EV Digest 4265
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) Fort Pierce Fl. 7th EV rally
by "STEVE CLUNN" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) Re: Better Meter, was Meter or Charge?
by Evan Tuer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) electric dragster
by Rod Hower <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) Re: 12volt 24 volt Help
by "Peter VanDerWal" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) Re: electric dragster
by "Roderick Wilde" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) Re: electric dragster
by Evan Tuer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7) Avcon Confusion
by "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8) Re: electric dragster-correction
by "Roderick Wilde" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
9) Re: Avcon and Manzanita Micro chargers
by Ralph Merwin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) Re: electric dragster
by Doc Kennedy <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
11) Re: Avcon Confusion
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
12) Re: Aero drag and VW fenders.
by "Peter VanDerWal" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13) Re: Craig Vetter aerodynamics expert shows how to get 500 mph in
the real world. This happened 20 years ago.
by "Peter VanDerWal" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
14) Re: Avcon Confusion
by Marc Geller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
15) Re: Avcon and Manzanita Micro chargers
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
16) Re: Avcon Confusion
by "Peter VanDerWal" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
17) Re: AC volt meter
by Neon John <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
18) Re: Avcon Confusion
by Marc Geller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
19) Re: Avcon Confusion
by Ralph Merwin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
20) Re: Raptor controllers
by "Bob Rice" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
21) Re: Cheap DC/DC converters 600W Vicor Mega Mod $45
by "Brian D.Hall" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
22) Re: pusher to electric
by "James A. Eckman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
23) Re: How many Wh does your vehicle average?
by Victor Tikhonov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
24) Re: pusher to electric
by Christopher Zach <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
25) Re: pusher to electric
by Neon John <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
26) Toshiba's New Rechargeable Lithium-Ion Battery Recharges in Only
One Minute
by Joseph Vaughn-Perling <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
27) Re: electric dragster
by Ken Trough <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
28) RE: How many Wh does your vehicle average?
by "Sweeney, John P" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
29) RE: Cheap DC/DC converters 600W Vicor Mega Mod $45
by "Roger Stockton" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
30) Re: AC volt meter
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
31) Re: Aero drag and VW fenders.
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
32) Re: Better Meter, was Meter or Charge?
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
33) Re: Aero drag and VW fenders.
by Victor Tikhonov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
34) Solar charge controller (OT)
by James Jarrett <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
35) Fan-style wheels. Was Re: Aero drag and VW fenders.
by "Patrick Maston" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
36) Re: First drive around the block in the New Beetle
by Victor Tikhonov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--- Begin Message ---
http://www.grassrootsev.com/flyer.htm
I'll be having My EV rally on Saterday april 30 for 11am to 4pm , all are
welcome, plenty of room for EV's .
steve clunn
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On Apr 7, 2005 12:47 PM, jerry dycus <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Hi Lee and All,
> --- Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > Richard Marcus wrote:
> > > Thanks Joe. On further investigation the state of
> > > charge meter is a state of charge meter (or at
> > least
> > > looks like one with % indicated).
> >
> > I'll bet it is a plain old voltmeter with a "state
> > of charge" scale
> > pasted on.
>
> While a meter like this isn't that good, there is
> one that is.
> It's called the Chargicator by Danforth available
> through most boating supply shops.
> What makes it go is it has 3 scales that are neded
> to better tell a lead battery's condition.
> These scales are 1 for when the battery is being
> charged, the second is when it's resting with no load
> and the third is for when the battery is loaded.
That sounds like a slight improvement, but it might be less useful on
an EV, where your "on load" current is all over the place, unlike a
nice steady draw from a boat propellor.
regards
Evan
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Ultracapacitors boost electric dragster to world
record
Brigham Young University (BYU) set a world record for
fastest electric drag racecar after a little BOOST
from Maxwell Technologies. This free technical paper
examines the design and development of their electric
dragster and examines the performance benefits
delivered by BOOSTCAP ultracapacitors.
www.maxwell.com/go.php?id=164
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Easy.
Wire it up so you only energize the contactor when reversing, then center
tap the pack.
The tiny amount of current the contactor draws and the small amount of
time you'll spend reversing won't have any measurable effect on the pack.
> OK all you EV wizards, I need alittle help. My commuta car runs on 48
> volts ( 8 six volt batteries). I have a DC DC converter that runs all the
> dash, lights, etc. Here's the problem. My forward /reverse contactor
> works with 24 volts. The switch from the dash to the contactor is 12
> volts. Does any one know how I could wire it so I could get 24 volts to
> it? I have an idea but not sure it would work.
