EV Digest 4024
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) re Save the rangers
by Jeff Shanab <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) Re: EA Adapter plate reliab. & torque rotation ?s
by Electro Automotive <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) EV Pusher Trailers?
by "Justin Van Deusen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) RE: re Save the rangers
by "Justin Van Deusen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) Re: ACRX acceleration time (was: point of diminishing returns)
by "Roy LeMeur" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) OT: CATTRON CONTROLS
by "SCOTT O'QUINN" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7) RE: save the EV Rangers
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
8) RE: save the EV Rangers
by "Justin Van Deusen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
9) Re: E-meter
by mreish <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) Re: E-meter
by Jon Glauser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
11) Re: EA Adapter plate reliab. & torque rotation ?s
by David Dymaxion <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
12) Re: EV Pusher Trailers?
by "Steve Clunn" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13) RE: save the EV Rangers
by Gnat <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
14) Re: EA Adapter plate reliab. & torque rotation ?s
by "Dave" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
15) fight the automakers' lawsuit
by Sherry Boschert <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16) Re: LED output
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
17) Re: save the EV Rangers
by "Steve Clunn" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
18) Re: EA Adapter plate reliab. & torque rotation ?s
by "Steve Clunn" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
19) Rush Limbaugh thinks EVs are Slow
by David Dymaxion <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
20) Re: EV Pusher Trailers?
by Doug Weathers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--- Begin Message ---
I personally am not a motorcycle person, but it seams that a motor cycle
is a great way to get into EV's at a much reduced buy-in.
--
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 265.6.11 - Release Date: 1/12/2005
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I'm currently hot on the trail to solve the final
issue on CivicWithACord: a tranny-adapter plate issue
that kind of chatters/roars when over 25 mph, or under
heavy load.
This is the first we have heard of this problem. We always recommend that
when customers (ours or anyone elses) have a problem, they should talk to
their supplier FIRST to get help solving it. Am I understanding correctly
that this adaptor was built by someone else? Have you talked with your
fabricator about the issue?
As you may have heard, I believe it is an issue
that occured because my fabricator was off a few
thousandths. EA swears they have developed patterns.
Sooo, I'm out $900 for the existing adapter, and $750
for the new one, but I _will_ have a properly quiet
EV!
My question:
Anyone out there purchased EA? Do they use solid
dowel pins? Bolts only secure one so far... I do
have a motor mount on the casing end of the motor, but
still want to have as little torque rotation as
possible. In my mind, dowel pins keep the motor in
line with the tranny, and put the force on the tranny
mounts.
We try to make our adaptors as compatible as possible with the original
setup. This includes using the factory dowels. We do not supply these as
a rule. If the original ones come out in good condition, they can be
re-used. Otherwise, we advise the customer to get new ones from the dealer.
Sometimes the dowels are hollow because they have bolts running through
them. If they are sufficient to locate the original engine, they should be
sufficient to locate the electric motor. We have never had a report of a
dowel failure.
Mike Brown
Electro Automotive POB 1113 Felton CA 95018-1113 Telephone 831-429-1989
http://www.electroauto.com [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Electric Car Conversion Kits * Components * Books * Videos * Since 1979
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hello Everyone,
I am new to the list but have been reading many archived messages etc. I
really enjoy reading them and have been learning a lot. I would like to
start my own EV Coversion soon. I'm Leaning towards DC to get my "feet
wet". If I do a conversion I am thinking about a
good performance single Engine EV Machine (Hey im young and need a toy).
However the bane of this idea is of course range. I need at least 60
miles on a charge in order to cover my needs. I realize this is
difficult if you are trying to keep a lightweight EV in respect to
battery weight. Therfore, I have been thinking about Range Extending
trailers everyday it seems. It is driving my crazy! So I thought I would
ask the experts. Is a High Voltage DC Pusher Trailer possible? If so,
what would be the basic components of the system? So far what I have
researched has not turned up much. I found AC Propulsion's Version but
noticed the current output is rather low. Makes sense with an AC Motor
from what I have read. What about DC motors? Your thoughts? My apologies
if this has been covered before (I tried to find something to no avail).
Thanks!
Justin
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Good Point,
I was also thinking about small dune buggy type Vehicles to tinker with.
Heck, even electric RC cars can teach you much about electric vehicles,
especially DC motors and controllers (and now brushless motors are in
them too) not to mention Batteries and charging (especially ni-cads and
nickel metal hydrides).
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Jeff Shanab
Sent: Thursday, January 13, 2005 8:34 PM
To: EVlist
Subject: re Save the rangers
I personally am not a motorcycle person, but it seams that a motor cycle
is a great way to get into EV's at a much reduced buy-in.
