EV Digest 4467
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) Re: Tachometer Hookup
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) Re: PCF-20 Design Flaw
by Dave Cover <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) Re: Albright contactor
by Rush <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) OT: Gmail invites
by Nick Austin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) Brusa Charger Max Voltage (was FW: PCF-20 Design Flaw)
by "Don Cameron" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) 9" Motor questions
by Rush <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7) Re: Tachometer Hookup
by "Roland Wiench" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8) BRUSA NLG5xx max voltage
by Victor Tikhonov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
9) Re: 9" Motor questions
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) Re: PCF-20 Design Flaw
by "Rich Rudman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
11) Re:Charger Recommendation
by "Rich Rudman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
12) Re: Albright contactor
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13) Bolt patterns used to our advantage. Low rolling tires.
by "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
14) Re:BRUSA NLG5xx max voltage
by Dave Cover <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
15) RE: Bolt patterns used to our advantage. Low rolling tires.
by "Philip Marino" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16) Re: Bolt patterns used to our advantage. Low rolling tires.
by Ryan Stotts <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
17) Re: Bolt patterns used to our advantage. Low rolling tires.
by Andrew Letton <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
18) Re: Bolt patterns used to our advantage. Low rolling tires.
by Christopher Zach <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
19) e-bike trans question
by BR Deshpande <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
20) Re: ComutaCar "rescue"
by Nick Viera <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
21) Re: D.C. Motor tear down proceedure (Long)
by Nick Viera <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
22) Re: Oozing Motor?
by Nick Viera <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
23) Running caps over spec
by Christopher Zach <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
24) JeepEV Drivetrain (was: Re: Oozing Motor?)
by Nick Viera <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--- Begin Message ---
Bill Dennis wrote:
>> I'm at a loss on the tachometer. I hooked up the noise
>> suppression filter and hooked the tach to a 12V battery. But
>> as soon as I make the connection, it shoots up to 2000 RPM
>> and stays there. I've triple checked that I've got the
>> correct wires going to the places they should.
Roger Stockton wrote:
> Given that it seems that 2000RPM should correspond to a signal of
> about 50-60Hz, perhaps the tach is picking up 60Hz EMI from things
> like nearby flourescent lights, etc. at your test bench?
Or just that 2000 rpm happens to be displayed when there is no signal on
the rpm wire. For example, the tachometer's designer might have gotten
clever and designed it so "open +12v wire" shows 0 rpm, "rpm wire
shorted to ground" displays 1000 rpm, "rpm wire shorted to +12v"
displays 3000 rpm, and "broken wire" displays 2000 rpm. This would
provide a serviceman with an indication of what to look for if it
breaks.
Try measuring the voltage on the rpm wire with a multimeter;. Or apply a
voltage and see if the meter moves, or apply an AC frequency source
(such as from the headphone jack of a radio if that's all you have).
--
Humanity is acquiring all the right technology for all the wrong
reasons.
-- R. Buckminster Fuller
--
Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart_at_earthlink.net
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
--- Victor Tikhonov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> > The NG-5 seems to be much more robust. Flawless operation for
> > years.
> >
> > Bill Dube'
>
> So is BRUSA NLG5xx...
>
> --
> Victor
But do any of the Brusas go over 240 volts? Not according to their web site.
But a PFC-20 will
handle the 300+ volt pack I'm putting together. Rich, how long until the new
pcbs will be
available?
Dave Cover
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Paul,
Thanks for the diode value.
If I use them in my set up for 180 V, I am basically risking some of my
components if they fail because of overvoltage, correct?
Rush
Tucson AZ
www.ironandwood.org
----- Original Message -----
From: "Paul G." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Thursday, June 30, 2005 9:21 AM
Subject: Re: Albright contactor
>
> On Jun 29, 2005, at 3:14 PM, Rush wrote:
>
>> Has the contactor been harmed in any way?
>
> Not likely, I've hooked one up backwards too
>
>> What is the value of the diode?
>
> The diode is a 1N5404. Its a 3 amp 400 volt standard recovery diode.
>
>> Are these contactors good for 180V?
>
> Not rated for that voltage, but they have been used at higher voltages.
>
> Paul "neon" G.
>
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
If anybody on this list wants a Gmail invite, message me off-list and I'll
get one out to you.
Gmail is a webmail service offered by Google. It is currently in beta, and so
is invite only.
It's surprisingly good, you should consider giving it a try even if you are
normally skeptical about such things :)
Thanks!
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Dave, if you read Victor's web page: http://www.metricmind.com/charger.htm
you will see that these chargers can go up to 720Volts.
Just scratch off the old model number replace it with the new, and viola!
Don
Victoria, BC, Canada
See the New Beetle EV Conversion Web Site at
www.cameronsoftware.com/ev/
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Dave Cover
Sent: June 30, 2005 11:31 AM
To: EVList
Subject: Re: PCF-20 Design Flaw
--- Victor Tikhonov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> > The NG-5 seems to be much more robust. Flawless operation
> > for years.
