EV Digest 4187
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) EVLN(BlueCar Cleanova model using lithium metal polymer batteries)
by bruce parmenter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) EVLN(Longer-lasting hybrid batteries is done; cheaper is next)
by bruce parmenter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) Re: Vote: Would You Buy an EV-1 -- Was Re: Was GM DC office & EV-1 Vigil
by Ryan Stotts <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) Re: Transistor Votage Question
by Eric Poulsen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) Re: Transistor Votage Question
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) EV1 Vigil on N P R
by "David Roden (Akron OH USA)" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7) respond to NPR, Ariz. paper
by Sherry Boschert <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8) Re: Vote: Would You Buy an EV-1 -- Was Re: Was GM DC office & EV-1 Vigil
by David Dymaxion <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
9) RE: Was GM DC office & EV-1 Vigil
by "Ivo Jara" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) How fast can you do a conversion?
by Jeff Shanab <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
11) Re: Vote: Would You Buy an EV-1 -- Was Re: Was GM DC office & EV-1 Vigil
by "John Westlund" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
12) Re: How fast can you do a conversion?
by Mark Farver <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13) GM DC Office address
by "Chip Gribben" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
14) EV-1 Vigil
by Ken Trough <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
15) Re: How fast can you do a conversion?
by Ryan Stotts <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16)
by "David Roden (Akron OH USA)" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
17) Re: Was GM DC office & EV-1 Vigil
by Lightning Ryan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
18) Re: How fast can you do a conversion?
by "Roland Wiench" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
19) Re: How fast can you do a conversion?
by Nick Viera <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
20) FL EAA Meeting Notice
by "Shawn Waggoner" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
21) RE: dc-dc converter,5-40V, 5A control
by "Markus L" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
22) Re: Tires again and Powerwheels
by "Paul G." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
23) PowerPoint EV Presentation Updaet
by Bob Bath <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
24) Introduction
by John Martin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
25) Re: Powerpoint EV Presentation
by Neon John <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
26) Re: Transistor Votage Question
by "Peter VanDerWal" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
27) Re: PowerPoint EV Presentation Updaet
by Ryan Stotts <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
28) Re: PowerPoint EV Presentation Updaet
by "Dave" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
29) Re: How fast can you do a conversion?
by "STEVE CLUNN" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
30) Kilo-Amp-About or Excuses help the ego.
by Otmar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--- Begin Message ---
EVLN(BlueCar Cleanova model using lithium metal polymer batteries)
[The Internet Electric Vehicle List News. For Public EV
informational purposes. Contact publication for reprint rights.]
--- {EVangel}
http://www.autoindustry.co.uk/news/industry_news/news-5843man4pb
BatScap presents Mini-inspired electric car concept at Geneva
3rd March 2005
The French Society of Electric Vehicles, involving the Heuliez
specialist automotive assembly group, French power generator EDF
and entrepreneur Vincent Bollor�, wants to challenge the lead of
hybrid cars with a new �BlueCar� version of its Cleanova model
using rechargeable batteries.
Mr Bollor� has invested �48m in a lithium metal polymer battery
based on technology developed by his plastic film business. The
new battery is said to be five times lighter than lead-acid
alternatives, can last 10 years or 90,000 miles, and provides the
Blue Car with a 125-mile range before recharging.
The BlueCar has been designed by Philippe Guedon, former chairman
of Matra Automobiles and creator of the first Renault Espace. He
said he had drawn on the original Issigonis Mini for the new car.
(The Guardian)
===
http://www.greencarcongress.com/2005/03/bolloreacute_gr.html
March 07, 2005
Bollor� Group Introduces BlueCar Lithium-Metal-Polymer EV Concept
Bluecar
The Bollor� Group, through its subsidiary BatScap, introduced an
electric vehicle (EV) concept car using new its
Lithium-Metal-Polymer batteries at the Geneva Motor Show.
The Bollor� group is not trying to become an automaker, but is
eager to have its battery technology used in a vehicle.
The new BlueCar with its LMP batteries offers an operating range
of 200�250 kilometers (124�155 miles) and a top speed of 135 kmh
(84 mph).
A full recharge requires 6 hours; a two-hour rapid charge will
recover 50% capacity.
BlueCar has three front seats, and an 810-liter (28.6 cubic feet)
storage area in the rear. The vehicle is a mere 3.05 metres long,
or exactly the same length as the old Mini. Two fold-up jump
seats can also be installed in this area, making the BlueCar a
five-seater. Lmp_illbateriecoupe
The lithium-metal-polymer cell is a laminate of four ultra-thin
materials:
*A metallic lithium foil anode that acts as both a lithium source
and a current collector.
