9", and lower
> peak current, and they may need to get the rotor balance checked and run it
> to 5000RPM.
I'm a bit confused. I thought the motor is 90 lbs.? If it is, that sure sounds light
from
what I've seen in the Cat brand lift trucks I service. The 11 inch motors weigh more
like
175 lbs., or about 30 'more' lbs. than a 9 inch.
> They're looking for somthing to go 45mph , in a light car.
Pretty much all forklift traction motors are very robust, and are timed at neutral for
max
torque. If you take that Cat motor and advance the timing, it should be good for higher
voltage operation. They are wound with fewer turns of wire than our EV specific
motors, so
at voltages over 100 or so, they'd really suck some amps! At 96V though, and with the
timing set properly, this motor would made a nice EV drive motor.
>And use a Z1K, so they can keep the motor parameters under control.
Heck, I'd use a Zilla just because it's the best controller made, period!
See Ya.......John Wayland
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
As far as donors go, stay away from the Metro/Firefly/Swift. Poor build
quality
all around, especially the brakes, transmission and suspension. Parts are
very
expensive.
The Ghia is a great idea, and my preferred vehicle. Parts are pretty cheap,
and with the exception of some small pieces (window rubber, etc.), still
available.
If you're looking for the most options, the Civic is probably the best bet.
They have everything for them, including custom suspension bits, tranny
swap kits, carbon fiber body lightening kits, brake upgrade kits,
ready-built
race cages, etc.
Whoa, free adapter plans, Bill? Does anybody have those available, or maybe
a CNC file I can send to a machine shop to be done? $400-600 is an awful
lot to swallow for a machined piece of metal. In fact, I would have to
choose
my donor based on a cheap/free adapter plate.
Tim
-----------
Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 15:52:12 -0700
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
From: "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Donor Car Recommendation
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed
At 11:11 AM 3/12/04, you wrote:
>I am still hunting for my donor car. I want to use a small light, car
>2dr hatchback with enough room for a 6'2" driver. Max 2 passengers. I
>have been looking at Geo Metros, Fireflys and Swifts (1995 and better)
>however the payload is not all that good. The Mazda 323 payload looks
>better. Anybody have any other suggestions or recommendations?
>
Whatever you do, DO NOT buy a "fixer upper". Buy a car that you
would be proud to drive in the condition that it is in. You will spend much
more money restoring a crappy car to acceptable condition than you would
spend simply buying a nice car to begin with. This is true even if you do
all the work yourself!
Of course, a blown engine is perfectly acceptable.
Even though body, bumper, and trim parts are expensive and hard
to
find, my favorite car to convert is a VW Karmann Ghia. You need to find one
that is in near pristine condition. This will cost about $4,000. Like:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=15293&item=2462567902
There are several things that make a Ghia a great conversion.
They
have a low drag coefficient. They are lightweight. The suspension is very
rugged, inexpensive to "soup up", and can easily handle the extra weight of
the batteries. Adapter plates and couplers are easy to find, as are the
plans for adapter plates and couplers. There is plenty of room for a
typical battery pack. Mechanical parts (like brakes, ball joints,
transmissions, etc) are very inexpensive and easy to find.
My second choice is a Porshe 914. The disadvantage of the 914 is
that the mechanical parts are significantly more expensive than a Ghia.
The best W-hr/mile figure I have ever heard of in a home built
was
John Bryan's Ghia. I believe the number was 135 W-hrs/mile (or something
near that) in mixed highway and city driving. For comparison, my Wabbit
(VW Cabriolet) best numbers never get below 212 W-hr/mile.
_________________________________________________________________
Get business advice and resources to improve your work life, from bCentral.
http://special.msn.com/bcentral/loudclear.armx
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Don Cameron wrote:
> I am still hunting for my donor car. I want to use a small light, car
> 2dr hatchback with enough room for a 6'2" driver. Max 2 passengers. I
> have been looking at Geo Metros, Fireflys and Swifts (1995 and better)
> however the payload is not all that good. The Mazda 323 payload looks
> better. Anybody have any other suggestions or recommendations?