--
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 265.6.11 - Release Date: 1/12/2005
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Victor Tikhonov wrote:
I don't have spinning problem on the second gear.
I limited battery current (in software) to 150A based on the
battery requirements. Actually, I can relax it now since
ultracaps supplying power, not the battery. Haven't got around >to do that.
Victor
----------
ACRX acceleration time (was: point of diminishing returns)
Done quick 0-60 test with just a stop watch.
10.14 sec one way, 14.29 sec opposite way on the same stretch.
So I guess, 12.2s average.
The voltage went from 325V to 245V at the end of >acceleration.
The pack was -8.6Ah from 100% SOC at the time of the test, >but
most of the current comes from ultracaps, so this didn't >matter much.
Some things to note, the max voltage should have been 380V
to start with, not 325V. Once I fix the battery, I'll repeat
the test. And, it is very cold here now, 40'F or so.
Also, I should have changed 150A battery curent limit - it may >have
pegged there too, I didn't check. I could almost double it >(280A).
Then, wrong tires...
Perhaps all this obvious changes and fixes may get me >improvement, so I
think 11s is doable, but I'd need to test.
I don't now how this stack up against other EVs. Not that
it matters to me much, I'm just reporting what Otmar was
interested to know.
Victor
'91 ACRX - something different.
Wow. It almost seems like you are actually interested in acceleration Victor
:^D
Is it possible that the ACRX may someday make a 1/4 mile run?
IIRC, the ACRX has shown up at the last three (or is that four?) Woodburns.
(that is four years)
Yet, it has never made a run down the track.
Isn't it about time that you did?
Miracles can happen. Maybe in 2005.
It certainly couldn't hurt the EV cause if you did.
We can at least have hope. :^D
Roy LeMeur
Woodburn 2004 Race Coordinator
Roy LeMeur Olympia, WA
My Electric Vehicle Pages:
http://www.angelfire.com/ca4/renewables/evpage.html
Informative Electric Vehicle Links:
http://www.angelfire.com/ca4/renewables/evlinks.html
EV Parts/Gone Postal Photo Galleries:
http://www.casadelgato.com/RoyLemeur/page01.htm
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I know this is off topic but I need the help of the brain's of the list !!!!
Where I work we need to find the sourse fo an acturator that will work with
a CATTRON model controller AT-32 or P06C .
It needs to work from 0 to 10 volts and 4 to 20 ma and proportional .
THANKS IN ADVANCE FOR ANY HELP !!!!!!
SCOTT O'QUINN
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I know I shouldn't but I can't help it. I'm pissed off and dejected
too when it comes to telling anyone about my EV, biodiesel, renewable
energy, etc. When I mention I have an EV, the somewhat informed people
respond with "An Insight or a Prius?" Then I explain to the that those
aren't EV, they're just efficient gas powered cars. Then I explain the EV
and half the people look at me like I'm crazy to invest so much
money/effort/time when the same people wouldn't think twice about someone
who modifies their ICE to go faster and get LESS mileage and the other half
usually respond with "How do you drive really far?" That's when I ask them
how much they drive every day, which is usually within the range of an EV,
and I tell them I have a 13 mile round trip commute and the grocery store is
2 miles away and I have an ICE car for long trips, more than half of my
driving. Incredibly some people have actually taken offense at EVs, as
though they are un-American. Then, finally, many of the nicer people wind up
the conversation with, "Well that's a really good thing to do," which can be
interpreted as "That's a really good thing for YOU to do, I'd never do
anything like that." It's the wrong thing to do, but lately my attitude has
been "Why waste my time." Part of the problem is the people I work with. I
work with mostly good-old-boys who believe trucks and SUVs are the most
patriotic vehicle you can drive and see no connection between deployments to
the Middle East and their vehicles.
A really smart friend of mine, who would have an EV if he had any
car at all, explained to me that for someone to accept the idea of EVs, the
have to change too much in their lives; mentally, fiscally, etc. They have
to accept that the greenhouse effect is real (many still don't even thought
the oil companies admit it is), they have to accept that our future security
depends on an independent source of energy, that we don't really care about
democracy in the Middle East, that they don't have to worry about what the
Joneses think, that their 2nd car CAN be a battery powered car instead of a
trophy ICE, that SUVs are not safer in an accident, etc., etc. And then they
are finally ready to sell the Expedition and buy a converted car or convert
their own. If there are any hard sci-fi fans out there you might have heard
of this guy. Stephen Baxter wrote a book where an extraordinary event
happened and a giant object appeared in the sky. People who saw couldn't
look at it for extended periods of time not because it was too bright but
because their human brains couldn't handle such a strange anomaly. They
would have to physically look away from it. That's how I perceive a lot of
people react to EVs. The idea is so radically different and goes against
what they have been taught and believe and have learned that they need to
make arguments against them or make a deflecting joke about 50 mile
extension cords. Not only are they mistaken in much of what they believe and
know, they don't want to be corrected.