> Thanks
> Catherine
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Make Yahoo! your home page
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
The press release from Maxwell says: "A student team from Brigham Young
University (BYU) set a new record for the world's fastest electric drag
racecar." Not to belittle the student team's efforts from Brigham Young but
the world record was not for the "world's fastest electric drag racer". That
would be Bill Dube at over 150 mph and Dennis Berube is the quickest, which
is most important with an 8.801 second E.T. The world record they did set
was in the non contested modified production class "A" at 15.907 seconds
E.T. at 77.37 mph. It is of note that in 1998 Marvin Rush drove a stock EV-1
to a record of 16.26 mph in 16.26 seconds in Street Production class "A".
Just trying to keep the facts straight. Marketing people pretty much write
what they feel will be the most exciting to the reader and do not seem to
worry about the facts too much. I have seen this kind of things many times.
Roderick Wilde
NEDRA President
----- Original Message -----
From: "Rod Hower" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2005 4:58 AM
Subject: electric dragster
Ultracapacitors boost electric dragster to world
record
Brigham Young University (BYU) set a world record for
fastest electric drag racecar after a little BOOST
from Maxwell Technologies. This free technical paper
examines the design and development of their electric
dragster and examines the performance benefits
delivered by BOOSTCAP ultracapacitors.
www.maxwell.com/go.php?id=164
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--- Begin Message ---
On Apr 7, 2005 4:24 PM, Roderick Wilde <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> The world record they did set
> was in the non contested modified production class "A" at 15.907 seconds
> E.T. at 77.37 mph. It is of note that in 1998 Marvin Rush drove a stock EV-1
> to a record of 16.26 mph in 16.26 seconds in Street Production class "A".
Rod, what was the actual MPH for the stock EV-1?
Thanks
Evan
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I have DS-50 AVCON. Intended for use with the Th!nk City. How compatable
is it? Will it work with the Ranger, RAV4 etc....? Lawrence
Rhodes..............
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I guess it is just too early in the morning out here on the left coast. I
should have had my coffee before responding :-) Marvin Rush's actual mph was
78.37.
Roderick "red faced" Wilde
NEDRA President
----- Original Message -----
From: "Evan Tuer" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2005 6:29 AM
Subject: Re: electric dragster
On Apr 7, 2005 4:24 PM, Roderick Wilde <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
The world record they did set
was in the non contested modified production class "A" at 15.907 seconds
E.T. at 77.37 mph. It is of note that in 1998 Marvin Rush drove a stock
EV-1
to a record of 16.26 mph in 16.26 seconds in Street Production class "A".
Rod, what was the actual MPH for the stock EV-1?
Thanks
Evan
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--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
John O'Connor writes:
>
> Am I correct that Avcon and Manzanita Micro chargers can be made
> compatible?
Yes. I have an Avcon wall unit and inlet, and a PFC-20 charger.
> What do I need to be able to utilize the public Avcon stations for
> opportunity charging?
Either get an Avcon inlet with the emulator from www.avconev.com and
mount them in your vehicle, or buy the Avcon adaptor from the EAA
(www.eaaev.org). If you mount an inlet in your vehicle, yo might also
consider buying a wall unit from avconev.com or from the EAA.
Ralph
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Thanks for the details, Rod. I sent them a short e-mail, reminding
them of that fact and asking for NHRA and NEDRA
confirmation.
As my Dear Mom always says; "Figures don't lie but liars figure."
Doc Kennedy
On Apr 7, 2005 7:58 AM, Rod Hower <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Ultracapacitors boost electric dragster to world
> record
>
> Brigham Young University (BYU) set a world record for
> fastest electric drag racecar after a little BOOST
> from Maxwell Technologies. This free technical paper
> examines the design and development of their electric
> dragster and examines the performance benefits
> delivered by BOOSTCAP ultracapacitors.
>
> www.maxwell.com/go.php?id=164
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
<< I have DS-50 AVCON. Intended for use with the Th!nk City. How compatable
is it? Will it work with the Ranger, RAV4 etc....? Lawrence
Rhodes...... >>
Yes on the Ranger, no on the RAV4, since it's inductive.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
It's been a while since I've laid eyes on a VW bug, but as I recall the
wheels only stick out about 3 inches further than the doors.