What about a Honda (Acura) Integra? How come there doesn't seem to be any
conversions of these? I have a 1990 model that I hope to convert one day,
trouble is the damn ICE won't wear out! In fact nothing on it seems to wear
out, everything still works fine after 230,000 km. I'm not over 6' but I
have friends who are and have driven it without problems. Newer models have
more headroom. I think it would make a great conversion, but I must admit I
am not sure what to look for in a donor car either...
Dean
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
That is one of the simplest circuits I have seen. It is worth considering.
The jeep has no brakes right now. To stop on a hill requires throwing it in
reverse and stabbing the foot switch to jerk it to a stop. I want to install
brakes on it and I don't want to lose reverse. I might try Lee's two switch
circuit before I get all the pieces to make the dynamic braking, reversing,
two speed transition.
I was thinking about putting four buttons on the floor to run four DPDT
contactors (no diodes needed.)
1 to go fast (24 Volt contactor)
2 to go slow (12 Volt contactor)
3 to reverse (Reverse connection to the PM motor contactor)
4 to stop (disconnect battery and short the PM motor contactor)
To go really fast (36 Volts), press buttons 1 & 2.
To go in reverse, press buttons 2 & 3.
To stop press button 4
I could make pressing button 3 lock out button 1 so reverse can only be run
at 12 volts.
Joe Smalley
Rural Kitsap County WA
Fiesta 48 volts
NEDRA 48 volt street conversion record holder
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mark Thomasson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Friday, March 12, 2004 2:28 PM
Subject: Re: fun with powerwheels 2...
>
> Joe, Here is a three speed contactor controller design from Lee Hart
using
> 3 12v batteries and two contactors. I used this successfully on a
minibike
> with an 6.7" ADC and 55 Ahr batteries.
> http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/439.html (Note: photo shows original 1 HP
> motor)
>
> View as fixed width font.
>
> ____
> / \
> / \ \
> _____| Motor |____ \__
> | \ / |
> | \____/ Safety |
> | Disconnect |
> | |
> | |
> | | | |
> | ---||||------------|
> | | | | |
> | | 24v |
> | | ---
> | |---------||---| /\ D2
> | | |
> | R2 | |
> | | | |
> | ----||-------------|
> | | | |
> | | 12v ---
> | | /\ D1
> | |---------||---| |
> | | |
> | R1 | |
> |------------------------|
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Switch logic Batteries
> In use
> Speed R1 R2 Volts 12v 24v disconnect
> 0 0 x
> 1 x 12 x x
> 2 x 24 x x
> 3 x x 36 x x x
>
>
> Charging: each battery separately
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
> Set them all up in series for the most voltage you
> dare.
> 240 would be nice.
> Target pack voltage??
The pack voltage will be between 240 and 300 volts
depending on the type of traction motor I pick. I'm
torn between ac induction and ac synchronous.
Gadget
> --
> Rich Rudman
> Manzanita Micro
> www.manzanitamicro.com
> 1-360-297-7383,Cell 1-360-620-6266
>
=====
visit my website at www.reverendgadget.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Kinda gives a new meaning to "dump charging"
Mark
(sorry :-)
-----Original Message-----
From: Lawrence Rhodes [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, 12 March 2004 2:56 PM
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List
Subject: OT: Brown Power
2.
SAME #$%@, DIFFERENT USE
Scientists Turn Excrement Into Electricity -- Really
Scientists in the U.S. have developed a method to convert raw human
waste -- or as the scientists call it, "number two" -- into
electricity, putting a brown spin on the green-power movement.
