EV Digest 4076
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) Re: WarP 11 and 13 questions
by "Paul Compton" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) Re: NEDRA 100 mph Club Clarification
by James D Thompson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) Once a rolling science project always a rolling science project...
by "damon henry" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) Converting a Dodge Caravan
by Chris Zach <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) Re: Converting a Dodge Caravan
by Derrick J Brashear <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) Re: Converting a Dodge Caravan
by "Ryan Stotts" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7) DC/DC Converter manual?
by "Ryan Stotts" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8) Re: Good flooded battery dealer in DFW/Austin, TX area?
by "David Roden" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
9) Re: Charging cord ejection
by "David Roden" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) Re: Converting a Dodge Caravan
by Mike Chancey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
11) Re: Used Hawkers
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
12) Re: NEDRA 100 mph Club Clarification
by "Joe Strubhar" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13) RE: Source for GE motor brushes?
by "Markus L" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
14) Re: Converting a Dodge Caravan
by Rod Hower <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
15) Re: Used Hawkers
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16) High Voltage - let go!
by "Don Cameron" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
17) Re: NEDRA 100 mph Club Clarification
by "Roy LeMeur" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
18) Re: NEDRA 100 mph Club Clarification
by "Roderick Wilde" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
19) Re: Madman's 100mph no BS club
by "Rich Rudman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
20) Re: NEDRA 100 mph Club Clarification
by "Rich Rudman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
21) Re: NEDRA 100 mph Club Clarification
by "Roderick Wilde" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
22) Sick EV Humor Revisited
by "Roy LeMeur" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
23) Re: NEDRA 100 mph Club Clarification
by "Ryan Stotts" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
24) Re: Sick EV Humor Revisited
by "Ryan Stotts" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
25) Re: High Voltage - let go!
by "Roland Wiench" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
26) Re: Converting a Dodge Caravan
by Chris Zach <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
27) Re: Converting a Dodge Caravan
by "Tom Shay" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
28) Re: DC/DC Converter manual?
by Bob Bath <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
29) RE: High Voltage - let go!
by "Don Cameron" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--- Begin Message ---
The chassis dyno cannot account for the unknown drivetrain losses, so
all it can give you is rear wheel HP and torque referred back to the
motor shaft.
Every professional rolling road dyno I've ever seen is capable of estimating
driveline losses from a coastdown. The accuracy of this varies, but it's a
standard procedure to give you a 'flywheel' figure. You have to do this test
anyway or otherwise you'll get a lower figure than you should due to the
extra tyre losses associated from running them on a roller, rathe than a
flat road. It should be noted that motorcycle trye manufacturers recommend
that tyres used for dyno runs should not be used on the road or track
afterwards due to the stress put on the carcase.
Paul Compton
www.sciroccoev.co.uk
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
>Concerning the "Maniac Mazda", we have raced it licensed and insured but
>due to the modifications I think it would be very unfair and unsportsman
>like to try and pass it off as a street conversion class vehicle.
How so? From what I've seen, it's not any farther from "street" than the
Zombie is, maybe a bit closer since it has a working tranny. Bring that
rotary rocket out of retirement.
David Thompson
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Another day another battery reconfiguration, but then again I have never
paid for a battery on this project, so what do I expect. I loved my
motorcycle when it had the 8 Saft Nicad modules on it. I could easily get
it up to 60 mph and had a solid 30 - 40 miles range. I never liked the way
it looked however with those big bulky batteries strapped on it, and I
always had problems with my chain alignment in order to make space for the
batteries. http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/497.html
When the Safts started to die off and I only had 6 good ones left I decided
to remount the motor to take care of the chain alignment and have everything
ready to drop in that dream pack of batteries some day. I started
collecting aircraft starter NiCad's and found some very nice looking battery
boxes that fit well on the bike, while tooling around town on a very range
limited set of UPS AGMs. I was excited about the thought of having a nice
clean looking bike finally, and was optimistic that with the new NiCads I
could still have enough range to make the 17 miles to John Wayland's house.
Unfourtunately as I started collecting the Nicads I found that most of them
were not delivering in the high 30 ahr range I was hoping for. High 20's
and low 30's was more the norm. Still I did have some willing to put out 36
- 38 ahrs and with a seemingly unlimited supply I just figured it was only a
matter of time and testing before I had a pack that might get me to John's
house again. But now my supply seems to have dried up, and my patience has
run out.
