EV Digest 4781
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) Re: Help with my Link 10 (phantom regen!)
by "Roland Wiench" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) Cable Crimping Tools
by Rush <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) RE: Tilting 3-wheelers
by "stU" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) Re: Tilting 3-wheelers
by Matthew Trevaskis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) City-EL on eBay
by "Jeff & Teri" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) Re: battery explosion, terminal connections
by Neon John <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7) Re: Battery charging in parallel
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8) Re: Cable Crimping Tools
by mike golub <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
9) Re: Cable Crimping Tools
by Ralph Merwin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) Re: Cable Crimping Tools
by Neon John <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
11) Re: City-EL on eBay
by "Rick" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
12) Re: Tilting 3-wheelers
by "Peter VanDerWal" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13) Fw: Battery charging in parallel
by "Rick" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
14) NO ATTACHMENTS (was: for sale 914 porsche)
by "David Roden" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
15) Re: Battery charging in parallel (follows Lee's idea)
by "Rick" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16) Re: City-EL on eBay
by "Christopher Robison" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
17) Re: Siemens EV Motors
by Ryan Stotts <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
18) Re: Help with my Link 10 (phantom regen!)
by Ryan Bohm <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
19) FW: Battery charging in parallel
by "Robert Chew" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
20) Re: Siemens EV Motors
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
21) Re: Help with my Link 10 (phantom regen!)
by "Roland Wiench" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
22) Re: Battery charging in parallel
by "Mark Grasser" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
23) Industrial motors was: Re: Siemens EV Motors
by James Massey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
24) Re: Battery charging in parallel
by "Mark Grasser" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
25) Re: Industrial motors was: Re: Siemens EV Motors
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
26) RE: Battery charging in parallel (A Different Idea)
by "stU" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
27) Re: Battery charging in parallel
by "David Roden" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
28) RE: Battery charging in parallel (A Different Idea)
by "David Roden" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
29) RE: Battery charging in parallel (A Different Idea)
by "stU" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--- Begin Message ---
It could be in your prescaler unit. I am using a No. 1N2537 which is 0-499
volt rated that has a built in DC-DC 12 volt output. You still input your
Battery 12 Volts into it. It provides a stable 12 volts output and isolates
from the EV 12 volt system.
Roland
----- Original Message -----
From: Evan Tuer<mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu<mailto:ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Saturday, October 01, 2005 7:12 AM
Subject: Re: Help with my Link 10 (phantom regen!)
On 10/1/05, Adams, Lynn <[EMAIL PROTECTED]<mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>> wrote:
>
> Ok, I've chased this problem for weeks and am appealing to the list for
> help. My link-10 meter is acting strangely. The meter seems to work
> correctly until I turn on something in the 12 volt system (fan,
> headlights, brake lights, whatever). When this happens, the current
> starts jumping around and finally settles on +510 Amps. That would be
> great if it were true!
>
> So, I turn on the heater and run the fan on high, a situation I know to
> pull between -15 to -16 amps. The link 10 shows +510 on the display.
> Measurement of the voltage drop across the shunt is 1.6 mV, as expected.
> My KTA amp meter show that -16 amps is being drawn.
I'm not sure if this is quite the same problem I had, but I used to
see the amps sometimes start jumping around even with everything
switched off, and sometimes stick at 510 (or 512?). Tapping the meter
would temporarily fix it. I eventually took it apart and re-flowed a
few solder joints (mainly the connector), and that fixed the problem
for good.
Yours does sound a bit more like electrical noise or an isolation
problem though.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Doug wrote:
> I'm building my cables now - QuickCable copper terminals on the SAE
> posts on Orbital batteries.
Are you using #2/0 cables? What are you crimping them with?
I'm about to do my cables and have a 2' bolt cutter that I was going to turn
into a crimper but don't know what size hex socket to use. I looked at some
cables connections and 1/2" looks right. Can anybody say whether that is the
correct size or not?
Thanks
Rush
Tucson AZ
www.ironandwood.org
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
If you want to understand the 'feel' of a tilting 3-wheeler or any tilting
vehicle this of the last time you drove around a banked turn at high speed.