A brown power movement so to speak. The process works by feeding the
... material ... into a microbial fuel cell (MFC) that uses bacteria to
break it down -- much as the human body does -- but diverts the
resulting electrons, which would normally power respiratory reactions
in the bacteria, into a power generator. Even better, harmful organic
matter is broken down in the process, so the MFC can serve as a
kind of sewage treatment plant. The technology promises extraordinary
benefits, particularly to developing nations that desperately need both
sewage treatment and inexpensive energy. But, says microbiologist
Derek Lovley, large-scale use is a ways off: "One way to think of this
technology is that it is currently at the state of development that
solar
power was 20 to 30 years ago -- the principle has been shown, but
there is a lot of work to do before this is widely used."
straight to the source: New Scientist, Celeste Biever, 10 Mar 2004
<http://www.gristmagazine.com/cgi-bin/forward.pl?forward_id=2140>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
this is the same guy I met at EVS-20. I don't think he
has sold a single one yet. I think he's got 161 of
them. The big problem is the output shaft. what do you
do with that? and what do you use as a controller?
Gadget
--- Jeff Shanab <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> hey victor, look!
>
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=46098&item=2466585654
>
=====
visit my website at www.reverendgadget.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
At 4:07 PM -0800 3-12-04, Jeff Shanab wrote:
hey victor, look!
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=46098&item=2466585654
Is it just me, or does anyone else think his price ten times too high?
As a base I think it would be worth about $50 for scrap metal.
Considering it doesn't have an inverter and you need to adapt to a
terrible shaft I think they are worth about $200 each for EV use. I
don't see any other market. I'm guessing these resellers are looking
for a lot of profit, I doubt a informed person would pay much over
scrap value for them.
Just my 2 watt hours.
--
-Otmar-
http://www.evcl.com/914 My electric 914
http://www.CafeElectric.com/ Zilla controllers in production, see them here.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
How easy (or difficult) would it be to replace the shaft with a regular
shaft from Siemens?
----- Original Message -----
From: "Otmar" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2004 4:51 AM
Subject: Re: Siemens motors on ebay
> At 4:07 PM -0800 3-12-04, Jeff Shanab wrote:
> >hey victor, look!
>
>http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=46098&ite
m=2466585654
>
>
> Is it just me, or does anyone else think his price ten times too high?
>
> As a base I think it would be worth about $50 for scrap metal.
>
> Considering it doesn't have an inverter and you need to adapt to a
> terrible shaft I think they are worth about $200 each for EV use. I
> don't see any other market. I'm guessing these resellers are looking
> for a lot of profit, I doubt a informed person would pay much over
> scrap value for them.
>
> Just my 2 watt hours.
> --
> -Otmar-
>
> http://www.evcl.com/914 My electric 914
> http://www.CafeElectric.com/ Zilla controllers in production, see them
here.
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I agree. Look at what the solectria motors went for and they had a
mating transaxle up for bid and inverter, too.
Seth
On Mar 13, 2004, at 4:51 AM, Otmar wrote:
At 4:07 PM -0800 3-12-04, Jeff Shanab wrote:
hey victor, look!
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?
ViewItem&category=46098&item=2466585654
Is it just me, or does anyone else think his price ten times too high?
As a base I think it would be worth about $50 for scrap metal.
Considering it doesn't have an inverter and you need to adapt to a
terrible shaft I think they are worth about $200 each for EV use. I
don't see any other market. I'm guessing these resellers are looking
for a lot of profit, I doubt a informed person would pay much over
scrap value for them.
Just my 2 watt hours.
--
-Otmar-
http://www.evcl.com/914 My electric 914
http://www.CafeElectric.com/ Zilla controllers in production, see
them here.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Going to meet my new (to me) road EV today.
I am buying the VW Rabbit EV that Mark Hastings got a year or so ago.
The one that had a battery EVent in Delaware.
Right now it has 72V and a 6.7" motor. I am going to use it as a
station car for now. And a test bed.
Bob Rice graciously offered to haul it up to my work from Connecticut
today. Then if the schedule permits, off to the local EAA meeting.
Long term plans:
NiCads, (got 'em) 240V or more
AC drive. either permanent magnet or induction (don't have it yet)
Ginning...