> >
> > Bill Dube'
>
> So is BRUSA NLG5xx...
>
> --
> Victor
But do any of the Brusas go over 240 volts? Not according to their web site.
But a PFC-20 will handle the 300+ volt pack I'm putting together. Rich, how
long until the new pcbs will be available?
Dave Cover
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi all,
My motor is an ADC 9", it is already *installed* in the truck, at least
attached to the adapter plate and transmission, the motor clamp still has to be
attached to the truck's motor mounts. I have a couple questions:
1) If I rotate the motor clamp so that the flat plate is on the bottom,
fabricate an adapter mount plate that the flat plate sits on and attaches to,
can I then attach the adapter mount plate directly to the holes of the existing
motor mounts or do I have to use the rubber bushings as shock absorbers?
2) The motor was never broken in, what I was planning to do was take a 12 V
battery, hook it up and let it run. It is already hooked to the transmission
and so there will be a load on it, the flywheel etc, will that be a problem?
How long should I let it run? I have a 12 V charger that I can hook up to the
battery so that it has a continual charge.
3) How do I hook up the motor? I know that I only use two of the terminals, but
which two? And the other 2 terminals get shorted, right?
My battery pack will be 180 V, does that present a problem in any way? I will
have a Zilla as a controller.
Any other steps I should take?
Thanks for the patience with these basic questions..
Rush
Tucson AZ
www.ironandwood.org
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
----- Original Message -----
From: Lee Hart<mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>
Sent: Thursday, June 30, 2005 2:20 PM
Subject: Re: Tachometer Hookup
Bill Dennis wrote:
>> I'm at a loss on the tachometer. I hooked up the noise
>> suppression filter and hooked the tach to a 12V battery. But
>> as soon as I make the connection, it shoots up to 2000 RPM
>> and stays there. I've triple checked that I've got the
>> correct wires going to the places they should.
Roger Stockton wrote:
> Given that it seems that 2000RPM should correspond to a signal of
> about 50-60Hz, perhaps the tach is picking up 60Hz EMI from things
> like nearby flourescent lights, etc. at your test bench?
Or just that 2000 rpm happens to be displayed when there is no signal on
the rpm wire. For example, the tachometer's designer might have gotten
clever and designed it so "open +12v wire" shows 0 rpm, "rpm wire
shorted to ground" displays 1000 rpm, "rpm wire shorted to +12v"
displays 3000 rpm, and "broken wire" displays 2000 rpm. This would
provide a serviceman with an indication of what to look for if it
breaks.
Try measuring the voltage on the rpm wire with a multimeter;. Or apply a
voltage and see if the meter moves, or apply an AC frequency source
(such as from the headphone jack of a radio if that's all you have).
--
Humanity is acquiring all the right technology for all the wrong
reasons.
-- R. Buckminster Fuller
--
Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart_at_earthlink.net
Go to a Stewart Warner Instrument Web site to see a multiple of tack hook ups
for different ignition systems. My Stewart Warner Tack in my 1966 sports car
is a three wire system.
One wire is to 12 VDC + when ignition switch is on.
One wire is to 12 VDC - ground
The sender wire goes to the 12 VDC negative of the coil which is switch on
and off by the points in the distributor. The points ride on a 8 lobes on the
distributor shaft, so when the distributor makes one 360 degree turn it turns
it fires the coil 8 times.
This sends a 12 VDC negative on-off pulse in the sender wire to the Tack.
I am using this same type of tack on another car which has a solid state
ignition system, which is connected to the tack output terminal on the unit.
So its must be a 12 VDC negative pulse in the sender to indicates RPM.
But this may be just Stewart Warner system.
The Zilla also has a tack output which can operated my Stewart Warner tack in
my EV. Could talk to Otmar about the output specs.
Roland
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Don already answered you, it's 720V max. I wanted to add that since
the voltages overlap, it makes sense to pick the lowest voltage
model covering your needs but not higher. The current output will
be higher (since the power is the same for any model.
You can stack them to increase output power too.
--
Victor
'91 ACRX - something different
Dave Cover wrote:
--- Victor Tikhonov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
The NG-5 seems to be much more robust. Flawless operation for
years.
Bill Dube'
So is BRUSA NLG5xx...
--
Victor
But do any of the Brusas go over 240 volts? Not according to their web site.
But a PFC-20 will
handle the 300+ volt pack I'm putting together. Rich, how long until the new
pcbs will be
available?
Dave Cover
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Rush wrote:
> 1) If I rotate the motor clamp so that the flat plate is on the bottom,
> fabricate an adapter mount plate that the flat plate sits on and attaches to,
> can I then attach the adapter mount plate directly to the holes of the
> existing motor mounts or do I have to use the rubber bushings as shock
> absorbers?
You can mount an electricmotor directly to the fframe, with no rubbermounts. If
the motor (and flywheel assembly) are well balanced, there will be no noise or
vibration *from the motor*.
