EV Digest 4539
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) Re: Freewheel rethought - connecting motor and ICE,
by "Nick 'Sharkey' Moore" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) Flooded nicad power output
by john bart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) Re: Auto front suspension donor for trike from RWD
by "Peter VanDerWal" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) Breaker ratings. Using an AC breaker for a DC application.
by "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) Re: Insight battery pic / Thunder Sky question
by =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jukka_J=E4rvinen?= <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) 1959 BMW Isetta WHATTADRAG
by "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7) Re: Trojan 125 capacity and electric gen eff
by jerry dycus <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8) Re: Flooded nicad power output
by jerry dycus <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
9) RE: Freewheel rethought - connecting motor and ICE, sharks
by "Stu or Jan" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) Re: Racing 3wheels, Re: 3 wheel EV's trike pick up,
and CUSHMAN Truck
by "Peter VanDerWal" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
11) RE: Racing 3wheels, Re: 3 wheel EV's trike pick up, and CUSHMAN Truck
by "Stu or Jan" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
12) RE: Auto front suspension donor for trike from RWD
by "Stu or Jan" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13) Re: Freewheel rethought - connecting motor and ICE, sharks
by "Nick 'Sharkey' Moore" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
14) RE: Freewheel rethought - connecting motor and ICE, sharks
by "Stu or Jan" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
15) Re: Finding Parts
by "John G. Lussmyer" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16) Re: What're they worth?
by Evan Tuer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
17) BB600 Voltage Question
by "Bill Dennis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
18) RE: Bolt Circle
by "Ellery Deuville" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
19) Re: BB600 Voltage Question
by "John G. Lussmyer" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
20) Re: Tubes
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
21) Re: hybrid battery question
by "Bob Rice" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
22) Re: What're they worth?
by Ralph Merwin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
23) Re: Finding Parts
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
24) Re: Breaker ratings. Using an AC breaker for a DC application.
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
25) Re: Finding Parts
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
26) Re: Tubes
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--- Begin Message ---
On 2005-07-30, Stu or Jan wrote:
> So what if the engine and the ICE were 'hard' connected to each other
> through the jackshaft?
>
> The Kawasaki in neutral with the motor driving.
I'm new to the list and don't know which Kawasaki you're
thinking of, but most of the Japanese bike engines I've
pulled apart have had the gearbox pressure lubricated
by the oil pump ... which is driven from the crank. It's
not wise to 'free wheel' these engines, or the gearbox
may seize.
PS: Hi everybody!
-----sharks
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I'm looking to purchase a super pocket bike as a electric conversion project in
the near future. I plan on using a etek and 50 1.2 volt 14 amp hour flooded
nicad cells. This would give around 60 volts or so, but how many amps can
these flooded nicads usually produce? The more the better in this case, as im
out for speed and some more range than what lead acid would offer. I've read
up on nicads on www.buchmann.ca and they rate nicads as being 20C discharge
capable. If this is the case these will work just fine for this project, whats
all your takes on this?
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Mustang II's are popular (or used to be) among the custom kit car crowd.
However, I think that it's actually two separate assemblies (left and
right), could be wrong though.
VW bug front suspension has tons of aftermarket parts, they're cheap, and
they are basically one assembly which could make them easier to use,
depending on your experience level.
Just make sure you get the original beetle and not the "super-beetle".
The super-beetle used McPherson struts which could be complicated to
accommodate.
> I am looking for a donor front suspension from a RWD car with disk brakes,
> manual steering, and enough oomph to carry 600 pounds of batteries.
>
> Possibilities might include, Miata, RX7, Triumph, MG.
>
> Any suggestions of what yr/make/model?
>
>
> BoyntonStu
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I have a GE Breaker. AMB comp.circuit breaker 40° C.
Type TQD 2 pole 240 VAC Will break 10,000 amps at 240vac.
What is the max DC voltage this breaker will be safe with? It was sold with
a KTA 120v kit.
It has big hokin wire capacity. .640"
Lawrence Rhodes
Bassoon/Contrabassoon
Reedmaker
Book 4/5 doubler
Electric Vehicle & Solar Power Advocate
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
415-821-3519
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I guess you are not going to use them in Prius anyway...
but for 21 kw battery power the ~200 V nominal requires ~100 A
discharge. I would not consider to use nothing less than 100 AH cells in
it. TS batteries are not designed to deliver power so much with long
life. Other vice 50 AH cells could be used too but life will be around
500 cycles (50 % cpasity left). And in Prius you are geting those cycles
quite nicely.
