EV Digest 4569
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) ET WebExclusive :: Clooney's Tango!
by "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) re: prius with blown engine
by Carl Clifford <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) Re: EVLN(Behind the wheel of a solar race EV)
by Andrew Letton <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) RE: 80v AC 3 phase EV Traction Motors and low voltage AC controllers
by "Roger Stockton" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) Re: EVLN(Behind the wheel of a solar race EV)
by Danny Miller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) Re: 80v AC 3 phase EV Traction Motors and low voltage AC controllers
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
7) Re: Avcon wall unit
by Ricky Suiter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8) Re: Silver Bullet Electric Z Car Makes 7 Runs at the Drag Track!
by "Roderick Wilde" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
9) Re: factory S-10 charging woes
by Ricky Suiter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) Re: EVLN(Behind the wheel of a solar race EV)
by "David Roden" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
11) Re: EVLN(Behind the wheel of a solar race EV)
by Victor Tikhonov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
12) Re: EVLN(Behind the wheel of a solar race EV)
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13) Re: EV-200 Resistor for 144v system
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
14) Re: EVLN(Behind the wheel of a solar race EV)
by "David Roden" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
15) Re: Cushman escapades, field weakening
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16) Re: Efficiency, ADC 5.5" (was: RE: John's GT-6)
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
17) Re: EV-200 Resistor for 144v system
by Danny Miller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
18) Re: Wayland Invitational Street Drags
by "Rich Rudman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
19) Re: EVLN(Behind the wheel of a solar race EV)
by Danny Miller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
20) Powering refridgerator off of HV traction pack
by Bob Bath <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
21) El Chopper
by Ken Albright <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
22) Re: El Chopper
by Mark Hastings <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
23) Re: Avcon wall unit.
by Dave <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
24) Re: El Chopper
by Ryan Stotts <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
25) Re: Silver Bullet Electric Z Car Makes 7 Runs at the Drag Track!
by Ken Trough <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
26) Re: El Chopper
by "Nick 'Sharkey' Moore" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
27) Re: Silver Bullet Electric Z Car Makes 7 Runs at the Drag Track!
by Ryan Stotts <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
28) RE: Silver Bullet Electric Z Car Makes 7 Runs at the Drag Track!
by "Roger Stockton" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
29) RE: El Chopper
by "Roger Stockton" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
30) Re: Powering refridgerator off of HV traction pack
by jerry dycus <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--- Begin Message ---
Message: 2
Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2005 12:12:07 -0400
From: RemyC <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: ET WebExclusive :: Clooney's Tango!
Click:
http://www.electrifyingtimes.com/ClooneyTango.html
Awesome pictures! A class act.
RemyC.
ET webed
Lawrence Rhodes
Bassoon/Contrabassoon
Reedmaker
Book 4/5 doubler
Electric Vehicle & Solar Power Advocate
415-821-3519
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
just a thought,
I've always wondered what kind of mileage you could get if you could pair the
vw tdi diesel with a proper hybrid drive. Diesel's relative lack of power
bands would seem to make them good candidates for electric assist, and pairing
hybrid savings with the already astronomical mileage of the tdi might get you
into new territory.
I know it would take some genius solutions to get some of the control modules
to speak to each other but wouldn't it be a satisfying heads-up to VW and
Toyota if it worked out and a hobbiest wound up building the best mileage four
seater in existence.
Carl Clifford
Denver
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Ryan Stotts wrote:
I still think it's misleading. Didn't the Solar cars in the 1980's
not have any batteries at all? I was under the impression then that
the motor was being powered by the solar cells with no on board
batteries.
I don't think any of the significant solar racers have ever not had
batteries. I raced in the first GM Sunrayce in '90, and every car had
batteries, as did all the World Solar Challenge cars of three(?) years
earlier (when GM won, racing the Aerovironment-built Sunraycer).
Without batteries, how do you go under an overpass or under a tree, or
any other shadowed area?
The battery capacity allowed by the rules is only enough to run one of
these cars a fraction of a day's distance, so over the course of a 10+
day rayce, the power really does come from the sun (even if the car
started the race with grid-charged batteries.)
cheers,
Andrew
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Peter Perkins [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> Pricing on the two I mentioned is about £1000 each.