I decided to get the 6 good Saft modules I have back on the bike, and use as
many of the NiCad cells as I could get on the bike to bump the voltage up.
I got it all put back together last night, with 4 groups of 3 paralleled
cells giving me a little more speed than the Saft modules can on their own.
Still I am limited to just under 50 mph right now, so I might try and fit a
few more of the cells on to get my voltage up a bit higher. I should have
good range. I should be able to ride a good 25 - 30 miles on a full charge,
but I will have to limit my freeway riding to an absolute minimum at these
speeds. I think I can get another 6 cells on if I try which would put me in
the low to mid 50's for top speed.
So for now, it's ugly again, and a bit speed limited, but should be very
functional. Most of my riding is on 40 - 50 mph roads. After I have some
test runs on these new batteries it will be time to try a trek to John
Wayland's house again.
I'm sure hoping that the guys at ProEV have good luck with those big Kokam
LiPoly cells, as right now that is the only battery I see with potential to
make my EM everything I want it to be. In the meantime though I am
delighted to have something that is not perfect, but still a lot of fun!
damon
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Well, the family Caravan is not going to last forever. Although the body
is fine, the motor is starting to burn oil; eventually it will fail.
After 150k miles it's probably about time.
This might mean I could convert it to electric. Has anyone ever
converted a Caravan, thoughts on battery placement and what kind of
adapter could fit the 3 speed transmission?
Chris
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On Sat, 5 Feb 2005, Chris Zach wrote:
Well, the family Caravan is not going to last forever. Although the body is
fine, the motor is starting to burn oil; eventually it will fail. After 150k
miles it's probably about time.
This might mean I could convert it to electric. Has anyone ever converted a
Caravan, thoughts on battery placement and what kind of adapter could fit the
3 speed transmission?
What year is it? Seeing as the TEVans had their batteries under the floor
and later models had the fold down seats that folded flush, some sort of
underfloor battery mounting should be possible. I'm lazy; mine is 15 years
old, starting to rust, and has 218k miles on it and so isn't worth
converting, but if it were I think I would choose one of the middle or
rear seats as one to always be in and mount a battery box partially in the
floor under it. even putting the batteries in the back shouldn't mess up
handling too badly though you'd probably want stiffer springs. I drove
mine 300-some miles back from South Jersey with a railroad interlocking
machine in the back, if it could take that 1500 pounds of batteries
shouldn't be a big deal either.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
>Caravan, thoughts on battery placement and what kind of
>adapter could fit the 3 speed transmission?
I'd build a rack using angle iron and mount the batteries in
the back.
Get an adaptor for the motor here:
http://www.electroauto.com/catalog/adaptors.shtml
Get a tape measure out and see how big an area you have for
batteries. For example, my trunk is roughly 43" wide and
33" deep. I think I could fit 18 orbitals in there with
them being 10" long, and 7" wide.
Here is an example of a rack (not my car):
http://img182.exs.cx/img182/83/032404battrackcrossmemberslg0o.jpg
Imagine one that looks like that for the "lid" or the top of
it. Bolt it down through the sub frame rails. Use either
some really big, thick washers, or maybe even 3" square 1/8"
thick plate on the underside of the frame rail to keep the
bolts from pulling through. When you mount your rack(s),
imagine if the vehicle was upside down if the bolts would
keep the batteries held to the floor? If the vechicle came
to a sudden stop, would the batteries stay in place?
This site has some good info:
http://www.driveev.com/jeepev/convpgs/battboxes.php
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Anyone have a link to an instruction manual for a DC/DC
converter (12 volt)?
Thanks.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On 4 Feb 2005 at 16:12, Mark Hastings wrote:
> I'm looking for 20-24 6VGC batteries preferably someone who would cast L-Posts
> on them.
US Battery will supply ^any^ battery with L posts on request.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Good find, John. As for price, the page below gives a price of $172.80 for
the 20 amp version. I'm sure there are other prices available; this was
just the first I found in a quick web search.
http://lifestarrescue.com/Electrical.html
= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
Want to unsubscribe, stop the EV list mail while you're on vacation, or
switch to digest mode? See http://www.evdl.org/help/
= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
1991 Solectria Force 144vac
1991 Ford Escort Green/EV 128vdc
1970 GE Elec-trak E15 36vdc
1974 Avco New Idea rider 36vdc
= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
When the president does it, that means it is not illegal.
-- Richard Nixon
= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Chris Zach wrote:
>Caravan, thoughts on battery placement and what kind of
>adapter could fit the 3 speed transmission?