So for light and swift pack 50 Ah and for normal user nothing less then
100 AH.
With those 10 Ah cells you still need the management part. Solutions are
available but the price of the system vs battery is upside down. System
will cost at least 2x more then betteries them selves.
20 -30 AH system has been discussed about and it might come available
during next year (batts and BMS).
10 ah cells are in stock but playing with plain cells is a bit pointless
if it is hard to actually use them in real life application.
TS has got its "fame" already by selling plain cells. Any other
manufacturer would have faced the same problem if thay would have sold
plain cells. And around the globe without local product support....
gosh....
I would like to say again that Li-Ion/-polymer batteries alone are not
"batteries" as we genereally know them. The battery cell it self is 40%
of the "battery". Rest is management.
Battery cell technology is ready enough to be used in EVs. Management
part will take still few years before the general public can start
adobting it (At least in EVs that would be generally sold in any regular
car sales place by "regular" car salesmen).
-Jukka
fevt.com
Ryan Stotts wrote:
Martin Klingensmith wrote:
http://www.thunder-sky.com/en/battery.htm
Speaking of which, does anyone know if it is possible to buy 20 or 30 of
those 3.6v 10Ah cells?
I imagine Victor could get you some at $2.50 per 1Ah:
$25 each? $500 for 20 or $750 for 30...
http://www.metricmind.com/battery.htm
http://www.metricmind.com/prices.htm
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
http://www.microcarmuseum.com/tour/whattadrag.html How about an electric
version?
Lawrence Rhodes
Bassoon/Contrabassoon
Reedmaker
Book 4/5 doubler
Electric Vehicle & Solar Power Advocate
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
415-821-3519
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi Don and All,
--- Don Buckshot <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Hi folks,
>
> I am trying to determine how many Ahrs I can draw
> from my batteries to
> define my range @ 50% (my norm) and 80% discharge.
>
> The VW pickup I just bought (built by Paul
> "Neon"Gouch) now has 20
> Trojan 125 - 6V batteries about 6 months old.
>
> The Trojan 125s are rated as follows:
>
> 6 hr = 197 Ahr
> 20 hr = 235 Ahr
> 100 hr= 261 Ahr
I'd go with 149 amphrs though less in the cold or
real hard driving. I'd never use more than 125 or so
amphrs for good life at regular EV use.
T 125's have a lower pureket? than other flooded
batts so an excellent choice for greater range, more
power and the extra weight in them is all lead Vs
t105's!
>
> _How do I come up with the 1 hr rate?_
> Is there a web site that has the discharge curves
> for the Trojan 125s?
>
> How many Ahr = 80% discharged? ( Yes I know there
> are other factors )
>
> My 120V system seems to use about 2 Ahr per mile, if
> the Emeter and the
> speedometer are accurate.
>
> So 120V * 2Ahr = 240 Watt hrs per mile.
>
> If 10 kwh = 1 gallon of gas, then my "mile per
> gallon equivalent" would
> be only 41.66 mpg. Not all that impressive.
But gasoline does better than that with about
16kw/gal in a 35% eff motor/90% eff gen.
Though if BTU equivelent, Diesel makes 18-19kw/hr,
steam makes 20-23kwhr, gas turbine/steam cogen get
about 30kwhr. And wind, hydro, thermal solar gets many
more depending on just how you count it.
But best of all is little of these are made from
oil, but instead of US based fuels, wastes or RE.
HTH's,
Jerry Dycus
PS, I'm jealous as I always wanted one of those
pickups in biodiesel or EV!!
>
> It may be that I just don't understand all that I
> think I know about this.
>
> Can anyone shed some light on this for me or just
> direct me to a good
> source?
>
> Don Buckshot
>
>
____________________________________________________
Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page
http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi John and All,
--- john bart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I'm looking to purchase a super pocket bike as a
> electric conversion project in the near future. I
> plan on using a etek and 50 1.2 volt 14 amp hour
> flooded nicad cells. This would give around 60
> volts or so, but how many amps can these flooded
It depends on just which ones you have. Most are
regular ones that put out about 5c but others are
starting batts that put out much more. Others put out
much lower, like 2c you want to completely avoid.
I have used SAFT 14amphr over 30 yr old batts for
my E bike projects for many yrs, got 72cells for free
as the batt place didn't want to mess with recycling
them.
I have used them to 100 amps at least without a
problem and feel they could go more so are probably
starting batts. They are so old SAFT doesn't even know
what they are!! And they still put out more than rated
cap!!