*A solid polymeric electrolyte created by dissolving a lithium
salt in a solvating co-polymer (polyoxyethylene).
* A cathode composed of vanadium oxide, carbon and polymer to
form a plastic composite.
*An aluminum foil current collector.
The ultra-thin films are layered, coiled, then compressed into a
prismatic shape and assembled into cells, which are then
assembled into modules.
LMP batteries offer advantages such as a much higher energy
capacity per unit volume and unit weight, and a very predictable
and stable charge/discharge characteristics over varying
environmental conditions�all very good qualities for an electric
vehicle battery.
BatScap is not alone in providing LMP technology for vehicles or
in looking for automakers as partners. Avestor, a subsidiary of a
Hydro-Qu�bec, has put its LMP modules into the prototype
CleanNova II delivery van for the French Post Office (earlier
post).
[Electric Vehicle Battery Technology
Energy Density Power Cycles Technology
(Wh/Kg) (Wh/l) (W/kg)
110 110 320 --- BatScap LMP
121 143 241 300 Avestor Prototype LMP
138 210 430 550 Li-ion
63 150 200 800 NiMH
50 90 120 800 Ni-Cad
36 86 180 600 Lead-Acid ]
-
Bruce {EVangel} Parmenter
' ____
~/__|o\__
'@----- @'---(=
. http://geocities.com/brucedp/
. EV List Editor, RE & AFV newswires
. (originator of the above ASCII art)
===== Undo Petroleum Everywhere
__________________________________
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Yahoo! Small Business - Try our new resources site!
http://smallbusiness.yahoo.com/resources/
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
EVLN(Longer-lasting hybrid batteries is done; cheaper is next)
[The Internet Electric Vehicle List News. For Public EV
informational purposes. Contact publication for reprint rights.]
--- {EVangel}
http://www.idahostatesman.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20050304/NEWS0202/503040337/1029/NEWS02
INL works to create better hybrid car batteries
Longer-lasting is done; cheaper may take a while
Edition Date: 03-04-2005 The Associated Press
IDAHO FALLS � Researchers at the Idaho National Laboratory have
already figured out how to make hybrid car batteries last more
than 10 years � even under extreme cold and heat.
Now they just need a way to make them cheap.
The work is part of the Department of Energy's $4 million
FreedomCAR program, meant to help automakers develop more
efficient gasoline and advanced hybrid vehicles and, eventually,
cars that run on hydrogen.
For years, the lab's primary work was running batteries for
weeks, months or even years in controlled-environment boxes that
could be kept at very cold temperatures until the batteries
stopped working. The tests helped manufacturers know how safe the
batteries were and how long their warranties should be.
"If we're going to put them in cars, we have to make them safe �
at least as safe as driving around above a tank of gas," said
chemist Tim Murphy, who runs the Energy Storage Technologies
Laboratory.
One of Murphy's recent projects was to test rechargeable
batteries for gas-electric hybrids. The manufacturer's goal was
to find one that could last about 15 years � and the best one
they had lasted only about two years.
"Now we're over 10 years � we're doing pretty good," Murphy said.
"We just haven't figured out how to make them cheap."
Automakers hope to get the cost of each battery down from about
$2,000 to $500 so the cars can compete in price with gasoline
vehicles. For instance, Murphy said, his team tested a Toyota
Prius battery and found that each one cost more than $5,000 to
build. That means Toyota is probably selling the $20,000 cars at
a loss, he said.
The batteries are expensive because hybrids use exotic metal
electrodes and solid polymers, instead of the relatively cheap
acid solutions surrounding metal plates in most batteries.
-
Bruce {EVangel} Parmenter
' ____
~/__|o\__
'@----- @'---(=
. http://geocities.com/brucedp/
. EV List Editor, RE & AFV newswires
. (originator of the above ASCII art)
===== Undo Petroleum Everywhere
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Make Yahoo! your home page
http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Ed Blackmond wrote:
> My only option is to do my own conversion. As I plan this multi-year
> endeavor, I read this list for its wealth of knowledge.
It's actually easier then you might think.
Have you selected your "ideal" vehicle for conversion yet? Or even
better, do you already have said vehicle?
Are you going to do an AC or DC conversion?
AC parts and info here: http://www.metricmind.com/
You can get a 8" DC motor (WarP or Advanced DC) for ~$1200 and a 9" for ~$1400.
Charger: http://www.manzanitamicro.com/
Controller: http://www.cafeelectric.com/
Find a place locally to get your Exide Orbitals or Interstate
distributes Optimas.