However, the *rest* of the vehicle's drive train (transmission, drive shaft,
differential) will also produce noise and vibration. So the vehicle will be a
little bit louder without the rubber mounts. You probably won't notice the
difference on a truck, but you would in a car.
2) The motor was never broken in, what I was planning to do was take a 12 V
battery, hook it up and let it run. It is already hooked to the transmission
and so there will be a load on it, the flywheel etc, will that be a problem?
How long should I let it run? I have a 12 V charger that I can hook up to the
battery so that it has a continual charge.
A day or so at 12vis usually plenty. A battery charger will work if it is
able to supply at least 30 amps.
3) How do I hook up the motor? I know that I only use two of the terminals, but
which two? And the other 2 terminals get shorted, right?
No; you have a series motor, which should have 4 terminals marked A1 A2 (the
armature) and S1 S2 (the field). You need to wire the field in series with the
armature. For example, connect A1 to +12v, A2 to S1, and S2 to -12v. If the
motor runs backwards, swap S1 and S2.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
PFC chargers can get to 450 volts, not just 300.
New Pcbs are about 50 units down the road.
There are ways to get the current controller PCB to do just exactly what
a NiCad needs, you just have to ask, or let me know at the ordering time
that you are using NiCads.
There already is a Zero time out to cut the high voltage hold time to Zero.
This was needed for the first Evercells. Set a peak and CLICK! once hit it's
off. This is a very rarely used feature.
I do test it.
- The other is a timer start on power up. What you need when you don't trust
the voltage peak timer start method... This has been on all of our chargers
since the Beta days.
But it only goes to 2.75 hours. Adjusting the internal clock trim pot...
gets you about 8.5 hours. Messing with the timer R/C network can get you
days of timer. I have only had about 2 customers that have asked for more
than the 2.75 hours that they all come with. So... there has not been a
real high demand for it.
What the added feature is , a latch that locks in once the voltage peak
has set the timer. That we will get on the next rev of PCB turn. We do have
a timer latch for Reg start timing. As far as I know nobody has actually
used this feature. Clearly that function will get rewired for latch at
voltage detect.
It's not like we don't have features, we have tons of them, it's just that
time changes which ones are really important to our customers and which ones
looked really good at the last board turn.
Lets all keep clearly in mind the PROPER method for charging NiCds is to
replace %110 of the amp hours used. So if you are really doing a NiCd
right, you have a E-meter and logging software that knows how much came out
and how much is needed. Manzanita Micro chargers clearly don't have a built
in amphour counter... and therefore need additional state of charge support.
That you can get a PFC charger using a PbLa logic control to charge a NiCd
is a matter of skill and luck on the operators part.
Some times, both run out at the same time.
Rich Rudman
Manzanita Micro
> But do any of the Brusas go over 240 volts? Not according to their web
site. But a PFC-20 will
> handle the 300+ volt pack I'm putting together. Rich, how long until the
new pcbs will be
> available?
>
> Dave Cover
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Lawerence;
> > Ummm
> > I have to be carfull about the details of WHO is doing what,
> > But I have plans on a 50Kw single phase charger... it's being loaded
with
> > PFC75 Xrevs this week for testing.
> >
> "I am also working on a 480VAC version for one of my clients."
> >
> > So yea the Big stuff is being talked about and We are making progress on
> > developing it.
> > A really Big check would take this of the back burner like fast.
> >
> > I expect to use Gp as my main test Rig for high speed charging. It's the
> > only EV that is near by that can possibly use 50kw of charge power.
> Clearly
> > we should have sub 30 minute charge times Even if she gets completely
> > drained. But.... this has to be done with control and respect the Rod's
> > batteries and equipment. Doing really high power charging requires
REGS,
> to
> > protect the batteries. Stuffing $1800 bucks of Regs into that Beast is a
> > week long project of standing on my head. I have better places to stick
my
> > head.... As Rod will gladly point out.
> >
> > Yes I expect the Governator to notice.....I don't think his Hummer can
> roast
> > the front tires like My client's can....I've been inside this Van , and
> had
> > the Old Raptor 1200 rip my head off with 3 other healthy sized men on
> > board. We did this as we blew past the Governator's mansion. This
AreoStar
> > van would do very well at a NEDRA event.
> >
> > Some specs that should make us EVers proud is 500 watt hours per mile,
60
> > mile plus range on lead Acid, Lays rubber on command....and at will.
It's
> a
> > DC Series wound and costs Fractions to make comapared to the AC drive
> ground
> > up alternative.
>
> > Well enough to think about it for the front of Gp.... think about it...
Gp
> > has a 9 incher and a Zilla 2K.... and a tranny that was made for a 2
liter
> > V6... This Aerostar Van has a 9 incher and a Raptor 1200 and a tranny
made
> > for a 3.8 liter Ford or a 4 liter. LOTS more tranny. And it shifts like
> > fricken NOW! It's a better idea than a whimpy 5 speed and a cable
shifter.