If so, then they don't contribute all that significantly to frontal area
and you're better off leaving them alone (or going with a new aerodynamic
body)
> Dave wrote:
>>
>> I wonder if you could fab some fenders that attach to the knuckle, and
>> "float" with the wheel assembly, like some T-buckets have. A full cover
>> inside and out...
>
> I'm sure you could. But, now you have the centrifugal fan effect for the
> air trapped between the tire and fender.
> --
> "Never doubt that the work of a small group of thoughtful, committed
> citizens can change the world. Indeed, it's the only thing that ever
> has!" -- Margaret Mead
> --
> Lee A. Hart 814 8th Ave N Sartell MN 56377 leeahart_at_earthlink.net
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
> Also, while on this subject, I'd like to add that I find the current very
> prominent national discourse about, and advocacy of, PiHEVs by the some of
> the most politically influential people to be analytically fallacious and
> fraudulent, where they are claiming 250-500 mpg PiHEVs are possible using
> today's technology. They arrive at those figures by counting only the
> gasoline or diesel but not taking into account the electricity put into
> the vehicle from charging.
True, but they aren't the first ones to try that particular trick. Mother
Earht news ran an article a couple decades ago about how to build a plug
in hybrid using a jet engine starter for a traction motor, a 5 hp lawmower
engine connected to a generator, and 4 ordinary car (SLI) batteries.
They claimed it got 70 mpg, of course what that actually meant was that if
you started with a gallon of gas and a fully charged battery, you could
get 70 miles before the battery was dead and you were out of gas.
Then again the article was full of questionable figures and aparently
nobody other than the author could match his claims.
My favorite claim was that the lawmower/generator output was approx 3kw
(possibly true) and that this was ALL that was needed to cruise at 55 mph
??!!!??
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
It'll work with any car with an AVCON inlet.
RangerEV, certainly.
On Apr 7, 2005, at 7:38 AM, Lawrence Rhodes wrote:
I have DS-50 AVCON. Intended for use with the Th!nk City. How
compatable is it? Will it work with the Ranger, RAV4 etc....?
Lawrence Rhodes..............
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
<< Either get an Avcon inlet with the emulator from www.avconev.com and
mount them in your vehicle, or buy the Avcon adaptor from the EAA
(www.eaaev.org). If you mount an inlet in your vehicle, yo might also
consider buying a wall unit from avconev.com or from the EAA. >>
Didn't get a response from [EMAIL PROTECTED] when I was shopping for one -
remember it as <someone's name> @ meltric.com, but that was several years ago,
so it may have changed. And you only need the wall unit if you have a Ford or
Th!nk (these expect the unit's pilot signal), or if you feel the need for an
idiot-proof system instead of just putting on a NEMA 14-50 (or whatever) on the
other end of the connector and doing what many retirees are doing in RV parks
every day. I have nothing against Avcon's talking boxes, but most listees are
coordinated enough to do without - plug into the mains first, then plug the
connector into the car, and there isn't a lot of threat to your personal
safety.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I thought that there were at least two different, and incompatible, AVCON
inlets.
> It'll work with any car with an AVCON inlet.
>
> RangerEV, certainly.
>
> On Apr 7, 2005, at 7:38 AM, Lawrence Rhodes wrote:
>
>> I have DS-50 AVCON. Intended for use with the Th!nk City. How
>> compatable is it? Will it work with the Ranger, RAV4 etc....?
>> Lawrence Rhodes..............
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Depends. You have to tell us more. If the meter is a moving vane
type (most industrial/utility panel meters are) then it should work
fine on DC with the addition of a series resistor to set the coil
current. Or you might be lucky and have a low impedance coil meter
with an internal scaling resistor. That type works equally well on AC
or DC with one minor exception. If the meter contains components that
will retain residual magnetism then the meter may develop an error
over time. 60 hz normally continuously demagnetizes the meter. The
solution on DC is to periodically reverse the polarity. A switch near
the meter can do that.
I'd probably use the pack voltage right after coming off charge as a
reference. Put a little mark on the face to indicate the correct
needle position. When it varies, flip the switch.
If your meter is the rectifier type (a DC meter with some sort of
rectifier between it and the input terminals) then all you need to do
is remove the rectifier and rescale the meter with appropriate
resistors. There are a lot of calculations you can do to select this
resistor but I'd rather just put a decade box or high quality pot in
series and dial the reading in to a known voltage. Then substitute a
fixed resistor for that value.
