EV Digest 4754
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) Re: Idea for park
by Jeff Shanab <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) Re: Idea for park
by David Dymaxion <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) Peugeot 206 + 15kW Siemens (copy, with US units)
by Osmo Sarin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) Peugeot 206 + 15kW Siemens?
by Osmo Sarin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) Re: Idea for park
by "Peter VanDerWal" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) Re: Idea for Park
by "Peter VanDerWal" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7) RE: Real world data on 8 Volt Golf Cart Batteries - or 47,000 mil
by "Dewey, Jody R ATC (CVN75 IM3)" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8) Re: New Haven Register - Life-Styles - -
by Bruce Weisenberger <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
9) RE: Real world data on 8 Volt Golf Cart Batteries - or 47,000 mil
es in my EV
by "Dewey, Jody R ATC (CVN75 IM3)" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) Re: White Zombie Hits PIR again this Saturday Night
by Jim Husted <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
11) Weird wire bundle
by "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
12) Re: New Haven Register - Life-Styles - -
by jerry dycus <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13) Re: creaky rear struts in VoltsRabbit - slightly O.T.
by "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
14) Re: New Haven Register - Life-Styles - -
by "Bob Rice" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
15) Re: New Haven Register - Life-Styles - -
by "Mark Grasser" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16) Re: New Haven Register - Life-Styles - -Signing Up
by "Bob Rice" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
17) Re: New Haven Register - Life-Styles - -
by Bruce Weisenberger <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
18) Re: Vacuum booster
by "Mark Ward" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
19) Re: Vacuum booster
by reb <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
20) Re: New Haven Register - Life-Styles - -
by Neon John <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
21) Re: Idea for Park
by Mike Chancey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
22) Re: Peugeot 206 + 15kW Siemens (copy, with US units)
by "Paul G." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
23) California, Bay Area, Rally today.
by Otmar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--- Begin Message ---
Line Lock! kill 2 birds with one stone, i want one of those anyway.
Excellent idea.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
You might be able to install a 2nd gear shift lever that just does
the 5th and reverse gears. Then you could leave the regular shifter
in 1st, and the 2nd lever in reverse, and that would lock up the
tranny like "park" in an automatic.
__________________________________________________
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--- Begin Message ---
...sorry I forgot to add US units. Here´s the message again:
-------
I´m planning to convert Peugeot 206 as my first project, and I´ve been
offered a Siemens 1LH5118 AC motor with 15 kW rated, 123 Nm max, and
Simovert 6SV1 short inverter (110-380 V, max DC 280 A, max 80 kW).
According to my own calculations (which may be incorrect) I would need
much more power, but the seller says 15 kW is enough for my
requirements, which are:
-total weight (with passengers) 1400 kg (3090 lbs)
-top speed 110 km/h (68 mph)
-acceleration 6 sec 0-50 km/h (0-31 mph) = normal ICE-acc.
-voltage about 300 V
I´d appreciate any comments,
Osmo Sarin
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I´m planning to convert Peugeot 206 as my first project, and I´ve been
offered a Siemens 1LH5118 AC motor with 15 kW rated, 123 Nm max, and
Simovert 6SV1 short inverter (110-380 V, max DC 280 A, max 80 kW).
According to my own calculations (which may be incorrect) I would need
much more power, but the seller says 15 kW is enough for my
requirements, which are:
-total weight (with passengers) 1400 kg
-top speed 110 km/h
-acceleration 6 sec 0-50 km/h
-voltage about 300 V
I´d appreciate any comments,
Osmo Sarin
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Except that line locks are generally not intended for long term use. A
little leakage in the system and you can wake up to find your EV parked
across the street in your neighbors livingroom.
> Line Lock! kill 2 birds with one stone, i want one of those anyway.
> Excellent idea.
>
>
--
If you send email to me, or the EVDL, that has > 4 lines of legalistic
junk at the end; then you are specifically authorizing me to do whatever I
wish with the message. By posting the message you agree that your long
legalistic signature is void.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
> I didn't mean to imply I wasn't going to fix the emergancy brake!. I
> am talking in addition.
Do you know, that the USA is the only country I've liven in that calls it
an "Emergency Brake"? Everywhere else calls it a "Parking Brake". In
fact a lot of people in the US call it a parking brake, because that is
what it is primarily designed for...parking.
20+ years ago I took driving leasons in England. We were taught to use
the parking brake frequently. Pull up to a red light at an intersection?
Engage the parking brake and put the transmission in neutral. If you
failed to do this when taking the driving test you would fail the test.