> >
> > One of my goals for high power charing is to burry the H2 folks in
> practical
> > miles driven over a month. Yea they might beable to refill quicker...
But
> > they need to truck in H2, or have a REALLY large solar array... We just
> plug
> > in, and hit the Go button, Wait for the Blue light, and see ya later....
> My
> > hunch is we can out milage the current system, since our rigs are not
> > experimental and can only be driven by ceritfied fuel cell drivers. Most
> H2
> > rigs are NOT allowed to be driven by untrained folks, I guess it's too
> easy
> > to hurt a prototype Cell car that cost millions to build.
> >
> > I would also like to see the Kwhr of energy they need to make and
> transport
> > thier fuel. We will know our total use, since we will get charged for
it.
> > I would like to see the watthrs That go into that Sacramento Fuel cell
> > station that the Governator has been shown at. The Solar cells can't
make
> > that much H2, and we could get quite a bit more range from that energy
> than
> > converting it to H2 then compressing it then Celling it to back to the
> > electricity that we use in the first place. My hunch is the Solar cells
> are
> > really nice Wall candy... an they have Lots of 480 3 phase or a large
> > trucked in tank to do the real H2 conversion and storage. Hey this is
> > Californaia we are talking about ... you rarley see the Movie Star's
> warts.
> >
> > Madman
> >
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Rush asked:
> If I use them in my set up for 180 V, I am basically risking some of my
> components if they fail because of overvoltage, correct?
As long as you have TWO in series, and switch BOTH of them on and off at the
same time, they should safely break 180v.
Natrually, the rest of teh components in your system need to be rated for this
voltage, too. Charger, controller, etc. (Don't worry about the DC/DC and
Balancer; I'm taking care of it :-)
--
Lee Hart 814 8th Ave N Sartell MN 56377 leeahart_at_earthlink.net
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
13 inch tires are going out. No new car manufacturers are using 13's
anymore. Turns out that Honda, Kia and Ford Escorts share the same bolt
pattern. I'm looking fot the lightest 14 inch wheels it can find and go 65
instead of 70 for the height. Anybody done this? What issues does one have
going to 14 inch rims? Might they be too wide? Can't seem to find low
rolling resistance tires in 13 anymore. The diameter is only .5 inch
different. More rim and less tire. LR............
Lawrence Rhodes
Bassoon/Contrabassoon
Reedmaker
Book 4/5 doubler
Electric Vehicle & Solar Power Advocate
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
415-821-3519
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
--- Victor Tikhonov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Don already answered you, it's 720V max. I wanted to add that since
> the voltages overlap, it makes sense to pick the lowest voltage
> model covering your needs but not higher. The current output will
> be higher (since the power is the same for any model.
>
My bad. My appologies. I had just been looking at the Zivan chargers and got
confused betwen the
NG5 and the NLG5. (Any reason why they have almost the same model numbers?)
I'm still newbie
enough to forget to go to MetricMind fiirst for all the info I need.
Unfortunately, I can't afford a Brusa. No matter how much you try to
rationalize the quality,
longevity, etcetera, etcetera. But on my next car, the Beetle conversion for my
wife, I'm going to
try like @#$%^ to use an AC system with regen and all those nice features.
Don's as good a
salesman for your components as anyone. Does he get a commission?
Dave Cover
DAC
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
What low rolling resistance tires are available in 14" ? I'm looking for
LRR tires for my Echo ( stock size 175/65-14).
As far as wheel weight, are aluminum wheels really much lighter than the OEM
steel wheels? I always thought it was more of a style thing.
Phil Marino
From: "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: [email protected]
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <[email protected]>,
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Bolt patterns used to our advantage. Low rolling tires.
Date: Thu, 30 Jun 2005 13:59:06 -0700
13 inch tires are going out. No new car manufacturers are using 13's
anymore. Turns out that Honda, Kia and Ford Escorts share the same bolt
pattern. I'm looking fot the lightest 14 inch wheels it can find and go 65
instead of 70 for the height. Anybody done this? What issues does one have
going to 14 inch rims? Might they be too wide? Can't seem to find low
rolling resistance tires in 13 anymore. The diameter is only .5 inch
different. More rim and less tire. LR............
Lawrence Rhodes
Bassoon/Contrabassoon
Reedmaker
Book 4/5 doubler
Electric Vehicle & Solar Power Advocate
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
415-821-3519
_________________________________________________________________
FREE pop-up blocking with the new MSN Toolbar get it now!
http://toolbar.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200415ave/direct/01/
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Lawrence Rhodes wrote:
> I'm looking for the lightest 14 inch wheels
Stock wheels are all cast alum and might all weigh about the same.
I'd like to know how much cast wheels weigh, and how much aftermarket
forged alum ones weigh.
You can get light weight 14x7 and 14x8 inch wheels, or some 15x3.5 or
4" wheels(or wider)...
I'd suggest Welds since they are light and "cheap"(relatively and
comparatively).