I'm sorry to vent.
John Shelton
-----Original Message-----
From: James Jarrett [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, January 14, 2005 07:00 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: save the EV Rangers
Felix Gardner wrote:
> First it was the EV1 and now the Ranger. I didn't even know about
> what happened to the EV1 until two days ago. This makes me so angry!
> I don't even drive an EV, but it is just so . . . . AHGHAAAA!!!
*SNIP*
And therein lies the problem. Your'e interested in EVs (else you would
not be here) and *you* had not heard about what happened to the EV1
until recently.
The vast majority of the population has no clue either, in fact, when I
try to tell people what happened to the EV1 *THEY DON'T BELIEVE ME*.
Even my friends seem to think I'm some left wing conspiracy theorist.
It's only after the fact when I tell them to look it up for themselves
that they start to believe me.
The auto companies have plenty of money for ads saying what they want
and to sweep what they don't under the carpet. And that's a shame.
Most people that have even heard of the EV1 believe it was a failed
experiment because it didn't work or people didn't want it.
Don't even get me started on fool cells...
*SIGH* Sorry to vent, just generally pi**ed at the world right now. I
have no EV, there likely isn't one in my very near future, and the
powers that be like it that way.
James
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
No worries John, I get the same thing at work when I talk about my EV
conversion. We understand what you are going through. Just remember you
are one of the few people who are doing something about the problem
instead of contributing to it. One question, has any of them actually
driven an EV? That could change a few minds....
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Thursday, January 13, 2005 10:18 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [email protected]
Subject: RE: save the EV Rangers
I know I shouldn't but I can't help it. I'm pissed off and
dejected too when it comes to telling anyone about my EV, biodiesel,
renewable energy, etc. When I mention I have an EV, the somewhat
informed people respond with "An Insight or a Prius?" Then I explain to
the that those aren't EV, they're just efficient gas powered cars. Then
I explain the EV and half the people look at me like I'm crazy to invest
so much money/effort/time when the same people wouldn't think twice
about someone who modifies their ICE to go faster and get LESS mileage
and the other half usually respond with "How do you drive really far?"
That's when I ask them how much they drive every day, which is usually
within the range of an EV, and I tell them I have a 13 mile round trip
commute and the grocery store is 2 miles away and I have an ICE car for
long trips, more than half of my driving. Incredibly some people have
actually taken offense at EVs, as though they are un-American. Then,
finally, many of the nicer people wind up the conversation with, "Well
that's a really good thing to do," which can be interpreted as "That's a
really good thing for YOU to do, I'd never do anything like that." It's
the wrong thing to do, but lately my attitude has been "Why waste my
time." Part of the problem is the people I work with. I work with mostly
good-old-boys who believe trucks and SUVs are the most patriotic vehicle
you can drive and see no connection between deployments to the Middle
East and their vehicles.
A really smart friend of mine, who would have an EV if he had
any car at all, explained to me that for someone to accept the idea of
EVs, the have to change too much in their lives; mentally, fiscally,
etc. They have to accept that the greenhouse effect is real (many still
don't even thought the oil companies admit it is), they have to accept
that our future security depends on an independent source of energy,
that we don't really care about democracy in the Middle East, that they
don't have to worry about what the Joneses think, that their 2nd car CAN
be a battery powered car instead of a trophy ICE, that SUVs are not
safer in an accident, etc., etc. And then they are finally ready to sell
the Expedition and buy a converted car or convert their own. If there
are any hard sci-fi fans out there you might have heard of this guy.
Stephen Baxter wrote a book where an extraordinary event happened and a
giant object appeared in the sky. People who saw couldn't look at it for
extended periods of time not because it was too bright but because their
human brains couldn't handle such a strange anomaly. They would have to
physically look away from it. That's how I perceive a lot of people
react to EVs. The idea is so radically different and goes against what
they have been taught and believe and have learned that they need to
make arguments against them or make a deflecting joke about 50 mile
extension cords. Not only are they mistaken in much of what they believe
and know, they don't want to be corrected.
I'm sorry to vent.
John Shelton
-----Original Message-----
From: James Jarrett [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, January 14, 2005 07:00 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: save the EV Rangers
Felix Gardner wrote:
> First it was the EV1 and now the Ranger. I didn't even know about
> what happened to the EV1 until two days ago. This makes me so angry!
> I don't even drive an EV, but it is just so . . . . AHGHAAAA!!!