Not that I'm advocating that level driving paranoia, just pointing out
that the "Parking Brake" is intended to be used, and used frequently. THe
parts, including brake drums, etc. are intended and DESIGNED to be used
and used frequently.
It occures to me that a tranny lock is an bad idea. I'm sure that at one
time or another you have started the car moving and forgot to disengage
the parking brake. Can you imagine what would happen to a "locked"
transmission when subjected to all of that zero RPM torque, that DC motors
are so famous for? (Ok the grammer sucks, but you get the point)
Likewise the brakes system is NOT designed to have a line lock, especially
not a line lock used for long periods of time. If you keep the brake
system constantly pressurized, then there is a good chance that some part
will fail. When it does fail, chances are you won't be around to do
anything about it.
Parking brakes tend to fail when applied, so at least you will know about
it while you're still in the vehicle and can take other action.
>
> For emergancy stops can't beat an emergancy brake, but for parking the
> car on a slope, parking brakes are actually poor. They are kind of
> analog, how hard is hard enough?
If you have problems parking on a slope, then you need to get your parking
brake fixed/adjusted. For most brakes, they should hold a car on a slope
whith only about 1/2 the total movement of the parking lever.
> Either you crank them on really hard all the time which can be hard on
> the rotors and such or you risk it slipping. When everything cools the
> tendency for things to contract could mean a slow rolling out of the
> driveway. (Depends on type)
Actually, the amount of shrinkage is tiny and, if anything, would tend to
make the brakes hold TIGHTER. I.e. brake drums shrink slightly in
diameter when cooling.
--
If you send email to me, or the EVDL, that has > 4 lines of legalistic
junk at the end; then you are specifically authorizing me to do whatever I
wish with the message. By posting the message you agree that your long
legalistic signature is void.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Chip,
My 240SX is a hatchback. The reason I wanted so many batteries is
because the back seat is coming out completely. I havent figured out what
the number in the back or the number in front is yet. I want to make some
foam versions of the batteries for measuring purposes. I hope to get 20 in
back and 6 in front. I might be able to get more up front though since
there won't be any radiator up front to deal with. At first I wanted to try
a conversion using the Trojan L16HC batteries but Electro Automotive said
they were not suited for automotive use. It kind of confused me because
they have 400ah each and even though they weigh 123 pounds each they would
make a great battery. I also liked the 1000 cycles they offered. There is
no way however to do 26 of those bad boys.
Jody
-----Original Message-----
From: Chip Gribben [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, September 23, 2005 10:23 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: RE: Real world data on 8 Volt Golf Cart Batteries - or 47,000
mil
Hi Jody,
You mentioned you are a speed junkie. Since this your first build I
wouldn't expect breakneck speeds with 6 volt batteries. 6 volters tend
to sag under hard acceleration especially towards the end of their
range. You'll notice it when the ammeter needle shoots up to 300 + amps
under hard acceleration. But your car will certainly have highway
capable speeds though and pretty decent range.
Also installing 26 62 pound lead acid batteries in a small car is quite
a challenge. I've seen at the most 20 6-volt batteries installed in
cars and quite a few pickup trucks but 26 batteries is quite a bit. If
you can fit them all in there with easy access to water them I would
certainly beef up the suspension. As you install each battery you'll
see the car begin to sag lower and lower. You're 240SX will be
low-rider and the car will bottom out on the bumps. It's alot of weight
for a smaller car. I imagine you have a plan already to beef up the
suspension.
If you are going 156 volts with floodeds, 8 volters would give you
better acceleration and lighter weight. I have 144 volts of 8 volt
batteries in my Ford Escort. I've contemplated going with 120 volts of
6 volters for better range but can't even imagine 26 batteries. The
other 6 would have to go under the rear seat or where the rear seat is.
Good luck
Chip Gribben
----Original Message-----
From: Dewey, Jody R ATC (CVN75 IM3) [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Thursday, September 22, 2005 7:36 PM
To: '[email protected]'
Subject: RE: Real world data on 8 Volt Golf Cart Batteries - or 47,000
mil
es in my EV
Thats why I asked Jerry. That can't be the TOTAL weight of the car
with the
batteries. The reason I am interested is because I am in the planning
stage
of building a 1990 Nissan 240SX. Your range is exactly where I want
it. I
am pretty sure I am going with Trojan T105 batteries at 156 volts with a
Zilla controller. I am a speed junkie so I think that will give me the
ooomph I am looking for with the range I need. I am just hoping my car
is
capable of highway speeds for at least 17 miles each way to work. I am
hoping for a 3500 pound total weight with batteries. The Total weight
of
the pack (T105, 62 pounds, 26 batteries) will be 1612 pounds. I am
hoping I
can meet my range, speed, and useability goals with this car and the
components I selected.