Seth Allen
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hello all
FWIW, I had US145's in my (former) electrica, and had very good results with them. I
followed USB's charging guidelines with respect to final voltage, using my PFC20BE.
Half of the charging (~80 cycles under my use) was at C/20, the other half at C/10.
Figure that USB knows their product pretty well.
Range took ~30 cycles to get from new, but I could easily do 60 miles and have charge
left over. When I delivered the car to the new owner last weekend, it was a 62.1 mile
trip, including a hill at the end of the trip that was 4.5 mile continuous 6% grade!
Car made it, no issues with 25% SOC left.
I am (was?) really happy with the US145s, would highly reccommend them to anyone
thinking of flooded lead acid.
Scott
---------- Original Message ----------------------------------
From: "Mark Brueggemann" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 23:23:11 -0700
>From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>Subject: battery trouble
>
>Steve, and all;
>
>I wonder how closely you're following USB's recommended charge
>profile. I just replaced my year old set of USB's with a new set of
>T105's. The USB's had never delivered the expected range when new,
>and after about 8 months started to show signs of degradation. At
>the 12 month point they showed serious signs of sulfation and paste
>shedding, and range was down to less than 10 miles. Water use,
>voltage and current levels all seemed normal during charging, even as
>my range was evaporating. Emails to Nawaz revealed that the charge
>algorithm for USB's is quite different than what Trojans require, so
>much so that my charger (the FrankenLester) is not capable of
>delivering it. The USB's require a much higher finish charge
>voltage, and a much longer absorption phase time, a charge cycle that
>would cook Trojan's. I wish I would've known that before I bought
>the USB's. When I mentioned this to Nawaz he said that they
>typically qualify/approve a customer's charger before deploying USB's
>into customer fleets. For me it doesn't make economic sense to buy a
>new charger just to support a different brand of battery. My EV is a
>daily driver and must earn it's keep in overall TCO. In the past I
>have always had good service from Trojan batteries, so I went back to
>what I know will work in my EV. Can't say I'm mad at Nawaz or USB,
>I'm the one that wrecked them but wanted to post this as a heads up
>to anyone currently using or considering a USB pack. I've been off
>the EVDL for a while but thought I'd poke my nose in here and see
>what's going on, I see a lot of familiar names still here.
>
>Regards,
>
>Mark Brueggemann
>Albuquerque, NM
>S-10 EV
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On Sat, Mar 13, 2004 at 01:51:29AM -0800, Otmar wrote:
> Is it just me, or does anyone else think his price ten times too high?
Yep. Check out his other auctions; it's all overpriced. Hundreds
of CueCats at "bulk" prices that are higher than other sellers'
individual prices. Etc. He probably got them really cheap at an
auction somewhere with the idea of getting rich.
--
_______ Shawn T. Rutledge
(_ | |_) [EMAIL PROTECTED] * http://ecloud.org:8080
__) | | \________________________________________________________________
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Anyone know about the schabmuller 10" motor? as it compares to Advanced
DC 9"
if this price is still good, it might be a choice for my 300zx conversion
http://www.thunderstruck-ev.com/shabmuller.htm
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Control?
You could try
http://www.fluxvector.com/
Contact Information
email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Electric MotorSports Phone: 513-851-3748
2072 Greenpine Drive
Fax: 775-201-1362
Cincinnati, Ohio 45231
Bob's drives were used in many of the Formula
Lightning cars that were raced several years ago.
He also has some controls at Walt Disney on their
tram and one of their rides.
Rod
--- Reverend Gadget <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> this is the same guy I met at EVS-20. I don't think
> he
> has sold a single one yet. I think he's got 161 of
> them. The big problem is the output shaft. what do
> you
> do with that? and what do you use as a controller?
>
> Gadget
> --- Jeff Shanab <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > hey victor, look!