*SNIP*
And therein lies the problem. Your'e interested in EVs (else you would
not be here) and *you* had not heard about what happened to the EV1
until recently.
The vast majority of the population has no clue either, in fact, when I
try to tell people what happened to the EV1 *THEY DON'T BELIEVE ME*.
Even my friends seem to think I'm some left wing conspiracy theorist.
It's only after the fact when I tell them to look it up for themselves
that they start to believe me.
The auto companies have plenty of money for ads saying what they want
and to sweep what they don't under the carpet. And that's a shame.
Most people that have even heard of the EV1 believe it was a failed
experiment because it didn't work or people didn't want it.
Don't even get me started on fool cells...
*SIGH* Sorry to vent, just generally pi**ed at the world right now. I
have no EV, there likely isn't one in my very near future, and the
powers that be like it that way.
James
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I knew never deleteling messages would be usefull someday! This
message was from Feb '04 I think:
-------- Original Message --------
From: "Myles Twete" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
When I thought I fried my e-meter, I wrote a message to that effect on
Xantrex's web site and within a couple days got a friendly phone
call from their Technical Service Analyst Randy Johnson. Until I
told him my meter wasn't actually fried, he had said I should send
it in for repair, which they can indeed do. As I mentioned earlier,
they can also upgrade an e-meter to include the RS-232 interface for
about $70.
Here's contact info for Technical Service at Xantrex:
Randy Johnson
Technical Service Analyst
Customer Service Operations
Xantrex Technology Inc.
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
5916 195th NE
Arlington, Washington 98223
General Tel: 360/435.8826
General Fax: 360/925.5144
--
A hypothetical times a hypothetical divided by a questionable is
unusable.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Thanks for the suggestion about the broken feed wire, I'll check that
out tomorrow. SMD doesn't bother me, I used to do rework on stuff like
that.. steady hand ;). Thanks for the help!
-Jon Glauser
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
It's painful to hear about spending so much money! Maybe you
shouldn't give up quite yet, it would be doubly painful to hear you
bought another adapter and still had the problem.
First, are you sure that it is the adapters fault? Presumably
everything is smooth with the clutch in (so flywheel is OK). Is it
smooth with the clutch out and in neutral? Does it only make the
noise in gear under load? Does every gear make the noise?
You might have bearings that have gone bad in the tranny -- have you
been able to rule that out?
I would consider this last resort, but better than throwing away the
adapter. An SCCA publication recommended doing this, and Steve Clunn
does something similar on his videos (http://www.grassrootsev.com).
Drill out the tranny bolt and pin holes oversize. Bolt the motor and
tranny together tight enough it doesn't slip, but loose enough a
mallet can budge them. Run the motor, tap the tranny, and keep doing
the clutch until the noise is minimized. Then tighten the bolts all
the way. Optionally, you could drill and drive in new locating pins
if you wanted to make the fit repeatable.
--- Bob Bath <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Hey all,
> I'm currently hot on the trail to solve the final
> issue on CivicWithACord: a tranny-adapter plate issue
> that kind of chatters/roars when over 25 mph, or under
> heavy load.
> As you may have heard, I believe it is an issue
> that occured because my fabricator was off a few
> thousandths. EA swears they have developed patterns.
> Sooo, I'm out $900 for the existing adapter, and $750
> for the new one, but I _will_ have a properly quiet
> EV!
> My question:
> Anyone out there purchased EA? Do they use solid
> dowel pins? Bolts only secure one so far... I do
> have a motor mount on the casing end of the motor, but
> still want to have as little torque rotation as
> possible. In my mind, dowel pins keep the motor in
> line with the tranny, and put the force on the tranny
> mounts.
=====
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The all-new My Yahoo! - What will yours do?
http://my.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi Justin
----- Original Message -----
> However the bane of this idea is of course range. I need at least 60
> miles on a charge in order to cover my needs.
dose this mean you'll be driving 30 miles and want to be safe, . I find this
often when talking with people about what they really need. most EV's with
what the owner says "it has a 30 mile range" car could drive them 60 miles
or more , they would just have to drive slower. The driving slower extends
the range so much , that running out of juice only happens because of
driving to fast , (most of the time) . If you need to drive a real 60 mile
at high way speeds and have no chance to charge in-between and your doing it
everyday , well I wouldn't know what to tell you then other that money would
solve this problem , I hope this is not the case. I put a gen in the back
of my ev pick up a few times , didn't really like it but make it to the ev
rally which I did like:-) .
steve clunn
I realize this is
> difficult if you are trying to keep a lightweight EV in respect to
> battery weight. Therfore, I have been thinking about Range Extending
> trailers everyday it seems. It is driving my crazy! So I thought I would
> ask the experts. Is a High Voltage DC Pusher Trailer possible? If so,
> what would be the basic components of the system? So far what I have
> researched has not turned up much. I found AC Propulsion's Version but
> noticed the current output is rather low. Makes sense with an AC Motor
> from what I have read. What about DC motors? Your thoughts? My apologies
> if this has been covered before (I tried to find something to no avail).