[snip]
> Just need a nice lightweight 80v AC 3phase 18kw traction motor now.
Problem is that Curtis at least will not sell their AC controller to anyone but
an OEM with a motor manufacturer partner due to the need to custom program the
controller to match the motor.
Seth Allen [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> Yep, there are some. In the USA unless you are an OEM then I
> think you are looking at www.highperformancegolfcars.com.
> Wound for 48V, but they should be fine at a higher voltage.
> I am not sure if they need a new program for running at 72/80VDC.
I think this is pretty much your only option. Note that Hi Performance has
invested a lot of time and money into customising the Curtis controller
programming to match their motor and will not sell you a motor or controller
individually; you must buy the complete package.
I believe they do have a 72/80V system available (Dynasty, the local
manufacturer of the IT NEV has evaluated one of the AC drive systems, and I am
pretty sure it was a 72V system given that that is what Dynasty's vehicles run).
I'm not sure that a complete Hi Performance AC traction system is really that
much cheaper than one of Victor's Siemens systems when all is said and done,
however, I suppose you would still realise some savings due to being able to
use a lower voltage battery pack.
Cheers,
Roger.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
You wouldn't be as efficient without batteries either. It would mean
you would travel at a higher speed when the sun in shining and stop when
the sun is gone. Since higher speeds are subject to more than linear
increases in drag loss, this is not as efficient as maintaining a single
speed.
Man, I think arguing that it's not solar because it stores energy in
batteries is a ridiculous use of semantics. The energy comes from the
sun here. It's also transformed from solar to electric energy. Who cares?
Actually, I did a bit of work on Texas A&M Sunraycer project. There is
one exception to that "solar energy" thing. Naturally they cannot
require you start the race with 0% SOC. If I recall correctly you will
start with fully charged batteries. The length of the race is such that
most of the energy will need to come from replenishment from solar
energy rather than the initial charge energy. I'm sure as EV experts
some of you guys are thinking "yeah but *I* could build such a store of
batteries that I could do the whole race on the initial charge". The
vehicle requirements are technical and many and would probably prevent
this strategy. Either they would evolve a new rule preventing that
strategy or most likely you'd get denied entrance since the inspectors
are tech experts, not just box-checkers.
A more clever strategy would be to build a hydrogen fuel cell vehicle
and use the sun to do hydrolysis. That's probably an impractically
inefficient charge cycle, the only point would be the hydrogen "battery'
reservoir could easily contain enough energy to take you through the
entire race. I'm sure this wouldn't be allowed.
Danny
Andrew Letton wrote:
Ryan Stotts wrote:
I still think it's misleading. Didn't the Solar cars in the 1980's
not have any batteries at all? I was under the impression then that
the motor was being powered by the solar cells with no on board
batteries.
I don't think any of the significant solar racers have ever not had
batteries. I raced in the first GM Sunrayce in '90, and every car had
batteries, as did all the World Solar Challenge cars of three(?) years
earlier (when GM won, racing the Aerovironment-built Sunraycer).
Without batteries, how do you go under an overpass or under a tree, or
any other shadowed area?
The battery capacity allowed by the rules is only enough to run one of
these cars a fraction of a day's distance, so over the course of a 10+
day rayce, the power really does come from the sun (even if the car
started the race with grid-charged batteries.)
cheers,
Andrew
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Roger,
I see a rather familiar looking charger on their website ;)
Steve
-----Original Message-----
From: Roger Stockton <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: [email protected]
Sent: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 09:02:45 -0700
Subject: RE: 80v AC 3 phase EV Traction Motors and low voltage AC controllers
Peter Perkins [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> Pricing on the two I mentioned is about £1000 each.
[snip]
> Just need a nice lightweight 80v AC 3phase 18kw traction motor now.
Problem is that Curtis at least will not sell their AC controller to anyone but
an OEM with a motor manufacturer partner due to the need to custom program the
controller to match the motor.
Seth Allen [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> Yep, there are some. In the USA unless you are an OEM then I
> think you are looking at www.highperformancegolfcars.com.