Does anyone know of a local distributor in the Virginia Beach, VA area
where
I can buy the Trojan T105s at? I think it would be easier than ordering
them.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Bob
You might want to copy/paste the article as a few of
us are not registered to used the nhregister. But cool
that you got published.
--- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> Hi All;
>
> My 15 minutes of fame<g>! Enjoy<g>!Yesterdaze
> paper, like thursday.A little bit of EV stuff.
>
>
http://www.nhregister.com/site/news.cfm?newsid=15255812&BRD=1281&PAG=461&dept_id=7560&rfi=6
__________________________________
Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005
http://mail.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
That's awesome! Could I get that and some pictures too? I have been doing
some thinking in the past few days about direct drive since the Zilla
controller supports dual motors in series and parallel operation for direct
drive. Are you using two motors or just one? I have pretty much decided to
use a Warp 9" motor since the upgrades seem like a good idea and the motor
has the same bolt pattern as an ADC motor. Electro Automotive has the
tranny adapter already made. I was hoping that I could still use the
transmission but without the clutch.
What kind of batteries, controller, and motor are you using? Are
your range goals the same as mine?
-----Original Message-----
From: Matthew D. Graham [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, September 23, 2005 11:39 AM
To: '[email protected]'
Subject: RE: Real world data on 8 Volt Golf Cart Batteries - or 47,000
mil es in my EV
Jody,
You are in luck if you're looking for weight data on the 1990 240SX. That's
what I'm nearly done converting. But with 1600 pounds of batteries alone, I
think your 3500 pound goal is a little optimistic. Depending on how
exhaustive your weight removal process is, you can expect a glider in the
range of 1750-1900 pounds. Add in your 1600 pounds of batteries and you're
pretty much there already. With motor, controller, charger, contactors,
cable, etc. you'll be maybe 100-200 pounds over your goal.
Now that I think about it, aren't you using the transmission? Mine is direct
drive, so I didn't include that weight.
I have a spreadsheet that provides the weight of the components and my car
at various stages, if you'd like it.
Matt Graham
Hobe Sound, FL
-----Original Message-----
From: Dewey, Jody R ATC (CVN75 IM3) [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Thursday, September 22, 2005 7:36 PM
To: '[email protected]'
Subject: RE: Real world data on 8 Volt Golf Cart Batteries - or 47,000 mil
es in my EV
Thats why I asked Jerry. That can't be the TOTAL weight of the car with the
batteries. The reason I am interested is because I am in the planning stage
of building a 1990 Nissan 240SX. Your range is exactly where I want it. I
am pretty sure I am going with Trojan T105 batteries at 156 volts with a
Zilla controller. I am a speed junkie so I think that will give me the
ooomph I am looking for with the range I need. I am just hoping my car is
capable of highway speeds for at least 17 miles each way to work. I am
hoping for a 3500 pound total weight with batteries. The Total weight of
the pack (T105, 62 pounds, 26 batteries) will be 1612 pounds. I am hoping I
can meet my range, speed, and useability goals with this car and the
components I selected.
Does anyone know of a local distributor in the Virginia Beach, VA area where
I can buy the Trojan T105s at? I think it would be easier than ordering
them.
-----Original Message-----
From: jerry dycus [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Thursday, September 22, 2005 7:27 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: RE: Real world data on 8 Volt Golf Cart Batteries - or 47,000 mil
es in my EV
Hi Jody. Lynn and All,
"Dewey, Jody R ATC (CVN75 IM3)" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Wow! That is great data to see.
Yes it is some very interesting data, thanks Lynn.
What is your total weight with batteries?
Look under pounds below and you'll see.
HTH's,
Jerry Dycus
-----Original Message-----
From: Rich [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Thursday, September 22, 2005 5:20 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Real world data on 8 Volt Golf Cart Batteries - or 47,000 miles
in my EV
Hello Lynn,
What type motor and controller are you using?
Rich
----- Original Message -----
From: "Adams, Lynn"
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 21, 2005 5:11 PM
Subject: Real world data on 8 Volt Golf Cart Batteries - or 47,000 miles in
my EV
> Well I've been meaning to post my emperical battery data for a while,
> and the recent resurgence of the 8V/6V debate pushed me over the edge...
>
> I now have over 47,000 miles in my converted Civic. Car normally uses
> 18 8 volt golf cart batteries for 144 volts. My second set was the US
> 8VGC-HC where I installed two additioal batteries in battery boxes
> behind the front seats, concluded the extra batteries were not worth it.