Now think about the same curve, same speed, on the flat.
If you could make a 2F2R tilter like the Honda Gyro with the batteries and
the motor low in the rear and the tilt pivot very low, it would be nice.
However when you get to more than a single seater (narrow), I am not so sure
that it would be the way to go.
Theory tells us that 2F1R is substantially more stable.
There are some nice videos of tilters on the web.
BoyntonStu
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Though not yet in production, check out http://www.bath.ac.uk/mecheng/zedis
for a BMW C1-based tilting 3 wheeler
(Bath is my "alma mater", though not the Mech Eng dept!)
(Page is graphics heavy - huge images have been "thumbnailed" by size
attributes, lengthy download on dial-up connection!)
Matt
--
Matthew Trevaskis
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I don't find to much in the list archive on these.
Any opinions out there?
It's a lot like something I've been designing for a long time and I'm
considering it.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1,1&item=4579143432&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWA%3AIT
Thanks,
Jeff
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On Sat, 1 Oct 2005 00:36:58 -0700, Doug Weathers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
>
>On Sep 29, 2005, at 8:35 AM, Neon John wrote:
>
>> Even that doesn't work. L terminal lead creep is the single worst
>> problem I've had with my GoBig scooter containing Hawkers. Tightening
>> the terminals is an every-other-week chore. I've installed cut-down
>> fender washers on both sides of each terminal to spread the load out
>> as much as possible and still the damn things squish out.
>
>Mike Brown (as I recall) recommends using Belleville washers. Have you
>tried that?
No I haven't but I suspect that bellevilles would only lengthen the
tightening intervals and not solve the problem. I'd guesstimate that
the posts have lost a third of their original thickness - much farther
than the compression range of one washer. I suppose I could stack
them. I'd cast SAE posts onto the batteries except that there isn't
room for the cable lugs.
>
>> I think that the standard SAE battery posts are the best for high
>> current applications. That design has the largest cross-section of
>> metal and the largest surface area for the cable lug to mate against.
>> Crimped-on copper cable lugs have been absolutely trouble-free in my
>> Citi which fairly routinely pulls >300 amps from golf cart batteries.
>
>I'm building my cables now - QuickCable copper terminals on the SAE
>posts on Orbital batteries. Any suggestions for the proper torque
>value for tightening these?
No idea. I just tighten mine til 'snug'. I'd guess maybe 10 ft-lbs.
John
---
John De Armond
See my website for my current email address
http://www.johngsbbq.com
Cleveland, Occupied TN
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Robert Chew wrote:
> idea... PV powered battery bank... charge regulator, 20amp at 12volts
> to charge my 6 SCS225 12 volt batteries in parallel.
This should work, but it takes a lot of big switches to rearrange six
batteries from series while driving to parallel while charging.
> this regulator is switched on which is harsh on the batts...
> when one battery reaches the float voltage, the regulator will
> switch off and the other batteries may not have reached float yet.
Charging batteries in parallel to a float voltage isn't much of a
problem if you have lots of time. It takes a *days* to reach "full"!
This also gives them enough time to self-equalize to about the same
states of charge.
You turn off the charger when the *current* falls below a limit; not
when you reach the float voltage. When charging in parallel, you're
"done" when the current drops under 1% of the total amphour capacity. In
other words, a 50ah battery is full when it reaches 13.5v at 0.5a. Two
or more batteries in parallel behave like a single battery whose
capacity is the sum of the individual capacities; six 50ah batteries
behave like a single 300ah battery.
--
Ring the bells that you can ring
Forget your perfect offering
There is a crack in everything
That's how the light gets in
-- Leonard Cohen, from "Anthem"
--
Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart_at_earthlink.net
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
do you cut the HEX socket in half?
--- Rush <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Doug wrote:
> > I'm building my cables now - QuickCable copper
> terminals on the SAE
> > posts on Orbital batteries.
>
> Are you using #2/0 cables? What are you crimping
> them with?
>
> I'm about to do my cables and have a 2' bolt cutter
> that I was going to turn into a crimper but don't
> know what size hex socket to use. I looked at some
> cables connections and 1/2" looks right. Can anybody
> say whether that is the correct size or not?