You will probably have to make a new face for the meter, as rectifier
meters tend to be nonlinear. There's a really nice freebie program on
the net written by a ham radio operator that lets you create and print
new meter faces. Repurposing surplus meters is a way of life for hams
:-) I know it's called "meter" but I don't have a URL handy.
Googling for "replacement meter face" might pop it up.
While you're at it you might want to consider making an expanded
range meter. If you have a 144 volt pack then you might want the
meter to start at 110 volts and span to 160. That lets you use the
whole meter face for the range of voltage of interest.
The traditional way of doing this is to install a return spring in the
meter to bias it below zero sufficiently that the needle doesn't move
until the lower voltage limit is reached. Then paint the face
accordingly. The modern way to do it if you're not an instrument
maker is to series sufficient zener diodes to offset the meter. Then
span the meter with resistors to make it read in the range of voltage
of interest. You'll want a resistor string on the meter side of the
zeners to ground such that the right amount of current passes the
zeners to make their voltage drop constant.
If you're interested in doing this then I can provide more details. I
need to know what kind of meter you have. If the label doesn't tell
and you can't recognize the differences, a photo to me will do the
job. I'd need to know the coil resistance. If you wanted to do an
expanded range meter, I'd need to know the range.
John
On Wed, 06 Apr 2005 22:21:58 -0700, Rush <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>Hi,
>
>I got a bunch of AC volt meters at an auction, the scale is from 0-300 VAC, it
>is A&M Inst model
>366-124, fits in a 2.75" hole.
>
>Can this be used as a DC volt meter?
>
>tks
>Rush
>
---
John De Armond
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.johngsbbq.com
http://neonjohn.blogspot.com <-- NEW!
Cleveland, Occupied TN
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
There are other conductive connectors. The Yazaki was used in early
RAV4 EVs.
But I'm not aware of variants of the AVCON.
On Apr 7, 2005, at 9:46 AM, Peter VanDerWal wrote:
I thought that there were at least two different, and incompatible,
AVCON
inlets.
It'll work with any car with an AVCON inlet.
RangerEV, certainly.
On Apr 7, 2005, at 7:38 AM, Lawrence Rhodes wrote:
I have DS-50 AVCON. Intended for use with the Th!nk City. How
compatable is it? Will it work with the Ranger, RAV4 etc....?
Lawrence Rhodes..............
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Marc Geller writes:
>
> There are other conductive connectors. The Yazaki was used in early
> RAV4 EVs.
>
> But I'm not aware of variants of the AVCON.
There's a "European" version of the Avcon that is different from the
Avcon sold in the USofA. They appear to have different pin locations.
Ralph
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mark Farver" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Wednesday, April 06, 2005 4:06 PM
Subject: Re: Raptor controllers
> jerry dycus wrote:
>
> >
> > I have need of talking to Peter Senkowsky but
> >don't know how to get ahold of him. Could some let me
> >know how?
> > Is DCP alive?
> >
> >
> Yes and no.
>
> DCP run by Damon is dead, but a new DCP is run by Peter. Peter
> purchased the Raptor design and is currently repairing them and is
> working with Damon to update the Raptor design for new production.
> Hi All;
Well, THAT's good news, I still have a s....load of Rapters an' T Wrecks,
that MAY need the smoke re-installed.someday. Has Peter a website?
Many Happy Rapture miles later.
Bob
> Peter does not plan on producing nor repairing the DCP DC/DC converter.
> Ok !I hava nice Sevcon, forgot about it years ago when I hooked it up!
Seeya
Bob
> Mark Farver
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
These DC/dc are booster modules and need a regular module to turn in and
regulate correctly.
Brian D.Hall
>> That's odd. Halted has them listed as "New" and I've never known them
>> to
>> sell defective parts without stating that they're defective.
>>
>>
>>> I tested a few of these from Halted. They were all
>>> bad. The Sparrow uses a similar model of Vicor. I
>>> first thought I had found a source. It was too good
>>> to be true though.
>>>
>>> Ed Ang
>>>
>>> --- Peter VanDerWal <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>>> I kow there are a few folks out there looking for
>>>> affordable DC-DC
>>>> converters. While searching for something else, I
>>>> came across this:
>>>>
>>>
http://www.halted.com/ccp11977-dc-dc-converter-150v-15v-600watt-vi-n52-em-19678.htm
>>>>
>>>> It's a Vicor Mega Mod:
>>>> Input 100V-200V (150V nominal) brown out at 85V
>>>> Output 15V +-10% @ 40 Amps
>>>>
>>>> I believe some other folks ahve used these in EVs,
>>>> so perhaps they can
>>>> comment on suitability, but at only $45 seems like
>>>> too good of a deal to
>>>> pass up (I ordered one).