> >
>
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=46098&item=2466585654
> >
>
>
> =====
> visit my website at www.reverendgadget.com
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Joe Smalley wrote:
> The jeep has no brakes right now. To stop on a hill requires throwing
> it in reverse and stabbing the foot switch to jerk it to a stop.
The Powerwheels Jeeps usually arrange the switches to short the motors
when all switches are off. This a pretty crude, but it works. It brings
it to a stop fairly quickly on level ground, but won't stop it going
downhill (it keeps slowly creeping down).
On my son's EV minibike, I installed two switches, one on each
handlebar. The 'brake' switch turns off power and shorts the motor. The
'throttle' switch just applies full 12v to the motor. This too is a bit
too jerky; I have a small Petrosonics controller I want to add. The plan
is to have the throttle switch activate an RC network to ramp up motor
speed (and releasing it would ramp it back down). For brakes, I'm
scheming at ways to add a real mechanical brake.
--
"Never doubt that a small group of committed people can change the
world. Indeed, it's the only thing that ever has!" -- Margaret Meade
--
Lee A. Hart 814 8th Ave N Sartell MN 56377 leeahart_at_earthlink.net
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
you try to steal
* LP8.2: HTML/Attachments detected, removed from message *
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Joe, I think your plan will work. You could get by with SPDT for the
voltage control contactors, instead of DPDT:
view as fixed width font.
> _______
> | | K2
> +__|__ NC O ___________to motor +
> 24v ___ / COM
> | NO O/
> |_______|_________
> |
> _______ |
> | | K1 |
> +__|__ NO O _______|
> 12V ___ / COM
> | NC O/
> |_______|
> |
> O Main Contactor
> /
> O/
> |____________to motor -
> (diagram provided by Lee Hart)
Also note: You get regenerative braking with no additional components.
When you are cruising at the 36v speed, switch to the 24v batteries and you
regen down to the 24v speed. Switch to the 12v battery and regen down to
the 12v speed. This system worked well on the minibike while it had the PM
motor. Does not work with a series motor. With a series motor, all it
does is coast down to the lower speed. Mark T.
> dynamic braking, reversing, two speed transition.
>
> I was thinking about putting four buttons on the floor to run four DPDT
> contactors (no diodes needed.)
>
> 1 to go fast (24 Volt contactor)
> 2 to go slow (12 Volt contactor)
> 3 to reverse (Reverse connection to the PM motor contactor)
> 4 to stop (disconnect battery and short the PM motor contactor)
>
> To go really fast (36 Volts), press buttons 1 & 2.
> To go in reverse, press buttons 2 & 3.
> To stop press button 4
>
> I could make pressing button 3 lock out button 1 so reverse can only be
run
> at 12 volts.
>
> Joe Smalley
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On Sat, 2004-03-13 at 05:01, Seth wrote:
> I agree. Look at what the solectria motors went for and they had a
> mating transaxle up for bid and inverter, too.
Yup, I bought a motor, inverter, transmission, charger, and DC-DC with
shipping for less than his opening bid.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
The problem with the world is stupidity. Not saying there should be a
capital punishment for stupidity, but why don't we just take the
safety labels off of everything and let the problem solve itself?
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Oops, I should state this more clearly. Only the regen part (and dynamic
braking) does not work with the series DC motor. The speed control part
works fine with PM or series DC motors. Mark T.
..................................
> This system worked well on the minibike while it had the PM
> motor. Does not work with a series motor. With a series motor, all it
> does is coast down to the lower speed. Mark T.
>
>
> > dynamic braking, reversing, two speed transition.
...................................
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Reverend Gadget wrote:
>
> > Set them all up in series for the most voltage you
> > dare.
> > 240 would be nice.
> > Target pack voltage??
>
> The pack voltage will be between 240 and 300 volts
> depending on the type of traction motor I pick. I'm
> torn between ac induction and ac synchronous.