Why not convert it to a 5 speed manual and then work from that? The
automatic trans in the Caravan is the most unreliable component. They
stopped offering Caravans in the US with 5 speeds in 1993 or so, but it is
still an option in Europe and I believe in Canada as well. (Would you
believe they sell a turbo diesel version in Europe?) I would bet virtually
all the parts are in the US system, just not listed for Caravans.
I had an '86 cargo version with the 4 cylinder and the 5 speed, fun little
thing I wish I still had.
There is an older ('87) Caravan conversion in the Album at:
http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/377.html It is AC drive with a custom
controller and 24 Optima Red Tops.
Off course you could use the TEVan for inspiration. Sealed lead acid
batteries mounted in underbody pods would make for a very clean
conversion. You could redo the suspension to raise the body a bit, with
the batteries underneath the CG would still be low. That seems to be what
they did on the TEVans as they sat a little higher than an ICE
Caravan. They also had 15" wheels.
I have been kicking the idea around of converting a Caravan for a
while. Say find a low mileage one with a bad automatic, convert it to
stick, then convert it to electric. With the batteries under the chassis
there should be room under the hood for an on-board generator to extend the
range as needed. Could be fun. of course I have about 10 zillion other
projects I should get to first.
Thanks,
Mike Chancey,
'88 Civic EV
'95 Solectria Force
Kansas City, Missouri
EV List Photo Album at: http://evalbum.com
My Electric Car at: http://www.geocities.com/electric_honda
Mid-America EAA chapter at: http://maeaa.org
Join the EV List at: http://www.madkatz.com/ev/evlist.html
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
<<Are these the same Hawkres everyone likes to much? $39.95, 51AH, 52lbs.
http://www.industrialliquidators.com/wesell/batteries.html>>
I saw these a couple of weeks ago.
They are older looking and more beat up than most of the used batteries they
carry, and if I'm not mistaken, much larger than the ones usually discussed
here.
HTH,
Ben
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
You apparently haven't seen very much - it is NOT a street-legal vehicle, as
it has been heavily modified.
Joseph H. Strubhar
E-Mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Web: www.gremcoinc.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "James D Thompson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Saturday, February 05, 2005 12:54 PM
Subject: Re: NEDRA 100 mph Club Clarification
> >Concerning the "Maniac Mazda", we have raced it licensed and insured but
> >due to the modifications I think it would be very unfair and unsportsman
> >like to try and pass it off as a street conversion class vehicle.
>
> How so? From what I've seen, it's not any farther from "street" than the
> Zombie is, maybe a bit closer since it has a working tranny. Bring that
> rotary rocket out of retirement.
>
> David Thompson
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Otmar,
I just recently had to find brushes for my Elec-trac GE sep-ex motor.
I called Repco, talked to Scott Tussey, and he dug up the right
brushes for me. He was VERY helpful and knowledgeable. He said he's
been selling brushes since '72. I highly recommend him:
http://www.repcoinc.com
Repco Inc.
6 Eves Dr,
Marlton NJ 08053
Scott Tussey
1-800-822-9190
Hope this helps
Markus
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Otmar
> Sent: Freitag, 4. Februar 2005 01:03
> To: [email protected]
> Subject: Source for GE motor brushes?
>
>
> Hi All,
>
> I'm working on a Soleq Escort conversion here.
> I've discovered that after only 15,000 miles the brushes are worn
> down to the rivets!
>
> This is for a sep ex GE Mod 5DT2366C26, it's about 11" in diameter.
> Ratings are fan cooled at: 24.9 HP at 2507 rpm, 103.7V at 205A.
> The old brushes are M785 material which Dennis tells me is for low
> voltage motors (up to 80V). I'm thinking that with a 108 V system and
> regen it may need a more resistive material to survive.
>
> Does anyone know a good source for GE brushes?
>
> Thanks!
> --
> -Otmar-
>
> http://www.CafeElectric.com/ Home of the Zilla.
> http://www.evcl.com/914 My electric 914
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Chris,
Try and find a Dodge Caravan (TEVan) carcus
and start from there. I'm sure there is a TEVan
somewhere that somebody would sell for cheap.
This is already setup for 30 batteries connected to
the frame. I think it would be too much work to
convert an existing van that is not set up for the
batteries.
My TEVan is a great family vehicle for our family
of 5.
Good luck on your family EV!
