EV Digest 4522
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) RE: Real eff hybrids, - now Prius commentary
by jerry dycus <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) Re: 9Electric Degreasing Advice Sought
by "Bob Rice" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) Re: Conversion Van
by <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) Re: Conversion Van
by <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) Re: Conversion Van
by <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) 4x4 locking hubs
by "Stu or Jan" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7) Re: Regen with charged batteries, comments
by "Bob Rice" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8) Re: Looking for data logger for monitoring my Optima YT
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
9) Re: Honda Insight question
by John Wayland <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) Re: Honda Insight question
by John Wayland <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
11) Lenco/Tweco Cable Connectors
by Rush <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
12) Re: Motor cooling
by Nick Viera <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13) Re: Looking for data logger for monitoring my Optima YT
by "Sharon Hoopes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
14) RE: Lenco/Tweco Cable Connectors
by "Brown, Jay" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
15) Curtis Controllers in Pallet Jacks
by John Wayland <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16) Real world numbers, was Re: CalCars Teach Lead...
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
17) Inductive Throttle Position Sensor??
by "August Johnson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
18) More Datsun Truck Fun
by John Wayland <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
19) Re: Looking for data logger for monitoring my Optima YT
by Danny Miller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
20) Re: Inductive Throttle Position Sensor??
by Mark Farver <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
21) Re: Regen with charged batteries, comments
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
22) Metro engine weight, Re: Honda Insight question
by jerry dycus <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
23) Re: Conversion Van
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
24) Re: 1965 Datsun Truck - Future Electric Vehicle
by "Paul G." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
25) Re: 1965 Datsun Truck - Future Electric Vehicle
by "IMAP | OE" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
26) Re: Sepex Motor controller
by "Paul G." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--- Begin Message ---
Hi Philip and All,
--- Philip Marino <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>
> >From: jerry dycus <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>
>
> >
> >--- David Dymaxion <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> wrote:
> >
> > > A car's gas mileage is determined far more by
> its
> > > weight and aero
> > > than motor size. If you look at the same car
> with
> >
> > That is a big part of it but it's also x's the
> >engine eff which a 120 hp engine like the Prius'
> >running at 15hp to do 75mph is not heavily loaded
> by
> >any stretch of the imagination.
>
> Hi, Jerry -
>
> I found many sites which list the specifications for
> the 2005 Prius, and ALL
> of them give the ICE max power as 76 HP . It is
> clearly not 120 HP, as you
Cool, thanks for looking that up.
Maybe I was remembering the motor plus the
gen/emotor/starter side power together that's in
addition to the other e motor.
> state in support of your argument that the Prius
> ICE is lightly loaded at
> highway speeds. The earlier generation Prius ICE
> is listed as slightly
> less power : 70 HP.
>
>
> Also, can you tell us where your claim of 15HP ( at
> the engine) to drive
> this car at 75 MPH came from?
Expolated from other known power needs of other
cars/EV's. Maybe someone can give a more exact figure,
calculation using one of the power required progarms
on the web?
Doesn't it tell you on the dash in some way? It can
be calculated from mpg readings when the e motor is
not engaged.
The Prius uses many low drag features like a very
low aero CD plus low rolling resistance tires, ect, so
it's not likely to use much more than 15hp.
But it is close and even at 76hp vs 15hp or even
25hp to go 75 or so mph, it is still not heavily
loaded and alway wasting energy, fuel on running it's
parasitic engine drag.
Just how much power do you think it takes to run
the water/fuel/oil pumps, cam, valves, piston/bearing
friction, ect?
Now compare that to an AC motor's internal drag?
Which is more?
There is much saving here by using a much smaller
ICE engine, bigger E motor and a much larger batt
pack, plug in charger without any speed/range/power
loss.
So if someone could calculate just what it's power
needs in kw and it's shown mpg at 75mph are from the
dash or trip mileage, we can calculate it's motor eff.
This would be good for all of us to know.
Thanks,
Jerry Dycus
>
>
>
> Have you done a calculations based on CD, frontal
> area, estimated drive
> train losses and tire rolling resistance, etc,. or
> is this an estimate based
> on your ev rule of thumb ?
>
>
> Phil
>
____________________________________________________
Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page
http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
----- Original Message -----
From: "Rod Hower" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Friday, July 22, 2005 9:48 PM
Subject: RE: 9Electric Degreasing Advice Sought
> This is an extreme measure, but stop by your dollar
> store and get some oven cleaner. Make sure you rinse
> it off really good since it is very corrosive, but it
> does a really nice job of cleaning up the nasty stuff.
> Rod
>
> --- Roger Stockton <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > Ryan Stotts [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> >
> > > Or try this stuff:
> > >
> > > http://www.simplegreen.com/
> >
> > If you can't get the tranny to a steam cleaner,
> > definitely give the
> > Simple Green a try. Not only is it remarkably
> > effective, but it is also
> > environmentally friendly.
> >
> > Cheers,
> >
> > Roger.