>
> Thanks!
>
> Justin
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi John
I've found most people don't give a damn about most great things.
They think more along the lines of if it look good or what does
it cost.
It sounds like the peeps you were talking to won't understand anything but
how it might affect their wallet. Perhaps you might be able to clue them
in slightly if you compared direct operating costs per mile or something
equally unfair to an ice. ie it only cost me 30 cents to fill up (charge
etc)or it only costs me so many cents per mile compared to so many $$ per
mile for gas.
You don't need to try and feed them the full meal deal, they will just choke
on it and zone out on you. Give them just enough info to hook em and then
give them the rest of the info down the road. If you do it this way they
will
be interested enough to listen the next time (if they want to), otherwise
you
can talk to them forever and they just think you are some kind of looney
with
a pet project to force on them.
Learned the hard way.
Dave
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Sent: January 13, 2005 7:18 PM
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [email protected]
> Subject: RE: save the EV Rangers
>
>
> I know I shouldn't but I can't help it. I'm pissed off and dejected
> too when it comes to telling anyone about my EV, biodiesel, renewable
> energy, etc. When I mention I have an EV, the somewhat informed people
> respond with "An Insight or a Prius?" Then I explain to the that those
> aren't EV, they're just efficient gas powered cars. Then I explain the EV
> and half the people look at me like I'm crazy to invest so much
> money/effort/time when the same people wouldn't think twice about someone
> who modifies their ICE to go faster and get LESS mileage and the
> other half
> usually respond with "How do you drive really far?" That's when I ask them
> how much they drive every day, which is usually within the range of an EV,
> and I tell them I have a 13 mile round trip commute and the
> grocery store is
> 2 miles away and I have an ICE car for long trips, more than half of my
> driving. Incredibly some people have actually taken offense at EVs, as
> though they are un-American. Then, finally, many of the nicer
> people wind up
> the conversation with, "Well that's a really good thing to do,"
> which can be
> interpreted as "That's a really good thing for YOU to do, I'd never do
> anything like that." It's the wrong thing to do, but lately my
> attitude has
> been "Why waste my time." Part of the problem is the people I work with. I
> work with mostly good-old-boys who believe trucks and SUVs are the most
> patriotic vehicle you can drive and see no connection between
> deployments to
> the Middle East and their vehicles.
> A really smart friend of mine, who would have an EV if he had any
> car at all, explained to me that for someone to accept the idea
> of EVs, the
> have to change too much in their lives; mentally, fiscally, etc. They have
> to accept that the greenhouse effect is real (many still don't
> even thought
> the oil companies admit it is), they have to accept that our
> future security
> depends on an independent source of energy, that we don't really
> care about
> democracy in the Middle East, that they don't have to worry about what the
> Joneses think, that their 2nd car CAN be a battery powered car
> instead of a
> trophy ICE, that SUVs are not safer in an accident, etc., etc.
> And then they
> are finally ready to sell the Expedition and buy a converted car
> or convert
> their own. If there are any hard sci-fi fans out there you might
> have heard
> of this guy. Stephen Baxter wrote a book where an extraordinary event
> happened and a giant object appeared in the sky. People who saw couldn't
> look at it for extended periods of time not because it was too bright but
> because their human brains couldn't handle such a strange anomaly. They
> would have to physically look away from it. That's how I perceive a lot of
> people react to EVs. The idea is so radically different and goes against
> what they have been taught and believe and have learned that they need to
> make arguments against them or make a deflecting joke about 50 mile
> extension cords. Not only are they mistaken in much of what they
> believe and
> know, they don't want to be corrected.
> I'm sorry to vent.
>
> John Shelton
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: James Jarrett [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Sent: Friday, January 14, 2005 07:00 AM
> To: [email protected]
> Subject: Re: save the EV Rangers
>
>
>
>
> Felix Gardner wrote:
> > First it was the EV1 and now the Ranger. I didn't even know about
> > what happened to the EV1 until two days ago. This makes me so angry!
> > I don't even drive an EV, but it is just so . . . . AHGHAAAA!!!
>
> *SNIP*
>
> And therein lies the problem. Your'e interested in EVs (else you would
> not be here) and *you* had not heard about what happened to the EV1
> until recently.
>
> The vast majority of the population has no clue either, in fact, when I
> try to tell people what happened to the EV1 *THEY DON'T BELIEVE ME*.