> Wound for 48V, but they should be fine at a higher voltage.
> I am not sure if they need a new program for running at 72/80VDC.
I think this is pretty much your only option. Note that Hi Performance has
invested a lot of time and money into customising the Curtis controller
programming to match their motor and will not sell you a motor or controller
individually; you must buy the complete package.
I believe they do have a 72/80V system available (Dynasty, the local
manufacturer of the IT NEV has evaluated one of the AC drive systems, and I am
pretty sure it was a 72V system given that that is what Dynasty's vehicles run).
I'm not sure that a complete Hi Performance AC traction system is really that
much cheaper than one of Victor's Siemens systems when all is said and done,
however, I suppose you would still realise some savings due to being able to
use
a lower voltage battery pack.
Cheers,
Roger.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I think the 120 vac avcon plug was included with the Honda EV+ and would only
work with them. I read about someone trying one with their Ranger EV and it
actually discharged it.
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:<<<
The Avcon wall unit is basically a 240Vac connection with several safety
interlocks; an Avcon inlet with the "Ford emulator" circuit allows *any*
240Vac-capable charger to accept power from an Avcon wall unit (from
Avconev.com).
I've got an Avcon connector that plugs into 120Vac (yellow cable, yellow handle,
less-than-shoebox sixed control box, could be one-of-a-kind), so the Ranger EV's
charger may have accepted 120V at some point in its development, but it would
have taken more than 24hrs to charge the NiMH model.
Later,
Ricky
02 Red Insight #559
92 Saturn SC2 EV conversion in progress
---------------------------------
Yahoo! Mail for Mobile
Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hey John, I hope this same dude shows up for your street legal invitational.
I would like to see his jaw finally drop far enough for his foot to fit in.
Roderick Wilde
"Suck Amps EV Racing"
www.suckamps.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "John Wayland" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Thursday, August 11, 2005 8:03 AM
Subject: Silver Bullet Electric Z Car Makes 7 Runs at the Drag Track!
Hello to All,
A quick update before heading off to work this morning....Finally, we made
it to the 1/4 mile track this year! Last night Jeffrey Bywater, Tme Brehm,
and your truly took the Silver bullet for shake down 1/8 mile runs to PIR.
There were more cars than I expected for a Wednesday night drag race. As
has become the norm, the pack of 14 Exide Orbitals (168V) performed
flawlessly, dishing out power run after run, with current draws most
likely in excess of 2000 amps...not one battery problem. Same is true for
the three Prestolite motors and the three Raptor controllers. It was
really great to have my work service truck as a base of operations, thank
you, Northwest Handling Systems!
Jeffrey made a total of 7 passes. He had problems 'finding' 3rd gear, and
so his 1/8 mile times were around the 10.0 - 10.2 second region, but once
he figured out the linkage thing and started to nail his shifts, things
got better. The Silver Bullet's best time was a 9.8 second run. Even after
dropping the rear tire pressure down to 15 psi, the three motors were
still too much and traction was a problem....we need bigger tires! Most
electrics do better launching in 2nd gear, but we shaved .4 seconds off
the 60 ft. time by using 1st gear, going from a lazy 2.409 to a much
quicker 2.098, a huge difference.
I'll try to give a more thorough post tonight after work, but let it
suffice to say the crowd loved this car! On guy argued with me that it
wasn't an electric car he just watched lay rubber and waste a V8 off the
line....he swore it was a turbo Z Car, as it had the emblems to prove it,
and, he could hear the turbo whistle (the supercharger belt). No amount of
arguing with him would change his mind, and when I invited him to come
over to our pit area to see the car return from the run, he simply said,
"Bullsh.....ain't no damn electric car that can accelerate like
that"...then he walked away with his friends, still going on on how I was
pulling his leg and all :-)
See Ya...John 'Plasma Boy' Wayland
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--- Begin Message ---
http://www.evbones.com/
I think they have some spare batteries. A friend of mine's family had a PBA
S-10 and that's where he got another panasonic battery when one of theirs
failed. Good luck.