> >
> > Hi All;
After you have done all that, it's cleaned off so there isn't caked
greease. tape up all the openings good and sandblast it clean! It is very
gratifying to see the alumunun clean up shiny! After doing it all, get some
engine enamal from, say , NAPA in handy spray cans. One will do it! They
look BEAUTIFUL in shiny Ford Blue or Chevy orange or somebody elses dark
green. Now put it tohether after painting up the motor, too. I painted the
motor black, the adapter plate orange and the tranny Ford blue. so I can
say, at show an' tell, that that everything right of the orange plate is
stock VW.
Just a thought.
Seeya
Bob
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Thanks Mike, Beginning to lean toward converting the old van to electric
anyway just for the fun, well sort-of.
Randy
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mike Chancey" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Sunday, July 17, 2005 3:11 PM
Subject: Re: Conversion Van
> Hi Randy and all,
>
> Jet Industries did do a few full size Dodge Vans and Maxi-Vans around '79
> or' 80. 144 Volts of golf cart batteries, GE SCR controller and an 11" GE
> motor, Dismal performance and poor range. I think they could hit 45 mph
> but the range was only something like 20-25 miles. A couple of the
> Maxi-Vans turned up for sale in Iowa a few years back. I would love to
> mess with one but they didn't seem too practical. Sadly, I think they
> ended up getting scrapped.
>
> For your project the real question is what is the mission for this
> vehicle? Haul one person? Haul seven people? Haul half a ton of
> furniture? Whether or not an EV conversion of this van can be made to
> handle you needs is going to depend on what you want to use it for. If it
> can be done, then the question becomes the cost.
>
> The cheapest conversion I ever heard of was done for $1500. Most run
$5000
> to $9000 if you stick to the lower end components. Even if gas hits $3
per
> gallon and your van gets only 12 miles per gallon $9000 will buy enough
gas
> to go 36,000 miles or enough to make your projected 80 mile trip 450
> times. Driving gasoline free is seldom cheap enough to make up for the
> cost of conversion.
>
> I think a more realistic idea for you might be to purchase a used
> conversion and use it to cover the trips that don't require the range or
> cargo capacity of the van. Decent conversions are often available for
less
> than the price of the parts. Say pick one up for $4000, drive it for a
> while and learn how well an EV fits your needs. Odds are if you keep it
in
> good shape you could then resell it for at least what you invested.
>
> Thanks,
>
>
> Mike Chancey,
> '88 Civic EV
> '95 Solectria Force
> Kansas City, Missouri
> EV List Photo Album at: http://evalbum.com
> My Electric Car at: http://www.geocities.com/electric_honda
> Mid-America EAA chapter at: http://maeaa.org
> Join the EV List at: http://www.madkatz.com/ev/evlist.html
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Tim, Keep me posted on how your ICE conversion works out.
Randy
----- Original Message -----
From: "TiM M" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "EV-List-Post" <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Saturday, July 16, 2005 11:31 PM
Subject: Re: Conversion Van
> Randy Wrote:
> "It's a1989 Ford E150 so it might be a classic. Tried
> getting a kit once but it was around $15K and i
> couldn't justify the cost. Need something that will go
> 45mph top speed with a 80 mile range if possible.
> Randy"
>
> Randy,
> I have an electric 1961 Corvair Rampside pickup
> that I think is pretty closely related to your van. It
> was converted by a high school in AZ in 1997. The
> competition they built it for had a limit of 96V. This
> wasn't really enough to run the ADC 9" motor
> efficiently, but it did run. I bought it last year
> with it's abused pack of generic batteries. It was
> good for about 25 miles per charge. It could get up to
> 75mph on a flat stretch of highway (a tail wind
> helps).
> I'm currently installing a Zilla controller and
> 144V US battery pack. I'm hoping for a 100 mile range,
> but will be happy with 75, it's not very aerodynamic.
> I'm hoping to have it back on the road by next week. I
> can't afford to keep gassing my ICE truck.
>
>
>
> ____________________________________________________
> Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page
> http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Thats true. Must have the cargo area except maybe the rear two feet for
batteries. Maybe there would be room under the floor for batteries also. My
cargo is not very heavy - maybe 400 lbs of snacks.
Randy
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tom Shay" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Saturday, July 16, 2005 11:25 PM
Subject: Re: Conversion Van
> I think the main problem of a conversion van is that most of its weight
> hauling capacity would be taken up by batteries and there would be
> little or no capacity left for hauling people and cargo. What's the point
> of having a big van body with little or no hauling capacity?
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Could 4x4 locking hubs be utilized on the driven wheel as a mechanism to
engage/disengage the freewheel action?
stU
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
----- Original Message -----
From: "Lee Hart" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Friday, July 22, 2005 3:01 PM
Subject: Re: Regen with charged batteries
> Danny Miller wrote:
> > Do they make electric cars with only the motors available for
> > braking force, or are they always combined with conventional brakes?
