EV Digest 3928
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) Re: currenteliminator.com questions
by Evan Tuer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) Re: currenteliminator.com questions
by "Rich Rudman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) Re: "China plugs into electric vehicles"
by "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) Re: currenteliminator.com questions
by Eric Poulsen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) Re: currenteliminator.com questions
by Roderick Wilde <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) Re: windbike
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
7) Re: Modular Charger
by "Rich Rudman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8) Re: Modular Charger
by "Rich Rudman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
9) Re: currenteliminator.com questions
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
10) Re: Modular Charger
by Eric Poulsen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
11) RE: 200sx 0-60 estimates - a friendly little contest
by "rcboyd" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
12) Are lithiums now an option?
by Dick Farfel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13) Re: windbike
by Neon John <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
14) Re: 200sx 0-60 estimates - a friendly little contest
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
15) Re: windbike
by Sam Uzi <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16) PFC30 GFI breaker
by Rod Hower <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
17) Re: PFC30 GFI breaker
by John Lussmyer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
18) RE: Are lithiums now an option?
by "Mark Fowler" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
19) TAKE IT E.V.
by "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
20) Re: windbike
by "John DeArmond" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
21) Re: PFC30 GFI breaker
by "EAA-contact" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
22) Re: PFC30 GFI breaker
by Edward Ang <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
23) Re: PFC30 GFI breaker
by "Rich Rudman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
24) After a simple voltmeter circuit using LEDs
by "Mark Fowler" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
25) Re: Modular Charger
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
26) Re: Modular Charger
by "David (Battery Boy) Hawkins" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--- Begin Message ---
I see. The crappy content is a vague attempt at making it look like
they have some sort of valid claim to own that domain, still the aim
is to sell it back to the original owner and make it look not worth
challenging legally. This is rather a pathetic attempt though.
On Tue, 23 Nov 2004 09:25:18 -0800, Roderick Wilde <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> When Dennis Berube failed to renew his site it was picked up.
> www.currenteliminator.net is his current URL. I just couldn't
> understand their reasoning for picking it up and putting up false and
> missleading information.
>
> Roderick Wilde
>
>
>
>
> >Looks like an almost automated attempt at domain squatting. There are
> >some individuals and companies who like to buy up domain names of well
> >known brands and companies who've overlooked a permutation of their
> >name, in the hope of making a quick buck. A lot of this kind of thing
> >went out when the dot com bubble burst, but currenteliminator.com was
> >only registered in December last year.. from HONG KONG!
> >
> > | Registrant:
> >| Domain Deluxe
> >| GPO 7628
> >| Central, n/a n/a
> >| Hong Kong
> >|
> >| Registrar: DomainPeople Inc.
> >|
> >| Domain Name: currenteliminator.com
> >| Created on .............Sun Dec 07 14:10:39 2003
> >| Expires on .............Wed Dec 07 14:10:39 2005
> >| Record last updated on .Wed Sep 22 08:11:36 2004
> >| Status .................LOCK
> >|
> >| Administrative Contact:
> >| Domain Deluxe
> >| Domain Deluxe
> >| 16/F Cheung Kong Center
> >| Hong Kong, n/a
> >| n/a, HK
> >| (852)91028527
> >| ()
> >| [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >
> >
> >Let us know how much they want you to pay for it...
> >
> >Bizaarely, someone *else* owns currenteliminator.net but
> >currenteliminator.org is still available.
> >
> >This has happened to the charity I'm involved with as well and it's
> >not very amusing.
> >
> >Good luck
> >Evan
> >
> >
> >
> >On Tue, 23 Nov 2004 08:07:28 -0800, Roderick Wilde
> ><[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >>
> >> Can one of you computer gurus out there explain to me why someone
> >> would put up a site with the subtitle "The top ELECTRIC VEHICLE
> >> resources on the net " and have absolutely nothing to do with EVs.
> >> I'm confused. Is it some kind of scam or way of making money by hits.
> >> Please enlighten me. There doesn't seem to be a way to contact them
> >> and ask them what's this all about.
> >>
> >> Roderick
> >>
> >> --
> >>
> >> Roderick Wilde, President, EV Parts Inc.
> >> Your Online EV Superstore
> >> www.evparts.com
> >> 1-888-EV Parts (387-2787)
> >> Phone: 360-385-7966 Fax: 360-385-7922
> >> P.O. Box 221, 107 Louisa Street
> >> Port Townsend, WA 98368
> >>
> >>
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Yea Dennis Berube had some punks in California swipe his domain a few years
back. They wanted megga bucks to get it back. It's clear that they sold it
to
some other namless money grabber,and are trying to milk bucks and hits, and
are really clueless to what it's all about.
The warning is KEEP you domain name paid in full or it will get jacked.