This site has good details on all the parts needed for the conversion:
http://www.electroauto.com/catalog/catalog.shtml
You COULD be driving your EV THIS MONTH! All it takes is some
money... That's really all it takes.
It's so easy that the only reason every person on this list isn't
already driving their EV that they converted their selves... is money.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Bill,
There isn't an easy answer to this, but suffice it to say "it depends."
In a transistor, you have a base, a collector, and an emitter. The
amount of current flow through the EC (emitter/collector) is
proportional to the current flow through the EB (emitter/base). The
ratio is usually very high 100:1 or 1000:1 or more. For example, if you
have 1 mA of current through the EB, you may have 1A flow through the
EC. The actual gain curve and ratio is different for different
transistors. The /voltage/ across the transistor depends on how it's
used in the circuit, and how much current is flowing in the EB
junction. A transistor sorta acts like a current controlled variable
resistor.
Often, especially in logic circuits, and PWM applications (like a motor
controller), it's desirable to use a transistor in an on/off application
where it's either fully on (saturated, full current), or fully off
(cutoff, no current flow). In this case, the transistor will either
have a very high resistance (multiple megohms or gigohms), or be nearly
a dead short, depending on whether it's off or on, respectively. In
these applications, the voltage drop across the resistor will be zero
when the transistor is off, or it will be nearly full voltage when the
transistor is on.
A typical circuit for logic, led control, relay control, etc. would look
like this:
+5vdc
|
\
/
\
|
+---------- out
|
| /
in --/\/\/\--|/
|\
| V
|
|
GND
A high voltage in (> approx 1 volt) will cause zero volts out, because
the transistor acts as a short, bringing the output low. A low voltage
in (0 volts) will cause 5 volts out, because the transistor is off, and
5 volts is supplied by the "pull-up" resistor.
Here's a page I found via Google that might help:
http://www.satcure-focus.com/tutor/page4.htm
Perhaps if you were to expand a bit on your particular situation (fixing
something? creating something?), I could give you a more precise
answer. I'm sure Lee will have a good response also.
Bill Dennis wrote:
If a resistor is connected in series with the collector of a transistor and
the two are connected across a voltage that may be different at different
times, how do you calculate how much voltage will be dropped by the resistor
and transistor respectively for different voltages? Thanks.
Bill Dennis
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Bill Dennis wrote:
> If a resistor is connected in series with the collector of a
> transistor and the two are connected across a voltage that may
> be different at different times, how do you calculate how much
> voltage will be dropped by the resistor and transistor respectively
> for different voltages?
It's not easy to say. The apparent resistance of the transistor varies,
depending on the base current (or gate voltage for a MOSFET). It can be
anything from essentially a short circuit when the transistor is driven
fully on (base current more than about 1/10th of the collector current,
or a gate voltage more than 10~15 volts for a MOSFET), to essentially an
open circuit when the transistor is fully off (zero base current or zero
gate voltage).
As a practical matter, you'll need the data sheet for the transistor in
question, and you'll need to know the base current (or gate voltage)
being applied. There are then curves to show the resulting
collector-emitter (or source-drain) voltage and current that will
result.
--
"Never doubt that the work of a small group of thoughtful, committed
citizens can change the world. Indeed, it's the only thing that ever
has!" -- Margaret Mead
--
Lee A. Hart 814 8th Ave N Sartell MN 56377 leeahart_at_earthlink.net
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Yesterday, N P R's evening news program All Things Considered aired a 4-
minute piece on this event. If you'd like to hear the report, you may download
it from this page:
http://www.akronchorus.org/ev1/
The file is about 7mb. Although it downloads with an .mp3 file extension,
it's
actually in MPEG-1 Layer 2 (mp2) format. That's a little unusual, but it
should play fine with most software-based players. Both Winamp and
Windoze Media Player work for me with the .mp3 extension.
If you want it please download it in the next week or two; I can't leave it
there
forever.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Here are easy ways to respond to the latest media
coverage of the EV1:
To give comments about NPR's Talk of the Nation
report, email [EMAIL PROTECTED] and maybe send a copy to
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Hear the story at:
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=4536236#email
To respond to the Arizona Republic's story ("Electric
car sputters, dies in the desert," March 15), which
sounded like GM's mouthpiece, go to:
http://www.azcentral.com/arizonarepublic/opinions/sendaletter.html
See the Ariz. story here:
http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/0315electriccars-ON.html
Sherry Boschert
SFEVA
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Disclaimer: I have no financial interest in the success or failure of
this company. Commutercars might be a viable option for you in the
near future:
http://www.commutercars.com
Kind of a moot point now, but did you actually drive an EV1? I'm your
height and weight and fit with no problems (rented several times,
several hundred miles of driving).