>
> Gadget
>
> > --
> > Rich Rudman
> > Manzanita Micro
> > www.manzanitamicro.com
> > 1-360-297-7383,Cell 1-360-620-6266
> >
>
> =====
> visit my website at www.reverendgadget.com
Really?? the higher the output V the more watts we can move.
You can find a 100Kw + BLDC drive????
I was not aware that anyone made such a beast. I could in about a Week.
I have no clues to the motor. The Biggest one I have did 15kw peak and
failed with only 5Kw on for 15 minutes.
Boy I would like to try....
Ok back to a Old T-Rex... a paltry 1000 amps on 96 volts... Sigh, dyno
abuse time. last week was 150 amps lets try for 500 this weekend, the
Raptor, then Zilla2K. What will break first the controller, the old BLEM
Yts, or something on the dyno. I am betting the brushes on the load
motor.... since the motor was never made to run as a Sepex generator.
Once we get some time and good data on the series wound... I should rig
up the old BLDC marine motor and get some real data on it.
Oh boy Lots to do!!
--
Rich Rudman
Manzanita Micro
www.manzanitamicro.com
1-360-297-7383,Cell 1-360-620-6266
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Reverend Gadget wrote:
>
> this is the same guy I met at EVS-20. I don't think he
> has sold a single one yet. I think he's got 161 of
> them. The big problem is the output shaft. what do you
> do with that? and what do you use as a controller?
>
> Gadget
> --- Jeff Shanab <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > hey victor, look!
> >
> http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=46098&item=2466585654
> >
>
> =====
> visit my website at www.reverendgadget.com
Wait for the price to come WAY down.... and have a good machinist cut
the shaft end down to what ever you want.
I auta check this out... since I am always looking for bigger badder,
and water cooled....
--
Rich Rudman
Manzanita Micro
www.manzanitamicro.com
1-360-297-7383,Cell 1-360-620-6266
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Otmar wrote:
>
> At 4:07 PM -0800 3-12-04, Jeff Shanab wrote:
> >hey victor, look!
> >http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=46098&item=2466585654
>
> Is it just me, or does anyone else think his price ten times too high?
>
> As a base I think it would be worth about $50 for scrap metal.
>
> Considering it doesn't have an inverter and you need to adapt to a
> terrible shaft I think they are worth about $200 each for EV use. I
> don't see any other market. I'm guessing these resellers are looking
> for a lot of profit, I doubt a informed person would pay much over
> scrap value for them.
>
> Just my 2 watt hours.
> --
> -Otmar-
>
> http://www.evcl.com/914 My electric 914
> http://www.CafeElectric.com/ Zilla controllers in production, see them here.
Or those of us controller designers that would love to have a test mule.
I just had to use explorer... Yuk Gates stuff!!! to view the motor, and
it is a water cooled motor, and for $200 I would own one right now. $2K
not a chance, that nice buss motor that a scored.. is enough test mule
for me for now.
For 2K$ I would hand my cash to Victor... and have some support, and
design help.
--
Rich Rudman
Manzanita Micro
www.manzanitamicro.com
1-360-297-7383,Cell 1-360-620-6266
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Mark Brueggemann wrote:
> I wonder how closely you're following USB's recommended charge
> profile... Emails to Nawaz revealed that the charge algorithm
> for USB's is quite different than what Trojans require, so
> much so that my charger (the FrankenLester) is not capable of
> delivering it. The USB's require a much higher finish charge
> voltage, and a much longer absorption phase time, a charge cycle that
> would cook Trojan's.
People usually vacillate between two extremes. On the one hand, the
average Joe couldn't care less about charging algorithms. He picks his
charger based on what's cheapest, and pays no attention at all to what
it's doing to his batteries. And, short of outright battricide (severe
overcharging or very deep discharges), the batteries last "reasonably
well".
At the other extreme, you have the "techie" who obsesses over getting
the "perfect" charging algorithm, and requires his charger to rigidly
follow it. His batteries *do* last longer -- but not a lot longer. They
wind up dying anyway from some *other* kind of abuse; very deep
discharges or excessively high currents, etc.