> Even my friends seem to think I'm some left wing conspiracy theorist.
>
> It's only after the fact when I tell them to look it up for themselves
> that they start to believe me.
>
> The auto companies have plenty of money for ads saying what they want
> and to sweep what they don't under the carpet. And that's a shame.
> Most people that have even heard of the EV1 believe it was a failed
> experiment because it didn't work or people didn't want it.
>
> Don't even get me started on fool cells...
>
>
> *SIGH* Sorry to vent, just generally pi**ed at the world right now. I
> have no EV, there likely isn't one in my very near future, and the
> powers that be like it that way.
>
> James
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Something else you could try, if you are going to take the adapter out
anyway, is to take it to EA and have them check it for symetry and proper
sizing?
David C. Wilker Jr.
USAF (RET)
"I'm figuring out what's good for me, but only by a process of elimination"
----- Original Message -----
From: "David Dymaxion" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Thursday, January 13, 2005 8:13 PM
Subject: Re: EA Adapter plate reliab. & torque rotation ?s
It's painful to hear about spending so much money! Maybe you
shouldn't give up quite yet, it would be doubly painful to hear you
bought another adapter and still had the problem.
First, are you sure that it is the adapters fault? Presumably
everything is smooth with the clutch in (so flywheel is OK). Is it
smooth with the clutch out and in neutral? Does it only make the
noise in gear under load? Does every gear make the noise?
You might have bearings that have gone bad in the tranny -- have you
been able to rule that out?
I would consider this last resort, but better than throwing away the
adapter. An SCCA publication recommended doing this, and Steve Clunn
does something similar on his videos (http://www.grassrootsev.com).
Drill out the tranny bolt and pin holes oversize. Bolt the motor and
tranny together tight enough it doesn't slip, but loose enough a
mallet can budge them. Run the motor, tap the tranny, and keep doing
the clutch until the noise is minimized. Then tighten the bolts all
the way. Optionally, you could drill and drive in new locating pins
if you wanted to make the fit repeatable.
--- Bob Bath <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Hey all,
I'm currently hot on the trail to solve the final
issue on CivicWithACord: a tranny-adapter plate issue
that kind of chatters/roars when over 25 mph, or under
heavy load.
As you may have heard, I believe it is an issue
that occured because my fabricator was off a few
thousandths. EA swears they have developed patterns.
Sooo, I'm out $900 for the existing adapter, and $750
for the new one, but I _will_ have a properly quiet
EV!
My question:
Anyone out there purchased EA? Do they use solid
dowel pins? Bolts only secure one so far... I do
have a motor mount on the casing end of the motor, but
still want to have as little torque rotation as
possible. In my mind, dowel pins keep the motor in
line with the tranny, and put the force on the tranny
mounts.
=====
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The all-new My Yahoo! - What will yours do?
http://my.yahoo.com
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--- Begin Message ---
The following site has made it easy to compose and
send letters to car company officials urging them to
drop their lawsuit against California's clean air
requirements:
http://actionnetwork.org/campaign/car_company_lawsuit/i5kw6w2ojm37w7#
Every little bit helps.
=====
Sherry Boschert
President
San Francisco Electric Auto Association
415-681-7716
www.sfeaa.org
There are 941 electric vehicles and neighborhood electric vehicles in San
Francisco (DMV statistics). Driving with no gas, no oil, no noise, no emissions
-- no kidding!
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Victor Tikhonov [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> I always thought if this would be a good idea - to use
> polarized wind shield glass and headlight lens.
This very idea was the subject of Edwin Land's first patent, and the
reason he started Polaroid Inc. He couldn't get the auto companies
interested, and so went on to other products which *did* sell.