Mine were used in medical equipment in case of
power failure.
> nicads usually produce? The more the better in this
> case, as im out for speed and some more range than
> what lead acid would offer. I've read up on nicads
Only because you can discharge them deeper
safely. Cells weight about the same/cap as lead batts
do. Ni-cad batts/modules weigh about 66% of lead
batts.
They are very stiff and hold voltage well until
90% discharged so if you feel the power slacking,
stop!! Recharge.
To recycle them if SAFT, just ship them your
cost to them free and they will rebuild them too if
you want.
> on www.buchmann.ca and they rate nicads as being 20C
> discharge capable. If this is the case these will
> work just fine for this project, whats all your
> takes on this?
I'd only go this route if they were cheap or free.
Otherwise, use Hawker batts for it to get what you are
looking for in the small space you probably have.
HTH's,
Jerry Dycus
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam
> protection around
> http://mail.yahoo.com
>
>
____________________________________________________
Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page
http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Sharks,
Thanks for your comment and welcome to the list.
Great, a motorcycle maven is just what we need.
The donor bike is a 1982 Kawasaki GPZ 550 air-cooled. It was offered to me
by a friend.
If the bike is in neutral with the engine off, you are saying that the gears
will be turning with no lubrication. Correct? I notice that there are
front wheel carriers designed to trail motorcycles. Are there models that
will trail with no damage?
I suppose that the gearbox to rear sprocket engagement must be broken or
neutralized with a freewheel or a dog clutch.
Is there an alternative fix that could be done manually?
BoyntonStu
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Nick 'Sharkey' Moore
Sent: Sunday, July 31, 2005 3:06 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Freewheel rethought - connecting motor and ICE,
On 2005-07-30, Stu or Jan wrote:
> So what if the engine and the ICE were 'hard' connected to each other
> through the jackshaft?
>
> The Kawasaki in neutral with the motor driving.
I'm new to the list and don't know which Kawasaki you're
thinking of, but most of the Japanese bike engines I've
pulled apart have had the gearbox pressure lubricated
by the oil pump ... which is driven from the crank. It's
not wise to 'free wheel' these engines, or the gearbox
may seize.
PS: Hi everybody!
-----sharks
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
>
> > If it is a 2f1r 3wh EV designed correctly, can
> > even outhandle the best sportscars!
>
>
> I've always wondered about how 3 wheels would
> compare to 4 in a racing
> environment. If we were to take an existing Nascar
> and a Formula 1
> car and convert each to 3 wheels, and race them
> against the existing 4
> wheel cars, would 3 wheels give an advantage?
>
Jerry makes this statement a lot, but I can't recall him ever offering
irrefutable proof.
I'll assume a two front wheeler (often called a tadpole) design. Two rear
wheel design is similar, but often opposite to what's describe below. I.e.
substitute acceleration for braking, etc.
If you keep all other design constraints the same (except number of
wheels), then logically speaking a well designed three wheeler can NOT
handle all situations as well as a well designed four wheeler.
Jerry will argue that you can make changes to the three wheeler to improve
these problems (i.e. making the front wheels wider apart), but making the
exact same changes to a four wheeler will improve it too and keep it in
the lead.
Three wheeler design (like all vehicle designs) is a series of compromises.
In order to get the best cornering, you have to move the center of gravity
(COG) forward to where approx 70% of it's weight is on the two front
wheels (or back for two rear wheels). When you do this braking capability
is reduced. Even if your weight doesn't shift so far forward during hard
braking that you endo, it still lightens up the rear to the point where
the rear wheel contributes almost nothing to braking.
Granted a four wheel design gets MOST of it's braking from the front
wheels, but the back wheels still contribute some.
A three wheeler won't corner as well a four wheeler. In fact, unless you
design the vehicle to only handle oval tracks, then it won't corner
anywhere near as well.
With only three wheels your center of gravity is closer to the outside
edge formed by rear wheel and the outside front wheel. It HAS to be, the
only way to get the same distance is to either
a) move the COG until it's 100% between the two front wheels (now you
have zero braking ability) or
b) widen the front wheel track (see argument above about doing the same
to a four wheeler)
If all you do is turn left, then you can move the single wheel to be
inline with the right wheel, but you'd still have to move it forward some
which would cause comparatively more understeer.
Finally, accelerating out of a corner is reduced on a three wheeler.
Accelerating causes your COG to move back onto the single rear wheel and
give less stability and reduces cornering ability.