It would be nice if the power of this EV list could rip it back off, and
hand it back to Dennis.
Dennis had to find another close like name. And shut his site down.
So... keep the bills paid, and watch your site like a hawk.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Evan Tuer" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Tuesday, November 23, 2004 8:21 AM
Subject: Re: currenteliminator.com questions
> Looks like an almost automated attempt at domain squatting. There are
> some individuals and companies who like to buy up domain names of well
> known brands and companies who've overlooked a permutation of their
> name, in the hope of making a quick buck. A lot of this kind of thing
> went out when the dot com bubble burst, but currenteliminator.com was
> only registered in December last year.. from HONG KONG!
>
> | Registrant:
> | Domain Deluxe
> | GPO 7628
> | Central, n/a n/a
> | Hong Kong
> |
> | Registrar: DomainPeople Inc.
> |
> | Domain Name: currenteliminator.com
> | Created on .............Sun Dec 07 14:10:39 2003
> | Expires on .............Wed Dec 07 14:10:39 2005
> | Record last updated on .Wed Sep 22 08:11:36 2004
> | Status .................LOCK
> |
> | Administrative Contact:
> | Domain Deluxe
> | Domain Deluxe
> | 16/F Cheung Kong Center
> | Hong Kong, n/a
> | n/a, HK
> | (852)91028527
> | ()
> | [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
>
> Let us know how much they want you to pay for it...
>
> Bizaarely, someone *else* owns currenteliminator.net but
> currenteliminator.org is still available.
>
> This has happened to the charity I'm involved with as well and it's
> not very amusing.
>
> Good luck
> Evan
>
>
>
> On Tue, 23 Nov 2004 08:07:28 -0800, Roderick Wilde <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
> >
> > Can one of you computer gurus out there explain to me why someone
> > would put up a site with the subtitle "The top ELECTRIC VEHICLE
> > resources on the net " and have absolutely nothing to do with EVs.
> > I'm confused. Is it some kind of scam or way of making money by hits.
> > Please enlighten me. There doesn't seem to be a way to contact them
> > and ask them what's this all about.
> >
> > Roderick
> >
> > --
> >
> > Roderick Wilde, President, EV Parts Inc.
> > Your Online EV Superstore
> > www.evparts.com
> > 1-888-EV Parts (387-2787)
> > Phone: 360-385-7966 Fax: 360-385-7922
> > P.O. Box 221, 107 Louisa Street
> > Port Townsend, WA 98368
> >
> >
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
This excerpt from the article was most exciting. Lawrence Rhodes...........
Home-grown company
Yoshida's experience was with ThunderSky, a privately held company
agressively trying to market the technology at home and abroad.
CEO Lindo Ho told MSNBC.com that the batterymaker had also caught the
attention of a French carmaker.
Lithium ion batteries, Ho added, break "the bottleneck" that had plagued
electric vehicles, noting that ThunderSky's bus has a range of 180 miles and
a recharge time of just three hours.
The company has also developed an electric scooter with a 95-mile range, 60
mph top speed and a 90 minute recharge time, she said. Plans are to partner
with a scooter maker and sell it for around $2,000.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Patrick Maston" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, November 22, 2004 3:34 PM
Subject: "China plugs into electric vehicles"
Interesting article:
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/6290392/
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Always Always ALWAYS get the 3 main TLDs for your site: .COM, .NET and
.ORG. If you can, also get the alternative spellings and permutations,
and if you're running a business, be sure to get <whatever>sucks.com
(i.e. aolsucks.com).
Evan Tuer wrote:
Looks like an almost automated attempt at domain squatting. There are
some individuals and companies who like to buy up domain names of well
known brands and companies who've overlooked a permutation of their
name, in the hope of making a quick buck. A lot of this kind of thing
went out when the dot com bubble burst, but currenteliminator.com was
only registered in December last year.. from HONG KONG!
| Registrant:
| Domain Deluxe
| GPO 7628
| Central, n/a n/a
| Hong Kong
|
| Registrar: DomainPeople Inc.
|
| Domain Name: currenteliminator.com
| Created on .............Sun Dec 07 14:10:39 2003
| Expires on .............Wed Dec 07 14:10:39 2005
| Record last updated on .Wed Sep 22 08:11:36 2004
| Status .................LOCK
|
| Administrative Contact:
| Domain Deluxe
| Domain Deluxe
| 16/F Cheung Kong Center
| Hong Kong, n/a
| n/a, HK
| (852)91028527
| ()
| [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Let us know how much they want you to pay for it...
Bizaarely, someone *else* owns currenteliminator.net but
currenteliminator.org is still available.
This has happened to the charity I'm involved with as well and it's
not very amusing.