--
"Never doubt that the work of a small group of thoughtful, committed
citizens can change the world. Indeed, it's the only thing that ever
has!" -- Margaret Mead
--
Lee A. Hart 814 8th Ave N Sartell MN 56377 leeahart_at_earthlink.net
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--- Begin Message ---
Hi John , sounds a little like the 3ed stage of "EV madness" :-) . That EV
high that had you walking around with the big smile , well like all highs
there are some low's , Like watching uncle Sam choke on an big piece of meat
, you want to stand up , go to his table and do the Hedrick maneuver, but
everybody at your table tells you to stay seated , somebody else will take
car of it . Every stop light , where your surrounded buy gas burners , every
time you turn on the TV , there Uncle Sam down on the ground choking away,
You feel you must do something , So much of what you wrote , I can identify
with , More ev drivers would help , think if there was another ev driver at
work, the two of you at the water cooler , bubbling over with the EV take ,
with those big EV grins , talking about ev stuff, now this would make the
gas burning people take note. As for saving the EV rangers , my ev ranger
is in N.C . and needs a home , I'm entertaining any offers ,
Steve Clunn
----- Original Message -----
From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; <[email protected]>
Sent: Thursday, January 13, 2005 10:18 PM
Subject: RE: save the EV Rangers
> I know I shouldn't but I can't help it. I'm pissed off and dejected
> too when it comes to telling anyone about my EV, biodiesel, renewable
> energy, etc. When I mention I have an EV, the somewhat informed people
> respond with "An Insight or a Prius?" Then I explain to the that those
> aren't EV, they're just efficient gas powered cars. Then I explain the EV
> and half the people look at me like I'm crazy to invest so much
> money/effort/time when the same people wouldn't think twice about someone
> who modifies their ICE to go faster and get LESS mileage and the other
half
> usually respond with "How do you drive really far?" That's when I ask them
> how much they drive every day, which is usually within the range of an EV,
> and I tell them I have a 13 mile round trip commute and the grocery store
is
> 2 miles away and I have an ICE car for long trips, more than half of my
> driving. Incredibly some people have actually taken offense at EVs, as
> though they are un-American. Then, finally, many of the nicer people wind
up
> the conversation with, "Well that's a really good thing to do," which can
be
> interpreted as "That's a really good thing for YOU to do, I'd never do
> anything like that." It's the wrong thing to do, but lately my attitude
has
> been "Why waste my time." Part of the problem is the people I work with. I
> work with mostly good-old-boys who believe trucks and SUVs are the most
> patriotic vehicle you can drive and see no connection between deployments
to
> the Middle East and their vehicles.
> A really smart friend of mine, who would have an EV if he had any
> car at all, explained to me that for someone to accept the idea of EVs,
the
> have to change too much in their lives; mentally, fiscally, etc. They have
> to accept that the greenhouse effect is real (many still don't even
thought
> the oil companies admit it is), they have to accept that our future
security
> depends on an independent source of energy, that we don't really care
about
> democracy in the Middle East, that they don't have to worry about what the
> Joneses think, that their 2nd car CAN be a battery powered car instead of
a
> trophy ICE, that SUVs are not safer in an accident, etc., etc. And then
they
> are finally ready to sell the Expedition and buy a converted car or
convert
> their own. If there are any hard sci-fi fans out there you might have
heard
> of this guy. Stephen Baxter wrote a book where an extraordinary event
> happened and a giant object appeared in the sky. People who saw couldn't
> look at it for extended periods of time not because it was too bright but
> because their human brains couldn't handle such a strange anomaly. They
> would have to physically look away from it. That's how I perceive a lot of
> people react to EVs. The idea is so radically different and goes against
> what they have been taught and believe and have learned that they need to
> make arguments against them or make a deflecting joke about 50 mile
> extension cords. Not only are they mistaken in much of what they believe
and
> know, they don't want to be corrected.
> I'm sorry to vent.
>
> John Shelton
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: James Jarrett [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Sent: Friday, January 14, 2005 07:00 AM
> To: [email protected]
> Subject: Re: save the EV Rangers
>
>
>
>
> Felix Gardner wrote:
> > First it was the EV1 and now the Ranger. I didn't even know about
> > what happened to the EV1 until two days ago. This makes me so angry!
> > I don't even drive an EV, but it is just so . . . . AHGHAAAA!!!
>
> *SNIP*
>
> And therein lies the problem. Your'e interested in EVs (else you would
> not be here) and *you* had not heard about what happened to the EV1
> until recently.
>
> The vast majority of the population has no clue either, in fact, when I
> try to tell people what happened to the EV1 *THEY DON'T BELIEVE ME*.
> Even my friends seem to think I'm some left wing conspiracy theorist.
>
> It's only after the fact when I tell them to look it up for themselves
> that they start to believe me.
>
> The auto companies have plenty of money for ads saying what they want
> and to sweep what they don't under the carpet. And that's a shame.
> Most people that have even heard of the EV1 believe it was a failed
> experiment because it didn't work or people didn't want it.
>
> Don't even get me started on fool cells...
>
>
> *SIGH* Sorry to vent, just generally pi**ed at the world right now. I
> have no EV, there likely isn't one in my very near future, and the
> powers that be like it that way.
>
> James
>
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--- Begin Message ---
>
> I would consider this last resort, but better than throwing away the
> adapter. An SCCA publication recommended doing this, and Steve Clunn
> does something similar on his videos (http://www.grassrootsev.com).
> Drill out the tranny bolt and pin holes oversize.