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
Brian D. Hall
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
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Could someone tell me if it would be possible/reasonable to use this motor
and an inverter to build a cordless mower?
Jim
----- Original Message -----
From: "Andre' Blanchard" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Tuesday, April 05, 2005 11:04 AM
Subject: Re: pusher to electric
Seen this just the other day.
http://www.surpluscenter.com/item.asp?UID=2005040510004723&item=10-1938&catname
_________
Andre' B.
At 08:53 AM 4/5/2005, you wrote:
We have talked on the list before about converting a standard push mower
to electric. Well I now have five (5) dead old gassers, Ghosts of
yardwork past, and would like to convert at least one of the to electric
for basic edging and the like.
I can't seem to find my link I had to several pages where people have
done this. Anyone out there got a pointer for me?
James
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
The Wh consumption depends on the vehicle itself and
way of driving, and almost independent of whether it
has AC or DC drive in it.
--
Victor
'91 ACRX - something different
Ryan Stotts wrote:
Can it be said and agreed upon that each Optima or Orbital contain 300 Wh each?
At steady speed, what is your Wh as far as the motor is using?
How many Wh does a AVDCor WarP 9" use(on average)?
Are the numbers of 250 Wh/mile (worst case) and 150 Wh/mile (best
case) considered accurate?
Using those numbers a 144 pack would get 24 miles range at best and
only 14 at worst?
A 192 would get 32 miles best case and 19 at worst?
What's a ballpark figure for Wh using an AC motor?
I could fit 25 batteries(40lb,each) in the trunk of anything..
Question is, could the unibody support 1000 lbs? Granted, proper
tires would be used and springs with increased capacity, but still.
1,000 lbs in the trunk or hatch of a unibody vehicle? Will it take
the weight, or will it fail?
--- End Message ---
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Sure. No reason why not.
I've taken to dragging around an old APC Backups 600 in my tractor to
handle the little odd power jobs. Wish I could find one that would take
36 volt input.
Chris
James A. Eckman wrote:
Could someone tell me if it would be possible/reasonable to use this
motor and an inverter to build a cordless mower?
Jim
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On Thu, 7 Apr 2005 13:05:38 -0400, "James A. Eckman"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>Could someone tell me if it would be possible/reasonable to use this motor
>and an inverter to build a cordless mower?
Sure, anything's possible. Is it practical? That depends on what
you're willing to do, put up with and spend. A few numbers:
9 amps nominal is about 1100 watts at 120 volts. Being a series
motor, it will, of course, draw much more than that when overloaded.
Using a cheap 12 volt inverter, the current draw would be about 90
amps. (for a 12:120 volt inverter, that 10:1 ratio is a good rule of
thumb).
If you used a pair of 220 ah golf cart batteries (about 120 lbs), then
according to Peukert and using the Peukert calculator on my web site,
you'd get 1.4 hours of run time to 80%dod. In practice, I'd figure
about an hour, allowing for inefficiencies and overload in tall grass.
A push mower pushing 200 lbs would be a beast to manhandle. I
wouldn't want to without self-propulsion.
If you went with a single Group 29 battery (about 100 ah) then you'd
only get a half hour of mow time. Having two batteries available with
Anderson connectors so you could quickly change it out would get you
back to about the same mow time. That Group 29 battery is about 70
lbs so the weight is still considerable.
Some cost calculations.
Two Sam's golf cart batteries at $49 ea 98.00
Sam's Club (vector) 1500 Watt inverter 100.
Motor 25.00 (with shipping)
Misc wiring and contactor 50.
Total $273.00
Fairly expensive and very heavy for a low performance lawn mower.
If I were going that route I'd put the battery and inverter along with
a charger on a 2 wheel hand cart and make a "power pack". Not only
would the weight be removed from the pushmower but you could use the
pack for other things.
In fact, I have built just such a pack. Two golf cart batteries, that
1500 watt inverter and a Vector smart charger on a big wheel hand cart
from Harbor Freight. I use it for all sorts of stuff including
running my electric chainsaws and leaf blower. With all the weight
down around the axle and the big pneumatic tires, it is easy to push
around. I only use these appliances a few times a year so it's nice
to get away from all the hassles of an infrequently used gas powered
appliance.