>
> Thanks
> Rush
> Tucson AZ
> www.ironandwood.org
>
>
>
>
__________________________________
Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005
http://mail.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Rush writes:
>
> I'm about to do my cables and have a 2' bolt cutter that I was going to
> turn into a crimper but don't know what size hex socket to use. I looked
> at some cables connections and 1/2" looks right. Can anybody say whether
> that is the correct size or not?
Rush,
Is there a battery store in your area? They might have proper hex
crimpers that you can rent by the day. Or maybe someone in your
area (local EV club?) has some that you can borrow.
Ralph
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On Sat, 01 Oct 2005 08:22:15 -0700, Rush <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>Doug wrote:
>> I'm building my cables now - QuickCable copper terminals on the SAE
>> posts on Orbital batteries.
>
>Are you using #2/0 cables? What are you crimping them with?
>
>I'm about to do my cables and have a 2' bolt cutter that I was going to turn
>into a crimper but don't know what size hex socket to use. I looked at some
>cables connections and 1/2" looks right. Can anybody say whether that is the
>correct size or not?
I don't like the hex crimp because it doesn't make a gastight seal,
eg, causes metal to bond between the wire and lug.
I made my crimper from similar bolt cutters. I used a die grinder to
cut out a half moon notch on one jaw that fits the un-crimped lug. On
the other side I ground down a little, perhaps 1/8" in a shallow dish.
Into that I welded a tooth using a hard alloy welding filler. I used
the die grinder to shape this to approximately the same 2 toothed
shape as an AMP crimper, with a nice contour at the base of the tooth.
I figured that AMP had the crimper design figured out pretty much so I
copied their design. I polished the tooth and the back jaw to a fine
shine which aids the metal in flowing during the crimp. Before
polishing, I touched up the back side to get the right spacing, tight
enough to cause metal flow but not so tight that the cable is
partially severed. The test is to crimp on a lug, then cut the lug
off within an inch and try every strand to make sure it won't come
out.
The difference between an air-tight crimp and a simple mechanical one
is that corrosion cannot enter the air-tight crimp because the metals
of the lug and cable have partially merged into an almost solid
structure. The electrical performance between a mechanical hex crimp
and an air-tight one isn't significant when they are new but once some
corrosion sets in, the air-tight one has it by a wide margin.
John
---
John De Armond
See my website for my current email address
http://www.johngsbbq.com
Cleveland, Occupied TN
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
"Jeff & Teri" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
I don't find to much in the list archive on these.
Any opinions out there?
It's a lot like something I've been designing for a long time and I'm
considering it.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1,1&item=4579143432&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWA%3AIT
Hi Jeff,
My instinct says run!!! The mileage alone warrants some concern in my mind.
These weren't designed with bearings and suspension systems like a regular
vehicle. A motorcycle with 5500 miles on it is pretty well getting to be
worn out.
I went to the link for more info. Check out what the article says. My take
is that the reserve on it is $8000.00!!
One could build quite a bit of self-designed commuter for that kind fo
money, but it is turn-key, except for figuring out what happened to make the
cahrger smoke itself. Shorted battery pack from being run dry??
Regards and best of luck,
Rick
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
> Fascinating!
>
> What do the three-wheel gurus feel about tilting? ("General" Specialist
> Gurus are also asked for opinions.) And how 'bout when the two wheels are
> in
> front?
THere are advantages and disadvantages to tilting.
Designed properly non-tilting three wheelers can handle exceptionally
well. Basically to improve the handling of a three wheeler you can widen
the track and/or lower the center of gravity. However, sometimes other
design constraints prevent you from doing this.
Tilting allows you to achieve the same improvement cornering without
widening the track or raising the COG. In fact you can narrow the track
to the point where the wheels are touching and raise the COG as high as
you desire and still corner well.
On the down side a tilting three wheeler might not transition from one
corner to another as fast. It can be, and usually is, more complicated
which means there are more things that can go wrong.
Tilting threewheelers can have a high "Cool" factor, but I'm generally a
fan of the KISS principle.