One of the pleasures of the EV1 was knowing you were driving the
world's most advanced car, with awesome aerodynamics, yet it was
sportscar fast. A question that I've had for years is why don't
automakers make super aerodynamic cars, at least for a few sports car
models? Besides the EV1, the automakers have come up with the Ranger
truck EV, the Dodge TEV minivan EV, the EV+, and the Rav4EV; all were
heavy, aero-draggy slugs.
--- Ed Blackmond <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> When I leased my EVPlus back in 1997 Honda claimed it would cost
> $60,000. At the time I would have had reservations paying that
> much
> for it. I would certainly be willing to pay that for it now. In
> 2002
> I was ready to pay $42,000 for a Rav4-EV, but Honda told me I could
>
> keep my EVPlus for as long as it met my needs. I would gladly pay
> that
> for a Rav4-EV today.
>
> I'm not so interested in a used car. I want to put my own
> scratches on
> it and grind my own dirt into the floor mats. Even so, Rav4-Ev's
> coming off their leases are going for ~$35,000 on eBay; I might
> convince myself to go for one of those.
>
> I'm not interested in the EV-1. It simply isn't designed for a
> 6'4"
> 200lb out of shape middle aged man. It is just to hard to get into
> and
> out of the vehicle and ducking to keep my head from being wedged
> into
> the roof is uncomfortable.
>
> Somebody talked about importing electric Smart cars. That would
> work
> for me. They look small, but are quite accessible and there is
> enough
> head room for me. I bugged this dude once a month for a while,
> until
> it became clear he wasn't going to be able to overcome the hurdles.
>
> I came across a survey from AC Propulsion a few months ago which I
> filled out and submitted. I also sent email to their sales address
>
> asking where I could send a deposit for a converted Scion (both the
> xA
> and XB would work for me). I never got a response.
>
> My only option is to do my own conversion. As I plan this
> multi-year
> endeavor, I read this list for its wealth of knowledge.
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Small Business - Try our new resources site!
http://smallbusiness.yahoo.com/resources/
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I would, but don't have the cash, sorry
Ivo
-----Mensaje original-----
De: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
nombre de Lee Hart
Enviado el: mi�rcoles, 16 de marzo de 2005 13:35
Para: [email protected]
Asunto: Re: Was GM DC office & EV-1 Vigil
Bob Rice wrote:
> OK a show of hands, here on the List. How many of you guyz would
> actually BUY an EV-1 if offered at 24k used or the origional price of
> 30k bandied about when they were new. I would, so line forms here!
I would certainly buy one! Two, if I could (one for parts)!
--
"The two most common elements in the universe
are hydrogen and stupidity." -- Harlan Ellison
--
Lee A. Hart 814 8th Ave N Sartell MN 56377 leeahart_at_earthlink.net
--
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--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
That question has been asked of me lately, my response at first is a
littel tongue and cheek, the ole racers adage "How much money you got?"
Then I get serious and explain all the bits and pieces that, just
between the list and me, I have yet to do.
So my question to the people that have done a few conversions, especialy
ones for resale, What is a good average conversion time?
--
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--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Ryan Stotts wrote:
>It's so easy that the only reason every person on
>this list isn't
>already driving their EV that they converted their
>selves... is money.
Yup. I'm a college student without a great deal of money.
Slowly but surely, it's coming along. But oh so damn slowly.
High performance sports car for < $15k. No gas! Can't afford
a Tzero, so I'm attempting to make my own using a triumph.
First conversion. Hope I don't screw up! $$$$$$$
I think it's hilarious how high school kids and even old
backyard hippies are doing what the auto industry says is
impossible. If it only weren't so sad.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Jeff Shanab wrote:
That question has been asked of me lately, my response at first is a
littel tongue and cheek, the ole racers adage "How much money you got?"
Then I get serious and explain all the bits and pieces that, just
between the list and me, I have yet to do.
So my question to the people that have done a few conversions,
especialy ones for resale, What is a good average conversion time?
A kit would be wonderful... the VoltsRabbit was quoted as a 2 day
installation for an experience mechanic.
My first (and only) conversion for hire took a solid 6 months, but much
of that time was spent fighting adapter plate issues. If I did it today
with a proven adapter design it would be much less.. approx 3 months of
weekend/evening time.
Mark
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi Dave,
Can you provide Chris Zach with the address for the GM DC office.
Thanks
Chip
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Given the passionate views of many regarding saving this car (up to and
including some civil disobediance), I am very surprised that a number of
these cars didn't get "stolen" off the street by their owners or others
prior to returning them to GM.