Considering that this is a series (aka "universal") motor, you could
consider running it on DC. Gather up enough of those cheap surplus
UPS batteries that everyone seems to be selling to make a 120 VDC pack
and go. You'd have to use a better switch, of course. That would
probably be the cheapest approach, though the mower would still be
heavy unless you move the batteries off to a cart.
If you were adventuresome and considering the price, you might even
consider winding the motor for a lower voltage. At 48 volts the
current would a little more than double, something the brushes and
commutator should handle OK. Maybe a little shorter life, so buy a
spare motor!
At 48 volts, the current would be about 20 amps. Computing the
Peukert life for the cheaply available 17ah gell and AGM batteries,
that yields 0.36 hours using a Peukert of 1.2 and 0.42 hours using a
Peukert of 1.15. That would require 4 such batteries which would not
be too heavy.
There are other approaches that I can think of. Hopefully this post
will get you to thinking outside the box.
John
---
John De Armond
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.johngsbbq.com
http://neonjohn.blogspot.com <-- NEW!
Cleveland, Occupied TN
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http://i-newswire.com/pr12515.html
Anyone seen/used/know anything more about this?
"We are continually faced with a series of great opportunities brilliantly
disguised as insoluble problems."
-- John W. Gardner
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The press release from Maxwell says: "A student team from Brigham
Young University (BYU) set a new record for the world's fastest
electric drag racecar."
The world record they did set was in the non contested modified
production class "A" at 15.907 seconds E.T. at 77.37 mph.
When I talked to the BYU professor supervising this project at EVS-20,
he said that the Maxwell Ultracaps only powered their repurposed EV-1
part of the way down the track, and that they ended up coasting a
significant part of the strip when they set this record back in '03. I
would imagine that if they put enough ultracaps into the rig to get a
fully powered run, they'd turn a much faster time.
Also, according to the NEDRA records sheet, the EV-1 driven by Marvin
Rush hit 78.76 mph. Rod misread the last two digits due to lack of
caffeine. 8^)
-Ken Trough
Admin - V is for Voltage Magazine
http://visforvoltage.com
AIM - ktrough
FAX - 801-749-7807
message - 866-872-8901
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My Fiero only seems to be able to do about 25AH draw out of the
batteries that are at about 55 Deg. F before the voltage sags to a level
under load that is worrisome. (10.75V per battery.) Of course my current
draws are at or above 75 amps during much of my drive. I am running
Exide Orbital Marine (blue top) I also have a couple of the XCD orbitals
in the string for testing & they perform the same as the blue tops.
Pat
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Otmar
Sent: Wednesday, April 06, 2005 10:10 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: How many Wh does your vehicle average?
At 11:38 AM -0700 4-4-05, Lee Hart wrote:
>Note
>that the Optimas/Orbitals can only deliver 50 amps for about an hour,
so
>you'd be driving at 40 miles per hour.
Boy! Can I get some of those!? :-)
In my experience 50 amp hours in an hour is not a number you should
plan on from a Optima or Orbital in my book.
If you keep them at 120 deg F, and take the best Optima you can find
I think you may get there. But I find that 33 Ahr is more reasonable,
and Orbitals are lower.
hth,
--
-Otmar-
http://www.CafeElectric.com/ Home of the Zilla.
http://www.evcl.com/914 My electric 914
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Brian D.Hall [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> These DC/dc are booster modules and need a regular module to
> turn in and regulate correctly. Brian D.Hall
This is not true for all of them, since a local EVer bought one and it
works just fine. Perhaps Halted has more than one bin of Vicor, or
their bin contains a variety of different variations?
A Vicor MegaMod contains at least one master module and 0-2 booster
modules and do not require an external regular module to function
correctly.
A MegaMod containing only slave modules would be a manufacturing error,
however, should one happen across such an oddity, it would still seem to
be a reasonable deal to buy a regular VI-200 module (~$200) to drive the
600W MegaMod slave and end up with an 800W DC/DC for about $250.
Cheers,
Roger.
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Rush wrote:
>
> Hi,
>
> I got a bunch of AC volt meters at an auction, the scale is from 0-300 VAC,
> it is A&M Inst model
> 366-124, fits in a 2.75" hole.
>
> Can this be used as a DC volt meter?
There are several types of AC voltmeter movements. Most work on DC as
well as AC, but will give a different reading. Another problem is that
DC will magnetize it, so after use on DC it won't return to zero. You
just have to try it and see.