Here's mine,
http://www.qsl.net/w8rnh/tevanh/image4.html
http://www.qsl.net/w8rnh/tevanh/image10.html
--- Chris Zach <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Well, the family Caravan is not going to last
> forever. Although the body
> is fine, the motor is starting to burn oil;
> eventually it will fail.
> After 150k miles it's probably about time.
>
> This might mean I could convert it to electric. Has
> anyone ever
> converted a Caravan, thoughts on battery placement
> and what kind of
> adapter could fit the 3 speed transmission?
>
> Chris
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
> http://www.industrialliquidators.com/wesell/batteries.html
> Are these the same Hawkers everyone likes so much?
> $39.95, 51AH, 52lbs.
No; they are Hawker UPS batteries. They would work in an EV, but aren't
really built for high currents.
We bought 12 of them surplus for our BEST kid's EVs about 5 years ago,
and then 4 more two years ago from ABC Electronics in Minneapolis MN.
The price was about half of what these guys want.
They have worked out very well in our application, but we limit max
current to 20-30 amps with a circuit breaker. The ones that haven't been
dropped, run dead and left for 6 months, or charged in the reverse
direction (arrgh... kids!!!) have survived very well.
--
If you would not be forgotten
When your body's dead and rotten
Then write of great deeds worth the reading
Or do the great deeds worth repeating
-- Ben Franklin, Poor Richard's Almanac
--
Lee A. Hart 814 8th Ave N Sartell MN 56377 leeahart_at_earthlink.net
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I am curious about working with high voltage. I have heard, that at 50
volts it possibly can kill you (given the right circumstances), but at 150V
it will certainly kill you because you will be unable to let go of the
circuit - your muscles will contract and hold on.
So what is the scoop? (besides the obvious: be very careful!)
Don
Victoria, BC, Canada
See the New Beetle EV Conversion Web Site at
www.cameronsoftware.com/ev/
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Roderick wrote:
Concerning the "Maniac Mazda", we have raced it licensed and insured but
due to the modifications I think it would be very unfair and unsportsman
like to try and pass it off as a street conversion class vehicle.
How so? From what I've seen, it's not any farther from "street" than the
Zombie is, maybe a bit closer since it has a working tranny. Bring that
rotary rocket out of retirement.
David Thompson
Rod is just trying to be honest about the aspects of the Maniac Mazda which
you would not normally consider to be "street trim".
The main things are the low-pressure wrinkle-wall slicks which are not
street legal, the spool in the differential, (not easy to deal with while
turning a corner) not to mention the lexan windows, stripped interior,
wheelie bars, -and the Wildeman behind the wheel, (definitely not street
legal)- :^D
Roy LeMeur Olympia, WA
My Electric Vehicle Pages:
http://www.angelfire.com/ca4/renewables/evpage.html
Informative Electric Vehicle Links:
http://www.angelfire.com/ca4/renewables/evlinks.html
EV Parts/Gone Postal Photo Galleries:
http://www.casadelgato.com/RoyLemeur/page01.htm
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
To once again quote the infamous Dennis Berube, "The proof is in the time
slips" This eliminates all BS. No more talk, just do it and then report it
to the list. End of story.
Roderick Wilde
"Suck Amps EV Racing"
www.suckamps.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Rich Rudman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Saturday, February 05, 2005 10:09 AM
Subject: Re: NEDRA 100 mph Club Clarification
Good idea!!!
righ now I have to get Plasma boys ideas since he's the only member.
As to my NOT ever being a memeber.. Well... don't count on that very long
Rod!!
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve Clunn" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Friday, February 04, 2005 10:54 PM
Subject: Re: NEDRA 100 mph Club Clarification
Hay Rich , for those who do make the club , how about a different paint
job
on there charger, That green canves is waiting. maybe a sticker "Madman
100
mph club " .
----- Original Message -----
From: "Rich Rudman" > The Madman 100 mph club is AS I stated...
>
> 100 mph on a time slip from a track.
> Licensed and titled... and completely street legal.
>
> All takers welcome... %100 electric Only.
>
> And the slate clears at years End... You have to do it every year.
>
> No BS...
> That's the kind of club I want to be a part of.
>
> Madman.
>
--
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--- Begin Message ---
No malice....
just a gental prodding with a a Dull stick!!
Getting Goldie to go 100 is not something I am bragging about.
The point of the no BS 100 is.... it's hard, even harder to do it years in a
row... and I don't take lightly to folks claiming they are memebers and
don't even have running EV.
I do. I have a long ways to go, and I may fail Even when I actually get
around to trying.