--
If you send email to me, or the EVDL, that has > 4 lines of legalistic
junk at the end; then you are specifically authorizing me to do whatever I
wish with the message. By posting the message you agree that your long
legalistic signature is void.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
----- Original Message -----
From: "Rick" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Saturday, October 01, 2005 8:59 AM
Subject: Re: Battery charging in parallel
> From: "Robert Chew" >
> > I know the problems associated with charging batteries in parallel,
> > especially when they have slightly different capacities then one
another.
> IN
> > my case yes, because of the long wiring lengths between the battery
banks
> > may cause a slight capacity differential between the banks.
> >
> > I was pondering on the idea that by using a stand alone system PV
powered
> > battery bank and connecting that up to a charge regulator say 20amp at
12
> > volts in my car to charge my 6 SCS225 12 volt batteries in parallel. Yes
> > this regulator I am thinking of is a switched on which is particularly
> harsh
> > on the poor batts, but something to start off with. The problem with
this
> is
> > that when one battery reaches the float voltage, the regulator will
switch
> > off and the other batteries may not have reached float yet.
> >
>
> Hi Robert,
>
> I've pondered this same problem for a long time. I don't think that
charging
> in series is the cats' wisker either. In fact, I think that charging each
> battery at it's base voltage is likely better to some degree, but many
will
> refute that. I'd say the jury I'm on is still out in this matter.
>
> The experience I've had charging banks of batts in parrallel with solar
> panels and charge controllers has been on-going for a couple years now.
When
> I have one low battery connected, my charge controller just doesn't shut
> off. The low voltage of that battery keeps current flowing from the good
> batteries into itself and it just doesn't reach the same voltage as the
> others. But my controller doesn't shut off because the bad battery shares
> energy with the others, so it doesn't reach the cut-off voltage of the
> charge controller.
>
> Maybe you could purposely use the slight imbalance of the unequal wire
> lengths to your advantage. That is, place the bad battery on a long cable
> run, or on a short run and see if there is any gains to be had. It's just
an
> idea to experiment with. The voltage of a battery on a longer run of cable
> should be slightly less than the short ones, so a bit of tinkering and
> measuring voltages might yeild some critical data to better assist you in
> your plight.
>
> Bottom line; don't be dismayed about this subject, no matter what others
may
> say. I think it's a viable solution that can be worked around on any scale
> of EV. I did it for a period of time with my 48 volt ebike. It's just a
> matter of appropriate hardware and interconnect/disconnect contacts.
> The ultimate fix is, of course, having enough money to spend to buy
> replacement batteries when one satrts looking like dud, and the earlier on
> in it's lifetime, the better. Over the long run, you'll end up with spares
> that can be better matched together for other uses, even if not for EV's.
> They can be blueprinted and sold to others as well. There's a lot of life
in
> a battery. For low voltage lighting for camping, portable ham radio use,
> etc.. I use some batteries in my ham shack that aren't good enough for EV
> use anymore, but they seem to be very happy to continue working at less
> aggressive output rates. Just like us old guys. You wake up one day and
> realize; "Hey, I'm not 22 anymore!" I can't carry an 80 pound bag of
pre-mix
> concrete over my head. It's HURTS when I do that!!! But a 50 pound bag is
no
> big deal.
>
> Stick with your idea. I think that we are onto something. ;-)
>
> Regards,
> Rick
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
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--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Robert Chew wrote:
> idea... PV powered battery bank... charge regulator, 20amp at 12volts
> to charge my 6 SCS225 12 volt batteries in parallel.
Lee Hart wrote;
This should work, but it takes a lot of big switches to rearrange six
batteries from series while driving to parallel while charging.
Hi Robert and Lee,
I pasted 3 URL's of how I did my ebike wiring. I used connectors to form two
seperate harness assemblies. One stays with the vehicle and gets
disconnected from the batteries, and the other re-connects all the batteries
in parallel to the charging harness that is carried with the vehicle.
Switches that big might be a bit hard to find, unless you feel like making
your own knife type switches and have a way to form the huge copper contacts
for the knife blades to fit into. Not a bad idea, but copper ain't cheap
these days, thank you China!!