--
If you would not be forgotten
When your body's dead and rotten
Then write of great deeds worth the reading
Or do the great deeds worth repeating
-- Ben Franklin, Poor Richard's Almanac
--
Lee A. Hart 814 8th Ave N Sartell MN 56377 leeahart_at_earthlink.net
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Evan Tuer wrote:
> A practical limitation for the big manufacturers is the (legal?)
> requirement to be able to fit show chains for some markets!
Or that tire sizes are not all that standardized. A new tire of the same
marked size might be bigger. And, the wheel obviously has to move up and
down and turn corners!
--
If you would not be forgotten
When your body's dead and rotten
Then write of great deeds worth the reading
Or do the great deeds worth repeating
-- Ben Franklin, Poor Richard's Almanac
--
Lee A. Hart 814 8th Ave N Sartell MN 56377 leeahart_at_earthlink.net
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>> I'll bet it is a plain old voltmeter with a "state of charge"
>> scale pasted on.
jerry dycus wrote:
> While a meter like this isn't that good, there is one that is.
> It's called the Chargicator by Danforth available through most
> boating supply shops. What makes it go is it has 3 scales that
> are neded to better tell a lead battery's condition. These scales
> are 1 for when the battery is being charged, the second is when
> it's resting with no load and the third is for when the battery
> is loaded.
That's a big improvement. As you say, you can make your own, too. It's
nothing but scales on a plain old expanded-scale voltmeter.
The drawback is that you don't know the current actually flowing in/out
of the battery. The "on charge" and "under load" scales will only be
correct for one particular charging or load current. You could set it up
for your charger's normal bulk current, and your EV's normal cruising
current.
A minor improvement is to add a big capacitor across the voltmeter, so
it responds very s-l-o-w-l-y to the voltage change. This makes the meter
ignore short-term changes (as the voltage jumps around while driving),
but still shows you the average.
A further improvement was described by Mark Brueggemann. He used an
analog meter that has *two* meter movements in one case, positioned at
right angles so their pointers overlap. These are often used for ham and
CB radio SWR meters. Mark used one movement to measure voltage, and one
to measure current. Each has a scale as usual, so you can read voltage
and current.
What was clever is that the point where the two meter pointers overlap
defines a point on a 2-dimensional graph. He placed a red/yellow/green
scale on this region. The color thus tells you your state of charge, at
the present voltage and current.
Still another clever improvement was used in a meter built by Anderson
Power products. It came in my ComutaVan. It is based on the fact that
all lead-acid batteries basically have the same voltage versus current
versus state of charge relationship. It has a little bitty lead-acid
battery, which it puts in parallel with the EV's main battery. They
measure the voltage and current in/out of this little battery to infer
what they must be for the big battery. It is much easier to measure the
current in/out of this little battery; it doesn't require a huge shunt
and a precision microvolt amplifier.
The patent for this meter described using a single 2v low-amphour cell,
with a voltage divider to drive it to a percentage of the main EV pack,
and measuring the current it took in/out of this little cell to estimate
the big battery's current in/out. But the actual meter I had "cheaped
out" and used an electrolytic capacitor to simulate a lead-acid cell.
This is a rather poor substitute, so the actual accuracy was much
poorer. PS: If anyone wants to use this method, the patent has long
since expired.
--
If you would not be forgotten
When your body's dead and rotten
Then write of great deeds worth the reading
Or do the great deeds worth repeating
-- Ben Franklin, Poor Richard's Almanac
--
Lee A. Hart 814 8th Ave N Sartell MN 56377 leeahart_at_earthlink.net
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Lee Hart wrote:
There's an interesting aspect that I don't think has been studied. A
spinning tire intrinsically works as a fan. Perhaps there is a way to
use it for cooling purposes. It already incidentaly helps cool the brake
drum/disk, shock absorber, and tire. Perhaps the rear tires could also
pump air in behind the car to "fill in" the partial vacuum behind it.
Actually, it has been studied and used on some BMW's since at
least 80's - a wheel spokes were made as a blades resembling aircraft
propellers (of course, at least 5 blades), so when wheel spins
they blow air from outside toward the disk brakes cooling them.
I don't see this done these days, perhaps brake pads liners
have gotten so good (and aestetics of wheel disks changed too),
that there is no need for forced cooling like that anymore.
But IMHO the "fan" is there for free, designers might as well
take advantage of it.