About the only physical advantages to a three-wheeler are, possibly, less
rolling resistance -from one less wheel- and lower weight -one less wheel
and suspension.
Of course three wheelers have numerous 'bureaucratic' advantages over
four-wheeler, because it most places in the USA, they are classified as
bikes/motorcycles rather than automobiles. I believe the same is true in
several other countries around the world.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Trihawk - (304 - Two seater -Roadster)
Rating: 10/10
Review by Warren Behler. URL: N/A
Manufactured: Jan 1985. Engine: 1,299cc
102,000 miles and still going.
The 1983 / 84 Car Driver Yearbook when writing about going around corners
said of the Trihawk It's the Best Handling vehicle you can buy ....Period.
It is. It handles so well because of its front-wheel-drive with 75% of its
weight up there. The local Porsche drivers around here don't wave to me
anymore. Trihawks run best when they have a Porsche or two for breakfast.
The vehicle is dead reliable. I've been thru 17-western states as far east
as Des Moines, Iowa. My wife and I went 100-mi in a snowstorm in Nebraska,
with the top doors and the heater on we were nice and cozy. Its the most fun
you can have on three-wheels. I think Ill keep it around for another
102,000-miles......
BoyntonStu
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Peter VanDerWal
Sent: Sunday, July 31, 2005 8:44 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Racing 3wheels, Re: 3 wheel EV's trike pick up, and CUSHMAN
Truck
>
> > If it is a 2f1r 3wh EV designed correctly, can
> > even outhandle the best sportscars!
>
>
> I've always wondered about how 3 wheels would
> compare to 4 in a racing
> environment. If we were to take an existing Nascar
> and a Formula 1
> car and convert each to 3 wheels, and race them
> against the existing 4
> wheel cars, would 3 wheels give an advantage?
>
Jerry makes this statement a lot, but I can't recall him ever offering
irrefutable proof.
I'll assume a two front wheeler (often called a tadpole) design. Two rear
wheel design is similar, but often opposite to what's describe below. I.e.
substitute acceleration for braking, etc.
If you keep all other design constraints the same (except number of
wheels), then logically speaking a well designed three wheeler can NOT
handle all situations as well as a well designed four wheeler.
Jerry will argue that you can make changes to the three wheeler to improve
these problems (i.e. making the front wheels wider apart), but making the
exact same changes to a four wheeler will improve it too and keep it in
the lead.
Three wheeler design (like all vehicle designs) is a series of compromises.
In order to get the best cornering, you have to move the center of gravity
(COG) forward to where approx 70% of it's weight is on the two front
wheels (or back for two rear wheels). When you do this braking capability
is reduced. Even if your weight doesn't shift so far forward during hard
braking that you endo, it still lightens up the rear to the point where
the rear wheel contributes almost nothing to braking.
Granted a four wheel design gets MOST of it's braking from the front
wheels, but the back wheels still contribute some.
A three wheeler won't corner as well a four wheeler. In fact, unless you
design the vehicle to only handle oval tracks, then it won't corner
anywhere near as well.
With only three wheels your center of gravity is closer to the outside
edge formed by rear wheel and the outside front wheel. It HAS to be, the
only way to get the same distance is to either
a) move the COG until it's 100% between the two front wheels (now you
have zero braking ability) or
b) widen the front wheel track (see argument above about doing the same
to a four wheeler)
If all you do is turn left, then you can move the single wheel to be
inline with the right wheel, but you'd still have to move it forward some
which would cause comparatively more understeer.
Finally, accelerating out of a corner is reduced on a three wheeler.
Accelerating causes your COG to move back onto the single rear wheel and
give less stability and reduces cornering ability.
About the only physical advantages to a three-wheeler are, possibly, less
rolling resistance -from one less wheel- and lower weight -one less wheel
and suspension.
Of course three wheelers have numerous 'bureaucratic' advantages over
four-wheeler, because it most places in the USA, they are classified as
bikes/motorcycles rather than automobiles. I believe the same is true in
several other countries around the world.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
As the man said, "I want my Kate and Edith too". Disk brakes, and enough
oomph for 600 pounds of batteries. The VW can be converted to disks, but
600 pounds?
BoyntonStu
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Peter VanDerWal
Sent: Sunday, July 31, 2005 5:10 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Auto front suspension donor for trike from RWD
Mustang II's are popular (or used to be) among the custom kit car crowd.
However, I think that it's actually two separate assemblies (left and
right), could be wrong though.