> Hi All;
Yes the good folks that make electric cars, rail, for a living, run
a serious dynamic braking system, to help stop things. The more updated
stuff pumps it back intio the catenery or 3rd rail.Done automaticly it's
called "Blended Brake" and is controlled automaticly, more air as the
dynamic fades when you stop.
> Some electric cars in the early 1900's had only electric braking. I
> drove a 1902 Baker that was that way -- only regenerative and dynamic
> braking. The only other brake was a parking brake that locked the drive
> train.
> It's amazing how sophisticated the E braking and drive system was, but
the handling!!?? Those old ladies that drove them must have had arms like
King Kong or the Governater, to handle the tiller stearing! Every pothole
threatened to snatch your arms out as the tiller crank goes directly to the
drag link, NO gearing!
> However, the brakes on early automobiles were often weak, ineffective,
> and unreliable. So they passed laws that mandated hydraulic brakes. All
> cars since then have had hydraulic brakes, not because it's the only way
> to do it, but because it's the law.
>
And only in the 60's NINTEEN Sixties did the feds mandate Duel Master
cylinders! Us old farts remember in our deformative years stepping on the
brake pedal, THUNK to the floor 'cuz a brake line was busted!Looking for
something soft and cheap to hit! Yanking on the E brake. Ha Ha! US iron
NEVER had decent E brakes! Grinding the tires into a curb, downshifting to
first @ 25 mph. The good old daze<g>!RR's knew in the eighteen sixties that
you needed failsafe brakes. Geo Westinghouse patented the air brake in 1869,
redesigned it in 1870 , basicly the system we use today, the Automatic air
brake, anything fails, it goes into " emergency" and you come to a grinding
stop until you fix it! Usually parted air hoses between the cars. Last night
a deer got revenge on a Amtrak train, but died in the process, balling up
under the train, popping off several inter car air hoses, stopping the show
RIGHT THERE! Hey! One less one that I can hit with my Rabbit or Preus!Crew
hooked everything and were on their way in awhile. Bleech, pretty messy
under there!
> Big truck manufacturers lobbied for a change to allow air brakes for
> large trucks in the 1940s I think. GM got a special waiver to use
> electric brakes on the rear of the EV-1. Other than that, all cars are
> hydraulic.
> -- Hell, why not ? Trains had shown the value of air brakes, an ABS, We
have had them on trains for 75 years! Rolla kron and Slip Slide control,
other trade names out thereRoll a kron was Budd carbuilders. Theres a blast
from the Past. We had Budd, Pullman, St Louis Car just top mention a few. NO
RR passenger cars are designed and built in the USA anymore. The Good Folks
in Canada supply us with rolling stock, nowadaze.Sliding wheels was always a
braking issue on trains as a slid wheel creates flat spots, that bang- bang-
bang you hear when a freight train goes past. Slide more ythan a few seconds
and it's off to the backshop for wheel truing or replacment if TOO bad.Not
to mention beating the track to death, as those wheels are HEAVY, 15 -20
tons on each.
I dewll on history of RR tech, and legislating good stuff into
existance, RR's and Auto companies don't do the right thing unless
prodded.Friendly, you-will-do-by-certain-date laws on the books. NYC
outlawed internal , forward thinking ,I'd say,or EXternal(Steam),
combustion engines in the Manhattan, to sorta prod RR's to electrify in the
tunnels and open cuts in town. Mainly smoke covered the signals so engineers
couldn't SEE what was ahead. Many paying customers expired in nasty rear
enders. NYC FORCED the electric technology onto mainline RR's After all, for
a nickel you could be wafted about NYC on the trolleys and the new subway,
opened in 1904!
Fast Forward, say 100 years to CA legislating EV's on their roads by a
certain date. Magicly the EV-1 the Gold Standard EV the EV that all others
are judged, the Toyota Rav-4 the Think ALL just sorta appeared. Hey 'aint
laws wonderful?Lets just say that CARB had held power, the EV 2 woulda been
better than the EV-1 The battery tech, Sapieon, Valance MAY have hooked up
wth GM of our America and we could proudly be telling folks about the
General's newest offerings. 200 and 300 mile range EV's and fast charging
tech, on the Electric Highway. Old Stuff. Bob Aronsom had I-94 set up for
that 40 years ago, between Detroit and Chicago, at the Holiday Inns, EVery
40-60 miles Three faze 240 amp 200 amp service! Rich, eat your heart
out<G>!
What? Now the Chevron Oil keeps the Panasonic NIHM off limits here in
the states, I think somebody said on the Plug In Prius List?Texico holds the
Ovonic battey hostage? And the best Govt Oil Money can buy. Tough go for
EV's nowadaze. A National Energency COULD change things?
Meantime just faced my front end issues on my Rabbit. It drove FINE in
Hagerstown, at Power of DC, a blistering 53 mph on the strip<g>! But after
towing it home to CT and driving to work. Gees! Whatheehell, damn car pulls
to the right, tires?EAAACH my newer Nokeans destroyed! Chewed up I COULDN'T
have done that at my brakestand at Mason Dixon Dragway!? I did tow it
through potholes big enough to hide it in, on the way back, just didn;'t see
them in time to, say take another route.