Good luck
Evan
On Tue, 23 Nov 2004 08:07:28 -0800, Roderick Wilde <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Can one of you computer gurus out there explain to me why someone
would put up a site with the subtitle "The top ELECTRIC VEHICLE
resources on the net " and have absolutely nothing to do with EVs.
I'm confused. Is it some kind of scam or way of making money by hits.
Please enlighten me. There doesn't seem to be a way to contact them
and ask them what's this all about.
Roderick
--
Roderick Wilde, President, EV Parts Inc.
Your Online EV Superstore
www.evparts.com
1-888-EV Parts (387-2787)
Phone: 360-385-7966 Fax: 360-385-7922
P.O. Box 221, 107 Louisa Street
Port Townsend, WA 98368
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
If my business bought every suck site we would own the porn world :-)
Roderick Wilde
Suck Amps EV Racing
www.suckamps.com
Always Always ALWAYS get the 3 main TLDs for your site: .COM, .NET
and .ORG. If you can, also get the alternative spellings and
permutations, and if you're running a business, be sure to get
<whatever>sucks.com (i.e. aolsucks.com).
Evan Tuer wrote:
Looks like an almost automated attempt at domain squatting. There are
some individuals and companies who like to buy up domain names of well
known brands and companies who've overlooked a permutation of their
name, in the hope of making a quick buck. A lot of this kind of thing
went out when the dot com bubble burst, but currenteliminator.com was
only registered in December last year.. from HONG KONG!
| Registrant:
| Domain Deluxe
| GPO 7628
| Central, n/a n/a
| Hong Kong
|
| Registrar: DomainPeople Inc.
|
| Domain Name: currenteliminator.com
| Created on .............Sun Dec 07 14:10:39 2003
| Expires on .............Wed Dec 07 14:10:39 2005
| Record last updated on .Wed Sep 22 08:11:36 2004
| Status .................LOCK
|
| Administrative Contact:
| Domain Deluxe
| Domain Deluxe
| 16/F Cheung Kong Center
| Hong Kong, n/a
| n/a, HK
| (852)91028527
| ()
| [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Let us know how much they want you to pay for it...
Bizaarely, someone *else* owns currenteliminator.net but
currenteliminator.org is still available.
This has happened to the charity I'm involved with as well and it's
not very amusing.
Good luck
Evan
On Tue, 23 Nov 2004 08:07:28 -0800, Roderick Wilde
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Can one of you computer gurus out there explain to me why someone
would put up a site with the subtitle "The top ELECTRIC VEHICLE
resources on the net " and have absolutely nothing to do with EVs.
I'm confused. Is it some kind of scam or way of making money by hits.
Please enlighten me. There doesn't seem to be a way to contact them
and ask them what's this all about.
Roderick
--
Roderick Wilde, President, EV Parts Inc.
Your Online EV Superstore
www.evparts.com
1-888-EV Parts (387-2787)
Phone: 360-385-7966 Fax: 360-385-7922
P.O. Box 221, 107 Louisa Street
Port Townsend, WA 98368
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Someone on the http://groups.yahoo.com/group/power-assist group mentioned
building a campfire powered charger years ago.
Basically it's a stovepipe with bunch of thermoelectric generator chips (10-20
watts each) around the top and heat sinks on the outside.
Place the whole thing over a small wood fire and viola, slow charger.
Don't know what the specs or preformance where but the idea has always intreged
me.
"Mad" Mike Shipway
> -----Original Message-----
> From: keith vansickle [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Sent: Tuesday, November 23, 2004 03:05 PM
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: Re: windbike
>
> if anyone actually responds and builds or even designs
> something like this , please let me know as i am
> planning a long distance Solar Assisted Human Powered
> Electric Vehicle (SAHPEV) trip for this summer and I
> have not designed the basic vehicle yet. I vassalate
> between my electric bike that is already a proven
> vehicle and a three wheel recumbent that i have not
> built yet. any ideas and suggestions would be
> appreciated.
>
> kEVs
>
>
>
> --- Sam Uzi <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > this is kinda goofy, but how about:
> >
> > - a light-weight collapsing-frame bike-EV (assisted
> > human-power, perhaps
> > even a 3-wheeler - which are a riot to drive when
> > small, light, and fast,
> > yet have excellent low-speed load-pulling
> > characterisitcs)...
> >
> > ok, pretty normal so far, but
> >
> > - when no longer being ridden, the frame collapses
> > and - voila, grown-up
> > transformer toy - can be reassembled as a tower
> > structure, upon which the
> > motor is re-configured as a genset in a wind-turbine
> > - great for extended
> > tour-camping!
> >
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
----- Original Message -----
From: "damon henry" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Tuesday, November 23, 2004 8:25 AM
Subject: Re: Modular Charger
> >
This was the path that the Tango was on. A really high power series charger,
an then Lee's Batt ballencer with Sheer's code driving it.