So.. I won't be putting my name on anything for awhile. Nedra doesn't see
my logic, and I don't want folks telling me how fast thier EV could have
gone or how fast it went 10 years ago....
You are either a current holder or you are not.
I am Not. I will let you all know when I am.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ken Trough" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Friday, February 04, 2005 3:38 PM
Subject: Madman's 100mph no BS club
> Rich Rudman wrote:
> > It's a long season...... and I have the parts....
> > A couple of spare motors, a spare tranny...
> > A Zilla2K and 20 Orbitals...and more if I want 'em.
>
> > Goldie needs some more trophies, before I turn her into razor blades.
>
> Rich talks a lot of smack when it comes to how to go fast on the strip,
> but I haven't EVER seen him actually do anything even competitive in
> Goldie in the 3 or 4 NEDRA Nationals I've attended. 100mph? Not even
> remotely close so far, from what I have seen.
>
> Rich made a GREAT smoke show up at REV! last year, though and there is
> photographic proof of that feat up at my site. He is certainly VERY
> qualified to talk about how to blow smoke effectively.
>
> All these volumes of posts about how to go faster though.... I think you
> need some more slips before your credibility factor reaches your current
> bragging/advice level Madman...
>
> In other words.... >Take it to the track< and when YOU have entered
> your own no BS club, you can tell the rest of us how you did it. Without
> the slips, your advice on how to break 100mph has a very BS ring to it.
>
> (Rich is a friend and he knows this wasn't posted with malice. Just a
> friendly, good natured ribbing.)
>
> -Ken Trough
> Admin - V is for Voltage Magazine
> http://visforvoltage.com
> AIM - ktrough
> FAX - 801-749-7807
> message - 866-872-8901
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I was actually thinking about awarding a PFC30 to those that DO make it.
Just thinking here! no promises.
But the two Guys that should make it this year, already have Green boxes..
and Brian Hall, I am not sure if his sprint is street legal.. But... he
could probably use a charger
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve Clunn" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Friday, February 04, 2005 10:54 PM
Subject: Re: NEDRA 100 mph Club Clarification
> Hay Rich , for those who do make the club , how about a different paint
job
> on there charger, That green canves is waiting. maybe a sticker "Madman
100
> mph club " .
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Rich Rudman" > The Madman 100 mph club is AS I stated...
> >
> > 100 mph on a time slip from a track.
> > Licensed and titled... and completely street legal.
> >
> > All takers welcome... %100 electric Only.
> >
> > And the slate clears at years End... You have to do it every year.
> >
> > No BS...
> > That's the kind of club I want to be a part of.
> >
> > Madman.
> >
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Thanks for the vote of confidence David. You must realize as my position in
NEDRA I have to be beyond reproach . We want to encourage new competition
not discourage it. For this sport to grow we need competition. Breaking 100
mph in the quarter was not a walk in the park, It took several years as it
did for John. Rich will learn this also the hard way. It is easy to get into
the 90's but extremely difficult to break 100. That is why we started the
club.
Roderick Wilde
NEDRA President
----- Original Message -----
From: "James D Thompson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Saturday, February 05, 2005 12:54 PM
Subject: Re: NEDRA 100 mph Club Clarification
>Concerning the "Maniac Mazda", we have raced it licensed and insured but
due to the modifications I think it would be very unfair and unsportsman
like to try and pass it off as a street conversion class vehicle.
How so? From what I've seen, it's not any farther from "street" than the
Zombie is, maybe a bit closer since it has a working tranny. Bring that
rotary rocket out of retirement.
David Thompson
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--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Some of the folks on this list may remember something I posted a few years
back called "The Fringengineer".
This was a copy of an unsolicited and unidentified email I received while
working at EV Parts.
This is it, originally linked to on the EVDL about three years ago-
http://www.angelfire.com/ca4/renewables/fringengineer.html
Today, out of the blue, I recieved the following email, which appears to be
from the same person/wingnut.
I considered whether I should post the whole thing including the contact
info or not.
Well... I decided that anyone that want to take a shot at this guy should
have ample opportunity. :^D
So... here it is, email address and all, Enjoy!!!-
(you need to read the link above first to get it if you have not already
seen it)
From : G.R.McCotter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent : Saturday, February 5, 2005 11:20 PM
To : [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject : From : McCotter Technologies - Who are you?
From:
Gerald R. McCotter
McCotter Technologies
To ??????????????