If you contact them about the weights, please post the info.
http://www.weldracing.com/Weld_Racing/wheels/sport.shtm
http://www.jegs.com/cgi-bin/ncommerce3/ProductDisplay?prrfnbr=2233&prmenbr=361
or
http://www.jegs.com/cgi-bin/ncommerce3/ProductDisplay?prrfnbr=2235&prmenbr=361
There are lighter wheels, but they are not recommended for street driving..
http://www.bogartracingwheels.com/
Expensive though..
http://www.seanhylandmotorsport.com/online/product_info.php?cPath=45&products_id=837
Check out this pic of the older VW Bug 175R15 tire on a 3.5" wheel:
http://img2.uploadimages.net/702326red.jpg (narrow tire looks huge for
some reason!)
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Honda Insight wheels are 14", aluminum, and light. (I don't remember the
weight). They come stock with Bridgestone ProximaRR (?) 165-65R-14 low
rolling resistance tires.
hth,
Andrew
Ryan Stotts wrote:
Lawrence Rhodes wrote:
I'm looking for the lightest 14 inch wheels
Stock wheels are all cast alum and might all weigh about the same.
I'd like to know how much cast wheels weigh, and how much aftermarket
forged alum ones weigh.
You can get light weight 14x7 and 14x8 inch wheels, or some 15x3.5 or
4" wheels(or wider)...
I'd suggest Welds since they are light and "cheap"(relatively and
comparatively).
If you contact them about the weights, please post the info.
http://www.weldracing.com/Weld_Racing/wheels/sport.shtm
http://www.jegs.com/cgi-bin/ncommerce3/ProductDisplay?prrfnbr=2233&prmenbr=361
or
http://www.jegs.com/cgi-bin/ncommerce3/ProductDisplay?prrfnbr=2235&prmenbr=361
There are lighter wheels, but they are not recommended for street driving..
http://www.bogartracingwheels.com/
Expensive though..
http://www.seanhylandmotorsport.com/online/product_info.php?cPath=45&products_id=837
Check out this pic of the older VW Bug 175R15 tire on a 3.5" wheel:
http://img2.uploadimages.net/702326red.jpg (narrow tire looks huge for
some reason!)
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I use Portenza 165R14 tires on my Prizm. They are stock on Prius cars,
and have been upgraded for extra load capacity. No range difference from
my stock (and now 10 year old) Invictas.
Chris
Andrew Letton wrote:
Honda Insight wheels are 14", aluminum, and light. (I don't remember the
weight). They come stock with Bridgestone ProximaRR (?) 165-65R-14 low
rolling resistance tires.
hth,
Andrew
Ryan Stotts wrote:
Lawrence Rhodes wrote:
I'm looking for the lightest 14 inch wheels
Stock wheels are all cast alum and might all weigh about the same. I'd
like to know how much cast wheels weigh, and how much aftermarket
forged alum ones weigh.
You can get light weight 14x7 and 14x8 inch wheels, or some 15x3.5 or
4" wheels(or wider)...
I'd suggest Welds since they are light and "cheap"(relatively and
comparatively).
If you contact them about the weights, please post the info.
http://www.weldracing.com/Weld_Racing/wheels/sport.shtm
http://www.jegs.com/cgi-bin/ncommerce3/ProductDisplay?prrfnbr=2233&prmenbr=361
or
http://www.jegs.com/cgi-bin/ncommerce3/ProductDisplay?prrfnbr=2235&prmenbr=361
There are lighter wheels, but they are not recommended for street
driving..
http://www.bogartracingwheels.com/
Expensive though..
http://www.seanhylandmotorsport.com/online/product_info.php?cPath=45&products_id=837
Check out this pic of the older VW Bug 175R15 tire on a 3.5" wheel:
http://img2.uploadimages.net/702326red.jpg (narrow tire looks huge for
some reason!)
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi All,
I have some questions about the choice of rear sprocket for my dirt
bike project. The sprocket will be chain driven by a 36 V etek.
Doing some quick and dirty calculations, i came to the (erroneous?)
conclusion that at the top rpm of the motor 3600, if i want reasonable
top wheel speeds of say 25-30 mph i need to use a teeth ratio of 1:12.
I have been unsuccesful in finding sprockets. The highest i have found
so far is 12:72 (front-rear).
The other issue is regarding freewheeling. I am not sure if my Curtis
1201 supports this. It looks like I have to do it mechanically.
I would like some ideas about how to achieve a top speed of 30mph (a
jackshaft for an intermediate step down?) using my current setup and
secondly on what would be a good way to do the freewheeling. Thanks in
advance
B.R. Deshpande.
--
"The resistance to a new idea increases as the square of its importance."
-Bertrand Russell.
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--- Begin Message ---
Hi,
Thanks for the information and sources, everyone! I'll check them out
and let you know what I find when I get a chance to work on the
ComutaCar again. For now, getting my JeepEV back on the road is at the
top of my list. ;-)
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
http://api-assembled.com/electric/catalog/ordermenu.html These people
have been supplying me with Citicar and ComutaCar parts for many
years.