Finally took it to a front end alignment place to get it streightened
out. While waiting thumbed through the tire rack, looking at BFG's with a 30
or so maxPSI, a Kumho? Korea, 44 max. OK I'll take 2 for starters, cheepies,
didn't want to wait to order more Nokeans, so we put the Kumhoes on. Out on
the Turnpike again Oh JOY! no side pull, 70 mph no vibration-runout, car
would GO 70 again as it didn't hafta spend amps shaking everyything. Funny
,I had a hell of a time getting the vibration OUT of the Nokeans, taking
them back for a rebalance 2 times to get it sorta acceptable.The Kumhoes,
first shot. The tread sorta resembles the Nokeans, and I havent noticed a
real differance. I'm running them @ 44 PSI as suggested, havent tried 50PSI
or so as I did with the Nokeans. But I have killed tires early on with the
high pressure, bubbles, tread separation, the Michelin Disease, that's what
THEY used to do on my GAS cars, tire wouldn't be round anymore. You Chinesy
Scooter folks know about that issue.
OK onto what next?
Seeya at Woodburn
Bob
> Never doubt that the work of a small group of thoughtful, committed
> citizens can change the world. Indeed, it's the only thing that ever
> has! -- Margaret Mead
> --Were working on it!
> Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart_at_earthlink.net
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
KENT BAKKE wrote:
> I have a 144 Volt pack , two strings of Optima YT and I would like
> to monitor the voltage of each pair. I am looking for a data logger
> to monitor all the batteries or individual volt meters.
> Any recommendations?
Take a look at my Battery Balancer at
http://www.geocities.com/sorefeets/balancerland/
The system not only measures each battery voltage, but can also
individually charge and load test them. It uses a BASIC Stamp
microcontroller, a digital multimeter with isolated data output, and a
bank of relays to select each battery. This is a very straightforward
design, intended to be built in single quantities and easily modified
and maintained by the user.
We've built about 10 of them in the first batch a few years ago, and
they worked out well. They are sold out, but I've been trying to get
enough interest to build another batch for a couple years. Lots of
people have said they are interested, but not enough to actually place
an order. I feel it's been, "You build it first, and maybe I'll buy
one."
But now there's been a breakthrough. A customer has actually placed an
order, so I am making another run of PC boards. That means boards will
be available for others as well, or perhaps parts kits or even assembled
boards.
--
The two most common elements in the universe are hydrogen and stupidity.
-- Harlan Ellison
--
Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart_at_earthlink.net
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hello to All,
Jeff Shanab wrote:
>
> Does anyone know how heavy the honda insight 1 liter 3cyl engine is ?
Yes...exactly 124 lbs.
See Ya....John Wayland
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hello to All,
D B wrote:
>
> >This claims 124 lbs:
> >
> >http://www.obd-onboarddiagnostics.com/future.htm
>
> Aloha: That weight actually seems a little heavy, considering all of the
> effort made to lighten the engine (magnesium pan, etc). I understand that
>
> that Suzuki 1 liter 3 cyl engine used in the two door Geo Metro weighs
> less than that.
At time of the Insight's introduction Honda billed their 3 banger as the
world's lightest 3 cylinder 1 liter engine. I believe you are wrong about
the Geo Metro's engine weighing less, as it's about 50 lbs. heavier. I
think a non-turbo engine that puts out 73 hp (by itself minus the electric
motor's help) and runs squeaky clean that weighs a scant 124 lbs., is
pretty impressive. By comparison, the stock Datsun 1200 cc engine weighed
247 lbs. and made 69 hp, but that was gross rated not net, so it was really
about 55 hp or so.....larger displacement, 55 hp @ 247 lbs. vs smaller
displacement, 73 hp @ 124 lbs., and, the Insight engine is super enviro
friendly
See Ya....John Wayland
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi all,
Are Lenco/Tweco Cable Connectors acceptable for battery pack cable connectors?
I would use them in place of Anderson connectors.
At http://www.weldingsupply.com/cgi-bin/einstein.pl?Next::1:UNDEF:OR:A2::PA
(scroll almost down to the bottom of the page) for 2/0 wire they are rated at
350 amp capacity, no voltage but I suppose since they are connected to welding
wire they are probably rated at 600 vdc also.
They are a 1/4 twist turn to lock and so it would probably be a good idea to
keep them locked, with tape or some mech method.
Rush
Tucson AZ
www.ironandwood.org
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi,
Danny Miller wrote:
So how do you keep dust, rain, etc out of the motor? Is the air intake
located inside the cab or behind an air filter?
I guess that would depend on how you build your EV. My Jeep's motor is
not yet protected from rain, etc. That is one of those things that I
fear will eternally be on my to-do list.
Though, I have done a small amount of driving in the rain, and a bit of
driving on roads that are still wet/ have puddles. What I've noticed is
that the motor doesn't get splashed/sprayed all that much.