VW bug front suspension has tons of aftermarket parts, they're cheap, and
they are basically one assembly which could make them easier to use,
depending on your experience level.
Just make sure you get the original beetle and not the "super-beetle".
The super-beetle used McPherson struts which could be complicated to
accommodate.
> I am looking for a donor front suspension from a RWD car with disk brakes,
> manual steering, and enough oomph to carry 600 pounds of batteries.
>
> Possibilities might include, Miata, RX7, Triumph, MG.
>
> Any suggestions of what yr/make/model?
>
>
> BoyntonStu
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On 2005-07-31, Stu or Jan wrote:
> Sharks,
>
> Thanks for your comment and welcome to the list.
> Great, a motorcycle maven is just what we need.
Thanks :-) I'm reading through some of the archives trying to get a
better picture together of what is possible ... I don't know that
what I'd regard as a practical E-bike is doable on a sane budget yet,
though, so perhaps I'll have to stick to the dino juice for a while yet!
(I'll send in a Cunning Plan and a request for advice soon)
> The donor bike is a 1982 Kawasaki GPZ 550 air-cooled. It was offered to me
> by a friend.
Not a bad old clunker :-). If you're planning on using the
engine, I'd go straight out and buy the Haynes or Clymer manual
for Z400-550 series, you should be able to find one on Ebay or
a second hand place. I'm pretty sure the Z550, KZ550 and GPZ550
are all the same engine at least.
> If the bike is in neutral with the engine off, you are saying that the gears
> will be turning with no lubrication. Correct? I notice that there are
> front wheel carriers designed to trail motorcycles. Are there models that
> will trail with no damage?
Well, it'd definitely be the case with my Honda. Each of the
gearbox shafts is hollow, and tiny holes under each cog inject
oil under there.
On the other hand, it might turn out that the gearbox in your
Z is splash lubricated, in which case it's probably not a
problem ...
> I suppose that the gearbox to rear sprocket engagement must be broken or
> neutralized with a freewheel or a dog clutch.
> Is there an alternative fix that could be done manually?
Auxilliary oil pump?
I like the hybrid idea, but I think the main problem you'll have
is that bikes, in general, are chock full of engine already ...
One idea I was thinking about ages ago was to machine off two
cylinders of an inline four and attach a big electric motor in
their place, straight onto the crank. You'd end up with a small
(225 in your case) parallel twin. With a regenerative controller,
the motor could do a lot of the work when taking off, and the
engine could then take over to recharge the motor ... you'd
probably need fly-by-wire EFI to hide this behaviour from the
user though.
Sure, it may be a dumb idea, but at least you'd be able to
say you'd stood a 500 pound 250 on it's rear wheel!
-----sharks
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
One idea I was thinking about ages ago was to machine off two
cylinders of an inline four and attach a big electric motor in
their place, straight onto the crank. You'd end up with a small
(225 in your case) parallel twin. With a regenerative controller,
the motor could do a lot of the work when taking off, and the
engine could then take over to recharge the motor ... you'd
probably need fly-by-wire EFI to hide this behaviour from the
user though.
Sure, it may be a dumb idea, but at least you'd be able to
say you'd stood a 500 pound 250 on it's rear wheel!
-----sharks
Not dumb! A good idea, and please keep your brain cells active along these
lines.
My hybrid is for a 3 wheeler, not a MC. You might want to consider the
benefits of a 'Trihawk' type vehicle.
My notes from another forum. (I don't believe that it is a dumb idea.)
1 A motor and my 1982 Kawasaki 550 engine/tranny on both sides
of the wheel. This widens the rear and shortens the chassis. It
would also put the air-cooled engine at the side for easier duct cooling.
A tapered tail could extend it for looks/aero.
2 A jackshaft (at the free arm pivot) to the rear of the back tire to
engage/disengage The power sources (FREEWHEEL)and to run the A/C
compressor.
3 600 pounds of batteries forward the front axle.
4 The passenger roll cage designed like a bathtub. In accident,
batteries and engine/motor go under cage.
5 Weight distribution about 66/33 should be quite agile
6 Cargo area between cage and engine.
7 This sub 1,500 lb. vehicle is not high performance but it
would
get 30 miles on battery, have good acceleration with both power
sources pulling, and great for local commutes and shopping.
I welcome your comments.
BoyntonStu
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
At 10:08 PM 7/30/2005, Ryan Stotts wrote:
> Yeah, but those are standard crimp terminals that leave the tip of
> the wire exposed.
> I'd really prefer the lugs that enclose the entire end of the
> wire.