Also, isn't a poll about who would buy one a bit redundant and pointless
at this point? Isn't there already a standing offer of 1.9 million for
the remaining cars, an offer that GM has publicly refused?
Didn't Jay Leno offer a million US for a single EV1 all by himself? If
GM is unwilling to sell these cars for a million dollars a piece, they
are clearly committed to seeing them destroyed as part of an agenda.
It seems that if someone wants to save some of these cars, some stronger
measures at the protest would have to be undertaken. I'm not advocating
anything specific, but it sure seems like the vigil people are not
getting much message out there other than "we want to save these cars",
while GM is actively seeding disinformation at the same time (GM: only
50 owners wanted to keep their EV1s at the end of their leases).
I think that GMs pattern of blatant public LIES on the subject needs to
be the focus of the protest if the protesters really want to raise
effective public awareness of this issue. They need to paint GM for the
lying weasels that they are in the strongest possible terms, and I just
don't see that in any of the articles.
It seems like everyone at the vigil is being super nice and super well
behaved. This plays right into GM tactics of asserting that it is "only
a small group of dedicated people who want the failed product that is
the EV1". This is not the way to expose the truth of the demise of the
EV1.
Turn up the heat people! There is almost nothing left and you are not
being very effective so far.
-Ken Trough
Admin - V is for Voltage Magazine
http://visforvoltage.com
AIM - ktrough
FAX - 801-749-7807
message - 866-872-8901
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Mark Farver wrote:
>approx 3 months of weekend/evening time.
Motor swap. Mount the DC/DC, charger, controller, E-meter, and the
battery pack.
I haven't done it yet. So what takes so long?
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
query ev
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I would buy one maybe even two!
I wonder if GM would give me some of that 0% financing? Not likely.
I'de prefer a Gen1 with PbA. ( easier to replace pack ? )
1st mod = Install a PFC-50 ( for more versital & eff charging )
2nd mod = Build a genset trailer. ( no more "Range" issues )
3rd mod = (Continue to Attempt to) Modify public perception:
( drag racing, autocrossing, earthday shows, free testdrives )
L8r
Ryan
ps. Oh, ya, I'de also drive it to work.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
To convert a existing ICE to a EV depends on how much modifications you want to
do.
If you are replacing the engine in the same place where the motor will be
install using a TRACTION type motor that is design for direct replacement,
would only take about a day!!!
A traction motor is of the type that comes with a flywheel adapter, a motor to
bell housing adapter and motor mounts that is a direct bolt in to your existing
frame and transmission you specified which is all assemble by the factory.
Installation of a Emeter, a controller such as a Zilla should take only another
day.
The battery installation is going to be something else. If you install the
batteries on a open type platform, each bolted down, the time will depend on
the battery platform you make or install and already have a large area or space
to install it. Could take about a week to make.
Takes only a day to install the batteries and another day or two to make up all
the battery connectors and connected them all up.
Running all the power wires, inside the EV including a battery charger input
connection for a outboard charger, is about another day or two. If you make a
enclosed cable way or duct for you cables, this can take a week or two or even
longer if it is design into the frame of the EV.
If you do not need A/C, power steering, vacuum and a heating system, then you
could get by with one 12 volt accessory battery to run the control system, that
can be charge by a 12 volt charger and/or used a DC to DC converter from the
main battery pack.
This would be a bare basic starter EV. You then can go on and add
modifications and updates as time go on.
I started my second EV in 1980 and completed it in 1985. It took that long,
because I gutted the whole car, like you see on OVERHAULING and customized the
entire vehicle, which included suspensions, axils, sheet metal, glass,
interior, battery compartments, charger compartments, contactor enclosures,
fuse and circuit breaker enclosures and full instruments indications on every
input and output circuits with double bypass circuits.
It took me just over 2 years to do the battery enclosures that are totally
enclosed with filter air input and explosive proof vacuum fans with isolated
circuits. I did not like my first design, so I took another year to do a
second design.
The length of time, will also depend on the paint finish you want. I knew that
this will take me years to completed, so I drove the car with a standard paint
job, and color sand and compounding it every year starting at 600 grit compound
and today I am working up to 4000 grit compounds.
So it depends on what you want to do and what items you want in your EV.
Roland
----- Original Message -----
From: Jeff Shanab<mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List<mailto:[email protected]>
Sent: Wednesday, March 16, 2005 5:33 PM
Subject: How fast can you do a conversion?
That question has been asked of me lately, my response at first is a
littel tongue and cheek, the ole racers adage "How much money you got?"
Then I get serious and explain all the bits and pieces that, just
between the list and me, I have yet to do.