-----------------------
Mr. Roymemeur,
I don't know where you got this letter that you
published without my permission, but the I assume that
the response was in answer to YOUR QUESTIONS.
Perhaps people who ask strange questions get
strange answers.
The information that is in that letter is
so far behind in the times, I forget when
I even designed that conversion. Old News!
You see...I'm one of the hard working people that have
the Patents and Design Concepts while people like you
ask a lot of questions and are still trying to figure
it out.
Right now, I'm in the process of building a new
3 Phase Magneto Inertial Generator System. Looks
Promising...but...You wouldn't understand anything
about that, would you?
In the future when you're paying $10.00 per gallon for gasoline
at the pump...Remember Me!
I also hate self-appointed experts
Cheers
Gerald R. McCotter
McCotter Technologies
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Roy LeMeur Olympia, WA
My Electric Vehicle Pages:
http://www.angelfire.com/ca4/renewables/evpage.html
Informative Electric Vehicle Links:
http://www.angelfire.com/ca4/renewables/evlinks.html
EV Parts/Gone Postal Photo Galleries:
http://www.casadelgato.com/RoyLemeur/page01.htm
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
>From: "Roderick Wilde"
>To once again quote the infamous Dennis Berube, "The proof
>is in the time
>slips" This eliminates all BS. No more talk, just do it and
>then report it
>to the list. End of story.
Here is another quote that is one of my favorites from Ed
Curtis:
"Talk is cheap... take it to the track and prove your
point!"
http://www.flowtechinduction.com/
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
>Gerald R. McCotter
>McCotter Technologies
Interesting site he has there...
http://pages.prodigy.net/g_mccotter/mtech.htm
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hello Don,
Just don't touch any of the battery terminals while the batteries are
charging and standing in a puddle of water or grounding your self to the
metal body of the EV if it has the same reference to ground with a on board
charger.
Normally for maximum safety, used a Ground Fault Interrupter Circuit Breaker
for the charging circuit or if you are charging 20 amps or less on 120 VAC,
used a GFI 120 VAC recepticle.
Also, you can install the batteries in a total enclosed plastic or
fiberglass enclosurer that is epoxy coated using a shower or sink recoating
kit.
If you used a on board battery charger, you can also install it into another
epoxy coated glass container. Both of these containers are isolated from
any metal of the EV. Its like having a off board charging with only the two
DC charging leads to it.
Also, there should be two contactors that disconnects the battery pack from
the controller that is control by seperated voltage source, such as a 12
VDC. Normally these two additional contactors are call the safety
contactors, which is before the controller main contactor and motor
controller.
In some cases, if you do not have theses contactors which are normally off,
in the circuit while charging, you may have the charging voltage in the
controller system.
If you have this type of installation, as I have in my EV, I will at times,
test to see if there is any voltage potential to the EV chassic, by checking
this out with a volt meter from a battery terminal to the EV frame
When the battery charger is off, and battery circuits are all connected, the
maximum voltage of a battery pack should be at the two far ends of the
battery pack. For example, if you line up 30 each 12 volt batteries in a
roll, the end two will be about 30 feet apart. You cannot reach both ends
at the same time.
You also have to be careful when laying the batteries out in a square type
pattern, where you may have 5 batteries in one roll and another 5 batteries
in the next roll. In this configuration, you would have the 1st battery and
no 10 battery together in the adjacent rolls. This is about 120 volts
difference between these two batteries.
I used 6 volt batteries, so my difference is 60 volts between each roll.
You should keep the batteries super clean all the time. Even after you
clean them, you could read some voltage that is tracking across the battery
tops and may track to a adjacent battery. This is a another maintenance
test with a volt meter, to see if battery voltage is tracking.
In installing, battery connectors or links, all your tools, should be
insulated. All socket wrenches, torque wrenches, open or close end wrenches
used for battery work, should be insulated. I used a heavy duty heat
shrinks, that gets to be about 1/8 thick or more. Heat shrink the tools, so
only one end is expose.
Used a good set of mechanics gloves that have that rubberize coating on the
surface, normally for repelling grease and oil.
If you want to be more comfortable about this, you could get a set of
linemans gloves. I have a set of these, plus a rubber apron for installing
or pulling the batteries.
My batteries are a open type, of which I clean with a spray on battery
cleaner. The batteries cases are tight together, so there is residue of
this cleaner down the sides of which I cannot wash or wipe off. So when I
pull the batteries, it will make a mess of your hands if you are not rubber
gloves.