One minor "inconvenience" - the wheels for the right side
of the car were not interchangeable with those for the left
side (that is withoug disturbing cooling effect).
--
Victor
'91 ACRX - something different
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Sorry for the off topic post.
I have two BP Solec 90 solar panels and a 330w inverter that I am going
to be "donating" to the local Boy Scouts during their upcoming Jamboree.
They are going to be used to power a small P.A. / Music system and run a
power strip for the charging of emergency equipment (a handful of
walkie-talkies and cell phones).
I need a charge controller to protect the battery. I'm going to use a
12v deep cycle "marine" battery. The panels each give 90w in "best
case" but I'm only figuring on 50w. Even so, the system they are using
only needs about 75w and that is with Everything running. With just the
charging, it may need 50.
Does anyone out there have a 12v 15 amp or better charge controller
they'd like to part with? It is a cheritable contribution, and I can
get you a receipt if you like.
We could also use donations of any equipment to make this a better setup
for emergency personnel. Solar panels, controllers, inverters, or
anything else.
Thanks in advance.
James.
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Pontiac won a design award a few years back for their fan-style cast
alloy wheel. I believe it draws air from inside the wheelwell to the
outside.
You can see an example at this link:
http://www.wheels-and-rims.com/cgi-bin/webc.cgi/car-wheel.html?p_prodid=29563&sid=8LpJDk1EmHTuCYH-13105477662.b8
I would think these would be readily available in wrecking yards.
Patrick
>>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4/7/05 1:01:46 PM >>>
Lee Hart wrote:
> There's an interesting aspect that I don't think has been studied. A
> spinning tire intrinsically works as a fan. Perhaps there is a way
to
> use it for cooling purposes. It already incidentaly helps cool the
brake
> drum/disk, shock absorber, and tire. Perhaps the rear tires could
also
> pump air in behind the car to "fill in" the partial vacuum behind
it.
Actually, it has been studied and used on some BMW's since at
least 80's - a wheel spokes were made as a blades resembling aircraft
propellers (of course, at least 5 blades), so when wheel spins
they blow air from outside toward the disk brakes cooling them.
I don't see this done these days, perhaps brake pads liners
have gotten so good (and aestetics of wheel disks changed too),
that there is no need for forced cooling like that anymore.
But IMHO the "fan" is there for free, designers might as well
take advantage of it.
One minor "inconvenience" - the wheels for the right side
of the car were not interchangeable with those for the left
side (that is withoug disturbing cooling effect).
--
Victor
'91 ACRX - something different
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Don,
Back from vacation, catching up with messages.
I suppose you have adequate water flow? (> 8 l/min or ~2.11GPM)
I also suppose you have purged the system and there is no air trapped
inside inverter.
Lastly coldest water right out of rediator must first enter inverter
and *then* the motor, not the other way around.
If I recall, the fan on temp is programed at 75'C with 5'C hysteresis.
There are separate settings for fan on/fan off temps, and IGBT
heat sinks/DC-DC heat sinks temp (and motor temp) before power reduction
takes place. Of course you should program fan for lower temp, so only
if forced cooling fails to lower the temp enough, the drive power
is reduced.
Yes, Siemens drives have more programmable parameters than you'd
want to know about :-)
--
Victor
'91 ACRX - something different
p.s. FWIW, in ACRX the fan never comes on. THe stock radiator has
large enough area to keep the water under about 50'C at all times.
Don Cameron wrote:
Hi Charles, you are correct, the Siemens systems are water-cooled. The fan
I am referring to is the fan for the radiator. The controller can be
programmed to turn this fan on and off at specific temperatures.
I really like the Siemens setup. Very well manufactured, very easy to
install and interfaces well to the existing VW instrumentation (like the
tach and warning lights). I also like the fact that it is very
programmable. Which is something I have to learn a bit more about.
Don
Victoria, BC, Canada
See the New Beetle EV Conversion Web Site at
www.cameronsoftware.com/ev/
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Charles Whalen
Sent: April 2, 2005 7:55 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: First drive around the block in the New Beetle
Hi Don,
Congratulations on your first drive in the New Beetle!
2. The Siemens controller had the fan on for most of the time. I need
to talk to Victor about what are normal operating temperatures for the
drive.
I'm curious about that because I'm planning to go with a Siemens setup in my
conversion as well. I thought the Siemens motor and controller are both
water cooled. Does the controller also have a fan for air cooling in
addition to the water cooling?
Thanks,
Charles
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