So my question to the people that have done a few conversions, especialy
ones for resale, What is a good average conversion time?
--
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Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.7.2 - Release Date: 3/11/2005
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi,
Ryan Stotts wrote:
> Motor swap. Mount the DC/DC, charger, controller, E-meter, and the
> battery pack. I haven't done it yet. So what takes so long?
To me 3 months sounds great, and certainly not long, seeing as how my
Jeep EV conversion took like 14 months. Of course, I was planning on a
4-6 month conversion with my Jeep originally, but that time frame
quickly came and went, as I continued to have problems with my motor
hub/flywheel/clutch system.
My main problems and subsequent delays all stemmed from that damn motor
hub and adapter plate design which wasn't exactly the quality product it
should have been when I bought it. Thus, lots of time spent removing and
reinstalling the motor and clutch components many times (and all the
other stuff in the engine compartment which has to be removed to get to
it). Once I got all the mechanical problems worked out many months later
(thanks to the invaluable help from Mark Farver, Chris Robison, and
others from AustinEV), the rest of the Jeep conversion was fairly quick.
Of course, I guess if I had had more time to work on the Jeep during the
school year than just weekends, well, the Jeep might have been done
sooner...
So, I guess my point is that things don't always go smoothly, at least
not when it is your first conversion and you are depending on good help
from your parts supplier (because you don't yet know of the EVDL and
AustinEV) ;-)
--
-Nick
http://Go.DriveEV.com/
1988 Jeep Cherokee 4x4 EV
---------------------------
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--- Begin Message ---
Hey Everyone,
The FL EAA will be having it's next meeting this Saturday at 10:30AM in
Jupiter, FL (West Palm Beach Area). The meeting details are on the FL EAA
website: http://www.floridaeaa.org under the calendar section.
Please bring pictures of your EV's and project. We have lots of things to go
over. Should be a good meeting!
Please email me if you have any questions.
Hope to see everyone there!
--
Shawn M. Waggoner
Florida Electric Auto Assoc.
http://www.floridaeaa.org
Custom Honda Electric Motorcycle 72V
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi Rod,
thanks for this info. I found the osmc material in
general very interesting but seems to be a bit more
than what I am ready to implement for the ET. Also I
don't see how it would allow me to increase the input
voltage (36V) to say 48V for a stronger field.
I thought I try to keep it simple and while it is
working I maintain the contactor H bridge for the
armature that is in place.
IF I want to later do FWD/REV via the field then I
would opt for a simple DPDT switch and the adjustible
voltage could be via a $15 20A scooter controller.
As to the problem of raising the voltage I was thinking
if I should just use a small 12vdc to 110Vac inverter
and then step this back down to whatever I need for the
desired field strength (and rectify it). 200w inverters
seem to be very inexpensive.
My first steps now will be to add a 12V battery which I
can switch into the field to bump up the field strength
and see the results, then decide if its worth the trouble.
Markus
>
> "I myself am looking for a cheap way of making 5 - 48V
>
> (adjustable) max. 5A out of 36V. Anybody have an idea?
>
> (Its to control the field on my 36V elec-trak
> compound wound motor)
>
> Markus",
> I just wrote software for my 20A 3-phase BLDC drive
> that allows it to run a series motor h-bridge style or
> just regular
> single direction series or PM up to 60A by puting the
> the FETS in parallel.
> You could put your shunt field in the H-bridge
> configuration and have reversing capability.
> It will go up to 20 amps in this mode, but I think the
> ET field will draw less than 5A (more like 3 on my
> E-15 I think).
> Anyhow, this control is 3.5x3.5x2.5" and goes up to 63
> Volts.
> There's a schematic for all of the different
> configurations for a 3-phase control.
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/osmc/files/Multimotor/
> Rod
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Ivo wrote:
>>PLease remeber that a smaller footprint also means poorer braking, and
EV's are heavy, so look for a hard steel belted radial, or something made
for low rolling resistance, but not a smaller footprint, that is dangerous,
specially in wet conditions.<<
As a long time western WA resident I must comment. For rain traction you
want (generally, specific tire designs can alter this) the narrowest tire
for a given height. Now with directional rain tires...
Paul G.
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--- Begin Message ---
Hi All,
Ryan Stotts, and Juuka-- (misspelling?) (sorry)!
have offered to host the 9 megs of .ppt file.
I'll take Ryan up on his offer, and am expecting
him to get back to the LIST and tell us all where in
cyberspace this will be.
As far as other individual requests for the
presentation, I've been on 20 mins, and am only 18%
through sending it, thanks to being on a budget and
thus, a dialup connection. If I took it to work, with
the T-1 connection, the e-mail protection on GroupWise
says "file too large;" ain't gonna' happen.