Not only could it equalize, but it could move a good amount of charge energy
to fill a weak or dying battery.
It's a good idea. The code and support takes a lot of effort.
A PFC charger that is set to shut off at peak voltage...not taper at all.
Then the modular chargers follow up. Is also a good idea.
A PFC charger And Regs, will do the same thing as the Modular chargers, If,
you keep all the regs blinking long enough to get larger Batteries filled.
Of course the best way is also the most expensive and equipment intensive
way....
>
> I bought a 3 amp Soneil, I don't even know how long ago now, but it has
been
> charging some battery in my garage almost every hour since. I never have
to
> think about it, however everytime I check up on it, it is doing exactly
what
> I expect it to. It seems very reliable to me, and using a slew of these
as
> finish chargers seems easily as reliable as using regulators to finish
> things off correctly. Since all batteries are already charged up to ~80%
> before switching to modular charging the potential for disaster is
limited.
>
> damon
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
----- Original Message -----
From: "Eric Poulsen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Tuesday, November 23, 2004 8:54 AM
Subject: Re: Modular Charger
your separate regs are drawing.
>
> Now that I think about it, I think that the PFC + regs would be a better
> choice, but I'm still kinda on the fence.
>
>
I of course am trying to make the PFC and Regs a better bet all the time.
There are holes we are trying to plug. Regs are Not a total complete BMS.
We are trying for %90 of the function for %10 of the cost. The regs are
getting more expensive and much harder to test.
A $20 reg in '96 is a $45 Reg in '04, with 3 times the circuitry, and a
feature set that gets long.
We still need some more features to plug the last few holes.
Now that my Yts are fading, getting that last Red LED to clear on a cold
night....without frying other regs... is a pain.
Somewheres along the increasingly complex BMS is a Micro in each Reg. Then
we are in the real BMS world... and of course the costs go up also...
Sigh!!!
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Yes its a fact a while back someone stole my website currenteliminator.com.
Dennis Berube
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Rich,
The PIC line of microcontrollers are especially cheap for the OTP version.
Rich Rudman wrote:
----- Original Message -----
From: "Eric Poulsen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Tuesday, November 23, 2004 8:54 AM
Subject: Re: Modular Charger
your separate regs are drawing.
Now that I think about it, I think that the PFC + regs would be a better
choice, but I'm still kinda on the fence.
I of course am trying to make the PFC and Regs a better bet all the time.
There are holes we are trying to plug. Regs are Not a total complete BMS.
We are trying for %90 of the function for %10 of the cost. The regs are
getting more expensive and much harder to test.
A $20 reg in '96 is a $45 Reg in '04, with 3 times the circuitry, and a
feature set that gets long.
We still need some more features to plug the last few holes.
Now that my Yts are fading, getting that last Red LED to clear on a cold
night....without frying other regs... is a pain.
Somewheres along the increasingly complex BMS is a Micro in each Reg. Then
we are in the real BMS world... and of course the costs go up also...
Sigh!!!
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
14.4 seconds.
Bob Boyd @ Hayden Idaho
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Ryan Bohm
Sent: Monday, November 22, 2004 9:02 PM
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List
Subject: 200sx 0-60 estimates - a friendly little contest
Hi Everyone,
David Dymaxion responded to my question "how fast do you think the 200sx
will go from 0-60". He guessed 11-14 seconds. I was hoping for a
little better, but I can be realistic. I thought I'd have a little fun
with it though. In anticipation of the 200sx finally running (hopefully
within the next 2 weeks if my batteries ever show up and I can steal
enough time over the Thanksgiving break), I thought I'd have a little
contest. Everyone send me your guess to the nearest tenth of a second
on how fast you think I'll go 0-60 (David, you'll have to refine your
estimate a bit). *The closest guess gets a free CafeElectric T-shirt!*
Hey, I don't even have one of those yet!
For those that missed the specs:
Prestolite MTC-4001 7" 96V rated 20hp motor
Zilla Z1K
144V of Exide Orbitals
1984 Nissan 200sx chassis - should weigh in around 3k lbs
If you need a picture for aerodynamics, take a look at
http://www.evsource.com/conversion/
Hopefully we can have a little fun with this.
-Ryan
--
- EV Source -
Zillas, PFC Chargers, and other EV stuff at great prices
5% off all items in our Top-Line Shop from November to Christmas!
E-mail: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Toll-free: 1-877-215-6781
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
--- damon henry <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Lead Acid batteries are lead acid batteries and no
> matter what you have for
> a controller and motor setup 816 pounds of lead acid
> batteris are not going
> to give you all that much range.
Are Lithiums affordable for ev conversion?