I know heat has a seriously detrimental effect on motor power and
efficiency. How cool does the motor stay? I wonder if an external
cooling system might be justifiable.
That depends on the conversion (the size motor you use relative to
vehicle weight, aerodynamics, etc..)
My experiences so far using a 9" ADC motor in a Jeep Cherokee haven't
been good when it comes to motor cooling... and to sum things up I'm
convinced that the 9" motor was the wrong choice to make for this
vehicle (an 11" would've been much more appropriate). For now, I'm
working on better cooling by using electric fans to force more air
through the motor, which will help keep the motor cool when it is
stopped or at lower speeds. I'll probably be using bilge blowers (as
other EVDL members recommended) and see how they work.
With that said, It seems that there are a lot of EV conversions out
there that don't use any external cooling for their motors and work just
fine.
Just my 0.333 kWh
--
-Nick
http://Go.DriveEV.com/
1988 Jeep Cherokee 4x4 EV
---------------------------
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
HHHhhhmmm. Can I ask The Price of these "Battery
Balancer"..............Bill
Bill & Sharon Hoopes
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> [Original Message]
> From: Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
> Date: 7/23/2005 7:40:30 AM
> Subject: Re: Looking for data logger for monitoring my Optima YT
>
> KENT BAKKE wrote:
> > I have a 144 Volt pack , two strings of Optima YT and I would like
> > to monitor the voltage of each pair. I am looking for a data logger
> > to monitor all the batteries or individual volt meters.
> > Any recommendations?
>
> Take a look at my Battery Balancer at
>
> http://www.geocities.com/sorefeets/balancerland/
>
> The system not only measures each battery voltage, but can also
> individually charge and load test them. It uses a BASIC Stamp
> microcontroller, a digital multimeter with isolated data output, and a
> bank of relays to select each battery. This is a very straightforward
> design, intended to be built in single quantities and easily modified
> and maintained by the user.
>
> We've built about 10 of them in the first batch a few years ago, and
> they worked out well. They are sold out, but I've been trying to get
> enough interest to build another batch for a couple years. Lots of
> people have said they are interested, but not enough to actually place
> an order. I feel it's been, "You build it first, and maybe I'll buy
> one."
>
> But now there's been a breakthrough. A customer has actually placed an
> order, so I am making another run of PC boards. That means boards will
> be available for others as well, or perhaps parts kits or even assembled
> boards.
> --
> The two most common elements in the universe are hydrogen and stupidity.
> -- Harlan Ellison
> --
> Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart_at_earthlink.net
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Rush,
I use these on my 48 volt go-kart with a 400amp Alltrax and they work great.
Very easy to break the pack with these. They are rated at 600V and have never
ever been even warm to the touch. Even after running full out and sending
enough juice to my first Etek to melt it. They are very beefy.
Jay Brown
Sugar Land, Texas
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] on behalf of Rush
Sent: Sat 7/23/2005 10:23 AM
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Cc:
Subject: Lenco/Tweco Cable Connectors
Hi all,
Are Lenco/Tweco Cable Connectors acceptable for battery pack cable
connectors? I would use them in place of Anderson connectors.
At
http://www.weldingsupply.com/cgi-bin/einstein.pl?Next::1:UNDEF:OR:A2::PA
(scroll almost down to the bottom of the page) for 2/0 wire they are rated at
350 amp capacity, no voltage but I suppose since they are connected to welding
wire they are probably rated at 600 vdc also.
They are a 1/4 twist turn to lock and so it would probably be a good
idea to keep them locked, with tape or some mech method.
Rush
Tucson AZ
www.ironandwood.org
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
* ---REMAINDER OF MESSAGE TRUNCATED--- *
* This post contains a forbidden message format *
* (such as an attached file, a v-card, HTML formatting) *
* Lists at sjsu.edu only accept PLAIN TEXT *
* If your postings display this message your mail program *
* is not set to send PLAIN TEXT ONLY and needs adjusting *
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
------_=_NextPart_001_01C58F9E.6394E2FD"
Subject: RE: Lenco/Tweco Cable Connectors
Date: Sat, 23 Jul 2005 10:51:28 -0500
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
X-MS-Has-Attach:
X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Thread-Topic: Lenco/Tweco Cable Connectors
Thread-Index: AcWPm7PcLbQNKUwgTm6B4SlJtaO1IgAAiZlw
From: "Brown, Jay--
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Sat, 23 Jul 2005 09:09:38 -0700
From: John Wayland <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Subject: Curtis Controllers in Pallet Jacks
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; x-mac-type="54455854";
x-mac-creator="4D4F5353"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Hello to All,
STEVE CLUNN wrote:
> John Wayland wrote:
>
> > Curtis makes a lot of fine controllers and they're in use in everything
> from
> > forklifts to pallet jacks, to on road EVs, and most all deliver silent
> > reliable operation. The Curtis model 1221C and 1231C controllers don't
> > come close to matching other more advanced controllers.