Thanks Ryan, and keep us posted ASAP!
Sincerely,
'92 Honda Civic sedan, 144V
____
__/__|__\ __
=D-------/ - - \
'O'-----'O'-'
Would you still drive your car if the tailpipe came out of the steering wheel?
Are you saving any gas for your kids?
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi Folks
I'm reintroducing myself to the list. A couple of years ago, my son
Nathaniel and I converted a yellow 1974 rabbit thanks to the great
assistance of this list. You'll be pleased to know this car is still
on the road in LA. We also went to Woodburn for the EV drags.
Now I'm converting a 1983 Rabbit GTI with the help and advice of
Lawrence Rhodes.
I'll need to tap in to the expertise of this list as I proceed on this
project.
I'll keep you posted.
John Martin
San Francisco
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On Wed, 16 Mar 2005 11:46:35 -0600, "John Westlund" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
>I wish this inbox could handle 9 megs, so I'll just email
>you my other adress later tonight, Bob. I'll gladly look at
>it. Due to university computers not being exactly
>private/encrypted, I wont be sharing that adress at the
>moment.
You might want to become aware of this freebie service:
http://www.yousendit.com
I use it all the time. Very smooth.
John
---
John De Armond
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.johngsbbq.com
http://neonjohn.blogspot.com <-- NEW!
Cleveland, Occupied TN
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--- Begin Message ---
Based on the question, I going to guess that the calculations are beyond
your current skills.
You need to know the value of the resistor, the complete specs for the
transistor and the voltage and waveform applied to the transistors base.
If you knew all of that, then you could run the calculations to *estimate*
the voltage drops, or use a program to calculate it for you.
Simplest way would be to measure it with a voltmeter or O'scope.
If you really need to calculate it, then I'd suggest seeing if you local
community college offers a basic electronics course. Well worth the
money.
> If a resistor is connected in series with the collector of a transistor
> and
> the two are connected across a voltage that may be different at different
> times, how do you calculate how much voltage will be dropped by the
> resistor
> and transistor respectively for different voltages? Thanks.
>
> Bill Dennis
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Bob Bath wrote:
> Hi All,
> Ryan Stotts, and Juuka-- (misspelling?) (sorry)!
> have offered to host the 9 megs of .ppt file.
> I'll take Ryan up on his offer, and am expecting
> him to get back to the LIST and tell us all where in
> cyberspace this will be.
> Thanks Ryan, and keep us posted ASAP!
Here is the download link:
http://members.cox.net/rstotts/evpresentation.ppt
It's 44 pages so it's worth it.
After I uploaded it, I downloaded it from the server to make sure it
was not corrupt and it checked out fine:
http://img1.imageuploader.net/991/test.png
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Can you compress it with WinZip?
Dave
Some call it retirement, some call it a second career... I just call it
adding 5ive days to the weekend!
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob Bath" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Wednesday, March 16, 2005 8:44 PM
Subject: PowerPoint EV Presentation Updaet
Hi All,
Ryan Stotts, and Juuka-- (misspelling?) (sorry)!
have offered to host the 9 megs of .ppt file.
I'll take Ryan up on his offer, and am expecting
him to get back to the LIST and tell us all where in
cyberspace this will be.
As far as other individual requests for the
presentation, I've been on 20 mins, and am only 18%
through sending it, thanks to being on a budget and
thus, a dialup connection. If I took it to work, with
the T-1 connection, the e-mail protection on GroupWise
says "file too large;" ain't gonna' happen.
Thanks Ryan, and keep us posted ASAP!
Sincerely,
'92 Honda Civic sedan, 144V
____
__/__|__\ __
=D-------/ - - \
'O'-----'O'-'
Would you still drive your car if the tailpipe came out of the steering
wheel? Are you saving any gas for your kids?
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I have been keeping better track of my time , the 300zx was 190 hours , a
lot went into playing with the power steering and making the adaptor plate.
The kit car seemed to fly together with help form my EV friend Tom , but
still took 100 hours of my time ( 25 to make the adaptor plate) . A lot of
time can get tied up in stuff you didn't expect like the springs , or
putting gauges in the dash. The more you do the faster things go , on your
first one's your going to be spending allot of time thinking about what will
work and will this be strong enough. I have though while doing a conversion
for somebody , " if something happened to me this person would have to spend
a lot of money to have any non ev person finish the job" . I think its great
that your thinking about starting some kind of conversion business , I'm
pretty sure your not doing it to make a lot of quick money. After I did my
2nd and both my work truck and other vehicle where electric , I went around
of quite some time trying to talk anybody into doing a conversion. As much
as people say they liked it , getting somebody to do one even when I offered
to help for free doing all the stuff they couldn't ,didn't get any action.
after ev1 became ev3 and still nobody taking me up on the free help , I
came up with my raffle ticket plane , which really did not work well . I
spent more time trying to sell tickets and trying to make the program work
than if I had just worked my regular job and put the money into the car .