David Roden wrote:
According to the auto parts jobber who matched it up for me, the
master cylinder is the same as the one used in a 1967 Rambler
Ambassador with drum brakes.
Lee Hart wrote:
The brakes are standard trailer brake parts. Kind of a poor choice;
but cheap and easy to get. Any place selling trailer parts will have
them. As I recall, the master cylinder was from a 1979 Chevrolet
Chevette.
David Chapman wrote:
The `67 Rambler app sounds about right David. Once one figures out
what the original app was I have had very good luck finding odd old
and unusual at a very good price from www.rockauto.com
--
-Nick
http://Go.DriveEV.com/
1988 Jeep Cherokee 4x4 EV
---------------------------
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--- Begin Message ---
Hi,
Jim, I've been meaning to say thank you to you for writing such a good,
detailed post about motor disassembly/repair. I found it very
informative as I continue work on my motor!
--
-Nick
http://Go.DriveEV.com/
1988 Jeep Cherokee 4x4 EV
---------------------------
Jim Husted wrote:
I’ve had a few requests looking at how I would attack an in field
motor repair the following is a brief look at what I would do for
those interested. First lets add the disclaimer, hehehe. I also
rushed as to get this posted by Sunday for Nick
Always use eye protection; never work beyond your skills unless you
are willing to pay for the repairs in both skin and money. DO NOT
breathe the brush dust. Glove’s are optional and separate the boys
from the girl’s hehehe.
This is what I would recommend to those who would like to do a motor
freshen-up. Remember many things discussed here may not be applicable
to your motor.
Tear down procedure:
For me as I get several varieties I use the letters HT and stamp my
end plates and housing in line from C.E. to D.E. so I know how to
reassemble the plates correctly if they are non-symmetrical, this
also marks the motor as mine because I love them, hehehe. With a
pick or small hook lift the brushes and set the spring on the brush
side and lock the brushes in a lifted position. This will keep the
brushes from pushing in and possibly snagging the bearing as you
remove the armature. Remove the drive end bolts. Use screwdrivers
or pry-bars and pry the drive plate and armature assembly from the
housing being careful not to bump the comm. once out set it on a
bench with the drive plate hanging over the edge.
If you have pullers then use them. Try to grab from the inner most
area you can pull from. The threaded mounting holes of the plate are
good to pull from, if you have a puller that can grab bolts, which
have been threaded into these holes. You are less likely to break
the plate pulling from here rather than grabbing around the O.D. If
you have a shaft with a threaded end, leave the nut loose at the end.
This will keep you from splitting the shaft if the pullers are not
equipped with a shaft saver type tip. Once the plate has been pulled
to the nut remove it and finish pulling plate off. If you feel you
are going to break the plate which believe me does happen (not to me
of course, but so I’ve heard), then use a torch to heat the inner
bearing race inside the bearing itself. Remove the rubber seal if
applicable or just burn through a steel shield. This will expand the
bearing and she should break loose with a nice pop if the plate was
under puller force. If the pla! te is being a real jerk then hit the
puller end with a hammer straight in line with the puller and shaft
as someone also described earlier. When even this attempt is foiled
then your only recourse is to cut the bearing out as mentioned
earlier also. All of these ways were mentioned and are all good ways
to use both this is the order I would attack it in.
Now for those without pullers.
I actually prefer to set the armature and D.E. plate assy. onto a
second case. This one is empty so the fan won’t hit the fields and
the armature and is free to drop away once detached from the bearing.
I also use rags so the armature doesn’t it the ground. I like this
way because you distribute the force along the whole plate as you
drive the shaft down with a dead blow mallet and is one of the
fastest ways to remove the armature from the D.E. plate. For those
who don’t have an extra housing or large round metal base to hang the
armature and to rest the plate against I recommend to go rent or buy
a puller ; (you’ll be glad you did.
Once the D.E. plate has been removed the snap ring can be depressed
and removed. Be warned they like to jump out at your face, see
safety glasses. The bearing can now be tapped out. This bearing
should just slide out. If it is hard to remove you have either
cocked it or it has run against a marred snap ring lip area. If you
are stuck on that lip then reseat the bearing and remove any burs
from the lip with an X-acto blade or file. If cocked start over, and
try to tap it straight and it should just tap out. Installing the
new bearing is the same here. This bearing should be easy out easy
in.
The only way to remove the C.E. bearing is to use pullers or pry-bars
but the latter is not very effective and you end up scarring the
comm. and or the bake-a-lite face.