Running huge contactors in duplicity would really eat up some current too,
so I don't think I'd want them for any project I was doing.
http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/176ct.jpg
http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/176mt.jpg
http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/176lt.jpg
Think of the wires connected to each battery as ~battery terminal
extensions~, and run them to some variety of hardware that will allow each
wire to be connected and mechanically isolated so that vibrations don't
cause loosening. That is the point where I made the series connections with
loops of wire weaving in between connection points.
I used European barrier strips from Radio Shack, but obviously my current
demands were much smaller. Electricians use larger versions of these to
connect wires together for houses/buildings. They are similar, but not
insulated, so heatshrink may be required.
Those heavy duty connectors for golf cart chargers might get you
started....I can't think of the name of them right now, sorry.
Lee is right on with the charging info. I reference old posts from him as a
refresher course every so often. Hopefully some day I'll remember it
verbatim. Thanks for the input Lee!!
Regards,
Rick
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I have one of these (on long-term loan) sitting in my garage awaiting some
restoration and repair, and I have a few points to offer about it, good
and bad.
First of all, I think these are cool little vehicles. They're fun to drive
on small residential roads, and they're surprisingly stable for a three
wheeler with the single wheel forward. The batteries are mounted very low
over the rear axle, and the car behaves accordingly. I've pushed one to
the edge and can report that the rear wheels will slide before the vehicle
tips over. Also, the one in the ad is actually pretty rare -- they stopped
making the convertible version some years ago, and now only offer the full
top (like I have) and the targa top ("OpenFun") version.
They're very lightweight; imagine having a tiny Vespa or Honda Spree
scooter (remember those?) that you sit inside of instead of on top, and
you've got the idea. The suspension is more like a mountain bike
suspension than a motorcycle or car suspension.
They are not fast. And since on the road they look more like a little car
than a scooter, they visually give people the impression of something that
can go a bit faster. You won't be given as much latitude as if you were on
a scooter of similar power; cars will follow closely behind you waiting
for you to move aside. As such, there aren't many places where these
vehicles are practical in the US. Since the car won't do 50mph, I could
not drive to the grocery store in one, in my neighborhood.
The one I have was built in 1992. By the pictures in the ad, this one
appears to be of the same vintage. The 2nd generation sepex motor in the
back (Thrige "Titan") is underpowered, and the drivetrain is very noisy.
30mph is definitely the top end and it takes a while to get there, and
then only if you're going on flat ground or downhill. I hear that more
modern ones have better acceleration.
In mine, the traction system recently died (the motor now just vibrates
instead of spinning), and the seat upholstery is disintegrating from
having sat in the sun for a few months. The vehicle was clearly not
designed for warm, sunny climates. There is no A/C only a blower, so in
the summer it is a sauna inside. The one in the ad is undoubtedly a much
different experience with the top removed though. (There is an electric
heater, which seems very effective).
All in all, this would be a very cool vehicle ...in Denmark. In most
places in the US, it's more a toy than a useable car. When mine was
working though, it was a lot of fun to drive.
--chris
Rick said:
> "Jeff & Teri" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I don't find to much in the list archive on these.
> Any opinions out there?
> It's a lot like something I've been designing for a long time and I'm
> considering it.
> http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1,1&item=4579143432&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWA%3AIT
>
> Hi Jeff,
>
> My instinct says run!!! The mileage alone warrants some concern in my
> mind.
> These weren't designed with bearings and suspension systems like a regular
> vehicle. A motorcycle with 5500 miles on it is pretty well getting to be
> worn out.
>
> I went to the link for more info. Check out what the article says. My take
> is that the reserve on it is $8000.00!!
>
> One could build quite a bit of self-designed commuter for that kind fo
> money, but it is turn-key, except for figuring out what happened to make
> the
> cahrger smoke itself. Shorted battery pack from being run dry??
>
> Regards and best of luck,
>
> Rick
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Lee Hart wrote:
> > I've also looked for suitable air cooled AC motors.
>
> There are *lots* of them, of course.