> Third set was T875's and the fourth (currrent) set the T890's
>
> Below is a summary from actual data taken on my 43 miles commute to
> work, recharge at work, and 43 miles home. 86 miles a day every day
> speeds from stop and go to 65 mph. Battery pack end of life was defined
> as "limping into work with barely enough energy and hoping I can get
> home one more time..." Near the end of each pack life, bad batterys
> were removed, leaving a bigger load on the ones remaining, but could
> usually get 300 to 500 more miles by doing this. Of course if I had a
> shorter distance between charges probabally could have gone a lot more
> miles.
>
> Here is the data summary:
>
> Type US8V-GC US8V-GCHC T875 T890
> Year 2002 2003 2004 2005
> miles 12200 14200 16203 5000 so far
> Average WH/M 215 227 224 205
> Range to 80% 51.4 60 54 57.3
> Initial end trip voltage at 15A 142.5 151 143.5 144
> Final end trip voltage at 15A 136.5 144 138 143 so
> far
> Number of batteries 18 20 18 18
> pounds 1161 1380 1134 1242
> cost 940 1098 1168 1494
> miles per pound 10.51 10.29 14.29 ?
> Miles per dollar (US) 12.98 12.93 13.87 ?
> Cents per mile (US) 0.077 0.077 0.072 ?
>
>
> I've been very happy with all the batteries so far except the
> US8V-GC-HC's. The higher level of plates and acid resulted in greater
> acid leaking from the battery during use. They had a significtly
> stonger oder and acid residue than any of the others.
>
>
> When I get to 50,000 miles I'd write a longer piece telling all the
> interesting incidents.
>
> Happy EV'ing
>
>
> Lynn
---------------------------------
Yahoo! for Good
Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Please tell me you have or are going to set the Zilla to 170 motor volts (per
Otmar) so I don't have to fix your motor again. This will allow me to work on
other projects for awhile, hehehehe.
Good luck, rip some track for me as I'll be unable to attend although the
thought has come a few hundred times.
Cya
Jim Husted
Hi-Torque electric
John Wayland <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Hello to All,
Just a quick note to let anyone interested know that Tim and I will be
racing White Zombie tomorrow, Saturday night, at PIR again. Anyone
coming to watch, please bring video cameras if you have them.
The weather has warmed back up again with daytime temps in the mid 70's,
so the batteries will not be so cooled down as they were last weekend.
Unlike last weekend, the car is pretty much race ready, so we'll be at
the track right when the gates open at 6:00 for a long night with lots
of runs possible. Barring any unexpected failures, we'll be turning up
the power to see if we can get into the low 12's.
After breakfast, I'll be pulling the blown DC-DC to see if it can be
fixed and or modified further, be even if that doesn't pan out, the
backup plan is to add a 50 amp Anderson connector in back so a portable
12V battery (a spare 50 ahr Orbital with its built in handle) can be set
in the trunk and plugged in to carry the majority of 12V duties driving
to the track. During racing, it will be pulled out and charged up for
the nighttime drive home...an easy and simple fix to keep us racing
until the DC-DC is back on line. The new 'Inland Empire Drivelines'
stickers need to be put on the car, the Emeter needs to be reconnected,
a custom 'series only-time delay' burnout circuit for the Hairball is
going to be implemented, and a few other small items need to be attended
to, but other than this stuff, the car is ready to rock.
> See Ya....John 'Plasma Boy' Wayland
>
> 'We blow things up, so you don't have to.'
>
> http://plasmaboyracing.com
>
>
>
>
---------------------------------
Yahoo! for Good
Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I was wiring my sense wiring for the long range Rudman regs and the bundle
of 15 wires plus ground did something weird. I got a strange loop in the
bundle. One wire doesn't have a mate. I just don't get it and it has
continuity with a wire that it shouldn't. Maybe I should check for damage
in the wire bundle. I just don't get it. Are bundled wires ever wired like
this? Two wires at one end going to one wire at the other? This is really
strange. I cut the thing off a spool..... No I didn't it was a piece just
laying there already cut. Argggg. Maybe the cutter knew something I
didn't. Lawrence Rhodes....
Lawrence Rhodes
Bassoon/Contrabassoon
Reedmaker
Book 4/5 doubler
Electric Vehicle & Solar Power Advocate
415-821-3519
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi Bob and All,
Way to go Bob, Nice article !! You'll probably get some call
on that. I got the second post which had the article without registering for it.
Thanks,
Jerry Dycus
Bruce Weisenberger <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Bob
You might want to copy/paste the article as a few of
us are not registered to used the nhregister. But cool
that you got published.
--- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> Hi All;
>
> My 15 minutes of fame! Enjoy!Yesterdaze
> paper, like thursday.A little bit of EV stuff.