From forklift dirty to EV clean
I use a hot soap and water degreaser. In fact if the wife allowed
you to, you could wash your motor in her sink. With a fresh black
eye you’ve decided that maybe outside might be better. Add some soap
to some hot water and scrub away at any grease and grime that maybe
lurking. Now you must get the water out! I use compressed air and
blow out all I can and then use my bake oven to bake out the rest,
but you could use the wife’s range set at 250ish… If one black eye is
enough from the Mrs., you can use a small heater set outside and put
the armature and or housing close until it is dried out. You can use
solvents but I take no responsibility to your house burning down and
the ensuing wife beating you will receive (also do not breathe
vapor). Use an OHMmeter to make sure that your parts are ground free
(no continuity between any steel to any copper). A pre-test should
be done so you know whether you started with a ground or may still
have some moisture left to dry out. ! Just touch any copper area to
any steel area, it should not show any continuity between them @ a
minimum RX times 10K meter. I use a 40 M fluke meter
If you wanted to really shine it up use some clear AC-46 insulation
spray from EIS and coat all your windings and let it air dry, AHHHHH.
Inspection
I’ve always told my guys nothing beats a good pair of eye’s, and to
never rely totally on test equipment. What I mean by that is lets
say I test for resistance and it doesn’t show any continuity, so I’m
good right? Well no not really. What color is the insulation?
Bright and yellow, or really dark? Do you see a really nice yellow
band with a dark brown steak running through it?? Well that tells me
that armature has an open in one of the windings. Are your windings
nice and wine colored with hard, tough, and sharp insulation that
looks like it would just swipe a knuckle clean open if you gave it
half a chance? Or does it look dark, soft, flaky and at worse case
ashy. Look for dark banding as this is a bad sign unlike even
darkening, where the motor is just getting hot.
Make sure your brush holders have no wiggle, as they can get loose if
heated. Nothing will destroy your motor faster than if a holder
busted through the insulated part of the brush ring, and yes it does
happen if heated enough. The holder’s get hot and heats the board
around the rivets and they can eventually pull through. This is more
applicable to low volt usage but felt I’d have you all go wiggle your
holders real quick ; )
Look at the comm. does it have any pitting? Is it grooved, if yes is
it enough to have it turned? These you would have to determine
yourself or send a pic so I could look. Inspect the comm. edge where
it meets the bake-a-lite to see if there is any lifting or cracks.
If cracks are present there, get it dipped and baked and then turned.
If you bring in just an armature most places can turn it fairly
inexpressively.
Matching bearings
The number your looking for is a 4-digit number (located on the seal
area) usually starting with 6 as in 6207 (6200 series) or 6306, (6300
series) etc. There are tons of dashes after the number like 2RS and
PP and ZZ which are seal and shield codes. Just bring the bearings
down (but keep the C.E. one for later) to a bearing house and buy a
set based on your needs, preferences, and or budget. See oozing
motor thread for more on bearings.
If everything has gone at least somewhat according to plan (which it
hasn’t) you are now ready to reassemble the motor.
Install bearing into the D.E. plate (it should just tap in easy). A
dab of loc-tite can be used here. Install the cleaned snap ring.
Drive or press the plate and bearing assy onto the shaft using a
small piece of pipe. I use hardened bearing drivers (available
individually at EIS in numbers 0 through 9). A 6207 or 6307 bearing
uses a number 7 driver (the last number on your bearing is the number
of the driver you would need to use. You want to press or drive the
bearing from the inner race so you do not stress it. Make sure that
the pipe does not go into the seal or shield area as this would be
bad! If you press from the plate you are applying all that force
through the bearing. I hammer drive bearing all the time and as long
as you don’t go mad and try to seat the bearing with one blow you
will be fine. The nice thing I like about hammer driving is that
when you do seat the bearing you can hear a ting type noise and it is
different than when driving. Check to see if the fan rubs. Spin the
plate around, (do not put finger between fan and plate) (I had a boss
that did that)(7 stitches)(and a bone s! pur). If it doesn’t make an
aluminum ching ching ching sound you are go for comm. end bearing.
If you saved your old C.E. bearing wipe it off and use it on top of
the new one. This will allow you to hit it and not the new bearing.
This will only work on shafts that have short journals. You don’t
want the old bearing to press onto the shaft. Most C.E. shafts are
short and this will work well for those in field. Once on rotate the
bearing around, it should feel really smooth. If not bring the
bearing back and let them know that there was no way your 14 pound
hammer could have damaged the bearing to this extent (and you had
followed the internet instructions to the T) and demand that it be
replaced with a better bearing for free (let me know if this works,
hehe).
At this point you are ready to slip the armature and D.E. plate back
into the motor housing assy. Remember to install the wave washer
before installing armature. Install your rear bolts and tighten
(remember they are only ¼ X 20 bolts and can break if over-torqued)
(also these are self tapping bolts and will go in a little hard, as
the factory does not pre-tap holes), and hand spin the motor to see
if it free spins. Do this with the brushes lifted from the comm.
with no brush tension. If there is no rubbing in fan and or armature
body, set the brushes and springs and give it a 12-volt bench test.
She should purr.
There are I’m sure many issues facing those with their first motor
adventure, but I hope this will give you a basic list of how to go
about it. A quick E-mail can help resolve any mishaps and issues
that may arise.