Any particular reason?
This is for BB600 NiCd cells. I've found that unprotected metal
corrodes REALLY fast near the tops of these batteries. So I was
planning on getting the solid copper lugs and having them nickel
plated. Then I can use shrinkwrap to seal the lug to the cable.
>Waytek also has them - but not with a #10 hole.
Can you not up size to the next bigger hole?
Nope, fits rather loosely.
--
John G. Lussmyer mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Dragons soar and Tigers prowl while I dream....
http://www.CasaDelGato.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On 7/31/05, Ralph Merwin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> As a data point, I bought a set of 20 SAFT STM-100MR NiCads several
> years ago for about $2000. These had an unknown (but assumed to be
> small) number of cycles on them. When some of these died a couple
> of years later I bought used replacements for $200 each.
Hi Ralph, what did they die of, out of interest? (My van has
STM-100MRE - water cooled)
--
EVan
http://www.tuer.co.uk/evs2
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
The manual for my Marathon BB600's calls for charging to 1.55V per cell.
What is doesn't say, however, is whether, once charging stops, the cells
stay at 1.55V, or settle down to some lower voltage. Anyone with Nicad
experience know? Thanks.
Bill Dennis
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Bryan B
Sent: Saturday, July 30, 2005 11:36 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Bolt Circle
Hi,
I've been walking all through internetwonderland, and still haven't
found a drawing, or bolt circle for a VW bellhousing (bug). Anyone know
where I can get it?
Thanks in advance!
Hi Bryan, don't know if this will help but I converted a Zamboni from gas to
electric that had a VB motor. I found on my transmission the motor had a
collar that slid into the trans just a bit so I took my adapter plate to a
machine shop and he turned it on the lath to give me a collar that fit into
the trans. Once I had the fit I also had the center of my plate that he
turned to fit my bearing, I just used a piece of cardboard and tapped around
the trans to form a template of the bolt holes, slid over the adapter plate
and marked the holes.
Hope this helps
Ellery
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At 06:56 AM 7/31/2005, Bill Dennis wrote:
The manual for my Marathon BB600's calls for charging to 1.55V per cell.
What is doesn't say, however, is whether, once charging stops, the cells
stay at 1.55V, or settle down to some lower voltage. Anyone with Nicad
experience know? Thanks.
So far in my testing, they seem to settle down to about 1.32v. This
drops almost instantly down to around 1.2v when a load is applied.
--
John G. Lussmyer mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Dragons soar and Tigers prowl while I dream....
http://www.CasaDelGato.com
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<<The traditional vacuum tube (glass bottle with a high vacuum inside) is
a low-current, high-voltage, linear device. The gate voltage controls
the cathode-to-plate resistance.>>
Pardon me - I'm dense, and also crappy at "reading between the lines,"
especially when it comes to technospeak. It sounds like you are saying it's a
variable resistor, with a voltage controlling a resistance. However, I'm sure
you
are not saying this, because that would make a tube no better than a resistor
for controlling power (except perhaps that you could control it with a
voltage). I'm sure all of us agree we'd rather not use resistors for power
control,
unless it's an extenuating circumstance, or a low power/cheap application, etc.
I know what a variable resistor is, and how it works, and also why it is
undesirable (for this application at least). I also know why a switch is
better
than a resistor for controlling power, and I know how a switch works (it makes
or breaks a circuit) - therefore I understand why transistors are desirable.
I know why a variable transformer is better than a resistor for controlling
power (or at least more effecient), and I at least in theory sorta know how it
works. But I still don't know what a tube "is" in the simple definition. Is
it a resistor? Is it a transformer? Is it a switch? Or is it something else?
It must operate according to some basic principle. What is it?
Again, I apologize. As for my background, I actually have a very good brain,
and a very high IQ. I even have an electrical engineering background believe
it or not - I am a Computer Engineering major, which means I am almost a EE.
I took more circuits courses (including courses dealing with transistors,
semiconductors, etc) than I cared to at the time. The problem was the
instruction. You've heard the expression "can't see the forest for the trees?"
All my
college instructors approached the teaching of anything they taught from the
aspect of a bunch of trees, instead of a forest. But I can't learn that way.
I must see the forest first, and then I can delve into the trees later. The
first day of transistors, the instructor walked up to the board, drew a
"substrate," then illustrated "doping regions," then started talking about
"electrons
moving this way, holes moving that way," and "voltage between gate and
source, blah blah," and then my eyes glazed over. The textbook was no better.