Jim Coate <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
So after a couple of weeks traveling (and some fun meeting a few north
west EVers) (and falling 1000's of e-mails behind), I am back home and
find that my spiffy factory made 1998 Chevy S-10 truck isn't so happy. I
left it on the charger (Magne Charger) while gone so it could keep the
batteries cool and topped off. But it apparently spent much of the time
saying "check vehicle". The charger refuses to start; the truck doesn't
want to go either. Checking the error codes it seems to be that the
voltage for battery #11 is too low and because of (or in addition to?)
this it won't close the main contactor to start things up.
Anyone have any experience with these? It is the same drive system as in
the removed-from-existence EV1's. Dropping the battery pack is probably
quite an involved task. Ugh.
--
Jim Coate
1970's Elec-Trak's
1998 Chevy S-10 NiMH BEV
1997 Chevy S-10 NGV Bi-Fuel
http://www.eeevee.com
Later,
Ricky
02 Red Insight #559
92 Saturn SC2 EV conversion in progress
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On 10 Aug 2005 at 20:46, Ryan Stotts wrote:
> I still think it's misleading.
If the sole source of energy to power the vehicle is the sun, why isn't it a
solar car? What am I missing here?
David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
EV List Assistant Administrator
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--- Begin Message ---
If the sun powers it directly *as it runs*, looks like it is.
Batteries (or caps) can be used as a buffer, but the energy
directly must power the motor(s).
If you pre-store solar energy first and then use it, it isn't.
Else, anyone's EV which is charged only from PV panels on the
roof with no mains involved, can be called solar car.
Just my understanding.
David Roden wrote:
On 10 Aug 2005 at 20:46, Ryan Stotts wrote:
I still think it's misleading.
If the sole source of energy to power the vehicle is the sun, why isn't it a
solar car? What am I missing here?
David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
EV List Assistant Administrator
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--
Victor
'91 ACRX - something different
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Victor Tikhonov wrote:
>> it said "a vehicle powered completely by solar energy".
>> It doesn't say "solar car".
Ryan Stotts wrote:
> I still think it's misleading. Didn't the Solar cars in the 1980's
> not have any batteries at all? I was under the impression then that
> the motor was being powered by the solar cells with no on board
> batteries.
Well, perhaps it's misleading. But I think the solar cars have always
had batteries on-board. You need *some* kind of on-board energy storage
to deal with shade and clouds. Plus, you want some place to save the
excess solar energy when you are stopped or coasting.
I must say though that the solar cars have become rather formulaic. They
are all built alike, with pretty much the same solar cells, same motors,
and controllers. It seems that money and craftsmanship are more
important than creativity or innovation.
Now this is fine; most racing nowdays is tightly restricted by the
rules. They have defined the problem so tightly that the "best" solution
tends to be rather obvious, leading everyone to build the same car. I
guess it makes for a more interesting spectator sport when all the cars
are essentially identical. But it doesn't encourage people to think
"outside the box" or try new things or new technologies.
--
Every act of conscious learning requires the willingness to suffer an
injury to one's self-esteem. That is why young children, before they
are aware of their own self-importance, learn so easily. - Thomas Szasz
--
Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart_at_earthlink.net
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Lawrence Rhodes wrote:
> Am I placing it wrong? What location should the resistor be placed to
> prevent damage to the device being protected (contactor/switch etc.)
The precharge resistor goes across the last contact to close to connect
the controller to the battery pack.
In the simplest installations, there is only one main contactor; so the
resistor goes across its contacts. But this keeps the controller powered
all the time, even when parked or charging. Your controller is at risk
of earlier failures from high charging voltages, and the constant
current draw runs down the pack if you leave the car parked without
charging for weeks.
One worthwhile improvement is to put a small switch or relay contact in
series with the precharge resistor. This way, you can turn off this
resistor when parked and charging. Naturally, this switch or relay needs
to be rated to switch the high DC voltage present (but the current is
pretty low). Turn on this switch, wait a few seconds to precharge the
controller's capacitors, then turn on the main contactor.
A better arrangement is to have TWO switches of some sort in series with
the controller and battery pack. It could be two contactors, a contactor
and a circuit breaker, a contactor and a disconnect switch, etc. This
way, you can still completely turn off the controller when parked or
charging. You also have a backup system that can turn off the EV even if
the contactor welds.