I hope this was informative
Good luck
Jim Husted Hi-Torque Electric
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--- Begin Message ---
Hi,
Rich Rudman wrote:
Jim are you going to mention the possibility of a Comm to shaft short, and
that the Arm should be Ohmed comm to shaft.
Oozing black goey stuff from a sealed for life brearing could be a lot other
things than just worn out.
Use a DVM and you better get 100s of K ohms to a couple of megohms. It
should read open if clean and dry.
I did test my motor with my multimeter and it shows that there is no
connection (infinite resistance) from any of the Commutator bars to the
steel motor shaft.
I still am thinking that my bearings were damaged by excessive heat and
possibly some of the vibration that was still present in the system due
to my problem transmission.
Thanks,
--
-Nick
http://Go.DriveEV.com/
1988 Jeep Cherokee 4x4 EV
---------------------------
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Quick question: If I fire up a circuit that uses 35 volt caps at 48
volts, what will happen?
Likewise if I run a 35 volt rated N-FET at 48 volts, what happens? 35
volt diode?
Yes I have higher voltage components on the way; I was just wondering
what happens when you exceed voltage specifications.
Chris
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--- Begin Message ---
Hi,
Here's an update on my progress with my Jeep's motor bearing change out,
and transmission/transfer case swap.
Today I was able to complete the transmission/ transfer case swap on my
Jeep. As you may remember from previous posts, my old transmission was
having problems (vibration, noise, getting _really_ hot). I would've
just bought a replacement transmission, but the transmission used in my
Jeep (Peugeot BA-10/5 5-speed) was only used in 1988-1989.5 model year
Cherokees and is known to be a crappy transmission.
So I instead decided to upgrade to the better built Aisin Warner AX-15
5-Speed transmission that was used in Cherokees from 1989.5 to the end
of production in 2001. This transmission is pretty much a direct drop in
replacement for the Peugeot, except for a different mount and slight
differences in how the transfer case shift linkage attaches to it.
However, the AX-15 also has a 23-spline output shaft verses the
21-spline shaft on the Peugeot. This means I would've had to replace the
main shaft of my NP231 transfer-case to get it to mate up to the AX-15.
I didn't feel like tearing into my transfer-case. So instead I opted to
get a new NP231 transfer-case with a 23-spine input, based on the
feeling that I'd rather replace both units now, and tear the Jeep apart
once, rather than have the old original transfer-case die sometime soon
down the road.
Pictures of the transmission/transfer-case swap:
http://www.driveev.com/jeepev/photos/pgallery4_3.php
-- Switching thoughts --
I've also made some progress regarding my oozing motor. I rented a 2/3
Jaw puller and successfully pulled the comm end bearing with the puller.
That bearing came off pretty easy.
Then I was thinking of a way to use the jaw puller on the drive end of
the motor. I tried bolting two pieces of steel square tubing to the end
bell face. These two pieces of square steel had holes drilled in them so
I stuck the jaws of the puller in the holes, and tried using the puller
as usual. This approach didn't work... after applying a good amount of
pressure the bearing/end bell still didn't move any, and my square tube
pieces began to move around a little. I think that this approach didn't
work either because my square tube pieces weren't symmetrical enough...
so the pulling force wasn't perfectly straight out, or that bearing is
on the motor shaft _really_ tight?
I still haven't tried heating things up (don't really have the means
to), and I've only tried taking a mallet/hammer to the shaft a few times
to no avail (I'm probably just not hitting it hard enough because I have
this fear of damaging the shaft).
What I really think would help this situation is to have one of those
pullers that have a plate that you can bolt on to a flat surface (like
the motor end bell face). However, all the pullers of this type that the
auto part store has have plates with bolt holes about 7.5" or less
apart. This doesn't help as the bolts on my motor end bell are closer to
9" apart. Ideas?
Pictures of the motor work thus far are also located at:
http://www.driveev.com/jeepev/photos/pgallery4_3.php (near the bottom)
This last motor bearing is the only thing left keeping me from getting
my Jeep back together and on the road. I'm eager and nervous to see how
the new transmission/ transfer case will perform (hoping it'll be a big
improvement). :-)
--
-Nick
http://Go.DriveEV.com/
1988 Jeep Cherokee 4x4 EV
---------------------------
Nick Viera wrote:
Hi,
A big thanks to all that participated in this post... you've taught me a
lot about my motor!
After looking online at several places and locally, I decided to buy
from a local industrial distributor. They sold both SKF and Koyo
bearings, but I ended up buying the Koyo bearings because they were
about half the cost of comparable SKF bearings. It ended up being $19
for the main bearing (6207-2RDC3) and $15 for the comm-end bearing
(6305-2RDC3).
I still haven't been able to get the end bell + bearing off the motor
shaft, but now that I've read your suggestions, I'll pull the whole
armature out tonight and give it another shot, then let you all know how
it went ;-)
Thanks,
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