Oh,
I passed all the classes. The problem was, I didn't understand a bloody thing
that was going on, and neither did anyone else. The whole time, up until
fairly recently, I never really knew what a transistor was.
If you asked me two years ago "What is a transistor?" I would have told you
"Well, it's this thing, you see... and it has these doping regions on it, and
well it has holes which move one way, and electrons which move another, and...
and... and...." In other words, I would have thrown you a bunch of trees. I
had no idea what transistors really were. I could have told you "they are
used in lots of applications," but that's about it. It wasn't until I started
reading this list that I finally learned what the hell a transistor really was.
"Oh! It's a frigging switch!" and I slap my forehead. Then I understood,
and it all became crystal clear (or at least more clear). Again, it wasn't my
fault. It was the fault of the instructors, the textbooks, and the
curriculum. Education still suffers from the same problem today. I have a
friend in
his 20's complaining about how in statistics class the instructor will go up to
the chalkboard and start deriving a formula for two hours while everyone
scribbles madly trying to keep up, meanwhile my friend has no frigging clue
what
the hell the guy is deriving, or why he is deriving it, and neither does anyone
else.
<<The gas-filled tubes are like this. They switch on/off, with no
in-between state. They behave very much like a solid-state SCR, except
that the on-state voltage is much higher.>>
I suppose then that the advantage of this sort of tube over a mechanical
switch is that it is has no moving parts and can be controlled with a signal?
Thanks.
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----- Original Message -----
From: "David (Battery Boy) Hawkins" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "EV Discussion List" <[email protected]>
Sent: Saturday, July 30, 2005 10:58 PM
Subject: Re: hybrid battery question
> Eee gads, Gail is talking about using GASOLINE! What is the world coming
to?
> BB
> Hi All;
The OILIES are winning! Sigh, when EVen Gail is looking for a gasser.
But at least she is looking in the right place.IMHO I think you would be
very happy, for now, with a Insite. Ask John Wayland about his, they are
still honeymooning at 70 MPG or better.
Seeya
Bob
> >Date: Wed, 27 Jul 2005 14:50:11 -0700 (PDT)
> >From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >
> >Greetings,
> >
> >One of my co-workers just told me she is looking at hybrids but heard
that
> >the very expensive battery must be replaced every year and this does not
> >appeal to her. I have not been paying close attention to all the hybrid
> >messages but am quite sure this is not correct. What is the expected
> >longevity for the hybrid batteries? We are in Las Vegas where the heat
> >may impact them.
> >
> >I am considering an Insight myself, not extremely seriously yet, but my
> >EVs are all so old that things other than the electrical systems are
> >breaking. Are there ANY disadvantages to the Insight, other than its
> >using gasoline?
> >
> >Thanks,
> >Gail
> >
>
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Evan Tuer writes:
>
> Hi Ralph, what did they die of, out of interest? (My van has
> STM-100MRE - water cooled)
I think my car was drawing too much current from them. The SAFT spec
only mentions 200 amps continuous or 500 amps for about 10 seconds,
but the modules (according to tribal knowledge) "suffer dramatically
reduced lifetimes" if subjected to currents over 250 amps. During my
commute the pack would regularly see 300-350 amps when driving uphill
on the freeway.
There is also some speculation that these modules were from a known-bad
batch.
It's also possible that the battery boxes didn't have enough air flow
to keep the modules cool.
Ralph
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John G. Lussmyer wrote:
>
> At 03:22 PM 7/30/2005, Lee Hart wrote:
>
> >John G. Lussmyer wrote:
> > > I'm looking for some copper lugs for 4ga wire, with a #10 hole.
> > > Anyone know where I could actually order and/or get some of these?
> >
> >By "lug" do you mean a ring terminal? Waytek has them
> >(www.waytekwire.com); #35005 noninsulated, #35505 insulated. Of course,
> >they are local for me (Minnesota) but mail order for you.
>
> Yeah, but those are standard crimp terminals that leave the tip of
> the wire exposed.
> I'd really prefer the lugs that enclose the entire end of the
> wire. Waytek also has them - but not with a #10 hole.
How about soldering the wire in? That plugs the hole in the end.
--
"One doesn't discover new lands without consenting to lose sight of the
shore for a very long time." -- Andre Gide
--
Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart_at_earthlink.net
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Lawrence Rhodes wrote:
> I have a GE Breaker. AMB comp.circuit breaker 40° C.
> Type TQD 2 pole 240 VAC Will break 10,000 amps at 240vac.