--
Every act of conscious learning requires the willingness to suffer an
injury to one's self-esteem. That is why young children, before they
are aware of their own self-importance, learn so easily. - Thomas Szasz
--
Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart_at_earthlink.net
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On 11 Aug 2005 at 10:28, Victor Tikhonov wrote:
> Else, anyone's EV which is charged only from PV panels on the
> roof with no mains involved, can be called solar car.
I have no problem with that, as long as ^no^ other source of energy ever
fuels the vehicle. But I can see how most people would expect a solar car
to carry its PV cells along with it.
David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
EV List Assistant Administrator
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--- Begin Message ---
Mark Hanson wrote:
> ...for the goal of 250Whrs per mile.
That should be easy to achieve with these vehicles.
> I was curious is there a formulae for setting up field weakening other than
> just take a couple feet of #12 wire , contactor and wire across the field?
> Percent of current diversion, vs speed and efficiency loss tradeoffs?
Sure; measure the resistance of the field. For 50% field weakening (a
good starting point), put an equal value resistor in parallel. Be sure
to include the resistance of whatever wiring and terminals this
requires; it is significant because the field resistance is so low!
50% field cuts the field strength in half, so at the same applied
current, the motor tries to run twice as fast. Or, if you applied the
same voltage to the motor, the current will roughly double, thus
doubling the horsepower. This relationship gets nonlinear at higher than
rated motor current, where the increases are not as large.
--
Every act of conscious learning requires the willingness to suffer an
injury to one's self-esteem. That is why young children, before they
are aware of their own self-importance, learn so easily. - Thomas Szasz
--
Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart_at_earthlink.net
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Chris Tromley wrote:
> My understanding so far is that a direct drive single motor is
> generally less efficient and will therefore deliver less range
> than using a trans.
Not quite. You'll note that *all* purpose-built EVs are direct drive,
even those with series motors. Going with a fixed gear ratio requires a
larger, more expensive motor -- but the cost and weight savings from
eliminating the multi-speed transmission more than pays for it. And, the
larger an electric motor, the more efficient it gets. So the larger
motor with no transmission winds up being *more* efficient.
You see transmissions in conversion EVs because it was already there
(free), and is integrated into the vehicle in such a way as to make it
hard to remove (it includes the differential, or motor mounts). Once you
know you have a transmission anyway, then you can downsize the motor a
bit to save money and weight.
> Using two motors with direct drive adds a new wrinkle. They are still
> running at low rpm, but at only 1/2 load each. That has to improve
> efficiency. I wonder if two direct drive motors are (generally) as
> efficient as one with a trans?
It's very close. Two half-size motors will be less efficient than a
single motor of the same horsepower. But the difference is small.
The main advantage to having two motors comes from possible mechanical
simplifications. You may be able to eliminate the differential, or
position the motors more effectively in the space available. Again, this
applies mainly to purpose-built vehicles, not normal vehicles that
already came with a differential and only have room for one motor.
For the special case of DC motors, having two motors allows for simple
series/parallel operation to simplify your speed controller.
--
Every act of conscious learning requires the willingness to suffer an
injury to one's self-esteem. That is why young children, before they
are aware of their own self-importance, learn so easily. - Thomas Szasz
--
Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart_at_earthlink.net
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Switching a precharge resistor sounds like a good job for a mosfet of
the appropriate voltage rating.
Danny
Lee Hart wrote:
Lawrence Rhodes wrote:
Am I placing it wrong? What location should the resistor be placed to
prevent damage to the device being protected (contactor/switch etc.)
The precharge resistor goes across the last contact to close to connect
the controller to the battery pack.
In the simplest installations, there is only one main contactor; so the
resistor goes across its contacts. But this keeps the controller powered
all the time, even when parked or charging. Your controller is at risk
of earlier failures from high charging voltages, and the constant
current draw runs down the pack if you leave the car parked without
charging for weeks.