Another trick, I learn from a old battery guy back in the 70's, is that to
set the batteries on a bed of Baking Soda. You can do this if you have a
totally enclosed battery container. I have about 1 inch thick layer of
Baking Soda of which the batteries are setting on. Since doing this, the
inside of the battery box after 4 years of doing this is pure bright gloss
white. Before that, they would get a dirty yellow color.
If you used a battery rack for the batteries, than all the expose metal
should be insulated. This can be done, by taking it to a place that does
spray on bed liners. This does not have to be a rough black coating, you
can get it in any color that has a smooth texture.
Roland
----- Original Message -----
From: "Don Cameron" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Saturday, February 05, 2005 8:36 PM
Subject: High Voltage - let go!
> I am curious about working with high voltage. I have heard, that at 50
> volts it possibly can kill you (given the right circumstances), but at
> 150V
> it will certainly kill you because you will be unable to let go of the
> circuit - your muscles will contract and hold on.
>
> So what is the scoop? (besides the obvious: be very careful!)
>
> Don
>
> Victoria, BC, Canada
>
> See the New Beetle EV Conversion Web Site at
> www.cameronsoftware.com/ev/
>
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Why not convert it to a 5 speed manual and then work from that? The
automatic trans in the Caravan is the most unreliable component. They
stopped offering Caravans in the US with 5 speeds in 1993 or so, but it
is still an option in Europe and I believe in Canada as well. (Would
you believe they sell a turbo diesel version in Europe?) I would bet
virtually all the parts are in the US system, just not listed for Caravans.
The only reason this Caravan is still on the road is because it has the
"cheap" three speed transmission in it. Apparently the 4 speed super
nice transmission is absolute *GARBAGE* and literally eats it's bushings
and explodes every 40,000 miles. Right outside the warranty for most
people; they spend 2k on a new one and it blows up again. The three
speed auto is dumb as dirt, and has lasted over 150k.
That said, I'm not sure if I want to plumb in the connections for the
shifter. And I've gotten used to lack of shifting in the Prizm.
Off course you could use the TEVan for inspiration. Sealed lead acid
batteries mounted in underbody pods would make for a very clean
conversion. You could redo the suspension to raise the body a bit, with
the batteries underneath the CG would still be low. That seems to be
what they did on the TEVans as they sat a little higher than an ICE
Caravan. They also had 15" wheels.
I'd love to have a good clean TEVan. In fact I might sell or trade the
Prizm for it. That's probably the best way to go, as one also gets the
simple to maintain Nickel Iron or NiCD pack as well.
One possibility for a conversion would be to go with T145's, but then
again one could fit a *LOT* of 26ah Hawkers under that body.
Unbelievable amount of them :-)
I have been kicking the idea around of converting a Caravan for a
while. Say find a low mileage one with a bad automatic, convert it to
stick, then convert it to electric. With the batteries under the
chassis there should be room under the hood for an on-board generator to
extend the range as needed. Could be fun. of course I have about 10
zillion other projects I should get to first.
Lots of them in the junkyard. Very clean, great shape, blown
transmissions and a dent where the owner kicks them. Several times at
the pick-a-part place I have seen one come in on the truck; I follow
behind it like Wil-E-Coyote wit tools in hand.
Chris
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
There was considerable discussion several years ago about converting
minivans. As I recall a big problem is that if enough batteries are
installed to give decent range, then the weight of the batteries will fully
load the van and leave little or no capacity for hauling people or
cargo. What good is a van without capacity to haul people or stuff?
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi Ryan,
Hey-- you didn't mention the manufacturer. I have
one for DCP. What brand is yours? Or, what are you
trying to achieve with the manual?
(ie, my copy is hardcopy, but I could snail mail it to
you, or scan & post on website).
peace,
--- Ryan Stotts <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Anyone have a link to an instruction manual for a
> DC/DC
> converter (12 volt)?
>
> Thanks.
>
>
=====
'92 Honda Civic sedan, 144V
____
__/__|__\ __
=D-------/ - - \
'O'-----'O'-'
Would you still drive your car if the tailpipe came out of the steering wheel?
Are you saving any gas for your kids?
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail - 250MB free storage. Do more. Manage less.
http://info.mail.yahoo.com/mail_250
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Roland, thanks for the great reply. This is very useful information. But
it was not my question
My question was in regards to voltage levels: I have heard that 50 volts can
**possibly** kill you, but at 150V it will **certainly** kill you because
you will be unable to let go of the circuit - your muscles will contract and
hold on.