> What is the max DC voltage this breaker will be safe with?
> It was sold with a KTA 120v kit.
If it doesn't have any DC ratings, then it doesn't have magnetic
blowouts. In that case, its DC rating is somewhere around 1/4th of its
AC voltage rating.
So, if it is rated 240vac with both poles in series (120vac per pole),
it can safely break 60vdc (also with both poles in series).
--
"One doesn't discover new lands without consenting to lose sight of the
shore for a very long time." -- Andre Gide
--
Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart_at_earthlink.net
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John G. Lussmyer wrote:
> This is for BB600 NiCd cells. I've found that unprotected metal
> corrodes REALLY fast near the tops of these batteries. So I was
> planning on getting the solid copper lugs and having them nickel
> plated. Then I can use shrinkwrap to seal the lug to the cable.
Ah, now I see. #6 wire seems pretty light for these cells. You aren't
planning to ever draw the very high currents they are capable of?
Corrosion is in large part due to dissimilar metals. Since the terminals
are nickel, you'll have the least corrosion with nickel hardware. Why
not use nickel, or nickel-plated buss bars, and dispense with the copper
wire and crimp/solder/heatshrink entirely?
Another possibility is to buy nickel ring terminals. They make them for
high-temperature applications, like for connections to heating elements.
--
"One doesn't discover new lands without consenting to lose sight of the
shore for a very long time." -- Andre Gide
--
Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart_at_earthlink.net
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>> The traditional vacuum tube (glass bottle with a high vacuum
>> inside) is a low-current, high-voltage, linear device. The
>> gate voltage controls the cathode-to-plate resistance.
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> It sounds like you are saying it's a variable resistor, with a
> voltage controlling a resistance. However, I'm sure you are not
> saying this, because that would make a tube no better than a
> resistor for controlling power (except perhaps that you could
> control it with a voltage).
No; that is exactly right. A vacuum tube is a variable resistor. I am
speaking of traditional vacuum tubes, which have a true vacuum inside.
When you look at their performance curves, they show the
plate-to-cathode resistance as a function of grid-to-cathode voltage.
So, all the classic applications for vacuum tubes use them as linear
resistors; not digital switches.
For switching applications, they add a gas inside. The gas greatly
increases the current-carrying capacity and lowers the on-state
resistance. But it also causes the tube to abruptly switch from "off" to
"on". These gas-filled tubes look exactly like true vacuum tubes, but
work quite differently. Their solid-state equivalent would be the SCR.
MOSFET transistors are also really variable resistors; just like vacuum
tubes. A variable voltage on the gate controls the resistance between
the source and drain.
For switching, we don't *use* them as linear resistors; we slam them
fully on, or fully off. Hopefully, their "on" resistance is low enough
not to waste too much power.
> It must operate according to some basic principle. What is it?
The principle is easy to understand. You have a hot metal (called the
heater, or cathode) inside a vacuum bottle. As it approaches red hot,
electrons will "boil off" it, like steam over the surface of a pot of
hot water.
A short distance away, you have a cooler metal plate. By putting a
positive voltage on it relative to the cathode, it attracts the
electrons. So electrons will flow from cathode to anode. But if you put
a negative voltage on the plate relative to the cathode, it repels the
electrons and no current will flow. Thus, you have a diode!
You can interpose a thin screen between the cathode and plate, called
the "grid". It turns out that a negative voltage on the grid blocks the
electrons from reaching the plate, even if the plate is very positive.
As the grid voltage rises toward zero, it allows more and more electrons
to travel from cathode to plate. Thus, the grid acts as a control
electrode, that draws no current itself (because it is negative relative
to the cathode) but controls a much larger current from cathode to
plate.
> [transistor] "Oh! It's a frigging switch!" and I slap my forehead.
No. A transistor is a variable resistor. More like a valve that controls
water flow, only a transistor controls the current flow.
We tend to *use* transistors as if they were switches; just like you can
use a water faucet only fully-on or fully-off. But this is an
oversimplification. Sometimes pretending they are simple switches works
well. Other times it will get you into trouble!
>> The gas-filled tubes are like this. They switch on/off, with
>> no in-between state. They behave very much like a solid-state
>> SCR, except that the on-state voltage is much higher.
> I suppose then that the advantage of this sort of tube over
> a mechanical switch is that it is has no moving parts and can
> be controlled with a signal?
Correct!
--
"One doesn't discover new lands without consenting to lose sight of the
shore for a very long time." -- Andre Gide
--
Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart_at_earthlink.net
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