>
>
http://www.nhregister.com/site/news.cfm?newsid=15255812&BRD=1281&PAG=461&dept_id=7560&rfi=6
__________________________________
Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005
http://mail.yahoo.com
---------------------------------
Yahoo! for Good
Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Chuck. The top of the strut/shock should have a square or rectangle shape
you can get a small wrench on. That will keep the shaft from turning. It
sounds like your shock is loose. You do have to get the nut down a ways to
expose the end of the shaft. Lawrence Rhodes..........
----- Original Message -----
From: "Chuck Hursch" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "EVDL post" <[email protected]>
Sent: Friday, September 23, 2005 3:11 PM
Subject: creaky rear struts in VoltsRabbit - slightly O.T.
The rear strut assemblies on my VoltsRabbit have been rather
creaky lately. I'm wondering if any of the VW gurus out there
have had this problem and solved it.
When I went to replace my battery pack last spring, we decided to
swap sides on the two rear struts to see if a mild rattling
problem would move. The rattling problem would occur in the
passenger side strut when I would go over a road that had a mild
washboard (there's a particular one I'm thinking of on the uphill
south side of Wolfe Grade) in the asphalt. We disassembled the
springs and struts (actually putting in new springs), and the
struts aren't leaking and appear ok. Hopefully we got everything
back together ok. Then we swapped sides. It's rather hard to
tighten up the bolts appearing inside the car body without the
shock absorber turning. It also prevents one from latching on a
torque wrench. Anybody know about the special tool 50-200 (if I
recollect the number correctly) that's mentioned in the factory
service manual to keep the bolt from turning? It's guess and by
gosh as to what torque I'm getting. Things really creaked after
reinstallation. Tightened down some more, and after awhile the
creak became less. But it's still aggravating. It sounds like
rubber slipping on metal, along with the occasional thump when I
go over a bump (thump being more on the left side - old
right-side strut with the noise).
Are the rubber pieces at the top of the strut supposed to be
really well squished? What kinda torque is that going to take?
I think I'm already well over the ~25ft-lbs specified. Do these
rubber pieces ossify with time, and should I try replacing them?
When the shop down the street installed new front struts for me a
few years ago, they creaked while turning for awhile, but the
problem eventually went away.
I saw on a website awhile ago special bearings that could be put
in the rear, but it required a special weld job, which looked
like big work with big chances of screwing up. This rubber stuff
looks like it is a royal pain if it doesn't sit in there right.
I can even hear it creak when I get out of the car and the car
raises up a bit.
Creaking down the road in my electric jalopy,
Chuck
Chuck Hursch
Larkspur, CA
http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/339.html
http://www.geocities.com/chursch/bizcard.bmp
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi Bruce an' All;
Damn Register-ing crap! Not the "Register" but that ya have to sign up.
Pain in the ass, I'll try something else. What is it with papers nowadaze?
Used to be able to look on line. I think the NY Times makes you PAY now?
Feh! I tried opening the article , by registering and sent that too, opened,
I thought.That's why the 2 posts.
Working on that.
Seeya
Bob
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bruce Weisenberger" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Saturday, September 24, 2005 7:16 AM
Subject: Re: New Haven Register - Life-Styles - -
> Bob
> You might want to copy/paste the article as a few of
> us are not registered to used the nhregister. But cool
> that you got published.
>
> --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
> > Hi All;
> >
> > My 15 minutes of fame<g>! Enjoy<g>!Yesterdaze
> > paper, like thursday.A little bit of EV stuff.
> >
> >
>
http://www.nhregister.com/site/news.cfm?newsid=15255812&BRD=1281&PAG=461&dept_id=7560&rfi=6
>
>
>
>
> __________________________________
> Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005
> http://mail.yahoo.com
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
KILLINGWORTH - Bob Rice sings the auto electric. He's plugged into Internet
chat rooms, regional clubs, technical journals and national conferences, all
devoted to the empowerment of the electric car.
This is a guy who, at age 64, tools around town in an '82 Volkswagen Rabbit
fueled by golf cart batteries. He knows all the latest dope on lithium-ion
batteries, and his passion for electric drag racing borders on the
obsessive.
Advertisement
He's even got a shock of white hair reminiscent of Doc Brown from the "Back
to the Future" movies.
For years, Rice has yearned for a time when Americans would turn away from
gasoline and demand other energy sources for cars. And now may be his best
chance ever to make a convincing case for EVs - electric vehicles.
"We're getting robbed by the oil companies," Rice begins. "It's robbery
without the gun. But as we speak, there are modern marvels being built with
new technology." Some might call Rice's personal EV a marvel of sorts.