>
> John what happens when a Curtis blows in one of these forklifts or jacks ,
> do they go full on and take the rider for a ride , funny what we get use to
> , haven't had one of those rides for a while :-)
The Curtis controllers in my work world of forklifts, pallet jacks, etc., are
very nice, very reliable controllers. When they do fail, most often they just
drop out either a line contactor or a forward - reverse contactor set....no
drama, no runaway pallet jack. With exception to some of the older Curtis
controllers used in Crown PE3500 model rider pallets that make a not too
offensive SCR - like moan or growl, most all of the newer Curtis controllers
are silent and feature filled. Their newest pallet jack controller is used in
the Crown PE4000 series rider type, the model that replaced the venerable
PE3500 series. This controller is dead silent and is a sep ex type controller.
With the plug-in handset, you can talk to the controller, set all sorts of
stuff, and see the results on a very legible display...it's sort of Zilla like
in regards to programming options, but certainly not in terms of power :-) The
controller is state of the art, does either plugging or regen, and is beautiful
in build quality.
I've got mostly good things to say about the Curtis controllers in general,
it's just those miserable 1221C and 1231C street EV controllers they make that
get me going....geesh, what an awful design! Clearly, engineers that never
drove an EV or had one of their own worked on this 'design'. Who in their right
mind would
make an on-road EV motor controller that generates such a loud squeal through
the motor, and think it would be acceptable?
See Ya.....John Wayland
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Sat, 23 Jul 2005 09:10:12 -0700
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: EV Discussion List <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Subject: Real world numbers, was Re: CalCars Teach Lead...
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1"
Content-Disposition: inline
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
<<<
A car's gas mileage is determined far more by its weight and aero
than motor size.
>>>
I always remember the 10hp Road&Track measured on the first Chevy Sprint at
50mph (about 15hp at 60mph). Not the lowest Cd*ft^2, but made up for it in low
weight; then again, other than EV'rs wanting to maximize range, how many US
drivers would *choose* a Sprint for regular freeway use if they could afford
something bigger (motorcycle riders?)! At least they have a back seat (I've
seen 2 adults back there, but they must have been anorexics!)
P.S.- Not to change the thread, but being a past Ranger EV leasee, I've sent in
*my* postcard!
From: "August Johnson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Subject: Inductive Throttle Position Sensor??
Date: Sat, 23 Jul 2005 09:22:19 -0700
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: multipart/mixed;
boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0007_01C58F68.074E4D30"
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C58F68.074E4D30
Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hello Everyone,
=20
I'm finally re-building the Chevy Sprint I bought from Otmar. I'm =
putting in
a new charger, batteries, vacuum pump so I have real brakes, e-meter, =
etc. I
need to replace the throttle sensor, the Brusa controller uses either a =
5K
or a 10K Pot. Not a 0-5K rheostat like the PB-6 but an Honest-to-God
3-terminal potentiometer that goes full end-to-end. Does anyone know of =
an
Inductive Sensor that will work with this Brusa AMC-300 controller?=20
=20
Thanks,
=20
August Johnson
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C58F68.074E4D30
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
* ---REMAINDER OF MESSAGE TRUNCATED--- *
* This post contains a forbidden message format *
* (such as an attached file, a v-card, HTML formatting) *
* Lists at sjsu.edu only accept PLAIN TEXT *
* If your postings display this message your mail program *
* is not set to send PLAIN TEXT ONLY and needs adjusting *
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C58F68.074E4D30--
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Sat, 23 Jul 2005 09:24:45 -0700
From: John Wayland <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Subject: More Datsun Truck Fun
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; x-mac-type="54455854";
x-mac-creator="4D4F5353"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Hello to All,
With all the current buzz about Datsun minitrucks, one of my favorite
vehicles, and knowing that many of my visiting EV friends enjoy Portland's
status as 'the' place for microbrews, the following snippet from a
microbrewery piece in today's Oregonian newspaper might be entertaining:
On Widmer Brewing Company...
Homebrewers Kurt and Rob Widmer began their brewery in 1984 with money
cobbled together from family and relatives and a 1970 Datsun pickup they
pursuaded their dad to sell them for $700. "Our first business plan was
predicated on having 10 accounts", says Kurt, whose brewery today has 800
Portland accounts and sells beer in 44 states.....
Just though htis little Datsun story was timely!
See Ya.....John Wayland
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Sat, 23 Jul 2005 11:38:00 -0500
From: Danny Miller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Subject: Re: Looking for data logger for monitoring my Optima YT
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Some thoughts:
Be a lot better if you lose the BASIC Stamp. Those things are just
ridiculous reimplementations of PICs with a load of marketing behind them.
You can replace the external meter with something going through the uC,
then there's more information available to the code. Reading that shunt
is not too hard.
Can't a lot of those relays can be replaced with mosfets?
Danny
Lee Hart wrote:
> The system not only measures each battery voltage, but can also
>
>individually charge and load test them. It uses a BASIC Stamp
>microcontroller, a digital multimeter with isolated data output, and a
>bank of relays to select each battery. This is a very straightforward
>design, intended to be built in single quantities and easily modified
>and maintained by the user.