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The all-new My Yahoo! - Get yours free!
http://my.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On Tue, 23 Nov 2004 19:06:10 +0000, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>Someone on the http://groups.yahoo.com/group/power-assist group mentioned
>building a campfire powered charger years ago.
>Basically it's a stovepipe with bunch of thermoelectric generator chips (10-20
>watts each) around the top and heat sinks on the outside.
>
>Place the whole thing over a small wood fire and viola, slow charger.
>
>Don't know what the specs or preformance where but the idea has always
>intreged me.
Been there, done that.... A few years ago I bought one of those
thermoelectric coolers. I noticed that when I disconnected the 12 volt
supply, the cooling fan kept running as the Peltier pile merrily pumped
heat back into the cooler. I lightbulb came on.
I bought some surplus piles, mounted them to a piece of copper bus bar and
mounted a large heat sink on the other side. I heated the bus bar with a
propane torch. With the piles hooked in parallel, the result was nominal
12 volts at several amps. I have meant to make more permanent device but
never got that round tuit.
There are several limitations to this particular scheme. The most major
is that the piles most commonly found surplus have the individual
junctions soldered with a very low temperature solder. The hot side of
the pile must be kept below about 300 deg or the pile will disassemble
itself.
The other limitation is maintaining a large delta T. The cold side needs
to be as near to room temperature as possible. The largest heat sink I
had in my bone yard, about a foot long and 6" wide, did a fairly poor job
of that without a fan. Driving a fan would consume a goodly portion of
the output. I did experiment with both a fan and with misting the heat
sink with water + the fan. Both gave excellent results. It would take
some careful cold side engineering to make this work.
There are commercial units available. They're most commonly used on
remote mountaintop 2-way radio sites. A 500 gallon propane tank will run
a small site for years. I've installed them but I've never had the
opportunity to open one up for a look-see. They look expensive.
Then there are the SNAP generators, the nuclear fueled power sources used
on satellites and the like. Seems like I recall reading that the
Plutonium heat source ball runs at about 800 deg. Can't recall if it is C
or F. It would be interesting to research the technology to see what it
uses for the T/C junctions.
John
---
John De Armond
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://bellsouthpwp.net/j/o/johngd/
Cleveland, Occupied TN
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
In a message dated 11/23/2004 12:24:49 PM Pacific Standard Time,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
> http://www.evsource.com/conversion/
I say it will do 0-60 in10.7 sec Larry Cronk 72 Datsun 120 volt
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
> Then there are the SNAP generators, the nuclear fueled power sources used
> on satellites and the like. Seems like I recall reading that the
> Plutonium heat source ball runs at about 800 deg. Can't recall if it is C
> or F. It would be interesting to research the technology to see what it
> uses for the T/C junctions.
well, there's an idea - run your EV with an RTG... yikes! couldn't
complain about EVs being "just for tree-huggers" then, eh?
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
This question is really for Rich, but I thought I
would post it to the list to see what others have
done.
My 1994 Dodge TEVan has an onboard PFC charger similar
to Rich/Joe's PFC30 (at least in output power levels
and wide range output voltage).
The TEVan has a off the shelf GFI breaker mounted on
the side of the 'black box'. It's never tripped, but
I wonder if it would be usefull on a PFC30
installation.
I got to see the first PFC30 (that I've seen!) sitting
unconnected on a Sparrow where the Zivan is normally
mounted. They're wondering how it will fit there (I
have no input on that one, I'll stick to electronics).
So Rich/Joe, what do you think about the onboard GFI?
Would a PFC20 fit in the Sparrow better (it's height
seems to be the obstruction, I wonder if a PFC20 would
fit better?)
Thanks for the input.
Rod
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
At 03:25 PM 11/23/2004, you wrote:
I got to see the first PFC30 (that I've seen!) sitting
unconnected on a Sparrow where the Zivan is normally
mounted. They're wondering how it will fit there (I
have no input on that one, I'll stick to electronics).
So Rich/Joe, what do you think about the onboard GFI?
Would a PFC20 fit in the Sparrow better (it's height
seems to be the obstruction, I wonder if a PFC20 would
fit better?)
Whoever is doing this should probably be on the Sparrow_ev list.
A PFC-20 will (just barely) fit where the Zivan was. (I have pictures on
my site - somewhere - showing that.) It will require building new charger
mounting brackets though.
I don't know how much bigger a PFC-30 is. The 20 didn't have much clearance.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Like all things, it depends.
If you are talking long term cost, a properly sized set of TS Li-Ions
(bought in a nice discounted group purchase) should last longer than
several sets of Lead batts (and give more range with less weight) and
end up costing less in the long run.
(Assuming you look after them and they last for the manufacturers
specifed cycle life etc)
Long term, Lithium looks very promising for Evs.