But I was in the grips of the 2nd stage of EV madness. You've heard about
what happens to people when they get there EV's on the road , that smile
that won't come off , that feeling of being in on a big secret and wanting
to tell the world. well the 2nd stage happens a few years later , and you
feel you just have to do something. Well I'm getting off the topic, Think
I'll go for a ride in the kit car , ya the one with almost the same parts as
your planning on , the motor's starting to get broken in and I can feel it,
I saw 400 amps on the e meter today, sure has been fun taking people for a
ride it this one. I do the slow creep to start out , then ask if we should
see what she'll do,
Steve Clunn
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jeff Shanab" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <[email protected]>
Sent: Wednesday, March 16, 2005 6:33 PM
Subject: How fast can you do a conversion?
That question has been asked of me lately, my response at first is a
littel tongue and cheek, the ole racers adage "How much money you got?"
Then I get serious and explain all the bits and pieces that, just between
the list and me, I have yet to do.
So my question to the people that have done a few conversions, especialy
ones for resale, What is a good average conversion time?
--
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.7.2 - Release Date: 3/11/2005
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
So there I am, minding my own business, driving home in my old
electric 914 "California Poppy". It's just a usual errand. Tonight
I'm test driving a Z2K while returning from a nice Sushi dinner
treat, celebrating having finished another batch of controllers. I'm
down to about 50% capacity with eight amp hours down since the pack
is dropping off a bit early lately. (gotta find the stinker battery
in the pack someday)
I'm on Alma expressway, a long straight 35 mph posted limit road that
is nice for high efficiency driving. This means it's flat, 45 mph is
the norm and the stoplights are far apart. At the first red light I
pull up to the crosswalk next to a silver convertible Mustang with
Florida plates and the top down. The 5.0 on the fender tells me this
30ish guy enjoys a little speed. I glance over and we exchange that
slight nod of acknowledgement as guys in sports cars are prone to do.
The light turns green and I take off normally. I'm not trying to save
energy at this point so when I say "normal" that would be just fast
enough to avoid squealing the tires. It helps that I've got the
series mode current turned down to only 1600 amps so my normal start
happens to be pedal to the metal. Normal as in 0-60 in 5 seconds
normal... Mr Mustang is clearly not expecting this so I leave him
behind as I normally do to everyone. I let the car shift to parallel
mode, feel the strong pull hit me in the back and then let up to
avoid breaking 50 in this quiet area. Mr Mustang catches up with me
and hangs back just a bit, presumably to take in my many stickers
proclaiming "Zilla Powered", "Powered by 100% American Electrons" and
Zero Emissions Vehicle". I'm guessing it was a bit too dark for him
to make out the "Eat my Volts" sticker on the rear window.
We get the red light again, both right at the crosswalk. He looks
over a bit and so I roll down my window. Out of his mouth comes the
classic question that tells me I have him hooked.
"What `ya got in that thing?" He asks.
"It's electric powered, 2000 amps, no gas" I reply.
"Cool" He says.
I compliment him on his nice Mustang and we smile a bit and wait for the light.
It turns green and I'm off doing my "normal" start. Twenty feet out I
can't help but smile as I listen to engine roar mixed with his tires
complaining behind me, spinning as they cross the slick crosswalk.
Again I feel the satisfying kick in the back at about 35 mph when the
motors switch to parallel. Now with 2000 amps shared between the two
8" motors I continue pulling away from the silver blob roaring behind
me. I had no doubt that a 5.0 mustangs 6.2 second 0-60 time was not
in my league, but clearly he wasn't so sure. Once again I let off out
of respect for the neighborhood and this time he blasts by me at 60+
mph. What's this guy looking for, a racing ticket? :-)
The next light already has someone in my lane waiting, so he stops
short and waits for me to pull up.
Mustang Guy "That's pretty quick"
Me "Yeah, pretty fun, does thirteen eight in the quarter"
Mustang Guy "Wow, I just took this out of storage, been sitting for
ten years, Getting some aluminum heads and headers to really make it
move......
Yeah yeah yeah, when the ego is bruised, the excuses come out. :-)
Have fun!
--
-Otmar-
http://www.CafeElectric.com/ Home of the Zilla.
http://www.evcl.com/914 My electric 914
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