One worthwhile improvement is to put a small switch or relay contact in
series with the precharge resistor. This way, you can turn off this
resistor when parked and charging. Naturally, this switch or relay needs
to be rated to switch the high DC voltage present (but the current is
pretty low). Turn on this switch, wait a few seconds to precharge the
controller's capacitors, then turn on the main contactor.
A better arrangement is to have TWO switches of some sort in series with
the controller and battery pack. It could be two contactors, a contactor
and a circuit breaker, a contactor and a disconnect switch, etc. This
way, you can still completely turn off the controller when parked or
charging. You also have a backup system that can turn off the EV even if
the contactor welds.
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--- Begin Message ---
I so very clearly know that Rod...
Sigh!!!
I am trying to fill your order for 3 PFC50B, and about 3 to 4 other
chargers, as well as have the 75Kw charger clocking for a client inspection
that same weekend.
Some thing has to give besides my back and time commitments.
Oh yea Rod you should have gotten the TH400... it shifts ALOT faster than
you can.
That said... you ARE hunting...in the big leagues with that drive
train.....Imagine what it could do in Gp?
I had better get two Madman 100 stickers ready, Both not for me...
Madman.
AKA the Copper Bit## from Bellingham
Back to my old tricks. Many pound of copper are going into the
power stage of the 75K.
I might get it clocking this weekend.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Roderick Wilde" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Wednesday, August 10, 2005 1:16 PM
Subject: Re: Wayland Invitational Street Drags
> Hey Madman, If you plan on coming to Woodburn with old Optimas and a
Raptor
> in Goldie then you won't have a snowballs chance in hell of being in your
> own 100 mph club :-)
>
> Roderick Wilde
> "Suck Amps EV Racing"
> www.suckamps.com
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Rich Rudman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: <[email protected]>
> Sent: Wednesday, August 10, 2005 9:41 AM
> Subject: Re: Wayland Invitational Street Drags
>
>
> > Madman and Goldie will certainly be there!!
> >
> > This is the kind of fun that keep us old Fast Evers alive, Run it! play
> > with
> > the Gas guys... Carry the Fast EV flag.. Just fast simple Racing...
> >
> > They love us down there, and are trying to help get us power... We have
a
> > couple of 120 VAC outlets, but we are bringing 8Kw and 10Kw generators.
I
> > will have PFC 50s on each big Genset.
> > Charging should be in the 15 to 30 min span. Quite good enough for a
hand
> > full of EVers in a hurry.
> >
> > I am not sure If I will have 240 and a Zilla in Goldie.. But I will at
> > least
> > have the old Yts and the Raptor on line.
> >
> > At night... it's cooler, and there is not much a problem with Sunburn
like
> > at Woodburn...Getting my Bains Braked out, is a Woodburn hazzard..
> >
> > So... I will be there, hoping John can get as '05 in Madman's 100 club.
> > Street legal, real time slip....do it once...Got proof that's
fine
> > with me....
> >
> > Rich Rudman
> > Madman.
> >
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Roderick Wilde" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > To: <[email protected]>
> > Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2005 10:47 AM
> > Subject: Wayland Invitational Street Drags
> >
> >
> >> NEDRA is proud to announce a new sanctioned event, The Wayland
> > Invitational
> >> Street Drags. Open to all street legal NEDRA drag racers. Come out and
go
> >> head to head with the gas boys at Portland International Raceway (PIR)
> >> Friday September 2nd 2005. Gates open at 6 PM. Please note that there
is
> >> a
> >> 90dBA sound limit for this event :-) This will be a first annual event.
> > You
> >> are all invited to join John in this first historical racing event
either
> > as
> >> a spectator or participant. We have all heard John's exciting stories
of
> >> racin the gas boys at PIR. Here is your chance to join in the fun.
Track
> >> info at www.portlandraceway.com
> >>
> >> Roderick Wilde
> >> NEDRA President
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> No virus found in this outgoing message.
> >> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
> >> Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.10.5/67 - Release Date: 8/9/2005
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > No virus found in this incoming message.
> > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
> > Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.10.5/68 - Release Date: 8/10/2005
> >
> >
>
>
>
> --
> No virus found in this outgoing message.
> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
> Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.10.5/68 - Release Date: 8/10/2005
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
As far as I know nobody is talking about an electric car charged by an
external electrical PV station. Indeed this would be controversial
whether a "solar car" designation is appropriate. Did I miss
something? All the Sunrayce cars must carry their PV cells on board.
Danny
David Roden wrote:
I have no problem with that, as long as ^no^ other source of energy ever
fuels the vehicle. But I can see how most people would expect a solar car
to carry its PV cells along with it.
David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
EV List Assistant Administrator
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I was in So. Cal. not long ago, and they had localized
outages. It got me thinking: What is to keep someone
from disconnecting the Anderson connector of their EV;
hooking it to a high voltage inverter, and powering
the fridge and a couple of lights in this situation?
Anyone else have this up and working as a backup
power source?
Thanks,
'92 Honda Civic sedan, 144V
____
__/__|__\ __
=D-------/ - - \
'O'-----'O'-'
Would you still drive your car if the tailpipe came out of the steering wheel?
Are you saving any gas for your kids?
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Has anyone built, ridden, owned an El Chopper? I'm
interested in completeness of plans, ease/difficulty
of construction, performance, reliability, and
driveability.
Thanks
Ken Albright
____________________________________________________
Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page
http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I got the plans and they look well done and complete. The construction looks
pretty simple and cheap if you have to farm out the welding. Much cheaper then
a full size EV too. I really wish I had been in a motorcycle mood before
getting my truck as it would be a lot cheaper in every way and probably
outpeform my truck and give me enough range.
Based on the simple construction I think it should be pretty reliable but
performance is a ligering question in my mind. As the case with all ev's
terrain is a big issue but with the El Chopper and it's single speed with an
ETek I think it is a bigger issue and since it is pretty lightweight drivers
weight probably has a measurable affect unlike in my 4k lb pickup.
My other lingering though on it is that it looks like they place the etek in
the unspring weight but it is really close to the pivot point. I hear over and
over how important a low unsprung weight is but I'm unsure if 25 lbs or so
(motor plus mounting) would affect a motorcycle.
Ken Albright <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Has anyone built, ridden, owned an El Chopper? I'm
interested in completeness of plans, ease/difficulty
of construction, performance, reliability, and
driveability.
Thanks
Ken Albright
____________________________________________________
Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page
http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Which connections does the wall unit use to tell the charger how much current
is available. The data link connections,(not used here) or does it use the same
wire which turns the wall unit on?
-----Original Message-----
From: Ralph Merwin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Aug 11, 2005 10:04 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Avcon wall unit.
Dave writes:
>
> Does the AVCON wall unit simply supply 240 vac to
> an AVCON compatible charger with some ground fault protection
> or does it change the ac mains supply to some other (e.g. dc)
> voltage? In short, could you wire an AVCON compatible charger
> to plug into a standard 240 vac outlet ?
The AVCON wall unit provides 240vac only, and includes ground fault
protection. It also uses a 'pilot' signal/circuit that tells the wall
unit when the handle is plugged into the vehicle, at which point the
wall unit will turn on the AC. The wall unit will not turn on the AC
unless the pilot signal is active.
An AVCON compatible charger can work in a standard 240vac outlet as
long as the charger doesn't require the pilot signal (the pilot signal
tells the charger how much current the wall unit can provide, but
chargers are not required to look at this information).
Ralph
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Mark Hastings wrote:
>I hear over and over how important a low
>unsprung weight is but I'm unsure if 25 lbs
>or so (motor plus mounting) would affect
>a motorcycle.
25 lbs is a TON of weight when talking about wheels or tires.
Especially in a motorcycle application.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
The Silver Bullet's best time was a 9.8 second run.
Doesn't that mean that the Silver Bullet broke through the 100mph
barrier for street legal cars?? I realize that this was not a sanctioned
NEDRA event and that the times are probably not official, but how about
some timeslip details?? Drool.
-Ken Trough
Admin - V is for Voltage Magazine
http://visforvoltage.com
AIM - ktrough
FAX/voice message - 206-339-VOLT (8658)
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On 2005-08-11, Ryan Stotts wrote:
>
> 25 lbs is a TON of weight when talking about wheels or tires.