Prices will get cheaper (as all new technology does).
Power output will increase.
Cycle life will increase.
We will learn how to best manage and monitor their condition for longest
life.
Right now it is a bit more of a gamble.
(ie don't spend what you can't afford to lose)
Mark
-----Original Message-----
From: Dick Farfel [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wednesday, 24 November 2004 9:21 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Are lithiums now an option?
Are Lithiums affordable for ev conversion?
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Electric vehicles catching on in China; Smart cars coming to U.S.
All the talk these days is about hybrid and hydrogen cars, but in
China, where air pollution is an ongoing crisis, they haven't given
up on electric vehicles. Improvements in battery technology are
making electric cars, scooters, and buses a viable option, with
shorter charging times and traveling ranges that rival those of
gasoline-powered vehicles. Electric scooters are already popular in
crowded cities, and Beijing and Shanghai plan to deploy hundreds of
electric buses in coming years. As Lee Schipper of the World
Resources Institute points out, "Such cars still do not represent
'zero emission vehicles,' only 'elsewhere emission vehicles,'" as the
power to charge them has to come from somewhere, but he still sees
small electric vehicles as a positive development. In other greenish
vehicle news, the unbearably cute Smart micro-car -- a two-seater
that gets 60 miles to the gallon, sold in Europe since 1998 -- just
received final U.S. EPA clearance and should debut on American roads
in early 2005.
straight to the source: MSNBC.com, Miguel Llanos, 22 Nov 2004
<http://grist.org/cgi-bin/forward.pl?forward_id=3687>
straight to the source: CNN Money, 22 Nov 2004
<http://grist.org/cgi-bin/forward.pl?forward_id=3688>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On Tue, 23 Nov 2004 15:01:00 -0800 (PST), Sam Uzi
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Then there are the SNAP generators, the nuclear fueled power sources
used
on satellites and the like. Seems like I recall reading that the
Plutonium heat source ball runs at about 800 deg. Can't recall if it
is C
or F. It would be interesting to research the technology to see what it
uses for the T/C junctions.
well, there's an idea - run your EV with an RTG... yikes! couldn't
complain about EVs being "just for tree-huggers" then, eh?
I started to suggest that but there is so much off-topic stuff on this
list as it is.
Several years ago I wrote an SBIR proposal to study the feasibility of
using SNAP type generators in domestic settings. There were (and are)
tons of Sr-90, a byproduct of plutonium production, just sitting around
decaying and boiling water in the storage pools. Since Sr-90 is a pure
beta emitter, shielding is trivial. I proposed to use it as the heat
source in an RTG (SNAP unit. The proposal was accepted but I was too far
down the funding list for that year and I never persued it in subsequent
years.
I went ahead and did some calculations and simulations on my own.
Nukeophobia aside, this is emminently feasible. Imagine a shed-sized unit
that makes a kw or two 24/7 plus comfort heating and AC. When an Sr-90
half life expires, a technician shows up to remove the old Sr container
and install a new one. The decayed Sr can be used for lower quality heat
applications such as comfort heating or process heat.
This would be a grand use of a resource that is wasting away right now.
It might cause a reconsideration of nuclear fuel reprocessing. It sickens
me to think of all that spent fuel decay heat energy going to waste at
nuclear plants everywhere.
John
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
One of the Sparrow owners has gotten a PFC-20 to fit. The PFC-30 is the same
physical size box, so the general fit shouldn't be a problem. Only problems
might be if the case mounting tabs are different. But it can fit in the hood
where the Zivan normally fits, with some slight modifications of mounting
points. -Ed Thorpe--- On Tue 11/23, John Lussmyer < [EMAIL PROTECTED] >
wrote:From: John Lussmyer [mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED]: [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Tue,
23 Nov 2004 15:30:29 -0800Subject: Re: PFC30 GFI breakerAt 03:25 PM 11/23/2004,
you wrote:>I got to see the first PFC30 (that I've seen!)
sitting>unconnected on a Sparrow where the Zivan is normally>mounted.
They're wondering how it will fit there (I>have no input on that one, I'll
stick to electronics).>So Rich/Joe, what do you think about the onboard
GFI?>Would a PFC20 fit in the Sparrow better (it's height>seems to be the
obstruction, I wonder if a PFC20 would>fit better?)Whoe!
ver is doing this should probably be on the Sparrow_ev list.A PFC-20 will
(just barely) fit where the Zivan was. (I have pictures on my site - somewhere
- showing that.) It will require building new charger mounting brackets
though.I don't know how much bigger a PFC-30 is. The 20 didn't have much
clearance.
_______________________________________________
Join Excite! - http://www.excite.com
The most personalized portal on the Web!