I've wondered about this since you first posted this. How would one
go about attaching a motor of this type to a typical automotive bell
housing?
http://www.surpluscenter.com/item.asp?&catname=&qty=1&item=10-1937
Do you have any links to some suitable off the shelf air cooled AC
motors that would make for an impressive EV?
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi Everyone,
At times, my current reading goes positive too (while discharging!).
This started happening after installing a relatively heavy load near the
shunt wires. So I'm assuming I'm getting noise on the shunt wires.
They are quite long - running the motor compartment up front to the back
of the vehicle where I chose to install the e-meter near the charger. I
used 16 gauge twisted wire. It isn't shielded.
I'm wondering, what have others successfully used for the shunt wires?
Thanks,
Ryan
Ok, I've chased this problem for weeks and am appealing to the list for
help. My link-10 meter is acting strangely. The meter seems to work
correctly until I turn on something in the 12 volt system (fan,
headlights, brake lights, whatever). When this happens, the current
starts jumping around and finally settles on +510 Amps. That would be
great if it were true!
--
- EV Source <http://www.evsource.com> -
Selling names like Zilla, PFC Chargers, WarP, and PowerCheq
All at the best prices available!
E-mail: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Toll-free: 1-877-215-6781
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi all,
In regards to the big switches. Isn't it just possible to connect +ve and
-Ve to each battery terminal from the corresponding wires from the battery
charger. Say = from charger to + to all 6 batteries and - from charger to
negative on all 6 batteries. Similar to the wiring of how I am going to wire
up the voltmeters on each of my batteries to monitor their voltages.
Cheer
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Ryan Stotts wrote:
> How would one go about attaching a motor of this type to a typical
> automotive bell housing?
>
> http://www.surpluscenter.com/item.asp?&catname=&qty=1&item=10-1937
In this type of mounting, the torque reacts to the baseplate. The end
bells are perforated to provide cooling. The most straightforward mount
would probably be an adapter plate with a second plate welded or bolted
to it at right angles, for the motor's baseplate to attach to.
But it would be hard to make it strong enough and get the shaft
alignment right. So if I were doing it, I'd probably take the end bell
off and have a machinist make me a new one that also served as the
adapter plate. You could either perforate it with ventilation holes, or
leave it solid and drill holes in the outer casing of the motor to allow
the same airflow.
Motors like this are very common. The main difficulty (aside from the
mounting arrangement) is that they will need to be rewound or at least
rewired to work with a more modest pack voltage.
--
Every act of conscious learning requires the willingness to suffer an
injury to one's self-esteem. That is why young children, before they
are aware of their own self-importance, learn so easily. - Thomas Szasz
--
Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart_at_earthlink.net
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--- Begin Message ---
Hello Ryan,
You can get shielded cable design for the Link-10 from EV Parts Store. It is
double shielded, there is a aluminum tape wrap over each wire and than a
insulation layer with another expanded aluminum shield over that, and than
finally cover with a plastic jacket. I think it's a 8 or 10 wire cable.
The internal shields are floating and only one end of the outside shield near
the charger is chassis grounded only.
Used heat shrinks on the ends of this cable so the internal shields do not
contact the outer shields.
If any unshielded wire extension are used from this shield cable like to a
prescaler and link shunt, than each pair should be twisted going to that
circuit.
The two wires going to the Link shunt goes to no 2 and 3 on the Link 10 should
be twisted. The two 12 VDC Black and White wire are twisted to the Prescaler
and the Yellow and Blue wire are twisted that goes from the Prescaler to No. 4
and 5 on the Link 10.
If you used a battery temperature sensor, that is also twisted from the battery
connections to No. 6 and 8 on the Link 10 which should be the isolated 12 VDC
from the prescaler DC-DC 12V isolated output.
Roland
----- Original Message -----
From: Ryan Bohm<mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: EV List<mailto:ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Saturday, October 01, 2005 2:26 PM
Subject: Re: Help with my Link 10 (phantom regen!)
Hi Everyone,
At times, my current reading goes positive too (while discharging!).
This started happening after installing a relatively heavy load near the
shunt wires. So I'm assuming I'm getting noise on the shunt wires.