Is there any truth to this? Is 50V as dangerous as 400V? If not, why does
the higher voltage make it more dangerous? Simply because it takes more
insulation to protect from it?
Don
Victoria, BC, Canada
See the New Beetle EV Conversion Web Site at
www.cameronsoftware.com/ev/
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Roland Wiench
Sent: February 5, 2005 9:15 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: High Voltage - let go!
Hello Don,
Just don't touch any of the battery terminals while the batteries are
charging and standing in a puddle of water or grounding your self to the
metal body of the EV if it has the same reference to ground with a on board
charger.
Normally for maximum safety, used a Ground Fault Interrupter Circuit Breaker
for the charging circuit or if you are charging 20 amps or less on 120 VAC,
used a GFI 120 VAC recepticle.
Also, you can install the batteries in a total enclosed plastic or
fiberglass enclosurer that is epoxy coated using a shower or sink recoating
kit.
If you used a on board battery charger, you can also install it into another
epoxy coated glass container. Both of these containers are isolated from
any metal of the EV. Its like having a off board charging with only the two
DC charging leads to it.
Also, there should be two contactors that disconnects the battery pack from
the controller that is control by seperated voltage source, such as a 12
VDC. Normally these two additional contactors are call the safety
contactors, which is before the controller main contactor and motor
controller.
In some cases, if you do not have theses contactors which are normally off,
in the circuit while charging, you may have the charging voltage in the
controller system.
If you have this type of installation, as I have in my EV, I will at times,
test to see if there is any voltage potential to the EV chassic, by checking
this out with a volt meter from a battery terminal to the EV frame
When the battery charger is off, and battery circuits are all connected, the
maximum voltage of a battery pack should be at the two far ends of the
battery pack. For example, if you line up 30 each 12 volt batteries in a
roll, the end two will be about 30 feet apart. You cannot reach both ends
at the same time.
You also have to be careful when laying the batteries out in a square type
pattern, where you may have 5 batteries in one roll and another 5 batteries
in the next roll. In this configuration, you would have the 1st battery and
no 10 battery together in the adjacent rolls. This is about 120 volts
difference between these two batteries.
I used 6 volt batteries, so my difference is 60 volts between each roll.
You should keep the batteries super clean all the time. Even after you
clean them, you could read some voltage that is tracking across the battery
tops and may track to a adjacent battery. This is a another maintenance
test with a volt meter, to see if battery voltage is tracking.
In installing, battery connectors or links, all your tools, should be
insulated. All socket wrenches, torque wrenches, open or close end wrenches
used for battery work, should be insulated. I used a heavy duty heat
shrinks, that gets to be about 1/8 thick or more. Heat shrink the tools, so
only one end is expose.
Used a good set of mechanics gloves that have that rubberize coating on the
surface, normally for repelling grease and oil.
If you want to be more comfortable about this, you could get a set of
linemans gloves. I have a set of these, plus a rubber apron for installing
or pulling the batteries.
My batteries are a open type, of which I clean with a spray on battery
cleaner. The batteries cases are tight together, so there is residue of
this cleaner down the sides of which I cannot wash or wipe off. So when I
pull the batteries, it will make a mess of your hands if you are not rubber
gloves.
Another trick, I learn from a old battery guy back in the 70's, is that to
set the batteries on a bed of Baking Soda. You can do this if you have a
totally enclosed battery container. I have about 1 inch thick layer of
Baking Soda of which the batteries are setting on. Since doing this, the
inside of the battery box after 4 years of doing this is pure bright gloss
white. Before that, they would get a dirty yellow color.
If you used a battery rack for the batteries, than all the expose metal
should be insulated. This can be done, by taking it to a place that does
spray on bed liners. This does not have to be a rough black coating, you
can get it in any color that has a smooth texture.
Roland
----- Original Message -----
From: "Don Cameron" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Saturday, February 05, 2005 8:36 PM
Subject: High Voltage - let go!
> I am curious about working with high voltage. I have heard, that at 50
> volts it possibly can kill you (given the right circumstances), but at
> 150V
> it will certainly kill you because you will be unable to let go of the
> circuit - your muscles will contract and hold on.
>
> So what is the scoop? (besides the obvious: be very careful!)
>
> Don
>
> Victoria, BC, Canada
>
> See the New Beetle EV Conversion Web Site at
> www.cameronsoftware.com/ev/
>
>
>
--- End Message ---