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I have successfully put a PFC20 on my Sparrow in the
space the Zivan NG3 normally sits.
http://airlabcorp.com/EV/SparrowPFC20/
You should join the sparrow_ev group if you want to
know more about different mods on the Sparrow that
owners have made.
Ed Ang
--- John Lussmyer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> At 03:25 PM 11/23/2004, you wrote:
> >I got to see the first PFC30 (that I've seen!)
> sitting
> >unconnected on a Sparrow where the Zivan is
> normally
> >mounted. They're wondering how it will fit there
> (I
> >have no input on that one, I'll stick to
> electronics).
> >So Rich/Joe, what do you think about the onboard
> GFI?
> >Would a PFC20 fit in the Sparrow better (it's
> height
> >seems to be the obstruction, I wonder if a PFC20
> would
> >fit better?)
>
> Whoever is doing this should probably be on the
> Sparrow_ev list.
> A PFC-20 will (just barely) fit where the Zivan was.
> (I have pictures on
> my site - somewhere - showing that.) It will
> require building new charger
> mounting brackets though.
> I don't know how much bigger a PFC-30 is. The 20
> didn't have much clearance.
>
>
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail - You care about security. So do we.
http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
PFC20 20B and 30s are 13 inches by 9 by 5.5 tall.
The case grew from 5.250 to 5.5 when we went to the Aluminum Case at about
unit 36.
We are now on unit 179.
GFI breakers.
Most are voltage specific Our chargers are not.
Also a other brand of charger used a on board breaker, and after most had
nuisance GFI trips the owners dissabled to removed the GFI as it was a real
pain in the Butt to keep operating.
I will assime that a company making the Sparrow, can figure out how to chop
and channel a simple charger case to fit.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Edward Ang" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Tuesday, November 23, 2004 6:03 PM
Subject: Re: PFC30 GFI breaker
> I have successfully put a PFC20 on my Sparrow in the
> space the Zivan NG3 normally sits.
>
> http://airlabcorp.com/EV/SparrowPFC20/
>
> You should join the sparrow_ev group if you want to
> know more about different mods on the Sparrow that
> owners have made.
>
> Ed Ang
>
>
> --- John Lussmyer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > At 03:25 PM 11/23/2004, you wrote:
> > >I got to see the first PFC30 (that I've seen!)
> > sitting
> > >unconnected on a Sparrow where the Zivan is
> > normally
> > >mounted. They're wondering how it will fit there
> > (I
> > >have no input on that one, I'll stick to
> > electronics).
> > >So Rich/Joe, what do you think about the onboard
> > GFI?
> > >Would a PFC20 fit in the Sparrow better (it's
> > height
> > >seems to be the obstruction, I wonder if a PFC20
> > would
> > >fit better?)
> >
> > Whoever is doing this should probably be on the
> > Sparrow_ev list.
> > A PFC-20 will (just barely) fit where the Zivan was.
> > (I have pictures on
> > my site - somewhere - showing that.) It will
> > require building new charger
> > mounting brackets though.
> > I don't know how much bigger a PFC-30 is. The 20
> > didn't have much clearance.
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
> __________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Mail - You care about security. So do we.
> http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi all,
I vaguely remember seeing a simple voltmeter circuit for measuring small
voltages made out of just LEDs and resistors.
Can anyone point me to a web site or Hartian ASCII diagram to show how I
should wire something up to roughly indicate the voltage produced by a
little hand generator.
(I can get it to about 7V furiously spinning the handle.)
I have a whole bunch of pretty standard red LEDs - are they about 1.4V
drop?
Mark
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Eric Poulsen wrote:
> I've been looking closely at the Soneil brand... For their 24V 8A
> charger, Soneil claims... MTBF 50,000 power-on-hours (POH) or
> greater.
That's a pretty good number. Lambda, Vicor, and the other premium
supplies generally have an MTBF of 100,000 hours or more. But most
consumer supply MTBF aren't even 10,000 hours.
But, there are several ways to get that MTBF number.
1. Demonstrated MTBF: Test a bunch of the products for a significant
length of time under controlled conditions. The test conditions
are often deliberately severe to accellerate the test. Test enough
products for long enough to be a statistically significant sample.
2. Calculated MTBF: The military, NASA, and other agencies that need
high reliability have developed a sophisticated methodology for
estimating the MTBF of a product. It relies on a) using parts
that have a demonstrated MTBF, b) applying correction factors for
the actual stress level each part faces in the product due to
temperature, voltage, vibration, etc. and c) mathmatically compute
the resulting MTBF.
3. Marketing MTBF: This usually involves vague handwaving and made-up
numbers to sound good. Too often, they just use the same number
their competitor uses, or arbitrarily quote a slightly better one.