> Especially in a motorcycle application.
It's a lot, but on the other hand there's plenty of shaft-drive
bikes which have several kilos of final drive[*] wrapped around
the rear axle. Not real good for racing, but okay off the track ...
If El Chopper has the motor up near the swingarm pivot, it
wouldn't be such a big effect[#], and it'd have the advantage that
the chain slack wouldn't vary as the swingarm moved, nor would
the swingarm 'squat' when accelerating.
Flamebait: And it's not like choppers handle properly to start with.
-----sharks
[*] Just a big pair of bevel gears, their casing, various shims,
splines, O-ring seals, 250ml of oil ... it's often called a "diff"
out of similarity to a RWD car's diff, but it ain't differential!
[#] "Unsprung weight" should really be "Unsprung moment of inertia",
I think ... it's all about how quick the suspension can react.
--
"Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day. Teach him how to fish,
and you can sell him equipment." -- Avram Grumer
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Ken Trough wrote:
> > The Silver Bullet's best time was a 9.8 second run.
>
> Doesn't that mean that the Silver Bullet broke through the 100mph
> barrier for street legal cars??
9.8 seconds in the 1/8th mile...
Using a 1/8 mile to 1/4 mile converter:
15.3 seconds in the 1/4 mile..
http://www.tciauto.com/tech_info/calculators.htm
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Ken Trough [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> > The Silver Bullet's best time was a 9.8 second run.
>
> Doesn't that mean that the Silver Bullet broke through the 100mph
> barrier for street legal cars?? I realize that this was not a
> sanctioned NEDRA event and that the times are probably not
> official, but how about some timeslip details?? Drool.
It doesn't have to be a NEDRA-sanctioned event for the times to be
official, however, John wrote that the Silver Bullet was out for some
*1/8th* mile shakedown runs, so I would assume this time is for a 1/8th
mile run, not a 1/4mi run.
9.8s in the 1.4mi is well into EV dragster (rail) performance territory,
and we'd have seen a lot more written if the Silver Bullet had gotten
anywhere near to the 10s mark! ;^>
Cheers,
Roger.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Ryan Stotts [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> 25 lbs is a TON of weight when talking about wheels or tires.
> Especially in a motorcycle application.
Less is certainly better, however, it is the ratio of sprung to unsprung
weight that is important. So, a (typically) heavy EV bike might
actually be fine with 25lbs of additional unsprung weight even though a
light-weight ICE sportbike would suffer dramatically from it.
Note also that "unsprung" isn't the same as "rotating"; a 25lb wheel is
both unsprung and rotating, but a 25lb motor mounted to the swingarm is
only partially unsprung (the nearer to the pivot it is located, the less
its contribution to the unsprung mass of the vehicle) and only the mass
of its armature is rotating.
Cheers,
Roger.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi Bob and All,
--- Bob Bath <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I was in So. Cal. not long ago, and they had
> localized
> outages. It got me thinking: What is to keep
> someone
> from disconnecting the Anderson connector of their
> EV;
> hooking it to a high voltage inverter, and powering
> the fridge and a couple of lights in this situation?
>
> Anyone else have this up and working as a backup
> power source?
I ran my house off of my EV's for 3 days one time
during the hurricanes last yr here in Fla.
The easy way is running an inverter off your
DC/DC that charges a 12v batt for peak loads. You
sould be able to do your refridgerator, a couple
lights, small TV or radio/stereo and a fan off a 35+
amp DC/DC to a 1500 watt/2500wt peak inverter. Turn
the fridges door heaters, auto defrost off if you can.
I even ran my A/C some ;-))
And inverters are rather cheap now at about $139
or less for a 1500wt cont one at places like Pep
Boy's, ect.
HTH's,
Jerry Dycus
>
> Thanks,
>
> '92 Honda Civic sedan, 144V
> ____
> __/__|__\ __
> =D-------/ - - \
> 'O'-----'O'-'
> Would you still drive your car if the tailpipe came
> out of the steering wheel? Are you saving any gas
> for your kids?
>
>
____________________________________________________
Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page
http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs
--- End Message ---