They are quite long - running the motor compartment up front to the back
of the vehicle where I chose to install the e-meter near the charger. I
used 16 gauge twisted wire. It isn't shielded.
I'm wondering, what have others successfully used for the shunt wires?
Thanks,
Ryan
>Ok, I've chased this problem for weeks and am appealing to the list for
>help. My link-10 meter is acting strangely. The meter seems to work
>correctly until I turn on something in the 12 volt system (fan,
>headlights, brake lights, whatever). When this happens, the current
>starts jumping around and finally settles on +510 Amps. That would be
>great if it were true!
>
>
>
>
--
- EV Source <http://www.evsource.com<http://www.evsource.com/>> -
Selling names like Zilla, PFC Chargers, WarP, and PowerCheq
All at the best prices available!
E-mail: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]<mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
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--- Begin Message ---
The meters are all seperate items. The charger, from what I've read is one
item. Unless I've been misled and you are using 6 seperate chargerts.
Mark Grasser
78 #358
BIG REDs
http://members.rennlist.com/mgrasser
----- Original Message -----
From: "Robert Chew" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Saturday, October 01, 2005 6:28 PM
Subject: FW: Battery charging in parallel
Hi all,
In regards to the big switches. Isn't it just possible to connect +ve and
-Ve to each battery terminal from the corresponding wires from the battery
charger. Say = from charger to + to all 6 batteries and - from charger to
negative on all 6 batteries. Similar to the wiring of how I am going to
wire
up the voltmeters on each of my batteries to monitor their voltages.
Cheer
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
At 05:13 PM 1/10/05 -0700, Lee Hart wrote:
Ryan Stotts wrote:
> How would one go about attaching a motor of this type to a typical
> automotive bell housing?
So if I were doing it, I'd probably take the end bell
off and have a machinist make me a new one that also served as the
adapter plate.
Motors like this are very common. The main difficulty (aside from the
mounting arrangement) is that they will need to be rewound or at least
rewired to work with a more modest pack voltage.
Hi Ryan, Lee and All
I will second what Lee stated above, and add a little to it.
Lee, please feel free to corect any remaining holes in my understanding.
When I first got seriously interested in EVs (all of four years ago) I came
across an AC motor that I thought at the time would be a great motor to put
into an EV using industrial componentry (my business is based around
industrial technology, so it'd be a promotional platform). I knew a fair
bit about AC motors and variable frequency drives (industrial
applications), but found a large hole in my knowlege as far as the required
battery voltage:
The motor I have sitting up on some pallet racking is 415V, 50Hz, 37kW,
2800RPM air cooled (internal airflow). In order to get high RPMs out of it
it would need to have higher voltage applied - but (simplified) double the
RPMs require double the voltage - so to get 11,000 RPM (for a single gear
ratio) would require 4 x the peak voltage of the base rating - anyone for a
2400V battery pack? (didn't think so).
But the other thing is that if I was able to achieve 4x the RPMs, (again,
simplified statement) the horsepower would be 4x, or 200hp (continuous).
So, a 10hp motor (like the surplus center one) could be rewound to 50V,
60Hz, 7.5kW. This would require around 75V of batteries for 60Hz so at 4x
the RPMs is a 300V battery pack and 4x the continuous power is in the order
of 30kW continuous.
Lee, have I stuffed that up, or have I learned some?
James
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--- Begin Message ---
Ok, I need to say one more thing.
I work for Professional Mariner as the Director of Engineering. That's not
the point though.
We make 12 volt battery chargers that are 12 volts out 3 step chargers. The
outputs are isolated so you can hook them in series as you are suggesting.
We make chargers that are 3 and 4 output up to 30 amps. If you did 2-3
output chargers you could do 6 batteries and leave them in series.
Go to www. promariner.com to look over what's available. I'd look at the
ProTournament charger line.
Mark Grasser
The meters are all seperate items. The charger, from what I've read is one
item. Unless I've been misled and you are using 6 seperate chargerts.