>
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Sat, 23 Jul 2005 11:34:00 -0500
From: Mark Farver <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Subject: Re: Inductive Throttle Position Sensor??
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
August Johnson wrote:
> Hello Everyone,
>
> I'm finally re-building the Chevy Sprint I bought from Otmar. I'm putting in
> a new charger, batteries, vacuum pump so I have real brakes, e-meter, etc. I
> need to replace the throttle sensor, the Brusa controller uses either a 5K
> or a 10K Pot. Not a 0-5K rheostat like the PB-6 but an Honest-to-God
> 3-terminal potentiometer that goes full end-to-end. Does anyone know of an
> Inductive Sensor that will work with this Brusa AMC-300 controller?
The PB-6 is a referred to as a "potbox" becuase it contains a
potentiometer. However only two terminals of the potentiometer are
carried outside the case, since most EV controllers only use two wires.
Open up a PB-6 and you'll find there is a third terminal unused. Solder
to that and run the wire outside the case... You now have a three
terminal 5k pot. Nothing inductive involved.
Mark
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Sat, 23 Jul 2005 10:30:28 -0700
From: Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Subject: Re: Regen with charged batteries, comments
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Bob Rice wrote:
> It's amazing how sophisticated the E braking and drive system was,
> but the handling? Those old ladies that drove them must have
> had arms like King Kong or the Governater, to handle the tiller
> steering! Every pothole threatened to snatch your arms out as the
> tiller crank goes directly to the drag link, NO gearing!
The Baker I drove had tiller steering. I expected it to be heavy, but it
really wasn't bad at all. There was no serious lurch from potholes.
I suspect there are a combination of reasons. First, the whole car
weighs maybe 800 lbs, and most of that is on the rear wheels (400 lbs of
batteries, all over the rear axle). Second, the skinny high-pressure
tires are easy to turn. Third, the steering geometry has zero bump
steer, like a bicycle. The tiller arm is about 3 feet long. Finally,
there seems to be a steering damper somewhere -- fast movement of the
steering tiller were resisted, but slow movements were easy.
But these were low-speed cars, designed when "fast" was 25 mph. I'd
worry a lot about manual tiller steering in a heavier vehicle at higher
speeds. Although, motorcycles do it. :-)
--
Never doubt that the work of a small group of thoughtful, committed
citizens can change the world. Indeed, it's the only thing that ever
has! -- Margaret Mead
--
Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart_at_earthlink.net
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Sat, 23 Jul 2005 10:15:26 -0700 (PDT)
From: jerry dycus <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Metro engine weight, Re: Honda Insight question
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Hi John and All,
--- John Wayland <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Hello to All,
>
> D B wrote:
>
> >
> > >This claims 124 lbs:
> > >
> > >http://www.obd-onboarddiagnostics.com/future.htm
> >
> > Aloha: That weight actually seems a little heavy,
> considering all of the
> > effort made to lighten the engine (magnesium pan,
> etc). I understand that
> >
> > that Suzuki 1 liter 3 cyl engine used in the two
> door Geo Metro weighs
> > less than that.
As they say, that depends!!!
If you take everything off the Metro block and put
on a lightweight exhaust and intake, then yes it is
around 100lbs. This is how it is used in aircraft.
But adding a heavier exhaust, alt, starter,
flywheel, ect, then it weighs more.
Adding the turbo to bring it's 56hp? up to 73? hp
then weighs even more.
As I would use it with the lightweight
intake/exhaust with the gen as the starter, DC/DC for
12vdc then 100 lbs is correct.
So as they say, YMMV.
>
> At time of the Insight's introduction Honda billed
> their 3 banger as the
> world's lightest 3 cylinder 1 liter engine. I
> believe you are wrong about
> the Geo Metro's engine weighing less, as it's about
> 50 lbs. heavier. I
> think a non-turbo engine that puts out 73 hp (by
> itself minus the electric
> motor's help) and runs squeaky clean that weighs a
> scant 124 lbs., is
> pretty impressive. By comparison, the stock Datsun
> 1200 cc engine weighed
> 247 lbs. and made 69 hp, but that was gross rated
> not net, so it was really
> about 55 hp or so.....larger displacement, 55 hp @
> 247 lbs. vs smaller
> displacement, 73 hp @ 124 lbs., and, the Insight
> engine is super enviro
> friendly
And the other John says 3cyl's are hard to make
clean!! The Insight's engine proves otherwise as it's
about the cleanest engine built.
Thanks,
Jerry Dycus
>
> See Ya....John Wayland
>
>
____________________________________________________
Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page
http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Sat, 23 Jul 2005 12:10:58 -0700
From: Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Subject: Re: Conversion Van
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> Beginning to lean toward converting the old van to electric anyway
> just for the fun, well sort-of.
It all depends on your expectations. Vans have a lot of room and can
carry a lot of weight, so there is plenty of capacity for batteries. You
could build an EV conversion that uses all the load-carrying capacity
for batteries. It could be a relatively cheap, easy conversion. Range
would be adequate at low speeds where wind resistance wasn't a factor.