He started the project about five years ago on an old Rabbit. Among other
things, he installed an electric car motor and tricked the vehicle's
transmission into thinking it was still part of a gas-powered car.
Rice also had to find places for 20 6-volt golf cart batteries, which he
bought used for about $400. He put five of them where the back seat used to
be, for instance.
"I've always been a shade tree mechanic," Rice, a retired Amtrak engineer,
explains. "I'll take a car apart, sit there and look at it, look at the
batteries and figure something out. I didn't start with a plan."
The result was a car that has a ceramic heater and a plug where the gas cap
used to be. The contraption runs entirely on electricity. Rice drove it to
work in New Haven regularly, before his retirement this summer.
"I drove to the bank, the grocery store and the hardware store today," he
says, popping the hood of the Rabbit in his driveway recently. He has a jug
of water in one hand.
"I'm just going to give the batteries a drink," he explains. "This is
routine maintenance for an electric vehicle."
A full charge will last him about an hour, he estimates, depending on how
fast he drives and what sort of terrain he encounters. Long, steep hills
suck up a lot of juice, he notes.
He can charge the car in as little as 20 minutes. He says he once got the
vehicle up to 80 mph.
The whole thing cost him about $1,300, but Rice says most people pay $5,000
or more to build their own EV. "I got by on the cheap," he adds. "I had a
lot of parts already and I scrounged around on the Internet for other
stuff."
This was not his first electric experience, either.
In the 1960s, he got involved in a startup company that developed an
electric vehicle.
"It was a NEV, a neighborhood electric vehicle," Rice says. "You know,
something that would be perfect to drive around a gated community or
something. But we went belly up."
Despite all setbacks, Rice has kept current on each advance in EV
technology. He's involved in the National Electric Drag Racing Association
and the New England Electric Auto Association.
About a year ago, he tried to start a local chapter of the New England
group. He wasn't successful.
"The real action in electric cars is out west," he says. "Connecticut is a
wasteland."
Yet Rice perseveres. He owns a gas-electric Toyota Prius in addition to his
converted Rabbit, and he's diving back into the business world with a small
investment in an automotive startup company in Florida. This one is working
on a three-wheeled, electric commuter car.
"I've been preaching for years that we've got to clean up the planet.
Someone has to set an example," he says. "It's not like we have a spare
atmosphere sitting around in the trunk."
He's even going to take one more crack at organizing a local chapter of the
New England Electric Auto Association.
"No one should have to do this alone," he says.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Jim Shelton can be reached at [EMAIL PROTECTED] or (203) 789-5664.
©New Haven Register 2005
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob Rice" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Saturday, September 24, 2005 8:43 AM
Subject: Re: New Haven Register - Life-Styles - -
> Hi Bruce an' All;
>
> Damn Register-ing crap! Not the "Register" but that ya have to sign up.
Thanks Mark! Was working on figuring how to do that, so YOU didn't but ya
beat me to it<g>!
Hope it works?
Seeya
Bob
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Just to let you know, it pasted correctly on second post but I think our
repsective e-mails crossed in the electronic limbo of the internet. Thanks for
the post.
As to registering I have to do it for 3 news articles now and have a tough time
keeping up with the 300 passwords I keep track of now. I am including my job as
everything has a password to it. Every tool every door and each and every
computer program has its own registration. I'll sure be glad when bio sign on
becomes a reality. Walk up- press your thumb or scan your eye. This memorizing
passwords is getting tougher all the time and I'm only in my mid 40's.
Anyway thanks for the article. Another one for the EV'ers.
Bob Rice <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Hi Bruce an' All;
Damn Register-ing crap! Not the "Register" but that ya have to sign up.
Pain in the ass, I'll try something else. What is it with papers nowadaze?
Used to be able to look on line. I think the NY Times makes you PAY now?
Feh! I tried opening the article , by registering and sent that too, opened,
I thought.That's why the 2 posts.
Working on that.
Seeya
Bob
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bruce Weisenberger"
To:
Sent: Saturday, September 24, 2005 7:16 AM
Subject: Re: New Haven Register - Life-Styles - -
> Bob
> You might want to copy/paste the article as a few of
> us are not registered to used the nhregister. But cool
> that you got published.
>
> --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
> > Hi All;
> >
> > My 15 minutes of fame! Enjoy!Yesterdaze
> > paper, like thursday.A little bit of EV stuff.
> >
> >
>
http://www.nhregister.com/site/news.cfm?newsid=15255812&BRD=1281&PAG=461&dept_id=7560&rfi=6
>
>
>
>
> __________________________________
> Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005
> http://mail.yahoo.com
>
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Sounds like you re-invented the air brake.