Mark Grasser
78 #358
BIG REDs
http://members.rennlist.com/mgrasser
----- Original Message -----
From: "Robert Chew" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Saturday, October 01, 2005 6:28 PM
Subject: FW: Battery charging in parallel
Hi all,
In regards to the big switches. Isn't it just possible to connect +ve and
-Ve to each battery terminal from the corresponding wires from the
battery
charger. Say = from charger to + to all 6 batteries and - from charger to
negative on all 6 batteries. Similar to the wiring of how I am going to
wire
up the voltmeters on each of my batteries to monitor their voltages.
Cheer
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
James Massey wrote:
> The motor I have... is 415V, 50Hz, 37kW, 2800RPM air cooled (internal
> airflow). In order to get high RPMs out of it, I would need to have
> higher voltage applied -- but double the RPMs require double the
> voltage -- so to get 11,000 RPM... would require 4x the peak voltage
> of the base rating -- anyone for a 2400V battery pack?
>
> But the other thing is that if I was able to achieve 4x the RPMs,
> the horsepower would be 4x, or 200hp (continuous).
>
> So, a 10hp motor (like the surplus center one) could be rewound to
> 50V, 60Hz, 7.5kW. This would require around 75V of batteries for
> 60Hz so at 4x the RPMs is a 300V battery pack and 4x the continuous
> power is in the order of 30kW continuous.
>
> Lee, have I stuffed that up, or have I learned some?
I think you have it exactly right!
One other comment. You said it was "internal airflow". Was it completley
closed, so the internal fan only stirred the air around inside the case
-- what we call TENV (Totally Enclosed, Non Ventilated)?
Such motors are commonly used outdoors, or in very dirty environments.
But, lacking outside airflow, they tend to be *huge* and *heavy* for the
amount of horsepower they produce. You can get considerably more
horsepower out of these motors if you can open up the case and blow some
air through it.
--
Every act of conscious learning requires the willingness to suffer an
injury to one's self-esteem. That is why young children, before they
are aware of their own self-importance, learn so easily. - Thomas Szasz
--
Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart_at_earthlink.net
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Use a single 12 volt charger.
Wire each battery to a 2 pole micro switch that is placed around a motor
driven cam.
The wires can be lamp cord sized and cabled to a permanent plug.
Let's say for example you have 6 batteries.
The cam rotates at 1 RPM.
Each battery would receive 10 seconds of charging each minute. 1/6th the
charging rate of your charger.
Each battery is charged by the 'smart' charger.
Place an ammeter on the 'feed' side and you can observe the charging current
going into each battery.
BoyntonStu
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--- Begin Message ---
On 1 Oct 2005 at 19:39, Mark Grasser wrote:
> We make 12 volt battery chargers that are 12 volts out 3 step chargers.
Please forgive me for asking, but do you actually make them, or is the
assembly outsourced?
That is, where is the assembly plant - US, Canada, China, Taiwan, Hong Kong,
Korea, Thailand, Malaysia, or ?
Is the assembly plant under your direct control, or is it a generic contract
electronics assembly operation?
Also, do you have an MTBF figure for these chargers?
> Go to www. promariner.com to look over what's available.
Ouch, it's Flash. Bummer.
Thanks for the info.
David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
EV List Assistant Administrator
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On 1 Oct 2005 at 20:31, stU wrote:
> Each battery would receive 10 seconds of charging each minute. 1/6th the
> charging rate of your charger.
Have you tried this? I'm not sure, but I suspect that it would have a
negative effect on the intelligence of most smart chargers.
David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
EV List Assistant Administrator
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--- Begin Message ---
David,
Anyone who ever used a single charger to charge one battery, disconnect, and
then connect to another battery, has done what I am trying to explain.
The period could be 1 minute each, etc. click, click, click....
BoyntonStu
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of David Roden
Sent: Saturday, October 01, 2005 8:42 PM
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Subject: RE: Battery charging in parallel (A Different Idea)
On 1 Oct 2005 at 20:31, stU wrote:
> Each battery would receive 10 seconds of charging each minute. 1/6th the
> charging rate of your charger.
Have you tried this? I'm not sure, but I suspect that it would have a
negative effect on the intelligence of most smart chargers.
David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
EV List Assistant Administrator
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