Unless you pin them down and ask, you won't know what kind of MTBF
number they are giving you.
> Using a PFC-20, and a full set of regs, can you achieve as good a
> per-battery charge as individual chargers?
In theory, both methods can achieve the same degree of balance. In
practice, the details about how each system is set up, and how good an
individual charger you use will make all the difference.
--
"Never doubt that the work of a small group of thoughtful, committed
citizens can change the world. Indeed, it's the only thing that ever
has!" -- Margaret Mead
--
Lee A. Hart 814 8th Ave N Sartell MN 56377 leeahart_at_earthlink.net
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
All,
>From: "John Bryan" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
<snip>
> I've posted about this before, but I'll try to make it more clear this
>time.
>(It's obvious that John doesn't read my posts :-)
I wonder if Wayland is reading my posts...
>From: John Wayland <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
<snip>
>The biggest negative, is the threat of one of
>them failing, taking a vacation from the rest and leaving one battery out
>of the entire
>string un-charged.
As JB mentioned and I mentioned in an old post below, if you're using a
decent charger it's not that hard to determine if one failed. I simply
glance at the LEDs which are behind the seat, and check the pack voltage.
>JB would be the first to agree with me though, that his 16 Zap chargers do
>not rapidly
>bring his EV back to a full charge with their less than 10 amp charge
>rate, so this is a
>big downside that makes the modular charger idea not so attractive.
As I mention below, if I need to hump more than the individual charger's
five amps into the pack, I use the FrankenLesters to bulk charge. A big
dumb off-board series charger can be cheap, but you probably won't want to
take it with you like you can easily do with a PFCxx!
>The effect, is that the 10 amp rated charger really only outputs 10
>amps initially, but ramps down as battery volts
>rise....10,9,8,7,6,5,4,3...and so it goes
>for hours and hours.
Mine hump a solid five amps in until the voltage hits 14.4.
>As to using battery regs, I've learned that with the PFC type charger and
>it's adjustable time length for the constant voltage phase, quite frankly,
>I haven't
>needed any regs whatsoever and my sealed batteries have lasted a very long
>time while
>staying very well equalized with each other.
As someone that initially charged my string of YT's manually with the
FrankenLesters followed by the variac bad-boy, this seems amazing. I
remember the batteries being about the same voltage during bulk
(absorption) mode, and then one or more shooting up very high in voltage,
so I'd have to back off on the variac and run around the vehicle with a
volt meter!
>From: Eric Poulsen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
<snip>
>I've been looking closely at the Soneil brand. My question is: does
>anyone have failure information about this specific brand?
Eric,
I'm using Soneil 1212SR model chargers in the RX-7 per an old post below.
Hope this helps,
Dave (B.B.) Hawkins
Member of the Denver Electric Vehicle Council:
http://www.devc.org/
Card carrying member and former racer with The National Electric Drag
Racing Association:
http://www.nedra.com/
Lyons, CO
1979 Mazda RX-7 EV (192V of YT's for the teenagers)
1989 Chevy S10 Ext. Cab (144V of floodies, for Ma and Pa only!)
>Date: Tue, 10 Aug 2004 22:56:29 -0700
>Subject: YT modular charging with Soneil brand chargers
>
>All,
>Someone recently asked about charging YT's, and mentioned Soneil chargers,
>and as I was just cleaning out my e-mail boxes I came across this post
>from July 2003. I haven't had any of my chargers fail to this date, and it
>isn't too difficult to scan 16 LED's to make sure they all finished.
>On-board modular chargers do add more weight, since you have X number of
>power supplies and power cords, but until you can buy a pack charger with
>individual battery monitors that tell the charger when the pack voltage is
>to high, they can be an affordable option. You shouldn't try to charge a
>series string of sealed batteries with one unattended pack charger without
>some kind of individual battery monitoring/bypass system. It's just not
>being nice to your batteries!
>Hope this helps,
>BB
>
>>Date: Tue, 16 Oct 2001 23:07:03 -0600
>>Subject: Re: Powercheq or alternative options?
>>
>>Hello All,
>>Since installing "modular" chargers Friday Night (early Saturday
>>morning!), I've been doing some charging as David Roden describes below,
>>using off-board FrankenLesters (144V and 48V) to bulk charge. The modular
>>chargers output 5 amps until the voltage reaches 14.4, then the LED turns
>>from orange to blinking green as they pulse from 13.8V to 14.4V. Before I
>>had the modular chargers, I would run around the buggy checking each
>>battery, and then shut of the FrankenLesters when one went too high, but
>>now I just watch the LED's in the modular's, and stop the bulk charge
>>when they start blinking green. And having the individual chargers top
>>them off, sure makes for plug-and-play, or plug and go work on something
>>else! Now for an equalize system...
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