You don't even need to drill the holes bigger just use smaller bolts and
remove the pins for the test. Run the motor first with the set up you have
so you know how it sounds. Have the motor sitting with tail shaft pointing
toward the ground and tranny sitting on top , I start off with 12v and then
24v. You do the tapping while the motor is running so you can hear the
difference. You may also have to release the clutch a few time to get it
centered.
Bolt the motor and
> tranny together tight enough it doesn't slip, but loose enough a
> mallet can budge them. Run the motor, tap the tranny, and keep doing
> the clutch until the noise is minimized. Then tighten the bolts all
> the way. Optionally, you could drill and drive in new locating pins
> if you wanted to make the fit repeatable.
>
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--- Begin Message ---
Please, no political firestorm on the EVDL. I'd love it if any of the
NEDRA greats could set Rush Limbaugh straight about EVs being slow
and unloved! Quote below, and contact info below that.
>From the Rush Limbaugh show Thursday Jan 13, 2005:
�driving these little electric cars that nobody wants in the first
place, not even the kooks that drive them. They don�t really want
them, they just think that they are doing good. They don�t want them
either. Nobody wants this garbage. Nobody wants to take technological
status backwards. Nobody wants to pull into a power plant every 30
miles and recharge before you can head on down the highway at your
speedy 40 miles an hour. Who the hell wants that?
YOU can call The Rush Limbaugh Show program line between 12 Noon and
3PM Eastern Time at: 1-800-282-2882
You can e-mail Rush at: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
You can fax Rush at: 212-563-9166
You can write Rush at:
The Rush Limbaugh Show
1270 Avenue of the Americas
New York, NY 10020
=====
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The all-new My Yahoo! - What will yours do?
http://my.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi Justin,
It sounds like you're thinking of generator trailers. Pusher trailers
are something else, they actually push your EV down the road. The ones
I've seen on the web are made from the front end of a VW Rabbit. (You
can use one that's been totaled by a rear-end collision.) Here are
some links:
http://www.jstraubel.com/EVpusher/EVpusher2.htm
http://www.mrsharkey.com/pusher.htm
The benefit of a pusher trailer over a generator trailer is greater
efficiency. The generator trailer 1) burns fuel 2) generates
electricity 3) charges your batteries, which 4) turn your motor and
wheels. The pusher trailer 1) burns fuel and 2) turns the wheels.
Dropping the "charge the batteries" step increases efficiency - in
theory. I don't know if anyone's done any measurements.
I am also thinking of building a pusher trailer someday. The guys who
did the systems listed above seemed to have a lot of trouble with the
throttle control. My idea is to use an aftermarket cruise control and
put the controls in the EV and the actuators in the trailer. I'd also
like to figure out a way to make the brakes work, so stopping distance
doesn't suffer. Perhaps a set of trailer brakes can be fitted.
Like Mr. Sharkey, I'd like a diesel motor in the pusher so I could burn
biodiesel.
But first, I need to get my EV running! And also figure out a way to
put a trailer hitch on a VW Karmann Ghia. :)
Ultimately, I'd like to see some sort of standard for pusher trailers,
so any EV could hook to any pusher. Then just rent the pusher from
UHaul when you need extra range. Ah well, perhaps someday, when there
are enough EVs on the road to make it worthwhile.
For completeness, I should mention that there's another type of
range-extending trailer - one that's full of extra batteries. I can't
find a link to a car-sized one, but Craig Uyeda built one for his
electric scooter, as shown here:
http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/570.html
The drawback of this idea is the sad fact that today's batteries only
store a tiny percentage of the energy of the equivalent weight of
gasoline, so either you don't get much additional range, or your
trailer weighs more than your car and costs a fortune.
On Thursday, January 13, 2005, at 05:58 PM, Justin Van Deusen wrote:
Hello Everyone,
I am new to the list but have been reading many archived messages etc.
I
really enjoy reading them and have been learning a lot. I would like to
start my own EV Coversion soon. I'm Leaning towards DC to get my "feet
wet". If I do a conversion I am thinking about a
good performance single Engine EV Machine (Hey im young and need a
toy).
However the bane of this idea is of course range. I need at least 60
miles on a charge in order to cover my needs. I realize this is
difficult if you are trying to keep a lightweight EV in respect to
battery weight. Therfore, I have been thinking about Range Extending
trailers everyday it seems. It is driving my crazy! So I thought I
would
ask the experts. Is a High Voltage DC Pusher Trailer possible? If so,
what would be the basic components of the system? So far what I have
researched has not turned up much. I found AC Propulsion's Version but
noticed the current output is rather low. Makes sense with an AC Motor
from what I have read. What about DC motors? Your thoughts? My
apologies
if this has been covered before (I tried to find something to no
avail).
Thanks!
Justin
--
Doug Weathers
Bend, OR, USA
http://learn-something.blogsite.org
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