On other words, charging algorithms make a small difference in battery
life, because some other form of abuse will probably kill them anyway.
Golf cart batteries are (of course) mainly used in golf carts. Golf cart
makers won't put up with having different chargers for different brands
of batteries. They use the same (cheap) chargers no matter what. If a
battery manufacturer wants their business, he *has* to sell batteries
that will survive (at least as long as the warranty) what whatever junk
charger the golf cart makers use.
In fact, a strange business model has evolved. A friend in the business
tells me that the golf cart makers generally lease the carts with a set
of batteries. The lease expires about the time the batteries are shot.
The carts are pulled back, and sold without batteries. It is the new
owner's problem to buy new batteries. So, it makes no economic sense for
the cart manufacturer to do anything to extend battery life. Thus, they
don't put any pressure on charger or battery manufacturers to improve
life; just make them 'cheaper, cheaper, cheaper'. Thus, we EVers (who
also use these batteries and chargers) aren't seeing any technological
improvements.
--
"Never doubt that a small group of committed people can change the
world. Indeed, it's the only thing that ever has!" -- Margaret Meade
--
Lee A. Hart 814 8th Ave N Sartell MN 56377 leeahart_at_earthlink.net
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
At 11:38 AM -0800 3-13-04, Rich Rudman wrote:
Or those of us controller designers that would love to have a test mule.
I just had to use explorer... Yuk Gates stuff!!! to view the motor, and
it is a water cooled motor, and for $200 I would own one right now. $2K
not a chance,
Hey Rich,
That's odd, the pictures came up fine using iCab, and Opera too, No
need for gates stuff.
As for motors, you know how it goes, once you've pulled on apart it
just sits around until there is time to build a controller.
I've got some nice water cooled GM EV-1 motors sitting here, one is
even taken apart. You're welcome to check it out next time you visit.
I'm sure I have some pictures around here somewhere if I dig them up.
--
-Otmar-
http://www.evcl.com/914 My electric 914
http://www.CafeElectric.com/ Zilla controllers in production, see them here.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jeff Shanab" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "EVlist" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2004 8:32 AM
Subject: schabmuller vs Advanced DC
> Anyone know about the schabmuller 10" motor? as it compares to Advanced
> DC 9"
>
> if this price is still good, it might be a choice for my 300zx conversion
>
> http://www.thunderstruck-ev.com/shabmuller.htm
>
The web page says this motor weighs 95 lbs which is about two-thirds the
weight of an ADC 9- inch and close to the weight of of an ADC 6.7-inch
motor.
I'd expect its performance to match the 6.7-inch ADC.
The webpage says it has a tapered shaft which could be a serious challenge.
Has
anybody on this list managed to use a tapered shaft motor for an EV?
Tom Shay
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
That output shaft is hollow. not a lot of meat to cut
off. in fact when I say the thing sitting on the table
I was surprised at the thin tube they were calling the
output. I didn't see the other end as they had a plug
in it and it's still not very clear in the picture.
Gadget
--- Rich Rudman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Reverend Gadget wrote:
> >
> > this is the same guy I met at EVS-20. I don't
> think he
> > has sold a single one yet. I think he's got 161 of
> > them. The big problem is the output shaft. what do
> you
> > do with that? and what do you use as a controller?
> >
> > Gadget
> > --- Jeff Shanab <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > hey victor, look!
> > >
> >
>
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=46098&item=2466585654
> > >
> >
> > =====
> > visit my website at www.reverendgadget.com
>
>
> Wait for the price to come WAY down.... and have a
> good machinist cut
> the shaft end down to what ever you want.
>
> I auta check this out... since I am always looking
> for bigger badder,
> and water cooled....
>
>
> --
> Rich Rudman
> Manzanita Micro
> www.manzanitamicro.com
> 1-360-297-7383,Cell 1-360-620-6266
>
=====
visit my website at www.reverendgadget.com
--- End Message ---