:-)
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jeff Shanab" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <[email protected]>
Sent: Friday, September 23, 2005 4:59 PM
Subject: Vacuum booster
Please don't assume I am recommending driveing without booster and
safeies in place.
But another idea came to mind today that may help in the elcheapo EV
discussions or when space is tight. It depends on what you have avail or
around, just trying to brainstorm.
With the above disclaimer, it seems to me that the vacuum booster was
designed the way it was because there was vacuum available. If the
intakes had all been under pressure, perhaps the vacum booster would
have been built for pressure instead.
A quick theory of operation is the booster is a chamber split in 2 with
a big diaphram and a spring to return it.
vacuum goes thru a valve in the center when your foot is off it and both
sides see vacuum, no assistance.
When you step on the brake pedal, the rod moves forward, closing off the
valve between the 2 chambers and opening one near your foot, letting in
the atmosphere. It is this atmosphere at 14psi(0 gauge) that does the
work. When the piston inside catches up with your foot the valve in back
closes and the one up front opens and it equalizes, thus it follows your
foot.
Soooo
why not leave off the vacuum line and connect an air line to the
other side(need an adapter, no problem) and connect a line to an air
tank and a regulator dropping it down to 14 psi gauge.
It should work the same and now a small tank can be charged to 100 psi
when you charge your batteries and if you want a 12V compressor (way
cheaper and more avail in a pinch than a vacuum pump, mail order only)
that would be a good addition. put a 25psi safety switch to a warning
light or the "start" wire for feedback.
Perhaps some of us already have air pressure on board for those cars
with auto inflate tires, airbags, air shocks. I wonder how long a 4500
psi paintball bottle would last reduced down to 14psi!
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
millions of truck drivers the world over will hail you
as a hero
seriously though the complexity of on board cylinders
and/or compressors seem to be a lot more hassle than
either running a deisel car vacuum pump off the motor
shaft or just buying an electric vac pump from toyota
or someone else who makes millions of them
if you were trying to avoid belts etc just getting a
vacpump from a scrap deisel car and fitting a dc motor
on the end would work.
not sure how long a paint ball tank would last but you
have the problem of stored preasured air rather than
just creating vacuum when you need it
reb
--- Mark Ward <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Sounds like you re-invented the air brake.
>
> :-)
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Jeff Shanab" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List"
> <[email protected]>
> Sent: Friday, September 23, 2005 4:59 PM
> Subject: Vacuum booster
>
>
> > Please don't assume I am recommending driveing
> without booster and
> > safeies in place.
> >
> > But another idea came to mind today that may help
> in the elcheapo EV
> > discussions or when space is tight. It depends on
> what you have avail or
> > around, just trying to brainstorm.
> >
> >
> > With the above disclaimer, it seems to me that the
> vacuum booster was
> > designed the way it was because there was vacuum
> available. If the
> > intakes had all been under pressure, perhaps the
> vacum booster would
> > have been built for pressure instead.
> >
> > A quick theory of operation is the booster is a
> chamber split in 2 with
> > a big diaphram and a spring to return it.
> > vacuum goes thru a valve in the center when your
> foot is off it and both
> > sides see vacuum, no assistance.
> > When you step on the brake pedal, the rod moves
> forward, closing off the
> > valve between the 2 chambers and opening one near
> your foot, letting in
> > the atmosphere. It is this atmosphere at 14psi(0
> gauge) that does the
> > work. When the piston inside catches up with your
> foot the valve in back
> > closes and the one up front opens and it
> equalizes, thus it follows your
> > foot.
> >
> > Soooo
> > why not leave off the vacuum line and connect
> an air line to the
> > other side(need an adapter, no problem) and
> connect a line to an air
> > tank and a regulator dropping it down to 14 psi
> gauge.
> >
> > It should work the same and now a small tank can
> be charged to 100 psi
> > when you charge your batteries and if you want a
> 12V compressor (way
> > cheaper and more avail in a pinch than a vacuum
> pump, mail order only)
> > that would be a good addition. put a 25psi safety
> switch to a warning
> > light or the "start" wire for feedback.
> > Perhaps some of us already have air pressure on
> board for those cars
> > with auto inflate tires, airbags, air shocks. I
> wonder how long a 4500
> > psi paintball bottle would last reduced down to
> 14psi!
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
___________________________________________________________
Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail
http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Never fear, http://www.bugmenot.com is here. In this case:
uers: phillyfree
password: rjk5374
Bugmenot almost always has a usable uid and password for chickensh*t
registration sites.