Accelleration would be modest (especially with flooded batteries), but
vans aren't speed demons anyway.
Or, you could convert it to a hybrid. Vans generally have poor fuel
economy, but there are enough exceptions to prove they can be a lot
better. The old VW vans come to mind. I got 22 mpg in my 1961 Corvair
van, and 30 mpg in my 1994 Plymouth Voyager with 4-cyl engine and manual
transmission.
Toyota offers a hybrid minivan in other parts of the world; the Estima.
(In the US, all we get is the huge Sienna gas-hog.) The Estima has the
Prius hybrid drive train, combining a small gasoline engine with two
electric motors and a small battery pack. The Estima also has an
electric motor on the rear axle, so it is all-wheel drive. The result is
a minivan that gets twice the gas mileage of other minivans.
I've thought of doing something like this with my VW Eurovan. VW has a
wide range of engines for it, from tiny diesels to the huge V6. (The US
gets only the big V6, of course). There is an all-wheel drive version
(again, not imported to the US). Possibly I could add the rear wheel
drive components from Canada or Europe, and drive them with an electric
motor. With a small battery pack and regen controller, I'd have a hybrid
that could be driven short distances at low speeds on pure electric, and
still cruise long distances at highway speeds on gasoline.
--
Never doubt that the work of a small group of thoughtful, committed
citizens can change the world. Indeed, it's the only thing that ever
has! -- Margaret Mead
--
Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart_at_earthlink.net
Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v619)
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed
Message-Id: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
From: "Paul G." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: 1965 Datsun Truck - Future Electric Vehicle
Date: Sat, 23 Jul 2005 11:19:40 -0700
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
On Jul 22, 2005, at 7:52 PM, Joe Strubhar wrote:
> I would definitely NOT use an 8" motor - this truck is too heavy for
> an 8",
> IMO.
> I have a 1978 Datsun Kingcab, and use a 9" ADC motor with a Kodiak (no
> longer available?) controller and a Russco charger for 20 Trojan
> T-105's.
Judging from the Pictures I have found you have a larger Datsun than
the little '65. The 320 series weighs about the same as my Rabbit
Pickup (mine listed at 1998lbs, the Datsun was quoted online at
2085lbs.) Mine did just fine with a Prestolite MTC-4002 motor, similar
in continuous power handling to the ADC 8 inch. Mine had to pack around
1300lbs of batteries.
Paul "neon" G.
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
From: "IMAP | OE" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Subject: Re: 1965 Datsun Truck - Future Electric Vehicle
Date: Sat, 23 Jul 2005 14:26:49 -0400
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
I think the gentleman who started this thread should
sell (give?) that pristine pickup to me and buy this
one instead. Given that a special bed would be needed
for the battery rack(s) and that the ICE is not needed,
may be a useful approach.
http://tinyurl.com/7b6t7
Jay
----- Original Message -----
From: "Paul G." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Saturday, July 23, 2005 2:19 PM
Subject: Re: 1965 Datsun Truck - Future Electric Vehicle
>
> On Jul 22, 2005, at 7:52 PM, Joe Strubhar wrote:
>
> > I would definitely NOT use an 8" motor - this truck is too heavy for
> > an 8",
> > IMO.
> > I have a 1978 Datsun Kingcab, and use a 9" ADC motor with a Kodiak (no
> > longer available?) controller and a Russco charger for 20 Trojan
> > T-105's.
>
> Judging from the Pictures I have found you have a larger Datsun than
> the little '65. The 320 series weighs about the same as my Rabbit
> Pickup (mine listed at 1998lbs, the Datsun was quoted online at
> 2085lbs.) Mine did just fine with a Prestolite MTC-4002 motor, similar
> in continuous power handling to the ADC 8 inch. Mine had to pack around
> 1300lbs of batteries.
>
> Paul "neon" G.
>
>
Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v619)
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed
Message-Id: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
From: "Paul G." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Sepex Motor controller
Date: Sat, 23 Jul 2005 11:28:17 -0700
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
On Jul 22, 2005, at 7:41 PM, M.G. wrote:
> The problem is I need a controller, the motor is a separately excited
> motor or sometimes called a shunt motor. I would like to use this
> motor with my nicads ( Thanks Hump ).
> Could any body point me in the right direction to a zilla like
> performance controller.
>
You could just control the field with a small controller. With the
field on switch power the armature with a contactor. This will produce
an electric vehicle with an "idle" (will need a clutch or automatic.)
Current is limited by your right foot, regen happens when you release
the throttle. It would take a little learning because really sudden
releases of the throttle at high speeds without pushing the clutch in
could produce dramatic regen.
Points to consider include the motor idle speed with max field (lowest
rpm), a system to NEVER allow the armature to be powered when the field
is off, and a system to light the brake lights when regen exceeds the
equivalent of mild engine braking. Oh, and keeping your right foot
under control :-)
Paul "neon" G.
--- End Message ---