Too bad you had to start the interview with the tired old "the oil
companies are robbing us." Otherwise a good article.
John
On Sat, 24 Sep 2005 08:43:40 -0400, "Bob Rice" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
> Hi Bruce an' All;
>
> Damn Register-ing crap! Not the "Register" but that ya have to sign up.
>Pain in the ass, I'll try something else. What is it with papers nowadaze?
>Used to be able to look on line. I think the NY Times makes you PAY now?
>Feh! I tried opening the article , by registering and sent that too, opened,
>I thought.That's why the 2 posts.
>
> Working on that.
>
> Seeya
>
> Bob
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Bruce Weisenberger" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>To: <[email protected]>
>Sent: Saturday, September 24, 2005 7:16 AM
>Subject: Re: New Haven Register - Life-Styles - -
>
>
>> Bob
>> You might want to copy/paste the article as a few of
>> us are not registered to used the nhregister. But cool
>> that you got published.
>>
>> --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>>
>> > Hi All;
>> >
>> > My 15 minutes of fame<g>! Enjoy<g>!Yesterdaze
>> > paper, like thursday.A little bit of EV stuff.
>> >
>> >
>>
>http://www.nhregister.com/site/news.cfm?newsid=15255812&BRD=1281&PAG=461&dept_id=7560&rfi=6
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> __________________________________
>> Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005
>> http://mail.yahoo.com
>>
>
---
John De Armond
See my website for my current email address
http://www.johngsbbq.com
Cleveland, Occupied TN
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
A little side note on parking brakes. Some car designs REQUIRE the
periodic use of the parking brake to maintain the correct adjustment of the
rear brake shoes.
When I worked as an auto mechanic, we had a customer bring in an imported
station wagon for braking problems, I think it was a Nissan. When it
arrived I took it for a test drive. The first thing I noticed was the
brake pedal went way down when applying the brakes. The second was the
huge pile of papers, letters, and such piled on top of the parking brake
handle. I moved the papers to the passenger seat and pulled the brake
handle. It slid easily to its travel limit with no tension on it almost
like it wasn't connected to anything. I released it and reapplied it about
30 times, each time the tension became stronger and a clicking noise could
be heard from the rear brakes. Eventually it would stop before reaching
the end of the slide, and finally it stopped after only 3 clicks on the
ratchet pawl. I then released it and retried the primary brakes. They
were firm and the pedal stopped much much higher off the floor. A test
drive confirmed the brakes now worked as intended. The customer was very
surprised to learn that she was supposed use the parking brake since the
car was an automatic and had a "park" position. She had owned the car
since new and never used it. The service manual and the owner's manual
both stated that it had to be used regularly.
We did do a regular inspection of the brake system. There were no other
problems.
Thanks,
Mike Chancey,
'88 Civic EV
'95 Solectria Force
Kansas City, Missouri
EV List Photo Album at: http://evalbum.com
My Electric Car at: http://www.geocities.com/electric_honda
Mid-America EAA chapter at: http://maeaa.org
Join the EV List at: http://www.madkatz.com/ev/evlist.html
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On Sep 24, 2005, at 1:15 AM, Osmo Sarin wrote:
I´m planning to convert Peugeot 206 as my first project, and I´ve been
offered a Siemens 1LH5118 AC motor with 15 kW rated, 123 Nm max, and
Simovert 6SV1 short inverter (110-380 V, max DC 280 A, max 80 kW).
According to my own calculations (which may be incorrect) I would need
much more power, but the seller says 15 kW is enough for my
requirements, which are:
-total weight (with passengers) 1400 kg (3090 lbs)
-top speed 110 km/h (68 mph)
-acceleration 6 sec 0-50 km/h (0-31 mph) = normal ICE-acc.
-voltage about 300 V
I´d appreciate any comments,
Peak power will be 84kW at 300 volts. 15kW is almost certainly the
continuous rating, because electric motors built for continuous duty
are generally rated for what they can handle continuously.
I suspect that 3100 lbs and 84kW will do 0-31 mph in less than 6
seconds.
Paul "neon" G.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi All,
I'm just preparing to head off to the SVEAA Rally this morning.
I thought people in the area might like a reminder that it's happening
.
Details here: http://eaasv.org/rallyinfo.html
I managed a last minute build of a Z1K yesterday so my car
"California Poppy" will have something drive it there. Funny how I'm
often the one with no controller! :)
I expect to be there through about 2pm. I have to leave a bit early.
Have fun!
--
-Otmar-
http://www.CafeElectric.com/ Home of the Zilla.
http://www.evcl.com/914 My electric 914
--- End Message ---
